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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: fabfam on Monday 25 June 18 04:33 BST (UK)
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Hi, Would anyone have info on Hugh and Mary McIlvaine. My direct ancestor William McIlvaine was born Saltcoats Scotland in 1846. Parents listed as Hugh and Mary on his death cert but I have not been able to find anything else. William was married to Annie Blaine. Any help would be greatly appreciated thanks :)
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Hi & welcome to rootschat!
"My direct ancestor William McIlvaine was born Saltcoats Scotland in 1846"
Do you have the Baptism record or is this a circa date from marriage/census'/death?
Is there any leeway on that date or anywhere else he may have been born as the date seems very precise without further details?
What are all the details on the marriage cert. of William & Ann?
Anything relevant including where/when/addresses/witnesses/were parents alive when he married, what was Hughs' occ. on the marriage?
What census records do you have William on, yr/place/age/occ. & anyone else in the abode as those details may be of further help?
Can you list the name of his children in order please as those details could be significant too?
Have you tried variants of the surname on SP?
Annie
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Welcome to Rootschat :)
Marriage certificate of 13 July 1867, Dalziel, has his parents as William McIlvain, mariner* and Mary, Maiden Surname Ross.
William's age was 22 and his occupation was given as a wire fencer(?)
Living Motherwell at time of marriage.
Gadget
* now think it's mason
added for completeness - Annie's paretns were Thomas Blain, Butler and Ann MS Galloaway
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Welcome to RootsChat :)
There is a baptism of a William Mcilvain on 8 Nov 1870 Dalziel with parents William and Ann Blam Or Blane
1871 Living in Dalziel
William Mcilvin 24 Railway Breakerman b Ayrshire, Laltent?
Amy Mcilvin 26 b Lanarkshire, Glasgow
John Mcilvin 2
William Mcilvin 4 months
Thomas H Walker 2 Boarder
Kay
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That's about the only census that I can positively see them in, Kay.
There are a couple of tempting William Ross ones in 1851 but not at all sure. I've tried Ireland for his parents, but nothing so far.
Gadget
PS - it's a very bad transcription on Ancestry - Laltent = Saltcoats on FindMyPast
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I think in 1871 his birth place could be interpreted as Saltcoats :-\
Kay
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It's a very bad transcription on Ancestry - Laltent = Saltcoats on FindMyPast
No sign of his parents though, which is what the OP is needing.
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Having second thoughts about William's father's occupation. I read it as mariner first of all but now I think it may be Mason.
Will put it up on deciphering board.
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I've found an online tree on Family Search that has William in South Africa:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/K2HH-GD5
William McIlvain, b. Dec 18 1846, Scotland
Died - Feb 22 1897, Johannesburg, Transvaal, SA
Wife - Annie Blain
Parents - Hugh McIlvain and Mary, MS Brown
This info doesn't correspond to the marriage entry.
Gadget
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This one for Annie, also has ref to her Probate record:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/L24V-VNK
link in the right column.
Gadget
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Births of children suggest that they moved to SA between June 1879 (daughter Mary, Motherwell) and
February 1882 (son James, Kilpaat, Cape Province)
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Children of Ann Blain's parents Thomas Blain and Ann Galloway from the IGI:
Thomas Blain 1846
Robert McBlane 1848
John Mcblane 1851
Quintin Mcblain 1853
Catherine Mcblain 1856
Peter Imrie Blain 1858
All baptised in Kirkoswald, Ayrshire
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MCILWAIN
MARY JANE
52
1884
576/1 61
Ardrossan Old
Ardrossan is close to Saltcoats? (Don't know if this is relevant, checked aged b c 1832) not the mother Ms Brown
Definitely not her. This was her maiden name. She was married to aThomas Moore and before that to Charles Cowan.
Marriage cert to Ann Blain has Mary as MS Ross
Add - I see whiteout did a whitwash and totally changed the info previously given - that's not really approved of. You should say added or amended or some such.
Children of Ann Blain's parents Thomas Blain and Ann Galloway from the IGI:
Thomas Blain 1846
Robert McBlane 1848
John Mcblane 1851
Quintin Mcblain 1853
Catherine Mcblain 1856
Peter Imrie Blain 1858
All baptised in Kirkoswald, Ayrshire
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This is fantastic thanks - at least I am getting more info on Annie Blain's side, The family did move to South Africa as apparently William worked for Caledonia railways and went to build a railway line. this is just info passed down from family.
