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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Cockneyrebel on Tuesday 24 July 18 12:43 BST (UK)

Title: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Tuesday 24 July 18 12:43 BST (UK)
The above were 2 of the 9 children of John Joseph Curwood (1835-1893) and Sophia Rosser (1841-1884), I've found bmd's for the other 7 but these 2 elude me. Florence was on the 1881 and 1891 censuses and on latter as a visitor with her sister, Ada, in Marylebone  to John T Allen and his family. A few Anc trees record her as Florence M but I don't know how the M comes in?
Arthur was on the 1881 and 1891 censuses, the latter with his father and new stepmother; he seems to have been in Royal Navy at St. Vincent but then discharged as unfit 1895-1896 after that he disappeared?
Cr  ???
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: rosie99 on Tuesday 24 July 18 12:55 BST (UK)
I am confused as you quote the qtr but say the birth eludes you, is it just the marriages and deaths you need
CURWOOD, FLORENCE       ROSSER     
GRO Reference: 1876  S Quarter in PANCRAS  Volume 01B  Page 172
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Kay99 on Tuesday 24 July 18 12:56 BST (UK)
Could the possible middle name for Florence come from this death??

Florence Mary  Curwood age 17
Marylebone June Qtr 1894 Vol 1a Page    359

Kay
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Annette7 on Tuesday 24 July 18 13:01 BST (UK)
Arthur Curwood - mmn Rosser - Sept.qtr.1878 Pancras (Florence already given).

Annette
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Tuesday 24 July 18 15:01 BST (UK)
The actual birth date for Florence eludes me-all I've found is the qtr and year; it seems as if she and Arthur weren't baptised or if they were the surname was recorded wrongly? Arthur's dob came from his RN record.
There 1 Anc tree that gives a middle name of Mary and the death that you mention but the other 6 trees are stuck like me? I suppose it's coincidental that Florence M passed in 1894 but it's not necessarily a fact especially as her birth was registered and censuses show her as plain Florence?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: avm228 on Tuesday 24 July 18 15:07 BST (UK)
What other people put in their trees is neither here nor there, unless it leads you to a reliable source record.

The 1894 Marylebone death looks a strong possibility to me, given that the Curwood family was in Marylebone in 1891 and their daughter Florence disappears thereafter.  There doesn’t seem to have been another Florence Curwood who could account for the death.  The certificate would tell you either way.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Tuesday 24 July 18 21:08 BST (UK)
Yes I'm aware that a lot of Anc trees don't have any sources for some of their 'facts' that is why I post on here to try to get the best answer I can; I want my tree to be as accurate as possible and like to check sources.
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Wednesday 25 July 18 11:51 BST (UK)
Now I wonder what happened to her brother, Arthur?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: rosie99 on Wednesday 25 July 18 12:31 BST (UK)
It might be worth looking for him on passenger lists. 

There is an Arthur Curwood going to Australia in 1892 but I don't have access to the details.

 There is also a 61 year old Arthur (home address Worthing) leaving Southampton in 1929 going to New York.  He is Arthur S Curwood so can be ignored
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Wednesday 25 July 18 13:13 BST (UK)
No drawn a blank on the travel/migration records.
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: rosie99 on Wednesday 25 July 18 13:24 BST (UK)
It might be worth you asking for a lookup on the Australia and possibly N.Z boards for the Arthur who sailed to N.S.W in 1892 or have you done so already
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Wednesday 25 July 18 14:41 BST (UK)
He was in the Royal Navy 1895-1896, discharged unfit at Portsmouth, so hardly think he could have been in NZ or Oz before then?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Les09 on Thursday 06 September 18 22:11 BST (UK)
Hi, My wife and I are researching the CURWOOD family name, mainly in the UK.

The details we have for Florence CURWOOD are :-
born - Sept qtr. 1876 GRO indexed as Florence
1881 census - RG11/213/117/19 - Florence Curwood - daughter
1891 census - RG12/90/8/11 - Florence Curwood - visitor
died Jun qtr. 1894 GRO indexed as Florence Mary Curwood

The details we have for Arthur CURWOOD are :-
born 23 Jun 1878, 5 Hadley Street, Kentish Town, Middlesex. (we have a copy of his birth certificate)
1881 census - RG11/213/117/19 - Arthur Curwood - son
1891 census - RG12/75/26/46 - Arthur Curwood - son
Travel - 19 Jun 1929 - From New York, United States  to Liverpool England (Ancestry)
died - unknown

If you would like any more information, we have a lot more on this CURWOOD line family tree with over 80 CURWOOD names listed.

