RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Mayo => Topic started by: janet eliza on Tuesday 24 April 18 00:14 BST (UK)
-
Can anyone tell me how I would find out if my Great great grandfather James frayne had any siblings, his father was Michael Frayne sometimes spelt Frain, his mother was Anne nee Harrington, i have found a birth for James in 1869, he moved to Goole in the UK and on the 1881 census he is living in a boarding house with a Michael Frain, if anyone could point me in the right direction I would be grateful thank you.
-
Where did you find the birth?
The same place would seem like the best place to start.
-
James reg district Swinford
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03381/2239403.pdf
Keep searching in Swinford district.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-search.jsp
-
Mary born 1865
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03559/2310812.pdf
Catherine 1867
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1867/03462/2271053.pdf
-
Thank you so much, I really appreciate your help, I was contacted by someone who’s GG grandfather was Michael Frain and we thought James and Michael were brothers but can’t find a birth for him.
-
Kilmovee Parish
https://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0137
as Mary was born 1865 it's possible there are earlier children than won't be in the Civil Registration also the parents marriage may be before 1864.
-
I only looked from 1864 to 1868 so Michael could be there somewhere, was he older or younger than James?
There are a good few Michaels in the area I looked at quite a few, so he could also be a cousin.
-
Thank you, I think he was a few years older.
-
Michael and Ann married in 1856 so it's likely there are a few children before Civil Registration began in 1864
Right hand page, number 47
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632351#page/5/mode/1up
I have to sleep now but you can look through the register to find more children and see if there is a Michael.
-
The parents married in 1856 in Achorny Kilmovee.
-
Thanks for all your help, lunch time here I’m in OZ.
-
I found James and a Michael on the Goole 1891 census, michael was 29 and James 20, I’ll have a look through the pages you recommended.
-
Other children of Michael Frain and Anne Harrington
Thomas 8th Nov 1857
Patrick 20th Aug 1859
James 02 July 1869* your family
Ann 13 Aug 1871
Bridget 25 Aug 1873
Ellen 12 Jan 1878
The family come from Culmore Kilmovee Parish, 1901 census shows family Ann Frain widow with son and daughter Thomas and Ellen also married daughter Bridget Green and husband and child.
Census of 1911 Ann surname spelt Freyne is still with Bridget and family who now have 9 children. Thomas and Ellen no longer with the family. Ann Frain died 05 Aug 1918 Bridget Green present at death both of Culmore. The marriage of Bridget Frain and John Green in 1900 show her father as Michael Frain deceased.Michael Frain died 11 April 1896 daughter Bridget Frain present at death.
No birth found for a Michael Frain but there are several families living in Culmore maybe he is related.
-
owenwee, thank you so very much iv been searching for ages and couldn’t find anything I really do appreciate everyone’s help.
-
Owenwee, do you think it’s possible there were more children, I know there is a mary and Catherine born 1865/67, there seems to be a gap of a few years and the other children were born close together, thanks for your input.
-
It's quite possible there are more children.
This is the record for Thomas on the left hand page
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632350#page/15/mode/1up
The only way to know for sure is to go through the register.
Sites like Ancestry, FindMyPast and Family Search have transcriptions they all tend to give slightly different results it very much depends on the transcriber, it's better to go through the register yourself and use those sites as a guide only or don't use them at all.
-
Its possible that there are more children, but the pay site I use only show Mary, Catherine and the ones I listed. I did find a birth of a Michael Frain 01 March 1857 to parents John Frain and Catherine Byrne, the address is Culmore . John and Catherine have other children one is Patrick born 01 Feb 1855 the sponsor of this child is a Michael Frain, this could possibly be your Michael Frain father of James your family line.Michael the child could be a cousin.
When you search registers ensure the address is shown as Culmore as surnames Frain and Harrington are from the area, many people assume that they have "found" a birth, marriage just because the names appear to be the same. Culmore has several families of Frain in census so there may be other "Michaels".
-
Owenwee, do you think it’s possible there were more children, I know there is a mary and Catherine born 1865/67, there seems to be a gap of a few years and the other children were born close together, thanks for your input.
Civil registration of births didn't begin until 1864. I don't see a birth registered for your couple in 1864.
Kilmovee parish register for 1861-3 seems to be mixed up and there are some months missing. There is a page of 1863 baptisms which seem to follow on from 1860; names of months have faded. I found Nov. & Dec. 1863 somewhere else. 1861 seems to end in September. Then the register appeared to jump to end of 1863, missing 1862 altogether. ??? I've searched those years in that register before for one of my tribe whose mother was also a Harrington but not found her. Writing is bad in some places.
While searching those years in the register for children of your couple I turned up baptism of a Harrington cousin of my lass with her parents as sponsors, so it was fruitful for me if not for you. :)
-
PS to my post #17
There are 2 register of baptisms for Kilmovee parish.
June 1854-April 1881 This is the one with no entries for 1862 and very few in 1863. Only 4 years from 1857 -1870 have baptisms recorded for every month in this register: 1858, 1859, 1866 and 1870. There are no entries March 1868-July 1869 for instance. It's the register I was browsing earlier.
The other register runs from April 1855-January 1881. This seems to have 6 years between 1857 -1870 which have baptisms in every month: 1857, 1860, 1865, 1869 & 1870. There are baptisms Jan-July & Nov.-Dec 1862; Jan-Aug & Oct-Dec 1863 and Jan-Feb & April-Dec 1864.
I came across 2 more of my Harrington distant cousins while I was trying to make sense of the first register. :)
-
Thank you all for your help much appreciated.