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Just putting this into the 'pot'
There's an interesting family on the 1851 in Ardrossan
Transcription only ~
William Mcilone, 40, lab
Rosina, wife, 40
Barnard, 15
Elisabeth, 12
John, 10
Marrion, 7
William, 5
Hugh, under 1, b. Saltcoats
All but Hugh, b. Ireland
In the 1861, Ardrossan, William and Rose Ann/Rosina are down a Mcilwain and only Hugh is with them.
Gadget
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Ah - interesting.
Just found Hugh's baptism
31 August 1850, St Paliadius,# RC, Dalry, Ayr
Hugh McIlevain. Parents - William McIlevain and Rosanna BROWN
Maybe William got confused with Mother's maiden name - Rossanna/Rosina/ Rose Ann became ROSS
Gadget
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Hugh McIlevain. Parents - William McIlevain and Rosanna BROWN
Maybe William got confused with Mother's maiden name - Rossanna/Rosina/ Rose Ann became ROSS
Very possible but...where does Mary fit (from the marriage) :-\
Annie
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Not sure but maybe he didn't know his mother's first name. It has been known in many cases. By 1861 he was away from the family. Did he have contact with them or not?
Where did the father's name Hugh come from in the online tree and in the OP's first post ? There are many names all mixed up.
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If he was still in Ayrshire in 1861 there's a possible here~
Muirlaught, Ardrossan
William Allan, 69, farmer of 135 acres employing 1 boy, b. Ardrossan
,,,,,,,,
Willim McIllwain, servant, 14, farmers boy, b. Ardrossan
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1861 (SP) looks as though parents are still around but aged by almost 20 yrs instead of 10;
MCILWAIN WILLIAM 59
576/1 4/ 5
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
Others under same ref. no.
Rose Ann 58
Mary 15 error ::)
Hugh 10
Annie
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In the 1861, Ardrossan, William and Rose Ann/Rosina are down as Mcilwain and only Hugh is with them.
Gadget
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Annie - is it Drakemere Street?
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1871 (SP)
MCIWAIN WILLIAM 66
576/1 3/ 15
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
With Rosanna 63 & Hugh 19
Gadget, sorry but I'm using SP Index ;D
Annie
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This is the 1861 snip - no Mary
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Death;
MCILWAIN ROSE ANN 69
1888
576/1 14
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
Matching surname BROWN
Gadget, I must have erred on 1861 (it's my trait) :P
Annie
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Mary/Marion is with her uncle Roger Brown (70, b. Ireland) in Kirk Road, Ardrossan
Mary McIlwain, niece, 17, b. Ireland
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Annie - I reckon that this is the most likely family, with the names all mixed up. William, jnr, either didn't know the names of his parents or was confused by the ceremony or something else.
Added - I had a good look at the Irish records earlier and didn't find anything so far. Maybe a search for some of the other children's baptisms would turn up something. I think I found a Rosanna Brown bpt Dublin circ 1803 but nothing much else.
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Gadget,
Yes I agree on it being the correct family & things can get mixed up!
I can't find a suitable death for Wiliam although his age may be indexed wrong (I've come across this in the past)?
I think ff (OP) needs to have a look at the death for Rose Ann to find out if she was a widow or not?
Annie
Edit, We have found William in 1891 i.e. the DC is only if you need/want it as Rose A wouldn't have been a widow!
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Forgot to post the 1881...
MCILWAINE WILLIAM 76
576/1 3/ 19
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
Rose Ann 74
I think this could be significant?
1881
MCWHAIN ELIZ 17
576/1 3/ 10
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
Annie
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Just found this after a bit of gardening (too hot outside!)
Death of Uncle Roger Brown:
July 26th 1871 Ardrossan, Roger Brown, 78, labourer, widower of Agnes McDade, Saltcoats.
Parents - John Brown, labourer and Elizabeth M.S Corraghan, both deceased.
Informant - Rossan McIlewaine, Sister, present.
