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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Essex => Topic started by: LizzieL on Saturday 18 August 18 14:01 BST (UK)

Title: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Saturday 18 August 18 14:01 BST (UK)
Francis Prior was baptised in Broxted on 2 Mar 1808 s/o John and Sarah. The family moved to Takeley and his two younger brothers George and John were baptised there in 1815 and 1817 respectively. Francis married Susan Lucking on 19 mar 1831 in Takeley. In 1841 Susan and their children William, Emma and Thomas are living in Takeley, by her name is written "husband Ag Lab" which has then been crossed out. On the same double page are Francis' parents John and Sarah and the two youngest brothers. A couple of pages earlier is Mary Prior and her children (widow of Francis' older brother James).
They had four more children after 1841 and he is with the family in 1861 (Takeley is missing from 1851 census), so I don't believe they had separated.
Please can anyone find him?
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 18 August 18 15:28 BST (UK)
There's a criminal register entry from 1835 (not guilty) Francis Prior born 1808 - maybe he was in a similar boat in 1841  :-\

Whereabouts was was the closest child born after 1841 birth place?
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Saturday 18 August 18 15:55 BST (UK)
The next child after the three on the census was born in Takeley as well according to the 1861 census, he was 19, so born in last 3 quarters of 1841 or first quarter up to census day in 1842. Can't find a birth registration for him or the next two, only the last daughter born in 1851.
I can't find a baptism for him either, but I can find baptisms for all his siblings.

Francis and two other men were charged with stealing wood. They had been employed to "stub" a hedge (not sure what that means, but involves cutting). They were told not to take any of the wood away, but they did. They were found not guilty, I think the magistrate was not convinced that they understood that they were not to take the wood away.

As far as I can see that is his only "criminal" record and was probably the result of a misunderstanding and not any intention to steal.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: nannyj on Saturday 18 August 18 23:20 BST (UK)
Thomas is baptised takeley 5 Feb 1837, Emma 19 jan 1834, Daniel 28 Jul 1838 (surname spelled as Pryor by the Parish clerk), Sarah 7 Jun 1846 (father’s name is recorded as frank now but surname back to prior), george Aug 6 1848, Susan 25 May 1851.
All in takeley Parish records. Big gap between Daniel and Sarah? Maybe he was in prison after all?
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: philipsearching on Saturday 18 August 18 23:37 BST (UK)
Francis' earlier 'brush with the law' might have led him to be labelled a troublemaker so he could have been persecuted into prison.

An alternative possibility is that he was unable to find employment (perhaps through injury or ill health) and spent time in a Workhouse or infirmary.

Pjilip
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 08:59 BST (UK)
Thomas is baptised takeley 5 Feb 1837, Emma 19 jan 1834, Daniel 28 Jul 1838 (surname spelled as Pryor by the Parish clerk), Sarah 7 Jun 1846 (father’s name is recorded as frank now but surname back to prior), george Aug 6 1848, Susan 25 May 1851.
All in takeley Parish records. Big gap between Daniel and Sarah? Maybe he was in prison after all?

Thanks, I had all the other baptisms, it's John born about 1841/2 (according to age on census), I couldn't find. He married Rose Ann Jolly in 1862 in Suffolk. It's further confused by the fact he had a cousin John (son of James Prior) who also married in 1862, but in Takeley to Mary Ann Francis.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 09:02 BST (UK)
Francis' earlier 'brush with the law' might have led him to be labelled a troublemaker so he could have been persecuted into prison.


He was found not guilty so never went to prison. That incident was 6 years before the census. I suspect he was working away from home somewhere, and his employer or lodging house keeper forgot include him on the census form
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 19 August 18 10:33 BST (UK)
No John on parish records. As you say, maybe moved for work. Will have a look at the neighbouring parishes later. I thought you said you only had William, Thomas and Emma as well as Susan?
I would have expected there to be a Francis too as nearly all the other family names are there.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: Milliepede on Sunday 19 August 18 11:24 BST (UK)
Quote
Thanks, I had all the other baptisms, it's John born about 1841/2 (according to age on census), I couldn't find. He married Rose Ann Jolly in 1862 in Suffolk.

