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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Gloucestershire => Topic started by: Cienna on Friday 29 June 18 08:38 BST (UK)
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Looking for a marriage for Samuel (Edward?) Harding, he was born to Henry Harding and Ann Jane Norman, I have been given some info but it doesn't fit with other families info.
Thank you in advance.
Regards
Cienna.
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Any dates to give us a clue? ;D
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Any idea as to when he was born and whereabouts in Gloucestershire?
Emeltom
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Thank you emeltom and KGarrad for your reply, as far as I know Samuel was born at Bristol, Gloucester, I have a birth of October 1849 but not sure if it's correct, he also had a number of siblings.
John, George, Frederick, Isabella, Louisa, Clara, Bessie, Lilly, Florence and William.
Regards
Cienna.
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I can find two marriages for a Samuel Edward Harding
7 September 1875 Temple Church Bristol to Isabella Abraham
GRO ref Sep 1875 Bristol 6a 119
6 February 1899 Bristol St Jude to Clara Salome Gabriel
Gro Ref Mar 1899 Bristol 6a 185
On the marriage to Clara Samuel is a Widower and in both marriages his father is down as Samuel.
Both marriages fit with the Census details I have found. Samuel is a butcher.
How certain are you of the names of his parents?
Emeltom
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Have found a marriage for a Samuel James Harding to an Alice Rand 22 January 1880 in Barton Regis. Samuel's father is Henry. However his age is given as 22 which gives a yob of 1858
GRO Ref
Mar 1880 Barton Regis 6a 189
Emeltom
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Thank you both, the marriage I have for Samuel is with Isabella Abraham and a second with Clara Salome GABRIEL.
This is this info I was given but have not added them to my family due to being unsure, I have Samuel down as a son to Henry Harding, can someone please do a check for me on the children of the couple?.
Thank you
Cienna.
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Samuel Edward Harding born 1.10.1849 Bristol was son of Samuel Harding and wife Lois (Louisa) Brittan and did have the siblings you mention.
The only Henry/Ann Norman marriage I can find was a Henry Harden and Ann Norman married 12/2/1827 Bedminster, Somerset??
A plain Samuel Harding baptised 17/10/1848 Bristol, son of a Henry and Ann SO 2 Samuel's born a year apart in Bristol, 1848 one plain Samuel, son of Henry and 1849 one Samuel Edward, son of Samuel.
Annette
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Thank you Annette,
The info for I have Henry is.......Henry Harding married Anne Jane Norman, May 19, 1924 in St Marys, Lewisham, Kent, England.
Not sure if this is even right, so all the children do not belong to this couple except for Samuel and my great grandfather George James......so much confusion, wondering why they married in Kent and then returned to Gloucester and had the children.....the mind boggle.
Regards
Cienna
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Not sure if this is even right, so all the children do not belong to this couple except for Samuel and my great grandfather George James
Can you post details of the birth registration or baptism of George please.
Debra :)
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I can see a baptism for a George James HARDING in 1834 at Westminster with parents Henry and Ann Jane. Is that the one? I am not sure what this has to do with Bristol.
Debra :)
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Yes, that is him, thank you Debra, the info I was given for George James is that he was born in Bristol, Gloucester, England, and that his parents were Henry and Ann Jane....he married Ellen Paxton in Middlesex.
Are there any siblings for George?
Regards
Cienna
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George had a twin....
St Mary, Bryanston Square, Westminster (parish of Marylebone)
Baptised 2 Feb 1834
Born 13 Oct 1833
George James son of Henry and Ann Jane HARDING
Henry William son of Henry and Ann Jane HARDING
Abode: 2 Seymour Place
Father's occupation: Servant
Debra :)
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I don't know if you have the right person here. I cannot see a marriage anywhere between a George HARDING and Ellen PAXTON. The George James as baptised to Henry and Ann Jane looks to have married Ellen BALDEN in 1871 in Camberwell. He is a waiter and he names his father as Henry HARDING a gentleman's servant.
Their children were Ellen Jane born 1872, Florence Harriet born 1873, Ada Sophia born 1874, George James David born 1875 (died 1880), Lucy Elizabeth born 1878 (died 1878), and Grace born 1883 (died 1884).
Henry and Ellen in census records:
1871 (with wife and mother Ann J)
Class: RG10; Piece: 737; Folio: 12; Page: 17
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VRN9-VV8
1881
Class: RG11; Piece: 672; Folio: 6; Page: 3
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q277-MFYP
1891 George is a widower
Class: RG12; Piece: 464; Folio: 89; Page: 71
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QZV3-6T2
1901
Class: RG13; Piece: 494; Folio: 134; Page: 44
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9CV-J5P
1911
Class: RG14; Piece: 2498
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XW51-MCJ
Debra :)
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Perhaps if you come forward and tell us about your George we can help trace back to the right person. Who were his children?
Debra :)
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From what I am seeing on Ancestry trees a George James Harding is shown as married to an Ellen Elizabeth Paxton in 1878 Oatlands, Tasmania, and that he died there 3/4/1894. Is this who you are referring to?
If so, he is not the man who was son of Henry Harding and Ann Jane Norman - this George was already married to an Ellen in 1871 census and his mother was living with them. Indeed, he is still in UK in 1881. (George James Harding married Ellen Balden 20/2/1871 Camberwell).