Gadget
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1891 (SP)
MCILWAIN WILLIAM 83
576/1 4/ 9
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
So where did he die?
Annie
Add, from Fancestry;
William McIlwain 83
General Labourer Unemployed
26 Green St
Ardrossan
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Forgot to post the 1881...
MCILWAINE WILLIAM 76
576/1 3/ 19
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
Rose Ann 74
1881
Manse Street, Ardrossan
William, McIlwaine, 76, retired labourer, b. ireland
Rose Ann, wife, 74, b. Ireland
Robert miller, son n law, 37
Mary Miller, daughter, 36
William Miller, grdson, 8
Elizabeth Miller, grdd, 2
Marion Miller, grdd, under 1
5 boarders
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1891 (SP)
MCILWAIN WILLIAM 83
576/1 4/ 9
Ardrossan Old, Ayr
So where did he die?
Annie
I put an end date of 1891 when I searched - will have another look! Hope it wasn't just initials in the Poor House :-\
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Gadget,
I don't see him on the VRs in 1895 so that may narrow things down unless he may be with family elsewhere?
Annie
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Death for a William McIlvean, 1896, Kilmarnock, aged 81!
(Not sure - a bit young and place?!?)
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My closest, a long way from home & age is out?
MCILVAIN WILLIAM 76
1893
564/2 407
Greenock West
Annie
At this stage of the game with so many variants etc. anything is a possible ::)
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Maybe he was with the Millers - the Miller children were b. Port Glasgow.
Just about to say that that one was closest but a bit young :-\
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Death for a William McIlvean, 1896, Kilmarnock, aged 81!
Kilmarnock not too far in terms from home?
Annie
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I had a look - not him :-X
Added - I think it was the Mauchline one - son's address is given as Earl Grey Street, Mauchline. They kept coming up in the early searches!
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I can't recall the last name I searched with so many variants,
using so little consonants, no vowels & so many asterisks & getting nowhere fast!!! ??? ;D
Annie
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Added - I think it was the Mauchline one
Which one Gadget?
I only found one for Mauchline 1891 - 1910 which can't be our William?
MCILVEAN WILLIAM NICOL B 56
1904
604/ 21
Mauchline
Annie
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VRs
MACILVEEN NICOL
Tenant
HOUSE EARL GREY STREET, MAUCHLINE
1895
VR009000113-
Looks to be the same person as death above?
Annie
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1891
William McIlwain 83
General Labourer Unemployed
26 Green St
Ardrossan
1895 VRs
BROWN JOHN
Tenant
HOUSE 26 GREEN STREET WEST SIDE, ARDROSSAN
VR009000112-
Annie
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Yes,that's the Mauchline family. I wouldn't get too involved with them as the OP might get confused. William jnr was in South Africa and dead by then.
Gadget
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Just found this after a bit of gardening (too hot outside!)
Death of Uncle Roger Brown:
July 26th 1871 Ardrossan, Roger Brown, 78, labourer, widower of Agnes McDade, Saltcoats.
Parents - John Brown, labourer and Elizabeth M.S Corraghan, both deceased.
Informant - Rossan McIlewaine, Sister, present.
Gadget
These will be Rose Ann's parents. I'll have a look for any clues in Ireland. Also, maybe we look there for the children's births. I don't think there will be much more in Scotland.
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"In the 1861 Ardrossan" is it Drakemere Street?
Here's 1865 VRs
MACKELVIE WIDOW (not sure this is just a wrong spelling)?
Proprietor
HOUSE AND STABLE DRAKEMYRE ST SOUTH SIDE, ARDROSSAN
VR009000033-
And;
BROWN WILLIAM
ESQUIRE
Proprietor
HOUSES DRAKEMYRE ST SOUTH SIDE, ARDROSSAN
1865
VR009000033-
Annie
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Annie
That's not the right family!
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Yes,that's the Mauchline family. I wouldn't get too involved with them as the OP might get confused. William jnr was in South Africa and dead by then.
Gadget
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Ok, so the family have moved from Drakemere/Drakemyre Street after 1861 census then.
Annie
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That family are different ones. Go back and read the thread from the beginning please. I beg you
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Here are some relevant posts:
Welcome to Rootschat :)
Marriage certificate of 13 July 1867, Dalziel, has his parents as William McIlvain, mariner* and Mary, Maiden Surname Ross.
