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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lincolnshire => Topic started by: Nigel Porter on Wednesday 04 July 18 21:46 BST (UK)
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My GG Grandmother Ann Cox married Charles Porter in Howell on 14th May 1832 and I've found the marriage on Lincs to the Past and other sources, but the entry does not show her father. On the various censuses her birth date varies between 1805 and 1806 and her place of birth also varies with Heckington in 1851 and then Great Hale in 1861 and 1871. I can't find a matching baptism anywhere in Lincolnshire for those years, but there is one from Heckington for 6th July 1803, with parents Benjamin and Elisabeth, so if I can find am alternative record of the marriage with Benjamin listed it would go some way to confirming I had the right Ann Cox. Any suggestions?
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Marriages before the start of civil registration in 1837 do not show names of fathers.
Annette
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The witnesses could be relatives. Also, the names of their children might give clues. Did Benjamin have any other children or did he leave a will?
Just a few possible lines of investigation.
Gadget
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I see from the 1851 census their second son was called Benjamin and first daughter was Elizabeth, so it does look as if Benjamin and Elizabeth could well be Ann's parents.
Gadget
Add - ref is HO107/2101/217/55
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from image
entry no 13
Marriage Howell Lincs
Charles Porter of this Parish Bachelor
Ann Cox of this Parish Spinster
were married by Banns
consent of necessary parties
married by Chas de la Cour curate
witnesses Ann Vickers (signed) William Trollop (made his mark) & W Squire ??K (he witnessed others on the page}
Suz
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I see from the 1851 census their second son was called Benjamin and first daughter was Elizabeth, so it does look as if Benjamin and Elizabeth could well be Ann's parents.
Add - ref is HO107/2101/217/55
1841
Church street, Heckington
HO107/619/13/12/16
Benjamin Cox, 64, Ag Lab, b. County
William, 35, ag lab, -do-
And what looks like a son/poss brother - with similar named children to Ann and Charles
HO107/619/13/35/13
Gadget
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There is an online tree that gives Ann (1803- 1880)as the daughter of Benjamin Cox (1778-1846) and Elizabeth Mann (1775-1835)
I'm always sceptical about online trees but it looks well researched.
Gadget
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Benjamin Cox of Heckington married Elizabeth Mann of Kirkby Laythorpe at Kirkby Laythorpe on 17 May 1802.
(I don't think the Benjamin b. circa 1800 was the son of Benjamin snr and brother of Ann. His father was probably a Joseph.)
Gadget
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This is her burial, which gives her birth as 1803:
Annie Porter
All Saints, Rotherham
Age: 77
Birth year: 1803
Burial date: 31 Mar 1880
However the GRO has her Born c1805:
PORTER, ANN 75
GRO Reference: 1880 M Quarter in ROTHERHAM Volume 09C Page 374
David
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It probably depends on who the informant is . The tree that I found has the death as 1880, Rotherham and bpt 1803, Heckington. The children's names fit very well into the most popular naming pattern.
I'm not familiar with that part of Lincolnshire but the map shows that Heckington and Great Hale are fairly close*
Gadget
* 1.1 miles according to google!
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In 1871, she is living with son, Benjamin, in Rotherham. I see that she was a few years older than Charles (censuses have him as born 1811), which could also explain her flexible dob.
Gadget
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Thanks to all who have replied. I have a different burial date of February 18th 1880 which is from the Whiston parish records and shows her as 75, which is consistent with the 1805 birth on a few censuses. She lived in Whiston for many years, having moved to Yorkshire by 1861 (not sure why?) and lived with her son Benjamin. Her daughter Sarah Ann also lived in Whiston so I assume there was work there when times were tough in Heckington. Her son Benjamin lived until 1938 when he was 94 and I've been in touch with his descendants.
All the observations made suggest Ann Cox is the daughter of Benjamin and Elisabeth, but I suspect I'll never be able to it.
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This thread has also made me check that branch again and I've discovered I'd made the cardinal sin of assumption and had the wrong marriage for Benjamin Porter (Ann Cox's son). That's the good news, the bad news is I can't find his real marriage to Ann (who's surname I don't know)!
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The GRO birth index for son Joseph Charles, Rotherham, 1868 has mother's maiden name as Thackry.
Gadget
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Very odd as there's a marriage on freebmd that has Benjamin Porter possibly marrying an Ann Flint, Rotherham 1866. I wonder if she was a widow :-\
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Ann Thackry married a Thomas Flint, Rotherham March 1861
Gadget
Added - a Thomas Flint died March Q 1863, Rotherham
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Marriage entry of July 23 1866, Rotherham
Benjamin Porter 24, bach, farmer,living Rotherham. Father Charles Porter, Vet surgeon?
and
Ann Flint, 26, widow, living Rotherham. Father Joseph Thackry, Farmer
Gadget
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Marriage entry of July 23 1866, Rotherham
Benjamin Porter 24, bach, farmer,living Rotherham. Father Charles Porter, Vet surgeon?
and
Ann Flint, 26, widow, living Rotherham. Father Joseph Thackry, Farmer
Gadget
Given that the first son listed on the census was a Joseph Charles, it seems a likely marriage :)
Gadget
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Hi Gadget, Thanks for your help and I've checked again and I was right first time and the marriage you highlight from July 23rd 1866 is the correct one. What threw me was the claim that Charles Porter (father of Benjamin) was a vet, when he was at best a hostler/horse dealer! Looking at the GRO birth index Mary Ann Porter (b. 16/2/1867) was recorded with Flint as the mothers name, whilst the next 3 have Thackry, so not sure why the change? There is also a fifth child missing as the 1911 census records 5 with 3 living and I know Lucy Ellen died in 1875, but so far I've not found them.
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Ann and Thomas Flint had a daughter Emma (b. 1/12/1861) and who I think died in 1867, so perhaps she was the 5th child?
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On the 1881, Emma is listed as step daughter to Benjamin. b.c. 1862.
RG11/4674/55/9
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Have you checked for inter-census births and deaths? Otherwise I'd say that Emma was counted in 1911.
(Emma) - b.c. 1862.
Joseph C -b.c. 1868
Mary A - b.c. 1867
Lucy E - b.c. 1870
Martha - b.c. 1873
Gadget
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I've just checked and find that those listed are the only ones registered.
Emma as Flint and the others as Porter, so it does look as if Emma was counted in the five.
Gadget
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I have found the marriage for Emma Flint to George Marshall in Whiston on 1st August 1881 and they had a son Horace George who was born on 8th August 1882, but it looks like Emma died in August as there is a burial for an Emma Marshall aged 20 on August 17th, which suggest she died in childbirth. The baptism record for Horace George on August 28th shows his parents as George and Emma so not sure if this signifies that she was still alive, but does have the initial PB alongside it and this signifies a private baptism, which was often used when a baby was not expected to survive and there is a burial for Horace George in Whiston on 7th December 1882.