RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Northamptonshire => Topic started by: K Bowden on Saturday 21 July 18 19:53 BST (UK)
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Hi
I have a relative - Harriet / Harriot Buswell who died 1n 1850 aged 27 , registered in the Brixworth District, according to the GRO. However I have also found a grave stone for her in the Baptist Cemetery in Clipston, which says she is 29 years old.
The reason I think this may be the one and the same person is that I have found a marriage registration for her to Edward Buswell, (they both have the same surname, as I checked on the GRO's mothers maiden name for their 3 children) he was born in Clipston. She died just after the birth of her third child, and her husband remarried several years later - thereby perhaps being buried with her parents?
(She married Edward in 1845, registered in Market Harborough)
I found an 1841 census record for a Harriet Buswell with George Rowlson, Alice Rowlson and a Henry Buswell. Further searching on Alice Rowlson on the 1851 census identified her as the aunt of Henry Buswell, so perhaps she is the sister or aunt of Harriet. Both Henry and Alice were born in Clipston.
So I am wondering if I have found the names of Harriet's parents - or is there any easier way to do this?
many thanks
Karen
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Ages on the GRO / gravestones are only as good as the person giving the information which in some cases is not very accurate at all.
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The ages on death certs and grave stones are only as good as the knowledge of the person giving the information. Back in the day a lot of people could not read or write and I would imagine that any numerical skills were limited as well so how certain were people about their age.
When searching for someone using a year of birth I always search at least two years either side if not five. Without a birth certificate giving a date of registration/birth it is impossible to believe that what you read is correct.
Emeltom
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Thanks, pretty obvious if I had thought about it :D
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If Harriet's name was added to a family grave some time later,then her age may have become a bit mixed up.
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I have a member of my family in more recent times who were all literate & the date of death on the MI was inscribed wrongly (out by a yr) i.e. errors do occur but whether the info. given was wrong at the time, I don't know?
In times of grief etc. it's very easy to err (I did it myself on an occasion)!!
When my uncle passed away in Canada (although born in Scotland), I dealt with the dates from our Scottish records as his DoB was out on Canadian Records i.e. I had to confirm the 'actual' birth date but as time was of the essence & myself in grief, I had paid for the cert. (debit by phone) as I needed the info. then given over the phone & the date his birth was registered was what I'd given to my Canadian relative as I didn't have the cert. in front of me.
The details were for my Canadian relative for an obituary & it was only after I received the cert. which was after the obituary etc. was done, I realised the error!
This was in 2004!
Annie
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All information is prone to errors for example on a gravestone "February 31st 1898"
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/stone.html
Or on a copy marriage certificate, maiden name Imy rather than Guy even though the register entry is clear.
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/marr_cert.html
Mistakes happen in all walks of life
Cheers
Guy
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All information is prone to errors for example on a gravestone "February 31st 1898"
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/stone.html
Or on a copy marriage certificate, maiden name Imy rather than Guy even though the register entry is clear.
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/marr_cert.html
Mistakes happen in all walks of life
Guy, sorry I didn't pick up on the 1st example "February 31st 1898" (not sure what the error was/is)?
Although I did find the marriage one to be a strange error.
Annie
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On visiting my grandfather's grave for the first time since childhood I noticed that his age at death was given as 60. Not until I had driven half way home did my brain start to register that something was wrong. He had been born in 1866 and died in 1935. I'll leave you to do the arithmatic.
What has puzzled me ever since was that none of his children picked up the error at the time the stone was commissioned. The youngest was in her thirties by then.
Keith
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Guy, sorry I didn't pick up on the 1st example "February 31st 1898" (not sure what the error was/is)?
Although I did find the marriage one to be a strange error.
Annie
February only has 28 days ,29 every 4 years,but never 31 ;D
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All information is prone to errors for example on a gravestone "February 31st 1898"
http://anguline.co.uk/cert/stone.html
I can see why that may have happened.
Q: When did she die?
A. Last day in February.
The stone mason obviously didn't know the rhyme did he? ;D ;D Unless of course it is the month that is wrong and it should have been January.
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Hi
I have a relative - Harriet / Harriot Buswell who died 1n 1850 aged 27 , registered in the Brixworth District, according to the GRO. However I have also found a grave stone for her in the Baptist Cemetery in Clipston, which says she is 29 years old.
Hi Karen
Have you tried to trace the Baptist Burial Register, perhaps it survives in a nearby Archive, or University Archive or still with the Baptists and perhaps there is an extra snippet of information in the Register, that would clinch it!
