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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: brigidmac on Monday 25 June 18 21:29 BST (UK)
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If anyone can help me decide if these records are the same man and then how to find his age place of birth or next of kin I.d be very grateful
I don't understand the references but can guess some .
So the printed document is the clearest
It has
AlFred Thomas Chaplin R.A.S.C mz/182023 regiment number
Field of war service in Victory
Discharged 13.2 1919
The 2nd document is hand written
Chaplin Alfred T RASC /10127
Sublist rasc3531 ?
Corps ASC rank Pte
In remarks it has disc. Looks like Olisc but I think it's short 4 discharged
Any help gratefully received
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Hi
What else do you know about the target of your research?
How did you get to identify/point to him?
Ray
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My
ALFRED THOMAS CHAPLIN
b Fulham 20thFeb 1886 or 1888
1911 a cab driver living 20 st olafs road fulham
With father also cabdriver
Mother Eliza C
I thought the word in remarks on hand written document might say driver
Married Caroline Ann Bradford
1913
There is another alfed Thomas Chaplin born 27april 1888 London
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Only might be him cos of the names ...grandson believes he served in 1st
World war
But I am interested in understanding those documents even if it's not him
Do the numbers indicate a location of the regiment ?
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An ASC man with the number M2 (not MZ) 182023 has a medal card with the Victory and British War medal. He also has a Silver War Badge on the ASC list 3531, discharged wounded 13 Feb 1919.
The two notes therefore would appear to relate to the same person. The only other record I find for that man is an appearance on an ASC casualty list dated 22 Sep 1917. No unit given. Enlisted 19 May 1916.
No service record is apparent, probably lost in the 60% of records that did not survive WW2 bombing, so no personal identification.
MaxD
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Answering the question about the numbers - they do not indicate which unit of the ASC he served with.
MaxD
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Thank you ..
one of the records was a medals list
But as the printed one said field of service Victory ..I thought that was not a medal
And I thought British referred to nationality
I thought there was no date on handwritten one but printing at bottom has some numbers and letters including 10/19 which could be month and year
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Sorry to be ignorant but I don't know what ASC man means
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Hi
How does he fit into your family?
Would you give the family before/after/around him?
Ray
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He.s my brother in laws grandfather
Not sure what you mean parents and wife ?
Children were ivy Chaplin b 1914
Joan M Chaplin b1922 Eric Alfred b1923
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Sorry ..Fathers name was Alfred b1867 Newton Suffolk
Younger siblings were James 1890
William 1893
Rosa 1895
Eliza Caroline born 1904
All born Fullham
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The boys were in the Hackney cab driving business .I suppose drivers were needed in WW1 that's why of all technical Alfred T.s I noticed this one
I don't know what the chances are of him being correct 1
It's my first look at military records
PS stumbled across a ceremony for rememberance week today
So peace and goodwill to all
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The details about this man are on Ancestry I don't know if you can access this link if you are not a member
Or if it is open to public yet
..the privacy settings don't take effect immediately
The military records I found are referenced there ...
And I downloaded a pic of the word that was hard to decipher. .."driver ...or disc "
The link is on reply 44 of this thread
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=795730.msg6525454#msg6525454
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ASC is the Army Service Corps, a vast organisation with many different units. www.longlongtrail.co.uk/army/regiments-and-corps/the-army-service-corps-in-the-first-world-war/
His number prefix M2 says he was with a Mechanical Transport unit.
It seems someone has copied out the details on the medal card. I can't tell from this or your other thread whether you have seen the medal card itself which is at the National Archives and on Ancestry. If you have then you have seen all there is to be found for that man. If not, shout.
MaxD
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Is the someone on Ancestry. .me ?
I tried to copy documents but didn't think I'd been successful
Tried to copy the bit with the word " drive"
Mechanical transport corps but there is another Alfred T Chaplin cab driver born 1888 I think he was a cousin .
Did you see those 2 records and have any more information from the refs ?
Either way we now know the 2 documents relate to same man .
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Thanks so much for your patience and explanations max
How do I know if it is original medal card or copieD?
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As you have Ancestry, this link should take you to what is the genuine original medal card which has all the markings you posted at the beginning:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/1262/30850_A000308-00818?pid=1602078&backurl=https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DJdV5940%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource%26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26indiv%3D1%26dbid%3D1262%26gsfn%3Dalfred%26gsln%3Dchaplin%26cp%3D4%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26redir%3Dfalse%26gss%3Dangs-d%26pcat%3D39%26fh%3D20%26h%3D1602078%26recoff%3D9%252011%26ml_rpos%3D21&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=JdV5940&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true
In their transcription, Ancestry have seen fit to render M2 as MN and his middle initial is given as T.
The writing on the card in the column headed Roll is the location of the ASC medal roll in which he appears and from which the card is produced. The roll entry is here:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interactive/5119/41629_625537_9858-00039?pid=2373937&backurl=https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DJdV5943%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource%26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26indiv%3D1%26dbid%3D5119%26gsfn%3Dalfred%26gsln%3Dchaplin%26cp%3D4%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26redir%3Dfalse%26gss%3Dangs-d%26pcat%3D39%26fh%3D20%26h%3D2373937%26recoff%3D5%25207%26ml_rpos%3D21&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=JdV5943&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true
This gives his full name as Alfred Thomas Chaplin.
The other record is on FindMyPast and that is the Silver War Badge listing (note the medal card has the ASC number 3531). This doesn't have the list number (3531) but that is on the transcription.
That is at:
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/transcript?id=GBM/SILVERWAR/BADGES/799991
So all these are Alfred Thomas Chaplin. However, they don't, as said, have any personal detail to identify him as to family/place of birth etc.
I haven't had any success in finding the other Alfred T, cab driver, 1888 - can you direct me to what you have there please and we'll see what we make of it.
See next post
MaxD
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I now see the Alfred Thomas Chaplin born Q2 1888 Fulham son of Alfred. Both cab drivers in 1911. (I was looking in miltary records).
Circumstantial but it was exceedingly common for men who could already drive to be snapped up by the Mechanical Transport side of the ASC. Car ownership among the working classes at that time was almost unknown so men already trained for the army's needs got the MT side off to a good start.
Can't prove it but my money is on the Fulham man being the one for whom the medal records exist.
MaxD
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Thanks so much
The ancestry records were the ones I find
I can't get into the find my past ones