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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: lil growler on Tuesday 15 May 18 06:42 BST (UK)
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Hi There
Maori genealogy and the Hawkes Bay area are new to me and I need a little help researching please.
For a friend, the details I have received are Ahenita is believed to have been born in Frasertown about 1853 and her Iwi is Ngati Kahununyu
Ahenita married Stephen Thorpe in 1878 and they lived in Wairoa
Their children are Arthur, he married Annie ?
Benjamin, Mary and I believe a child called any but she died young, in a fire.
Ahenita died 20 Nov 1919 On the death index her name is written as Aheuita.
I have Ahenita's death certificate, kindly obtained by a friend and fellow researcher. Her parents details aren't listed. She died in Wairoa.
What I am looking for is any information that will help me discover her parent's name. Hope you can help with this.
Regards
Mandy
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Hi Mandy,
He name the way it is spelt doesn't sound very Maori,is her iwi maybe Kahungunu,if so have you tried their website: https://www.kahungunu.iwi.nz/
Cheers Janette
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Hi Janette
Yes, I mispelt the Iwi. It is Kahungunu. I did contact a member of the site, as the person I am researching for would like to register her grandson and the iwi member advised I needed to know what marae Ahenita belonged to.
This aside, She would like her grandson to know his heritage.
Thanks
lil
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Hi Mandy,
Just putting up these registration details for names and their spelling......
Death:
1919/7955 Thorpe Ahenita Taura 66Y
Marriage:
1878/1949 Ahenita Taura Stephen Thorpe
And husband's death?
1928/4492 Thorpe Stephen 89Y
[Have not found birth registrations for the children.]
Minniehaha.
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Hi Mandy,
There are two trees on Ancestry, but no parents mentioned.
Three children mentioned.
Annie : 1877 - death 4 November 1888
Mary : 1878? 1882? Wairoa? Turiroa? - death 18 February 1966 - should be under Morgan, Thomas James
Benjamin : 1887 - death December 1924
Just something to work around to find other names
Cheers
KHP
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A couple of thoughts:
In case you weren't aware there are (3?) microfiches specifically for Maori Births, Deaths and Marriages.
Also for that area, the book "Horouta: The History of the Horouta Canoe: Gisborne and East Coast" by Rongowhakoata Halbert may have the lineage in it.
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Hi Mihi and KHP
Thanks for putting the extra info up. I do recall originally finding some information on a tree a little while ago, maybe Ancestry but I will go and have a look.
Twiggy, I had no idea separate microfiche were available for Maori BMD. I shall be looking into this as well as sourcing the book you mentioned. Thank you
Regards
lil
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Probated will of Stephen Thorpe.....
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99GP-3ZRZ?i=482&cc=1865481
And death of the son mentioned in the will:
1924/6739 Thorpe Benjamin 37Y
A grandson, also named Benjamin is mentioned......
Minniehaha.
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Further to reply #4.....
This would appear to be the marriage of the daughter mentioned in the will of Stephen Thorpe...
1896/2612 Mary Thorpe Thomas Morgan
Minniehaha.
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Letters of Administration re Benjamin Thorpe who died in 1924. Details of wife and children....
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GT2T-9757?i=134&cc=1865481
Minniehaha.
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Death of children mentioned in previous post.......
2006/25783 Thorpe Benjamin Arkwright 23 July 1923
2001/18144 Smith Dellah Ruth 22 September 1924
Added:
1915/6655 Marie Beaumont Benjamin Thorpe
1923/9013 Maude Pearse Benjamin Thorpe
Minniehaha.
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Cenotaph details for Benjamin Arkwright Thorpe........
http://www.aucklandmuseum.com/war-memorial/online-cenotaph/record/111968?n=benjamin%20thorpe&ordinal=0&from=%2Fwar-memorial%2Fonline-cenotaph%2Fsearch
Minniehaha.
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Thanks for the additional information minnie
Any of these branches could lead to the discovery of Ahenita's line.
I appreciate your help.
Regards
lil
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I am not sure but perhaps Ahenita is the transliteration of the English Anita?
You have been given information about the children.
http://www.maorilandonline.govt.nz/gis/owner/interestSearch.htm
The website above is a listing of Maori blocks and it has the owners of the land. Generally to have an interest you need to be able to whakapapa back to a person that holds an interest in land. People who hold an interest in land hold it in the area that their family comes from, their turangawaewae or place to stand. When that person dies the family 'succeeds' to the interest of that person.
