RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: jacqui63m on Thursday 16 August 18 23:38 BST (UK)
-
Hi,
Can anyone explain why a couple first married in the Dublin Reg Off (with no apparent legal or religious reason) and then two years later marry in St Andrew's? They were both widows so why the Reg Office? And then the Church?
James Flood and Ellen Daniel Killeen
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1881/11010/8025570.pdf
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1883/10941/5998767.pdf
Jacqui
-
Not only did they marry twice, they were pretending to be living at separate addresses in the same street at time of their church wedding. ;D
Maybe it took them 2 years to save up for a wedding reception. ;D
Were they both same religious denomination at time of 1st wedding? They might have lapsed and then joined/ re-joined a church.
Were any children born in between the 2 ceremonies? Maybe 1st wedding was done in a hurry.
Were witnesses at either ceremony relatives? Perhaps they didn't tell their families about 1st marriage.
Were they definitely both widowed at time of 1st marriage or just pretending?
-
Not only did they marry twice, they were pretending to be living at separate addresses in the same street at time of their church wedding. ;D
Maybe it took them 2 years to save up for a wedding reception. ;D
Were they both same religious denomination at time of 1st wedding? They might have lapsed and then joined/ re-joined a church.
Were any children born in between the 2 ceremonies? Maybe 1st wedding was done in a hurry.
Were witnesses at either ceremony relatives? Perhaps they didn't tell their families about 1st marriage.
Were they definitely both widowed at time of 1st marriage or just pretending?
Oh the shame of it!! ;D ;D
What will neighbours say??
-
Seriously now.... could be many reasons!!
-
RC baptism (St. Michan) for a daughter of a couple called James Flood and Ellen Daniel took place on 30 April 1883:
https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/display-pdf.jsp?pdfName=st.michans_mf_1856-1888_ba_0062
-
It happens -
1882: Albert Edward Acheson married Rosetta Maria Marshall July/September 1882, Dublin South, Ireland
and
Albert Edward Acheson married Rosetta Maria Marshall September Quarter 1883, Sheffield, Yorkshire, England.
Rosetta was the daughter of a Solicitor in Sheffield. May be he put pressure on the Couple.
-
RC baptism (St. Michan) for a daughter of a couple called James Flood and Ellen Daniel took place on 30 April 1883:
https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/display-pdf.jsp?pdfName=st.michans_mf_1856-1888_ba_0062
Ah-ha! Clerical or family pressure. Perhaps it was a toss-up to decide what the priest would disapprove of most, them marrying in the registry office or being unmarried parents. Probably evens in the priest's opinion. They may have lapsed then returned to the church when the baby was born.
-
There are lots of reasons for a registry office marriage in Ireland- mixed marriage, family or clerical disapproval, recent family bereavement, pregnant bride or children born before marriage, wanting a quiet wedding, clergy of bride's church (marriages usually took place in her church) not authorised to perform marriages, one or both of the parties previously married...
-
Hmm
James Flood a widower married Anne Duffy Jan 1881
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1881/10991/8018718.pdf
Anne Flood age 18 married wife of a range setter (stonemason) died April 1881 informant Mary Duffy mother
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1881/06441/4850642.pdf
Thomas Killeen, fisherman and boat owner on childrens birth certs
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01mj4/
there is a death 1880 for a Thomas Killeen age 39 a Carpenter but this may not be him
-
Thank you everyone for your thoughts. I love the sense of humour shown.
I was quite happy to think that they first married in the Reg Off (for whatever reason) and then, with the birth of their daughter Ellen, were "obliged" to marry "properly"
And then you throw in another marriage Jan 1881 to Annie Duffy. The personal facts of husband James are exactly the same as my James query. This Annie may have died 3mths after the marriage. But she was 18 at death, James would have been 60. The same Annie??
This family, James Flood, is certainly a mystery. Three marriages in the space of 2 years. Two to the same woman!!!!!!!
Jacqui
-
Thank you everyone for your thoughts. I love the sense of humour shown.
I was quite happy to think that they first married in the Reg Off (for whatever reason) and then, with the birth of their daughter Ellen, were "obliged" to marry "properly"
And then you throw in another marriage Jan 1881 to Annie Duffy. The personal facts of husband James are exactly the same as my James query. This Annie may have died 3mths after the marriage. But she was 18 at death, James would have been 60. The same Annie??
This family, James Flood, is certainly a mystery. Three marriages in the space of 2 years. Two to the same woman!!!!!!!
Jacqui
Only 3 found!! ;D ;D
-
Dont forget he was also a widower when marrying Annie Duffy
-
Oh I have already discovered his previous marriage to an Ellen Richards in 1860.
So, that's four marriages.............
-
;D
-
Hmm
James Flood a widower married Anne Duffy Jan 1881
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1881/10991/8018718.pdf
Anne Flood age 18 married wife of a range setter (stonemason) died April 1881 informant Mary Duffy mother
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1881/06441/4850642.pdf
Anne Duffy was "full age" at Jan 1881 marriage so over 21. Father of James Flood was Michael Flood "living", bricklayer.
Cause of death of Anne Flood looks like "Puerpal fever 18 days certified" which would mean she had given birth at least 18 days before her death. The prevous death registered was James Flood, a baby aged 24 days. Address was different to Anne's though. Informant was his sister, Agnes.
I suppose there were many women called Anne Duffy in Dublin at the time and more than 1 James Flood, bricklayer and a few Mick Floods with that occupation. Pity there's no 1881 or 1891 census to look at.
-
I'd be inclined to think that they first married in the Reg Off (for whatever reason) and then, with the birth of their daughter Ellen, were "obliged" to marry "properly" too.
-
I'd be inclined to think that they first married in the Reg Off (for whatever reason) and then, with the birth of their daughter Ellen, were "obliged" to marry "properly" too.
There's a similar thread on the go with a contribution from River Tyne Lass saying exactly the same about her parents' 2 weddings. She had it from "the horse's mouth".
-
Our ancestors have a lot to answer!!!!
Between legalities of the day, religious beliefs and, sadly, ignorance, unthreading the knots of the looks like, could bes, maybes, possiblities is an absolute nightmare.
But I'm getting there, slowly
Thank you everyone for the help, the humour and the insight
Jacqui