RootsChat.Com

England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Norfolk => Topic started by: joliz on Saturday 18 August 18 16:27 BST (UK)

Title: samuel bartram
Post by: joliz on Saturday 18 August 18 16:27 BST (UK)
Hi im looking for any info on samuel bartram b abt 1842 depwade norfolk he married lucy neve 1861 in norwich norfolk , i have found them on 1861 census and 1871 census but can not find them after that , any help would be great

jo
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: rosie99 on Saturday 18 August 18 16:39 BST (UK)
Could you please give details of the family in 1871
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: PaulineJ on Saturday 18 August 18 16:41 BST (UK)
1871 he's in heigham, born "Sacthorpe, Norfolk"

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VFNK-53G 

1851 b Saxthorpe, not Depwade
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: louisa maud on Saturday 18 August 18 16:51 BST (UK)
looking at the census if I am correct
Samuel was born 1842
and
Lucy 1826

if this is so then I have found a death
1878 Norwich
Lucy Bartram
aged 52
making her birth date  circa 1836 which is possibly near enough

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: philipsearching on Saturday 18 August 18 16:52 BST (UK)
Have you considered:

Death Mar qtr 1922 Depwade vol 4b p354 BARTRAM Samuel age 77


Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: Christine53 on Saturday 18 August 18 16:56 BST (UK)
Probate for Lucy Bartram :

Death date 10 Nov 1878 at Willow Lane , Norwich, probate granted at Norwich to husband Samuel Bartram , tailor of 9 Lumsden Street, Old Dumbarton Road, Glasgow.

That doesn't make sense ! Samuel and Lucy Bartram are on the 1881 and 1891 census at Old Dumbarton Road , Glasgow  ???
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: Christine53 on Saturday 18 August 18 17:11 BST (UK)
The Lucy Bartram with Samuel in Glasgow as his wife is born 1852. They have a daughter Florence born in Glasgow in 1878 . familysearch doesn't offer the full transcript so I haven't linked to it.

Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: Christine53 on Saturday 18 August 18 17:17 BST (UK)
I don't subscribe to ScotlandsPeople but there is a marriage for a Samuel Bartram and Lucy Woodhouse in 1878 in Anderston and one death for a Samuel Bartram in 1899 in Cambuslang.
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: louisa maud on Saturday 18 August 18 17:18 BST (UK)
They appear to have 3 daughters  on 1891 and yes, Lucy's age is quite a bit different from Lucy on 1861 and 1871



Also I think I found a death 1913 for a Samuel aged 73,  buried Caistor cemetery , died in Yarmouth infirmary,  occupation gardener

The plot deepens

LM
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: Christine53 on Saturday 18 August 18 17:26 BST (UK)
I don't subscribe to ScotlandsPeople but there is a marriage for a Samuel Bartram and Lucy Woodhouse in 1878 in Anderston and one death for a Samuel Bartram in 1899 in Cambuslang.

A look at this marriage record should clarify the situation.
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: joliz on Saturday 18 August 18 17:32 BST (UK)
Hi , thanks for all your replies , im even more confused now , yeah i also thought lucys death was abt1878, but glasgow  :o
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: philipsearching on Saturday 18 August 18 17:38 BST (UK)
Probate for Lucy Bartram :

Death date 10 Nov 1878 at Willow Lane , Norwich, probate granted at Norwich to husband Samuel Bartram , tailor of 9 Lumsden Street, Old Dumbarton Road, Glasgow.

That doesn't make sense ! Samuel and Lucy Bartram are on the 1881 and 1891 census at Old Dumbarton Road , Glasgow  ???

It would make sense if Lucy 1 died in a carer's or relative's house in Norwich, then Samuel moved up to Scotland and married Lucy 2.

If the residents of Willow Lane, Norwich can be found on the 1881 census there might be a recognisable surname, or the death cert would give the name of the person reporting the death.

Philip

Philip
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: louisa maud on Sunday 19 August 18 12:26 BST (UK)
Pity there wasn't a number of Willow Lane and a particular area

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: Christine53 on Sunday 19 August 18 12:55 BST (UK)
I decided to take a look at the Scottish marriage:

Samuel Bartram 37 tailor cutter , widower, father Samuel Bartram iron moulder (deceased )
of 9 Lumsden Street,Glasgow                    mother Margaret Bartram , maiden surname Douglas

Lucy Woodhouse 26                                  father Elias Woodhouse railway labourer
of same address                                       mother Sarah Woodhouse ( no maiden surname given )

married 30 Nov 1878 at 8 ? Street , Glasgow by Declaration in the presence of Charles O'Kelly tailor cutter

The death certificate states :

Samuel Bartram
married 1: Lucy Neve
married 2 : Lucy Woodhouse
 died 8 Dec 1899 at Cambuslang , parents given as in Marriage Certificate.
 Informant : Daisy Bartram , daughter , present at death.
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: Christine53 on Sunday 19 August 18 13:30 BST (UK)
Samuel Bartram D Q 1841 Aylsham vol 13 page 11 mother's maiden Daglass ( from GRO website)

From the Norwich Bishop's Transcripts :

Samuel Bartram single man of this parish
Margaret Daglass single woman of this parish
married by banns 5 Aug 1833 in the Parish of Saxthorpe , Norfolk
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: joliz on Sunday 19 August 18 15:01 BST (UK)
Hi, wow thank you so much for your help
jo
Title: Re: samuel bartram
Post by: louisa maud on Sunday 19 August 18 17:24 BST (UK)
There is a whole family tree on Ancestry if you are interested

Samuel's mother is on 1881 as a widow with a niece

Louisa Maud