Couldn't find an 1845 Burial of my Selby Ancestor. Numerous Parish Church Burial Registers were searched on films. Five Private Cemetery Company Registers and other Nonconformists Burial Grounds searched (not online), nothing matched.
The named Arbitrator / Umpire in the Will (a Quaker) and my ancestor's property records indicated that some other parties involved in property transfers had the same names as local Quakers.
After several enquiries the Quakers had buried him right under my nose at Selby, as "Not in Membership" in their burial ground! The Selby Quaker Burial Registers (1845 images NOT online) were tucked away in a 50,000 plus - Registers, Volumes and items etc. - Quaker Collection Deposit at Leeds University Special Collections.
Eventually the Burial Register entry and others were traced and I've had colour images of all the family that the Quakers buried at Selby, all stated as "Not in Membership", except William who later converted to Quakerism.
It was great to bring a conclusion to the burial mystery and see the record images, but in this case no record gave any clue as to who my mystery ancestor (George Hood) was.
A later visit to see the York Quaker Records and the Monthly Meeting Minutes, indicated my ancestor had tried to join the Quakers 1836, but had been refused.
The search goes on.
Happy hunting, Mark
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Thanks for all your help, it turned out the error was with me! I had worked out her age from the census, then had got that mixed up with GRO. Lesson learnt - check check and check again
Karen ;D
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Date of birth is secondary information on gravestones and death certs, only what someone thought they knew or were told....... so can never be trusted as factual, the primary information on a death cert is place, reason, date of death.
Two examples:
My x2 great grandmothers date of birth varies on EVERY record, she made herself older than she really was adding a couple of years to her age each record she generated...maybe because she married a much older man. I have assessed her age based on her baptism date ( parents baptised their other children within the week they were born) and the first census she was on as a child with them ( +/- 1yrs potential difference)
My great grandfathers death cert states a full name ( he was known by) but he was born with a totally different first/surname. His and his 'wifes' grave stone states the same name/date but he is not buried there he is buried 3 miles away with his second wife..... and both marriage certs he says his father is a different man, first his grandfather and second one his Uncle, neither are his father and he knew who he was ( and he was alive when he married both times)
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Why do families have to be so complicated? It's almost as though they knew we would come searching for them so decided to make things as difficult as possible.
Emeltom
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My great grandfathers death cert states a full name ( he was known by) but he was born with a totally different first/surname. His and his 'wifes' grave stone states the same name/date but he is not buried there he is buried 3 miles away with his second wife..... and both marriage certs he says his father is a different man, first his grandfather and second one his Uncle, neither are his father and he knew who he was ( and he was alive when he married both times)
and I think mine are a crazy mixed up bunch
xin
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My great grandfathers death cert states a full name ( he was known by) but he was born with a totally different first/surname. His and his 'wifes' grave stone states the same name/date but he is not buried there he is buried 3 miles away with his second wife..... and both marriage certs he says his father is a different man, first his grandfather and second one his Uncle, neither are his father and he knew who he was ( and he was alive when he married both times)
and I think mine are a crazy mixed up bunch
xin
;D ;D ;D ;D......... and no wonder we are so off the wall, must be because of our ancestors ::)
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:)
humpty dumpty mk 2 thats me
xin
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My great-uncle's death just gives his birth as "about 1915" - as he'd been married to my great-aunt for well over 30 years I thought that was pretty poor form!
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My great-uncle's death just gives his birth as "about 1915" - as he'd been married to my great-aunt for well over 30 years I thought that was pretty poor form!
Is that on the actual certificate? I don't think people were that bothered about ages years ago, they weren't constantly having to fill in forms etc giving their date of birth, so it was probably quite easy to lose track of exactly how old you or your partner was.
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Be very thankful that you were not searching for gravestone records in the area of France I visited this year. Our campsite was opposite the cemetery, so I, of course, had to go and have a look :o There were numerous burial chambers, but the only information on the majority of them was the family name. On top of each were lots of individual memorials - my father, grandfather, uncle, etc. etc. but NO details for any of them!!!
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Why do families have to be so complicated? It's almost as though they knew we would come searching for them so decided to make things as difficult as possible.
Emeltom
Agreed.
My unconfirmed birth ancestor, even had three 1845 newspaper Death Notices, but rather than say Son of, it went on that he was liked by everyone who knew him.
Yes, "known by" means the reader of the document probably doesn't have his name, or full name, but an alias name, or partial alias.
Agreed, our Ancestors havn't always made things easy xinia.
The age in the Census can be very approximate and vary from one Census to the next (age rounded down in the 1841 Census for some) and dying before the 1851 Census can be another nuisance.
Mark