Regards.
Les.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Friday 07 September 18 09:53 BST (UK)
Hi Les09,
I'm aware of Florence's details but Arthur still remains a mystery. btw according to his RN record he was born 23 Jul 1877 not June.
As you say he returned from USA 19 Jun 1929 but to a residence in Worthing, Sussex aged 51; there is another record of this man going out to Canada 3 Feb 1929 from that same address aged 61 (presume age was recorded wrongly) and retired. So it would appear that he was visiting Canada for 3 months-have you any Curwoods' in Canada/USA he could've been visiting?
However I think this is not my Arthur because he is shown on the 1939 register at same address in Worthing dob 08 Nov 1867 as Arthur S Curwood a single retired glover? Maybe he is one of your other Curwoods'?
So my Arthur still is a mystery-maybe he emigrated totally or his surname has been badly recorded somewhere after his RN career ended in 1896?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: ShaunJ on Friday 07 September 18 10:40 BST (UK)
Quote
he seems to have been in Royal Navy at St. Vincent

HMS St Vincent was a training ship permanently moored at Haslar. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_St_Vincent_(1815)
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Les09 on Saturday 08 September 18 01:05 BST (UK)
Hi Cr,
I have checked the copy of the birth certificate for Arthur and it does say June. The certificate is a hand-written copy, not a scanned image of the register entry, so it might have been mis-transcribed onto the certificate. So either June or July could be correct. Therefore, need to keep an open mind regarding his dob.

John Joseph CURWOOD was born in Jersey, Channel Islands, as were his 9 siblings and parents.
A young brother to John, George Alexander (1840-1932) emigrated to Montreal Canada in 1875 and died there.
An even younger brother to John, Henry William (1848-1908) had a son Thomas Charles (1883-abt 1973) emigrated circa 1903 to the U.S.A.  Passenger lists destination Hamilton (1903), Buffalo (1908), Pittsford New York (1914). 1930 census in Mendon New York.
So Arthur could have been visiting his uncle George on his Canadian trips, or his cousin Thomas on his U.S.A. trips.
The Arthur you mention on the 1939 register address in Worthing dob 08 Nov 1867 as Arthur S Curwood is Arthur Samuel CURWOOD, born Uffculme Devon, died 1943 Newport, Monmouthshire, residence in Richmond Surrey, eldest son of Samuel and Jane (nee KENT). A completely different line of Curwood's.

Now, you have raised an interesting situation.
The June 1929 passenger list for Arthur, stated age 51, gives the destination as 49 King Edward Avenue Worthing which is the same address as the Arthur Samuel on the 1939 Register. So, either the age is incorrect on the June 1929 passenger list, (should be 61 to match Arthur S.) or Arthur was going to stay with Arthur Samuel. You say "there is another record of this man going out to Canada 3 Feb 1929 from that same address aged 61 (presume age was recorded wrongly)".
On this evidence, I am going for :- the age on the Feb 1929 passenger list is correct; the age on the June 1929 list is incorrectly stated as 51 it should be 61 and is therefore not the Arthur the son of John Joseph; as I very much doubt there is a very close relationship between Arthur and Arthur Samuel.  There may be a distant relationship but it will mean joining our two Curwood trees several generations back.

Hopes this all makes sense.
Les.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Saturday 08 September 18 08:30 BST (UK)
Yes Les, it makes sense to me in that my Arthur didn't go to and from Canada on those dates.

Have you seen my other post regarding him on the NZ board? There is a reply there saying that an Arthur had a daughter, Maud Curwood who married  Philip Edward Thomas 9/3/1926 in Perth, WA. Is she one of your Curwoods'?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Saturday 08 September 18 08:43 BST (UK)
Here is the link to the topic on the New Zealand board....

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=800031.msg6574399#msg6574399


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Les09 on Saturday 08 September 18 20:31 BST (UK)
Hi Cr & Minnie,

Thanks for the link to your NZ posts.
That Arthur (1861-1936) and family is in yet another of our Curwood trees (we have about 40 different trees, some with only a few of families, others with lots).
However, it did provide us with the marriage details of Maud, so that was a bonus. Thank you.

Les.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Saturday 08 September 18 23:07 BST (UK)
Hello Les,

Here is another link, this time concerning the death of Philip Edward Thomas, husband of Maud Curwood. [See death notices & funeral notices]

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/49026183?searchTerm=%22philip%20edward%20thomas%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=philip+edward+thomas|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1926-01-01|||dateTo|||l-advstate=Western+Australia|||l-advcategory=Family+Notices|||sortby

Sorry Cr, not much use to you..... :)

Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Saturday 08 September 18 23:45 BST (UK)
There may be something useful here? again for Les..........

[1936]**

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/235824216?searchTerm=%22arthur%20curwood%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=arthur+curwood|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1890-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby

**Looks like the missing man was actually Arthur J.

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/235828827?searchTerm=%22arthur%20curwood%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=arthur+curwood|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1930-01-01|||dateTo=1964-12-31|||sortby

[1947]

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/234631972?searchTerm=%22arthur%20curwood%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=arthur+curwood|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1947-01-01|||dateTo=1947-12-31|||sortby

[1944]

Death of a sister of the Western Australian Mrs. Arthur Curwood?