On the website I can see an entry for Benjamin Arkwright Thorpe. I have looked at the entry and the area that is given appears to be up the Mangapoike Valley. This valley is very close to Frasertown. (I come from Wairoa) I am not sure if there is/are marae up this valley. I know that there are several close to Frasertown.
https://www.maorimaps.com/marae/te-mira-whet%C5%AB-m%C4%81ramamill-p%C4%81
It may be that Ahenita's land interests were around here. What I would do, apart from obtaining a photocopy of the marriage certificate of Ahenita and Stephen Thorpe is to do a tree for all of the children of Stephen and Ahenita. This will show how the current day people can whakapapa back to Ahenita. Or perhaps just do the line for the youngster you are helping.
The marriage certificate may show the names of the parents of Ahenita.
Once you have got the names of the children and grandchildren I would look them up on the site above. I have looked at several of the entries for the Thorpe family on this website.
From my very cursory look at some of the Thorpe entries it seems that the family has been diligent in bringing the interest of present day people forward on to the Maori land record. (When you look at some records around the country there are cases where there has been no action on the land for many many years. The land is still held in the names/s of people who may have died in the 1890s or 1900s.)
I believe that if you have the name and block number of the person that your friends whanau whakapapas to you could contact the staff at Maori Landonline and ask how, or if, the records can be searched back to find out the original owner of the blocks. It may give the family first name for Ahenita and others of her siblings.
It looks like one of Ahenita's daughter's married a Morgan. Sometimes this is transliterated as Mokena.
I am not sure if your friend has any contacts in Wairoa but someone may be happy to do some introductions or really 'reintroduction' as it is family making contact with family. I know that at some marae they have days or weekends when they do have genealogy workdays and help each other.
With the greatest respect to a previous poster but I think that the canoe for some/all? of the Frasertown marae may be Takitimu.
Stephen Thorpe was a valuer and later a farmer farming at Turiroa out of Wairoa on the road to Napier.
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Part quote from reply #13........
"The marriage certificate may show the names of the parents of Ahenita."
Sadly no, this information was not requested at that time [1878]. Here is what one can expect:
From 1854 Marriage Act 1854 (Dated 1 January 1855)
Bride and Groom
When and where married
Name and Surname
Age
Rank or profession
Condition
Name of officiating minister (or Registrar)
When registered
Signatures
Signatures of bride and groom
Signatures of the witnesses
Signature of officiating minister (or registrar)
Minniehaha.
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Shanreagh
Thank you. I will certainly look into the resources you have provided me and follow your advice. It is time to organise the information I have and what has been provided on here.
Minnie - it might be possible family are witnesses, also might be just friends.
Regards
lil
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Yes the names of the witnesses & their addresses (?) may indeed be helpful.......... :)
Minniehaha.
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Hi lil,
Just a thought, perhaps making contact with the Wairoa District Museum, to see what they hold on the Maori side. You may never know until you ask :D
Cheers
KHP
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Good thinking my friend :)
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Hi lil,
Just a thought, perhaps making contact with the Wairoa District Museum, to see what they hold on the Maori side. You may never know until you ask :D
KHP
yes good idea. But get all you have in order. They will have contacts into the various marae & could do some introductions I am sure. For General and contemporary information about old Wairoa see if you can get hold of the books by Thomas Lambert...The story of old Wairoa etc. Thomas Lambert came from Co Galway and was resident in Wairoa for many many years. He was a newspaper editor then historian and held in high regard.
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Thanks Shanreagh
I will do that :)
Regards
lil
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Some snippets re the family.....
Mention of Stephen Thorpe as lessee
..
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/PBH19090123.2.26?end_date=31-12-1949&phrase=2&query=stephen+thorpe&start_date=01-01-1839
An obituary of a relative of Stephen Thorpe
.
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/PBH19181127.2.70?end_date=31-12-1949&page=2&phrase=2&query=stephen+thorpe&start_date=01-01-1839
The very sad story of the fire in which the eldest daughter of Stephen Thorpe died
.
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/PBH18881112.2.6?end_date=31-12-1949&page=2&phrase=2&query=stephen+thorpe&start_date=01-01-1839
Her death registration?
1888/4016 Thorpe Annie 12Y
Minniehaha.
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Hi Minnie
I did read about Annie's sad passing, horrific way to die. I had not seen theother two articles though. Thank you for that. Apicture is starting to develop with this family.
