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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: pineapple88 on Thursday 06 September 18 14:41 BST (UK)
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Hi all
I have attached a record of a Joseph Smith. In it describes him as having been in the Wakefield Correction facility for possible desertion of his unit I am struggling to read the part under, 4th column along where it says , awaiting a???? is it a Route? and what would that mean - also if he was up for desertion would he have still been allowed back into the regiment, if it was a 'misunderstanding' !
Any more info on this I would be grateful thanks.
pineapple
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Seems to read a route. Thanks
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This is interesting!
At least as far as the offence & sentencing column goes, I would say his and the entry above are in the same hand. Which makes me really unsure as to whether is it "Deserter". (There's definitely no "ing" on the end, so it's not "Deserting".)
The 2nd and 3rd letters don't look like "es", if you compare them to letters in the words above.
Going purely on letter comparison, it doesn't look like an "e" on the end of the word which looks like "Route". (And if it were "Route", what would this mean? Route to Australia?! :o)
But as we have often seen here, comparing handwritten letters from one single person can reveal extreme deviations in style!
Let's see what the experts can come up with. :)
Karen
P.S. Do you know what became of him later?
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Hi Karen
Oh thanks for this, you have thrown up some really good points! I really don't know what became of him and theres a chance this is my 3xgr grandfather but not sure yet.
I do know that in 1845 a few years later he is listed as a soldier in his child's baptism.
aT his marriage in 1841HE'S listed as a shoemaker and at son Cornelius Smiths birth in 1855 as a shoemaker. And on this document it says shoemaker and soldier. I also know he is not in any of the CENSUS returns but his wife is. So being away as a soldier would explain some of his absences. And having a child about once every five years. But his wife was widowed by 1861. So can only assume he died between his sons birth in 1855 and 1861. But where i am not sure possibly with his regiment if he had been allowed back in.
So any help on this decipher might help on what happened to him.
Thanks so much :)
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A search of old newspapers for the phrase 'awaiting a route' brings up a lot of hits, the vast majority of them associated with Army deserters.
Example from Northampton Mercury 1838
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Does it means dismissal from the Army :-\
In my very old Pocket Oxford Dictionary one of the definitions of the word route is 'Mil[itary]: formal written marching orders'.
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Does it means dismissal from the Army :-\
In my very old Pocket Oxford Dictionary one of the definitions of the word route is 'Mil[itary]: formal written marching orders'.
That is also very interesting! Not sure if it's an Essex thing ;) but we often used to use the term "routed" (but rhyming with shout, not root) to say that someone/something had been thrown out of something (club, etc.).
Karen
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Wow this is fascinating, - thank you all, that's interesting regarding the newspaper - good idea to search on that phrase there.
which makes me wonder if he did get his marching orders wonder where he went if he was still classed as a soldier in 1845 under occupation.
Thank you all, seems we are all agreement it says awaiting a Route.
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I suddenly need a very old Oxford Dictionary too in my arsenal for research :D Good find.
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I think the normal procedure when deserters were arrested by the civil authority was for them to be ordered to be detained in prison until they could be collected by their regiment. Perhaps that collection process was the "Route".
Looking at men named Joseph Smith in the 68th regiment I can see two in the 1851 "worldwide index" which is drawn from muster books and pay lists. They were then serving in Malta. They were numbered 2084 and 2466. Both fought in the Crimean War (and survived) and were present at the battles of Alma and Inkerman.
2466 joined the army in 1846 so it's not your man. 2084 seems likely.
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I think the normal procedure when deserters were arrested by the civil authority was for them to be ordered to be detained in prison until they could be collected by their regiment. Perhaps that collection process was the "Route".
That seems more likely than my theory.
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Oh my Shaun this is good stuff. So possibly he was awaiting collection from his regiment and then went on to serve for longer.
Thank you so much for the possible Joseph Smiths being possibility 2084 - does it note anything else on there about him or that number at all. You sound very knowledgeable about military stuff, many thanks.
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I suddenly need a very old Oxford Dictionary too in my arsenal for research :D Good find.
I can access the full Oxford English Dictionary from home via my library card.
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Must dig out my library card.
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Here you are - just as Shaun said:
Military deserters were also confined in the prison. Howard noted one in 1782; in 1809 the Order Books reported that one had escaped, and various Inspectors’ Reports recorded deserters “awaiting a route” for return to their regiments. This referred to the Mutiny and Desertion Act 1833 which enabled
deserters to be committed to a public prison to await orders on their disposal from the War Secretary.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01mo2/
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Good one Jen - that explains a lot. Good find. I wonder what his disposal from the war secretary was. Perhaps return to the regiment even.
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Deserters would always be returned to their regiments. They would be subject to court martial and punishment.