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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Topic started by: Bay89 on Saturday 04 August 18 22:39 BST (UK)
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My DNA Haplogroup is I-M223 I-M284 I-L126 I-S7753 longhand I2a2a1a1a1a
My surname is Bay my DNA matches those with surname Mcvey and some Mcleans. I have read that Bay is a reduced form of Macbeth. I need help confirming the name Macbeth may have been reduced to MacBay and to Bay possibly.
I've ready that Macbeth is reduced form of Macbeatha or Macbeath of Mac an Bheatha(d). My dna has been archealogically discovered in bronze age area of Argyll amd Bute and one off the isle of Lewis bronze age as well. Could this confirm family ties or direct connection to my Bay name and the Macbeth name? My DNA is nicknamed SCOT-ISLES AND IRISH-ISLES if that may help. Thanks for any help whatsoever.
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Sorry I can't help with the surname MacBeth in any variant.
I have always thought the (Scottish) word 'Bheatha' was Whisky as in 'Uisge Bheatha' meaning water of life although I may be wrong on that?
'Mac' means 'son of'
Annie
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Not sure if these might help?
www.houseofnames.com/macbeth-family-crest
www.surnamedb.com/Surname/Macbeth
Colin
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The spelling McBay is particularly common in the former county of Kincardineshire, between Angus and Aberdeenshire (it's now included in Aberdeenshire). If you check out the name on Scotlandspeople from about 1700 onwards, looking at Births - as I've just done - the majority are in the parish of Benholm, with others in Marykirk, Dunnottar and Bervie, all in Kincardineshire, with a fair amount also in Angus parishes like Craig, Montrose and Brechin. It's looks as if your name is an abbreviated version of McBay.
It's common for originally Gaelic names to have lots of different spellings in Lowland Scotland, where they wrote it down the way it sounded to them. McBeth/Macbeth is unusual in that it actually started off as a Christian or given name, "son of life" apparently referring to a man of religion.
I had McBeth ancestors in west Fife.
Harry
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Insightful info thank you. So if my DNA points to Western Scotland specifically Isles Scot and Isles Irish would that seem to match up with links to the McBeth family? The only ancient DNA of mine has been discovered is in these areas but dated Bronze Age
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My dna is downstream of I-L126. y4171; S7754 dated to a common ancestor less than 1000 years ago. I've found the Bay name throughout Berkshire, Lincolnshire, Reading and Kent. My oldest known ancestor left london age 16 in 1635 to the colony of virginia. His name was John Bay. If that helps my macbeth mystery
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It's hard to believe that the Bay surname in England is related to McBay or McBeth in Scotland. Also, Y DNA I is commoner in England, I believe. Most Scots are R1b.
Harry
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My DNA is said to be indigenous to the isles and seem to be linked to men with gaelic surnames
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G F Black's The Surnames of Scotland says that MacBeth is a personal name, not a patronymic. In Old Gaelic it was spelled Macc bethad, and means 'son of life', 'a religious person', 'man of religion' or 'one of the elect'. In Modern Gaelic the name would be spelled MacBeatha. He gives variants including MacBeath and MacBeith.
He also says that MacBay is Gaelic MacBeatha. Variants include MacBey and MacVey.
Bay is not listed as a surname.
'Beatha' is Gaelic for 'life'; 'Mac' means 'son of'; 'uisge' means 'water'. So MacBeth's name does include one element of the phrase 'uisge beatha' meaning 'water of life' that was anglicised as 'whisky'.
I know nothing about DNA haplogroups, but if the only DNA that matches yours is of Bronze Age origin, you are obviously never going to be able to match it to any documented family.
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Could Bay be the result of dropping a prefix of mc or Mac or 'o? My dna was discoverd earliest in bronze age. My dna is close to Mcvey dna project Mcbay and McLean
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I know nothing about DNA either but I would have to agree with Forfarian on this...
"I know nothing about DNA haplogroups, but if the only DNA that matches yours is of Bronze Age origin, you are obviously never going to be able to match it to any documented family"
How far back have you reached with paper trails, do any reach Scotland or UK & if so can you tell us who/when/where?
Annie
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My oldest known ancestor left Gravesend London age 16 in 1635 to the colony of virginia. His name was John Bay. Found a headright claim on this John Bay by William Ayres in 1642 in maryland or virginia. alot of passengers to the colonies took an oath of allegiance before leaving England. John Bay age 16 didn't take the oath which makes me believe he was a "NON-CONFORMIST" I don't know about any family members besides him in the British isles.
I hoped that knowing my dna originated in western scotland might help trace my genealogy in the UK.
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"The headright system was originally created in 1618 in Jamestown, Virginia. It was used as a way to attract new settlers to the region and address the labor shortage. With the emergence of tobacco farming, a large supply of workers was needed. New settlers who paid their way to Virginia received 50 acres of land."
Do you have names for the children (in order) of your ancestor John which may point to a Scottish connection as he may have ditched the Mc/Mac for some reason?
