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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: Graeme77 on Monday 11 June 18 11:52 BST (UK)
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I traced my paternal great grandparents, John and Mary Fraser Allan, to their marriage in Carluke in Lanarkshire, Scotland in 1857. The marriage certificate shows Johns' parents to be John and Catherine Allan. I have checked Parish Records available from Scotlands People, British Newpaper Archives and Family Search but I can find no trace of the parent's marriage or their births. Any suggestions on where else I can search. There are numerous records of earlier generation Allans in the area, and if I can make this link I can hopefully identify a few more generations.
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Hi and welcome to Rootschat did your John Allan die December 1903 Carluke ? There is a photo of a grave stone on www.findagrave.com with a Mary Fraser Allan says he was born 1830 Liberton
Edinburgh would that be your relation ...
Rosie
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Does his death certificate list the same parents ? I'm assuming no maiden name given for his mother
Have you managed to trace him on earlier census records before his marriage
Rosie
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Is there no m/s on marriage cert. or did they both have the surname Allan?
What was father Johns' occ. on the marriage cert?
What were the addresses on the marriage, assuming John was living at home prior to marrying?
Pre 1855 not all children were baptised & not all records survived.
Annie
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1841 Mid Calder – all born Midlothian
Catherine Allan 44, Jessy Allan 14 & John Alan 10
1851 Farm servant (Carter) in Mid Calder?
1857 John Allen married Mary Fraser
1861 no trace 1871 family in Carluke, John a Wagoner born Edinburgh
1901 John a Wagoner born Liberton, all indicate born about 1830
One possible marriage but no birth records for any children?
JOHN ALLAN to CATHERINE LOW 18/01/1819 Canongate
Colin
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Thank you for your suggestions.
John (Jnr) died in 1903 and I obtained an image of this tombstone in Wilton Cemetery in Lanarkshire.
He was married in Carluke and his address is shown as Galahill. His parents are both shown with the name of Allan on the marriage certificate. John(snr) is listed as a deceased "Farm Servant." (His bride,Mary Frase, mother's maiden name is shown, so maybe Catherine was born an Allan.)
One of the later census returns shows John(Jnr) as having being born in Edinburgh.
I tried following up on the possibility of John(Snr) being the spouse of Catherine Low, but cannot find enough evidence to prove the relationship. Similarly with Catherine Allan in Mid Calder.
Thank you again for your suggestions
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I'm assuming the witnesses on his marriage were not related to John then
1861 census surname for John transcribed as Alban on Ancestry address Wilton Carluke
1881 surname Annan address Honey Bank Carluke
Did you get the death certificate for John Allan
Rosie
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The witnesses to the marriage were Joseph Fraser (father of the bride) and Robert Annan- this is not a transcription error as I have viewed an image of the original certificate. Could have been an insertion error on the certificate as it seems just one person made all the entries on the certificate, and Robert is a common first name in the family.)
Have not found a death certificate for John Allan. In general I am finding it most difficult to get access to death certificates - any advice in this area i.e. best site to use?
Thank you.
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There is a death for a John Allan 1904 in Carluke Lanarkshire which would be his death ..he died 31 December 1903 so his death would have been registered beginning of following year .
Scotlands People is the only site for certificates in Scotland
Rosie
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Interesting one of the witnesses Robert Annan wonder if their is a connection ..On the 1881 Census Scotlands People John's surname is down as Annan also in 1891 Carluke
Rosie
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Great observation Rosie!
I wonder if someone may have had a speech impediment which made Allan sound like Annan ???
Annie
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Thank you Rosie- found a copy of the death certificate with the dod listed as 1904. Unfortunately the parents are just listed as deceased, no names.
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Hi Graeme ...That's a pity so no further advanced then in finding any information on them
Rosie
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Not sure if this is any help as names don't seem a good match?
Children of John Allan & Catherine Low 18/01/1819 Canongate (Midlothian)
All b Prestonpans (East Lothian)
Mary 05/11/1819 - 718/60 176
Alison 10/02/1822 - 718/80 24
Anne 02/03/1823 – 718/80 34
James 23/10/1825 - 718/ 80 53
Annie
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Hi I followed up on Catherine Low, but it does not seem to fit. The Allans seemed to always name their first born sons John. Found two John Allans, boy of the right ages, who do not appear to be with their family on the night of the 1841 census. Working on the premise that John was staying with relatives or friends that night.
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I have checked Parish Records available from Scotlands People, British Newpaper Archives and Family Search but I can find no trace of the parent's marriage or their births.
See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=714261.0
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Think you will find it quite hard trying to find him on any earlier census records as you said he was most probably working on a farm ..There are a few John Annan's and Allans you could maybe check
Rosie
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His parents are both shown with the name of Allan on the marriage certificate. John(snr) is listed as a deceased "Farm Servant." (His bride,Mary Frase, mother's maiden name is shown, so maybe Catherine was born an Allan.)
If no m/s is shown, this points to them never having married not to mention the fact 'John' may even be a fictitious name?
Annie
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Was thinking along these lines also Annie ;)
Rosie
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Was mother Catherine alive on the marriage?
It may be worth looking for her death which should give her parentage including her mothers' m/s if known to the informant?
You may find John (Jnr) was named after his maternal g/father?
Annie
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Allan says he was born 1830 Liberton
I wonder if this was consistent with census records?
Annie
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1841 Mid Calder – all born Midlothian
Catherine Allan 44, Jessy Allan 14 & John Alan 10
Have you managed to trace Catherine &/or Jessy/Jessie/Janet after 1841?
It would be interesting to know what info. is on her docs. if she married after Statutory Reg. & if she died after Statutory Reg?
Such a pity Catherine didn't have a child with an unusual name although that doesn't always help as I've found out.
Annie