William's age was 22 and his occupation was given as a wire fencer(?)
Living Motherwell at time of marriage.
Gadget
* now think it's mason
added for completeness - Annie's paretns were Thomas Blain, Butler and Ann MS Galloaway
Welcome to RootsChat :)
There is a baptism of a William Mcilvain on 8 Nov 1870 Dalziel with parents William and Ann Blam Or Blane
1871 Living in Dalziel
William Mcilvin 24 Railway Breakerman b Ayrshire, Laltent?
Amy Mcilvin 26 b Lanarkshire, Glasgow
John Mcilvin 2
William Mcilvin 4 months
Thomas H Walker 2 Boarder
Kay
I've found an online tree on Family Search that has William in South Africa:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/K2HH-GD5
William McIlvain, b. Dec 18 1846, Scotland
Died - Feb 22 1897, Johannesburg, Transvaal, SA
Wife - Annie Blain
Parents - Hugh McIlvain and Mary, MS Brown
This info doesn't correspond to the marriage entry.
Gadget
Births of children suggest that they moved to SA between June 1879 (daughter Mary, Motherwell) and
February 1882 (son James, Kilpaat, Cape Province)
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There were 2 William Mcilvaines - one b. Mauchline and one born Saltcoats/Ireland. It's the Irish family that are the most likely ones as the Mauchline one didn't go to South Africa.
Now you're muddling me - The Drakemere ones are the SA one's parents.
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Sorry, Annie. I think we're going around in circles. I'm trying to find where William snr's children were in 1892- 1900. William jnr was in SA. The daughter Mary (married Robert) was dead by 1891. Have we found Hugh?
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Sorry Gadget, I picked you up wrong on a question re the Mauchline lot & what I posted, was unsure whether related or not?
Anyway, this is a possible for Hugh;
MACILWAIN HUGH
Tenant Occupier
HOUSE 41 CASTLEHILL, CAMBUSNETHAN (close to Motherwell where William married)
1895
VR010700153-
Not the correct Hugh, born c1867 from 1891 census!
Annie
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Hugh seems to disappear after the 1871 when he was living with parents:
Parochial Board Land, Crofthead street, Ardrossan
William, 66, mason's labourer, b. Ireland
Rosanna, 63, b. Ireland
Hugh, 19, collier, b. Saltcoats
Children from the 1851~
Bernard/Barnard b.c. 1836
Elizabeth b.c. 1839 - followed
John,. b.c. 1841
Marrion/Mary b.c 1844 - followed
William, b.c. 1846 - followed
Hugh, b.c. 1850
I'll see if Hugh married or died but I'm starting to think that William snr might have been one of those deaths that aren't named - I've tried searching on just Wil* any surname and nothing jumps out :-\
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Death
MCILWAINE BERNARD 27
BROWN (mms)
1863
576/1 84
Ardrossan Old
Still no trace of Hugh yet & not found on a passenger list.
There's one who would fit with age/timing but gives Ireland for PoB & parents both deceased so doubting this one!
Annie
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Just putting this into the 'pot'
There's an interesting family on the 1851 in Ardrossan
Transcription only ~
William Mcilone, 40, lab
Rosina, wife, 40
Barnard, 15
Elisabeth, 12
John, 10
Marrion, 7
William, 5
Hugh, under 1, b. Saltcoats
All but Hugh, b. Ireland
In the 1861, Ardrossan, William and Rose Ann/Rosina are down a Mcilwain and only Hugh is with them.
Gadget
This must be the correct family as William (dob 1846) had a daughter named Mary Rosina Brown McIlvain. Could the name Mary on his marriage cert to Annie Blain have been Mary Rosina but she was known as Rosina? I am trying to get my head around everything thats been posted :) Am I right in thinkng that the parents - William and Rosina, were from Ireland? Apologies, I am very much an amateur at this.
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Welcome to RootsChat :)
There is a baptism of a William Mcilvain on 8 Nov 1870 Dalziel with parents William and Ann Blam Or Blane
1871 Living in Dalziel
William Mcilvin 24 Railway Breakerman b Ayrshire, Laltent?