I am unsure how large Wairoa was back in the day but one name that keeps reappearing is Epineha Taura https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/HBH18681006.2.21?end_date=1949-12-31&items_per_page=50&page=10&phrase=0&query=taura&start_date=1839-01-01&title=AMW%2CAONUPEP%2CHAEATA%2CHIIR%2CHOKIOI%2CHUIA%2CJUBIL%2CKAHITI%2CKORIM%2CMMTKM%2CMW%2CNZTR%2CPIHOI%2CWAKAM%2CWANANG%2CWHETU%2CBA%2CDTN%2CHAST%2CHBH%2CHBT%2CHBWT
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/DTN18821115.2.8?end_date=1949-12-31&items_per_page=50&page=11&phrase=0&query=taura&start_date=1839-01-01&title=AMW%2CAONUPEP%2CHAEATA%2CHIIR%2CHOKIOI%2CHUIA%2CJUBIL%2CKAHITI%2CKORIM%2CMMTKM%2CMW%2CNZTR%2CPIHOI%2CWAKAM%2CWANANG%2CWHETU%2CBA%2CDTN%2CHAST%2CHBH%2CHBT%2CHBWT
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/HBH18670226.2.13?end_date=1949-12-31&items_per_page=50&page=3&phrase=0&query=taura&start_date=1839-01-01&title=AMW%2CAONUPEP%2CHAEATA%2CHIIR%2CHOKIOI%2CHUIA%2CJUBIL%2CKAHITI%2CKORIM%2CMMTKM%2CMW%2CNZTR%2CPIHOI%2CWAKAM%2CWANANG%2CWHETU%2CBA%2CDTN%2CHAST%2CHBH%2CHBT%2CHBWT
I am wondering if he may fit in with Ahenita's family.
Regards
lil
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Her death registration?
1888/4016 Thorpe Annie 12Y
Minniehaha.
Seems to fit with my Reply # 4 ;D :D
Cheers
KHP
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Sure does KHP. ;D However I just wanted to put up the official BDM details......
Minniehaha.
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This I think is information about the son of Mary Morgan nee Thorpe........
1897/1346 Morgan Thomas Stephen Mary Thomas
1921/9725 Morgan Thomas Stephen 23Y
His WW1 file [see page 10]
.
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=21377314&digital=yes
Minniehaha.
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Minnie
You are on a roll. I appreciate your help. Definitely coming together on the Thorpe side.
Thank you
lil
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I know your subject concerns Ahenita but sometimes we have to go all 'around the houses' to find the information required. :) Hopefully we will get there in the end with this one.......
Minniehaha.
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As they say out there in television land
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Understand that Minnie. That is quite often the case with mine. Some snippet of information pertaining to the person we are searching for often comes from branching out.
Hahaha Janette, did you say it the same way too
Regards
lil
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Understand that Minnie. That is quite often the case with mine. Some snippet of information pertaining to the person we are searching for often comes from branching out.
Hahaha Janette, did you say it the same way too
Regards
lil
Haha,yes Lil I did.It is always the story with posts here ;D ;D ;D
Cheers Janette
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"The Meeting of the Kahungunu Tribes at the Wairoa", this article dated 16.6.1877 mentions one Epeniha* Taura. [Not the same spelling of Epineha as you mention in reply #22.]
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/WANANG18770616.2.7.1?end_date=31-12-1949&phrase=2&query=epeniha+taura&start_date=01-01-1839
*Under this spelling there are a number of documents to be found on our Archives website.
Added:Some details about land ownership.....
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/HBH18670226.2.13?end_date=31-12-1949&phrase=2&query=epeniha+taura&start_date=01-01-1839
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/HBH18681006.2.21?end_date=31-12-1949&phrase=2&query=epeniha+taura&start_date=01-01-1839
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/DTN18810822.2.8?end_date=31-12-1949&phrase=2&query=epeniha+taura&start_date=01-01-1839
Minniehaha.
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Minnie
Thanks for that. Epeniha does appear to come up quite a bit. I did not know he was a Chief though. I may look into him a bit more and see if there is a connection with Athenita. The dots will connect somewhere.
Thank you
Regards
lil
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Hello,
I am a decendent of Ahenata and am also interested in finding details of her parents. Did you end up finding further information when you researched this?
It would be greatly appreciated if you were able to confirm any findings you came across.
Nga mihi,
K Stephenson