Annie
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"The headright system was originally created in 1618 in Jamestown, Virginia. It was used as a way to attract new settlers to the region and address the labor shortage. With the emergence of tobacco farming, a large supply of workers was needed. New settlers who paid their way to Virginia received 50 acres of land."
Do you have names for the children (in order) of your ancestor John which may point to a Scottish connection as he may have ditched the Mc/Mac for some reason?
Annie
Hi thanks for the reply and the good information. Yes I John Bay (circa1619-c.1683 had son:
John Bay 1650-17??
Had son:
Thomas Bay 1700(6) -1746
Had son:
Captain Thomas Bay Sr. 1741-1826
Had son:
William Bay 1778-1863
Had son
James H Bay 1820-1847
Had son:
James E Bay 1846-1925
Had son
James Culburn Bay 1871-1931
Had son
Donald Dean Bay 1929-1994
Had son
Robert N Bay 1964-
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After doing some research it may be possible that John Bay who left london 1635 could have been the son of John Bye IV of Basingstoke and Prudence (Humphrey) Bay. John Bye died circa 1625 but records are said to be incomplete, so there's was no records requarding any children of John and Prudence. Only a record that they were married 1610
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"John Bay (circa1619-c.1683 had son:
John Bay 1650-17??
Had son:
Thomas Bay 1700(6) -1746"
Not sure what (6) relates to, was he 6th child born or born c1700-1706?
Do you have any other children (siblings) of Thomas '1700(6)'?
Annie
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"John Bay (circa1619-c.1683 had son:
John Bay 1650-17??
Had son:
Thomas Bay 1700(6) -1746"
Not sure what (6) relates to, was he 6th child born or born c1700-1706?
Do you have any other children (siblings) of Thomas '1700(6)'?
Annie
Hi, thank you VERY for your help by the way!
The (6) that I put next to 1700 was because I'm not sure of year he was born I've noted 1706 and 1700. I suppose It would have been more correct to put 'circa 1700'.
Tommy L West did extensive research on the Bay families in colonial America, and published his book "Some Member of The 18th Century Colonial American Bay Family". Connecting the "separate Bay families" could only be based on speculation at the time he published his book.
Until I did a Y-DNA test last year. Which proved to me that my oldest known direct descendant:
CPT. Thomas Bay c.1741-1826
was son of Thomas Bay living 1745 in Orange County, Virginia (in what became Frederick and Shenandoah co. VA). My dna test as well as a cousin of mine, who's direct male descendant is Cpt Thomas Bay matched a dna test of a descendant of David Bay 1755-1825 Ohio. David is son of Hugh Bay 1727-1773.
In 1745 Thomas, Hugh, and William Bay were added to the tithables list of Frederick Co. For the year. That solved the mystery as to who Cpt Thomas Bays brothers were.
As for children of Thomas Bay born possibly c. 1700 are as follows:
Hugh Bay 1727-1773
William Bay 1729-1769
Robert Bay baptized May 3rd 1741
Cpt Thomas Bay 1741-1826
Also regaurding John Bay born c 1619. I found he and 140 others left 10 August 1635 from Gravesend, London to be embarked to Virginia on the ship Safety. The landed in Norfolk Co Virginia. A William Eyres paid for his passage. I believe about 1650 Johm Bay is mentioned again as a land owner in Baltimore, Maryland.
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Here is a more accurate rundown of the decendants of John Bay born circa 1619.
John Bay born 1619 uk-??
Had son
John Bay circa 1650s-1700
- ownes land North and South side of Potapscoe Hundreds Baltimore,Maryland
- wife Ruth Bays
Had son
John Bay Jr. circa 1682-1739+
- land owner Baltimore, Maryland North side Potapscoe
- wife Elizabeth
Assigned sons: (* my paternal ancestor)
John Bay Jr. 1701-1742+
*Thomas Bay 1703-1746
Frances Bay 1713-1749+
*Thomas Bay moved from Baltimore, Md to Virginia at some point, but through records seemed to stay in touch with Baltimore resident George Egger,obvious friends of the family.
Had sons
Hugh Bay 1727-1773
William Bay 1729-1769
Robert Bay bap. 1741
*Thomas Bay (cpt.) 1741-1826 (wife Elizabeth Blackburn)
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I think it will be a hard task finding a Scottish connection as has been mentioned (lack of paper trail), too far back.
I would have been more convinced if I'd seen what I'd call 'Scottish' names as some of the names in your line could point to anywhere (common names) although you do have a Donald :D
Annie
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I think it will be a hard task finding a Scottish connection as has been mentioned (lack of paper trail), too far back.
I would have been more convinced if I'd seen what I'd call 'Scottish' names as some of the names in your line could point to anywhere (common names) although you do have a Donald :D
Annie
It does seem most of the males in my direct line have the names William Robert James Thomas John all seem to be common also looking at the women each one of my direct descendants married while in the colonies America until current all of the female surnames seem to be Scottish or Irish and origin for example my 7th great-grandfather Captain Thomas Bay married Elizabeth Blackburn and his son married a McCandless