Amy Mcilvin 26 b Lanarkshire, Glasgow
John Mcilvin 2
William Mcilvin 4 months
Thomas H Walker 2 Boarder
Kay
Another question - Thomas H walker 2 boarder - went to South Africa with the family and died under the name THW McKelvin 1886 to 1887. Is there a way to research his possible adoption in Scotland? (For clarity, The McIlvain name became McKelvin in South Africa)
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Just putting this into the 'pot'
There's an interesting family on the 1851 in Ardrossan
Transcription only ~
William Mcilone, 40, lab
Rosina, wife, 40
Barnard, 15
Elisabeth, 12
John, 10
Marrion, 7
William, 5
Hugh, under 1, b. Saltcoats
All but Hugh, b. Ireland
In the 1861, Ardrossan, William and Rose Ann/Rosina are down a Mcilwain and only Hugh is with them.
Gadget
This must be the correct family as William (dob 1846) had a daughter named Mary Rosina Brown McIlvain. Could the name Mary on his marriage cert to Annie Blain have been Mary Rosina but she was known as Rosina? I am trying to get my head around everything thats been posted :) Am I right in thinkng that the parents - William and Rosina, were from Ireland? Apologies, I am very much an amateur at this.
The census have them born in Ireland but Ive not been able to find them in the Irish records.
Gadget
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thank you :)
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Here are some relevant posts:
Welcome to Rootschat :)
Marriage certificate of 13 July 1867, Dalziel, has his parents as William McIlvain, mariner* and Mary, Maiden Surname Ross.
William's age was 22 and his occupation was given as a wire fencer(?)
Living Motherwell at time of marriage.
Gadget
* now think it's mason
added for completeness - Annie's paretns were Thomas Blain, Butler and Ann MS Galloaway
Hi again Gadget
Is it possible to find out more about this family please? Annie Blain's parents, Thomas and Anne (Galloway)
Thanks.
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Hi fabfam
Was it just the Blain family that you would like more info on? I mis-typed the MS of Annie's mother, Ann Blain, It's Galloway. The marriage cert suggests that they are still living at the time. Have you got access to the censuses on FamilySearch, for e.g.?
Gadget
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There's a marriage for Thomas Blain and Ann Galloway in Barony (Glasgow) on 15 December 1843
Gadget
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This might be the family in 1851, given that Annie was b.Glasgow:
Carscullan, Kirkoswald, Carrick, Ayrshire
Thomas Blain, 41, farmer of 20 acres, b. Maybole
Ann, 31, b. Monzie, Perthshire
James, s, 10, b. Crieff
Ann, s, 7, b. Glasgow
Thomas, s, 4, b. Kirkoswald
Robert, s, 2, b. -do-
John, s, under 1, b. -do-
Gadget
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Same family i n 1861:
Gowancroft, Kirkoswald
Thomas Blain, 51, gentleman's servant*, b. Maybole
Ann, 46, b. Monzie, Perthshire
James, s, 20, Ag Lab b. Crieff
Ann, s, 17, Ag Lab, b. Glasgow
Thomas, s, 4, b. Kirkoswald
Robert, s, 12, b. -do-
John, s, 10, b. -do-
Quintin, s, 7, b. -do-
Catherine, d, 5, b. -do-
Peter, s, 2, b.-do-
* ties in with Butler on marriage cert of Annie.
Gadget
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A possible baptism for Thomas (the only one showing on SPfor around his age on censuses)
13 Oct 1811, Newton on Ayr
Thomas Blain son of John Blain and Jean Watt
Gadget
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I wonder if this is Ann's baptism
21 January 1816, Monzie
Agnes daughter of Joseph Galloway and Isabel White.
Need both Thomas and Ann's death certs to find out if these are the correct parents. I'm not finding anything likely at the moment.
Gadget
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1871
Pathhead Cottages, Dailly
Thomas Blaine, 61, domestic servant (unemployed), b. Maybole
Ann, 52, b. Perthshire
Robert, s, 22,railway labourer, b. Kirkoswald
Peter, 12, b. -do-
AND :)
Catherine Galloway, mother in law, widow, 77, b. Perthshire
So maybe not the Monzie, bpt. - will check on Catherine on earlier censuses.