Tiny bit suspicious that a baptism/birth record for him hasn't been found and Francis is awol in 1841.

Tried different spellings and the notion John could be a second name but no luck. 

In fact can't find Prior/Lucking births on GRO at all  :-[  George - Sarah - Susan



Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 12:59 BST (UK)
I can only find the youngest, Susan mmn recorded as Luck, but I think it must be her. Probably never got the others registered.
If Francis was away from home on 1st June 1841 working elsewhere, he might have been away several months and John wasn't his and she never got him baptised. Or she went elsewhere for the birth and baptism and returned to Takeley later and John thought he must have been born there. He is consistently born Takeley from 1861 to 1911. In 1861 he was single and living with parents so presumably Francis would have filled in the census form. Francis was baptised in Broxted so I assume born there, so the other birthplaces could be suspect in 1861.

added
just checked Francis and Susan's marriage record and the Clerk has written Lucking otherwise Luck. She made her mark so we don't know what she actually called herself
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 13:16 BST (UK)
In 1871, Susan says she's born in Stanstead presumably Mountfitchet

added
Baptism at Stanstead
Susan d/o Wm and Sarah Loock 1 Sep 1811 is probably her.

Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 19 August 18 13:21 BST (UK)
Just heading home after a weekend at dad's but will check Stansted mountfichet records when I get back. Funny that john isn't there as all the others are baptised. Will check surrounding parishes and broxted. Interestingly Francis and Susan's marriage was shotgun. She'd have been about two months gone with William. Not unusual then.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 13:53 BST (UK)
1841 census for Stanstead M  has a William Luck age 60, Sarah Luck age 60, and in same household William Luck age 33, James Luck age 24 and Joseph Luck age 17. Possibly Susan's parents and brothers. But i'm not seeing a baptism for John Prior in Stanstead. Perhabs she had a married sister somewhere.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 19 August 18 14:19 BST (UK)
Ok will have a hunt later 😊
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 14:31 BST (UK)
Thanks.
I think I have found Sarah Luck's burial (as Luckey) on 8 oct 1862 age 82 and William also as Lucky buried 4 April 1863 age 84, so they should be on the 1861 census. I think 1851 for Stanstead is another one that may have gone awol.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 14:36 BST (UK)
No I was wrong, 1851 for Stanstead exists, found them as Luckey, William born Stanstead, Sarah born Rickling.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Sunday 19 August 18 16:05 BST (UK)
William Luck married Sarah Reed at Ugley on 19 May 1804 botp. Ugley about half way between Rickling and Stanstead
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 19 August 18 23:46 BST (UK)
Still no joy finding a John prior baptised 1840ish.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Monday 20 August 18 08:31 BST (UK)
Thank you for looking, I haven't been able to find him either.
He didn't appear on the 1841 census so was born after 6 june 1841.
early October 1840He was buried on 6 july 1920 age 78, which is likely to make his birthday after the beginning of July 1841, assuming 3 to 4 days between death and burial.
On 1861 census he is 19, 1871 - 30, 1881 - 39, 1891 - 49, 1901 - 59, 1911 - 69.
The 1871 aberration can't be due to difference in census date 2nd April in 1871, but also 2nd in 1911 and even earlier at 31 March in 1901. His wife was a year older, so I  guess 1871 was a mistake and 30 was put down for both.
If my maths is right the latest he could be born is 30 March 1842, therefore conception between  early October 1840 and late June 1841.
Title: Re: Looking for Francis Prior in 1841
Post by: LizzieL on Monday 20 August 18 12:01 BST (UK)
I widened my search criteria for Francis in 1841 and found one in St George Hanover Square. His age is given as 35, whereas my Francis would be 33/4 rounded to 30. He's a male servant not an Ag Lab. He's not bic (Middx) and I can't fit him in with any Francises of similar age I've found in 1851, unless he's the one born in Ireland living in Wales, but in that case there should be "I" in last column. Could it be him, a servant to a Barrister?

Piece 733 Book 13 Folio 27 Page 1