RootsChat.Com
Some Special Interests => Occupation Interests => Topic started by: saw119 on Wednesday 25 April 18 10:15 BST (UK)
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I'm currently looking at high level glassblowing in late 18th century London. Does anyone else have experience of glassblowers in their family? Is it the kind of occupation that would have required an apprenticeship? Ratcliff Crown glass is an extreme quality product and highly skilled it seems.
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You say the firm is still in existence, could you enquire direct about your relative. They may well have records as an apprentice could serve at least seven years before he got his indentures.
It was a big day, when he was ragged unmercifully ,dunked in water butts,greased and sooted etc.
Have a bash ,you may be lucky.
Viktoria.
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You say the firm is still in existence, could you enquire direct about your relative. They may well have records as an apprentice could serve at least seven years before he got his indentures.
It was a big day, when he was ragged unmercifully ,dunked in water butts,greased and sooted etc.
Have a bash ,you may be lucky.
Viktoria.
Thanks but Ratcliff Crown Glass is a kind of high quality glass used for glazing windows and not a company. I was trying to illustrate the high level of skill required to produce it. Google it, it's quite fascinating actually.
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I see the Who Do You Think You Are magazine for Sept 2017 had a 3 page article about Glassmakers.
Unfortunately it seems to focus on the 19th century, when Tyneside dominated the industry, although it briefly mentions London, Lancashire, Yorkshire and Scotland as other areas where it was made.
It might be worth a read as a general background.
I like the quote "In the 1840s a 13 year old boy would 'blow' 200 pipes of glass in a 12 hour shift".
And we say those were the 'good old days'................ !
You can probably get the issue from a local library (even here on the other side of the world!). :)
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Pilkingtons of Lancashire may have patented the method of "floating" molten glass to make very much larger sheets than was then possible.Some RootsChatter will know.
Your person would not be a glassblower as that was not the method for flat sheets.
You need to know who made the Ratcliff Glass in London and go from there.
Best of luck.Viktoria.
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Pilkingtons of Lancashire may have patented the method of "floating" molten glass to make very much larger sheets than was then possible.Some RootsChatter will know.
Your person would not be a glassblower as that was not the method for flat sheets.
You need to know who made the Ratcliff Glass in London and go from there.
Best of luck.Viktoria.
Crown glass is blown and is not a sheet. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_glass_(window)
I don't know for certain the man I'm researching was involved in the crown glass trade but it was produced in Ratcliff and his occupation is given as 'Ratcliff glassblower'. There is much work to be done though.
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From the Glasgow Herald - Monday 10 March 1845
Stan
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It was John Bowles whose factory was at the Bear Garden, Bankside, Southwark, and who opened another crown glasshouse at Cockhill, Ratcliff. He later opened a third factory at Lambeth.
You can see Cock Hill on the map at https://www.old-maps.co.uk/index.html#/Map/535697/180790/11/100909
Stan
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It was John Bowles whose factory was at the Bear Garden, Bankside, Southwark, and who opened another crown glasshouse at Cockhill, Ratcliff. He later opened a third factory at Lambeth.
You can see Cock Hill on the map at https://www.old-maps.co.uk/index.html#/Map/535697/180790/11/100909
Stan
Yes, it was adjacent to Glasshouse Fields, which is still there amazingly, and can be clearly seen on Roque's wonderful map of 1746. That's the most famous glassworks in Ratcliff. However, is that the only one?
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You say the firm is still in existence, could you enquire direct about your relative. They may well have records as an apprentice could serve at least seven years before he got his indentures.
It was a big day, when he was ragged unmercifully ,dunked in water butts,greased and sooted etc.
Have a bash ,you may be lucky.
Viktoria.
Thanks but Ratcliff Crown Glass is a kind of high quality glass used for glazing windows and not a company. I was trying to illustrate the high level of skill required to produce it. Google it, it's quite fascinating actually.
Your last post said the glass in question was used for window panes,I am willing to be corrected but I am curious to know how can flat panes of glass be blown?
A pipe is used in actually -blowing -glass into a hollow bubble,how then does it become a flat pane
Many thanks in advance. Viktoria.
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You say the firm is still in existence, could you enquire direct about your relative. They may well have records as an apprentice could serve at least seven years before he got his indentures.
It was a big day, when he was ragged unmercifully ,dunked in water butts,greased and sooted etc.
Have a bash ,you may be lucky.
Viktoria.
Thanks but Ratcliff Crown Glass is a kind of high quality glass used for glazing windows and not a company. I was trying to illustrate the high level of skill required to produce it. Google it, it's quite fascinating actually.
Your last post said the glass in question was used for window panes,I am willing to be corrected but how can flat panes of glass be blown? Viktoria.
Please read the attached link, it will explain it much better than I can:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_glass_(window)
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Thankyou,so the blown cylinder had to be cut and re-heated to flatten it,well I never thought of that.
I did post another reply but it has gone into the ether--or somewhere.
Viktoria.
P.S my previous two posts got mixed up[,I modified one but both were printed,one unmodified.
Thanks again.V.
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Do you have a person's name, either a master or a journeyman whom you can look up in apprenticeship records?
I don't know anything about the topic but the answer to your question "Is it the kind of occupation that would have required an apprenticeship?" is yes.
Edit. When searching apprenticeship records, if there's a keyword box, just put glass, don't be specific, or leave it blank if you have a name to search for.
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Thankyou,so the blown cylinder had to be cut and re-heated to flatten it,well I never thought of that.
I did post another reply but it has gone into the ether--or somewhere.
Viktoria.
P.S my previous two posts got mixed up[,I modified one but both were printed,one unmodified.
Thanks again.V.
I agree that the process for the production of the window glass is quite baffling at first. I suppose that's where the skill of the glassblowers comes in.
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Do you have a person's name, either a master or a journeyman whom you can look up in apprenticeship records?
I don't know anything about the topic but the answer to your question "Is it the kind of occupation that would have required an apprenticeship?" is yes.
Edit. When searching apprenticeship records, if there's a keyword box, just put glass, don't be specific, or leave it blank if you have a name to search for.
Many thanks, I'll see what apprenticeship records survive as I do have a name. Very helpful tip as well.
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See the video at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzBXU2ovfGo making crown glass.
Stan
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See the video at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzBXU2ovfGo making crown glass.
Stan
I was going to look for something like that nex, thanks. If anything this video is even more impressive: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4OAd8S4J0M
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I wish I'd noticed this thread earlier. I trained in stained glass so worked a lot with hand made glasses both the cylinder and crown types, not always the easiest glass to cut.
Next to our studio in college was the glass blowers and they often needed our help, I would do that part you can see in the video where the second person puts the punty iron to the base of the piece and brings it to the glory hole, the glass blower would take over again from there.
This thread was a great trip down memory lane.
The centre of the crown glass was the cheapest pane as it was thick and uneven and had the rough punty mark in the centre but today fake versions of it are quite popular for pubs and such like.
I've watched good glass blowers try to make dinner sized glass plates and it is very very difficult, it usually collapsed at some point, making one large enough to use as window glass is highly skilled work.