Indeed, something is very wrong with the various trees I've looked at with conflicting information and links to uk census when he was apparently in Tasmania?? Also finding it difficult to substantiate the actual events in Tasmania.
One certain fact is that the George James Harding who died 1894 Tasmania is not the man bc.1833, son of Henry Harding and Ann Jane Norman.
Annette
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Let's start again. This is apparently the marriage cert for George's son in Tasmania:
https://stors.tas.gov.au/RGD37-1-60p208j2k
William was born in New Brompton around 1870.
Debra :)
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Thank you Annette and Debra.....this is all so confusing, to begin with George James, I have him as being born Bristol, Gloucester, England in 1834, he married Ellen Elizabeth Paxton in Hillingdon, Middlesex, England, 19 March 1871.
Their first child William James was born Newbrompton, Kent, England, around 1870?, the rest of their children as far as I know were born in Tasmania, Australia, George James (jnr) being my grandfather, was born Oatlands, Tasmania in 1887.
I have nothing for George and Ellen while still in England, I was hoping to find more children born there due to being a 5 year gap between William and their next child...Matilda born in Tasmania.
Regards
Cienna
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I'm sorry but the marriage you state 19/3/1871 Hillingdon is not for a George James Harding to Ellen Elizabeth Paxton - it is for a plain George Harding son of a Joseph Harding, who married an Eliza Gobel??
There is no marriage listed between Harding and Paxton in the UK at all. There was no George James Harding born in Bristol can. 1834 and no William James Harding or Paxton bc.1870 in New Brompton.
Where does the information that George James Harding was born in Bristol come from?
It's all very odd as nothing can be substantiated.
Annette
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William James HARDING, born 1870 New Brompton is the brother of my grandfather and their parents are George James Harding and Ellen Elizabeth Paxton, New Brompton is named as the birth place of William when he married in Tasmania...it's stated on his marriage certificate.
I was given Bristol as the birth place for George and I have had it for a number of years and it also comes from the late daughter of William.
This is really confusing now, thank you for taking the time to help.
Regards
Cienna.
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You are wanting to account for possible HARDING - PAXTON births between 1870 and 1875?
Is this death, 9 Jul 1939, at Launceston, your Ellen Elizabeth HARDING?
The Mercury 10 Jul 1939
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/25596273?
The death certificate would ask for......years in the colony...….issue...…
Issue would be given as number of males / females, alive, deceased.
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I can see a baptism for a George James HARDING in 1834 at Westminster with parents Henry and Ann Jane. Is that the one? I am not sure what this has to do with Bristol.
Debra :)
I realise you have proved this is not the right George but just to add to that proof
Departure from England 27 Nov 1872. ship Clairellen, for Hobart
George 27 , Ellen 24 and William 2.
So George born about 1844/5 not 1834
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I saw that document and George's age differs greatly from his death record.
https://stors.tas.gov.au/RGD35-1-63p136j2k
Many people fibbed about their age to qualify for the various assistance schemes, but equally many informants got the age wrong when someone died, so it is difficult to know which is correct unless another mention of his age can be found.
Ellen's death notice says that she was born in Ramsgate but IF she was the daughter of Mark PAXTON and Matilda MILLS then she was born in Leicestershire, though her family did live in Ramsgate at some stage as a brother was born there. She is still at home with the family in April 1871 with no sign of an infant and 18 months later she was leaving England with George. The PAXTON family stayed in Kent but she could have gone anywhere in that time period.
There was no marriage so he possibly already had a family. I would be looking at all the George HARDINGs born between 1830 and 1850 to see if any were railway workers in April 1871.
Debra :)
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I don't know why they have her born in Ramsgate in her obituary, I have always had her birth place as
Leicester, and her parents being Mark and Matilda.
When George died in 1894 his death certificate has his age as 61 years so this would have him born around 1833, there is also no marriage for the pair in Tasmania so I am at a loss, I will do as you suggest and do a search for George in the years mentioned.
Thank you so much for your help, it's very much appreciated.
kind Regards
Cienna :)
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Hi All
I have just joined and I'm tracing my family tree my Great Great grandfather was called Samuel Edward Harding and I am wondering if anyone else on here is related to him.
Samuel was born 1 October 1849 Crown Court Lodgings Temple Bristol and died 6 December 1929 Carhay, Redcliffe, Bristol 13 siblings! I have a family tree up to my mum and if I can put photos on here I will upload it (of Samuel's first and second family)
Melanie
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Hello Melanie
I am distantly related to Samuel Edward Harding's first wife Elizabeth Isabella Abraham. She is my 2nd Cousin 3 x removed. So her children are my 3rd Cousins 2 x removed. Her maternal Great Grandparents are my 4 x Great Grandparents.
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How can I reply to a message privately?
If I were to put my email address on here will everyone be able to see it?
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Please do not publish your email address as it is viewable by anyone, the safe way is to exchange a private message (PM) you do this by clicking on the right hand round button that appears below the username of the person you are wishing to contact.
Regards
Sarah
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Lovely thank you
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Hello Melanie,
Mollymoofer was online yesterday evening, hopefully they will reply to your message soon.
Regards
Sarah