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/43229282?searchTerm=%22arthur%20curwood%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=arthur+curwood|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1890-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/44985656?searchTerm=%22arthur%20curwood%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=arthur+curwood|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1890-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby

A Curwood marriage  [1944]………

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/44985656?searchTerm=%22arthur%20curwood%22%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20%20&searchLimits=exactPhrase=arthur+curwood|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1890-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby

Added: This death......

CURWOOD ARTHUR
19850/1963
UNKNOWN
UNKNOWN
BALMAIN [N.S.W., Australia.]

https://familyhistory.bdm.nsw.gov.au/lifelink/familyhistory/search/result?7

A couple of unknowns re parentage.


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Sunday 09 September 18 02:35 BST (UK)
Cemetery details in respect of the Arthur Curwood mentioned in my last post.........

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/123629308


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Sunday 09 September 18 02:55 BST (UK)
Cemetery details for Maud nee Curwood & Philip Edward THOMAS...........


http://www2.mcb.wa.gov.au/NameSearch/details.php?id=KB00094572

http://www2.mcb.wa.gov.au/NameSearch/details.php?id=KB00159250


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Sunday 09 September 18 08:09 BST (UK)
Hi minniehaha as usual doing a great job on researching the Australian Curwoods' but 'my' Arthur is still a mystery.
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Sunday 09 September 18 08:35 BST (UK)
Yes I'm sorry about that Cr........ :(


Minniehaha.  :)
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Les09 on Sunday 09 September 18 21:46 BST (UK)
Hi Minnie,

Many thanks for all the links.
It has been ages since we did any Australian research and the Arthur J CURWOOD and his sisters Marion and Lilley of N.S.W. we do not know of. Same with the CURWOOD-STANLEY marriage in 1944 Perth. So I have made a note of them for future reference.
Thanks,
Les.
 
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Sunday 09 September 18 22:41 BST (UK)
Hello Cr,

Re replies #20 & 21 concerning the Arthur Curwood who died in 1963. It might pay to contact the cemetery to see if they hold any further information about this man............

https://northerncemeteries.com.au/field-of-mars/find-us/

There is an e-mail address to be found there.

What's to lose?


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: jonw65 on Sunday 09 September 18 23:06 BST (UK)
Re replies #20 & 21 concerning the Arthur Curwood who died in 1963. It might pay to contact the cemetery to see if they hold any further information about this man............

He was a retired boundary rider!
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/220332143?searchTerm=%22curwood%22
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Friday 14 September 18 12:24 BST (UK)
I've e-mailed the cemetery as you suggested jon so will wait and see.
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Saturday 15 September 18 10:49 BST (UK)
Had a reply: Unfortunately, we do not have much information on this particular deceased as it was a public burial arranged by the department of Repatriation. No age or date of death is known. The only information we know is that the burial took place on 11/07/1963.
Back to the drawing board?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Wednesday 19 September 18 09:57 BST (UK)
Hello Cr,

From reply #27 we learn that although this Arthur Curwood died intestate, "an election to administer was filed". So somewhere in NSW archives, there should be court documents showing how his estate was distributed. Hopefully someone will be able to advise you as to how you might sight these documents, because something useful may be found here........


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Wednesday 19 September 18 12:05 BST (UK)
Hi minnie, can't find a way to access those records from here?
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: minniehaha on Saturday 22 September 18 03:22 BST (UK)
Hi minnie, can't find a way to access those records from here?
Cr

Hi Cr,

Re assessing the court records, you might try putting this up as a new topic on the Australia board......


Minniehaha.
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Saturday 22 September 18 08:52 BST (UK)
Hi Minnie, have done that and can be found at http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=800866.new#new
Cr
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: jonw65 on Saturday 22 September 18 09:22 BST (UK)
This Arthur Curwood was in the AIF in the war.
Died 6 July 1963, Balmain
Letter dated 13 August 1963, The Public Trust Office, N.S.W.
Arthur Curwood, no. 2271, Driver, 38th Company, A.A.S.C.
"It appears that the deceased died intestate and left no next of kin. Could you please search your reords...."

According to his army record, his father was John Curwood of Brunswick, Victoria.
See it from here
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/SearchScreens/NameSearch.aspx

Need to select a category, all records is OK for that name
John
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: majm on Saturday 22 September 18 09:42 BST (UK)
:)

Here's an alternative live link to that set of army records
http://soda.naa.gov.au/record/3480377/1
born in Victoria, Australia, so not the chap born Marylebone, England.

JM

 :)
Title: Re: Florence & Arthur Curwood b Q3 1876 & 23 Jul 1877 St Pancras
Post by: Cockneyrebel on Saturday 22 September 18 10:35 BST (UK)
So not mine then-another brick wall.
Cr