Gadget
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Most likely for Catherine
1841
Watergate, Perth
James Gallaway, 70-74, Porter, b. Scotland
Catherine, 35-39, b. Perthshire
1851
Dovecotland, Perth
Catherine Galloway, 50, winder, b. Dunkeld
Not sure of the 1861 ones.
Gadget
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Looking at the FS tree again:
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/K2HH-GD5
I see that one of the daughters is named Catherine Imrie McIlvain. Maybe Catherine, M in Law, on the 1871 was an Imrie.
Gadget
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I'm looking now at all the children's names listed on the tree. They certainly match with the census, etc. findings:
All surnames McIlvain or McKelvin
John 1868
Tom 1869
William 1870
Annie Galloway 1873
Elizabeth 1875
Catherine Imrie 1877
Mary Rosina Brown 1879
James Robert Jefrey 1882
Jane Kirkwood Brown 1884
Quentin Blain 1886
Neil Imrie 1889
Gadget
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yes, Blain family. I will have a look at census - must confess I haven't looked that far with them - my interest has been piqued through this discussion
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Same family i n 1861:
Gowancroft, Kirkoswald
Thomas Blain, 51, gentleman's servant*, b. Maybole
Ann, 46, b. Monzie, Perthshire
James, s, 20, Ag Lab b. Crieff
Ann, s, 17, Ag Lab, b. Glasgow
Thomas, s, 4, b. Kirkoswald
Robert, s, 12, b. -do-
John, s, 10, b. -do-
Quintin, s, 7, b. -do-
Catherine, d, 5, b. -do-
Peter, s, 2, b.-do-
* ties in with Butler on marriage cert of Annie.
Gadget
Thanks Gadget - the right family as I recognise family names used for William & Annie McIlvain's children
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Same family i n 1861:
Gowancroft, Kirkoswald
Thomas Blain, 51, gentleman's servant*, b. Maybole
Ann, 46, b. Monzie, Perthshire
James, s, 20, Ag Lab b. Crieff
Ann, s, 17, Ag Lab, b. Glasgow
Thomas, s, 4, b. Kirkoswald
Robert, s, 12, b. -do-
John, s, 10, b. -do-
Quintin, s, 7, b. -do-
Catherine, d, 5, b. -do-
Peter, s, 2, b.-do-
* ties in with Butler on marriage cert of Annie.
Gadget
Thanks Gadget - the right family as I recognise family names used for William & Annie McIlvain's children
Thanks so much - this is gold, i feel very 'bonded' to this side of my family and now have great leads to work on my tree. Much appreciated!
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If you need anything else, just give a shout.
I see I've made Ann a s(on) on the 1861! Sorry about that.
Gadget
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thanks Gadget :)
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A bit more:
Death 28th November 1888, Dailly, Ayrshire
Ann Blain, 69, widow of Thomas Blain, Labourer, Poundland
Parents - William Gallaway, under gardener and Catherine, MS Imrie
Cause - old age and debility, certified
Informant - Thomas Blain, son. Island of Rum.
Gadget
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1871 Living in Dalziel
William Mcilvin 24 Railway Breakerman b Ayrshire, Laltent?
Amy Mcilvin 26 b Lanarkshire, Glasgow
John Mcilvin 2
William Mcilvin 4 months
Thomas H Walker 2 Boarder
Another question - Thomas H walker 2 boarder - went to South Africa with the family and died under the name THW McKelvin 1886 to 1887. Is there a way to research his possible adoption in Scotland? (For clarity, The McIlvain name became McKelvin in South Africa)
Don't mean to muddle you Gadget, but I'd forgot about this query & don' think it's been answered?
Too early for legal adoptions but I think this is his birth if you need to find out his connection (possibly a relative through illegitimacy)?
WALKER THOMAS HILL 1867
595/ 218 Irvine
Annie
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Thanks both :)
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Strange that I can't locate a death for Thomas Blain or Catherine Galloway MS. Imrie, so far.
Both were dead when Ann Blain (Ms Galloway) dies in 1888.
*Need to check on children of William Galloway and Catherine Imrie for Ann's siblings, in case she died with one of them. Aged 77 on 1871.
* I recall seeing Thomas on 1881 - so he would likely have died 1881-1888
:-\