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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: johneowens on Sunday 16 September 18 18:43 BST (UK)
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I wonder does anyone have access to St. Helens, Lancs. newspapers for December 1918.
My maternal grandmother's sister, Kezia Esther McConville (nee Allen) was a Red Cross Sister who died in Westcliff on Sea, Essex 6 December 1918 and was buried at St. Helens Cemetery, Rainford Road 10 December 1918. Her parents, James and Harriet lived in Hardshaw Street, St. Helens.
I wonder if some kind person could access the St. Helens newspapers for December 1918 and find a report on her funeral so that I can discover who attended. Unfortunately, I have not found any St. Helens newspapers at the British Newspaper Archives and wondered whether any are located and accessible locally for this month.
In anticipation, many thanks
Best wishes
John
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Married Xmas Day 1916 aged 31 - so she wasn't even married 2 years - how sad - was she killed by the result of a bomb - or aircraft fire ?? she was only 33 when she died - she married in Liverpool ...
Marriage: 25 Dec 1916 St Bride, Toxteth, Lancashire, England
Mark Roy McConville - 30, Seaman, Bachelor, 80 Leven Street
Kezia Esther Allen - 31, Hospital Nurse, Spinster, 55 Canning Street
Groom's Father: John McConville, Chemist
Bride's Father: James Allen, Tripe Dresser
Witness: Alfred Henry Brown; Ada Jones
Married by Banns by: George Mortimore, Curate
................................................................................
as no father are down as deceased I would imagine the 2 fathers and witnesses would have been at the funeral ??
the good news is that Mark McConville is not on CWGC WW1 casualties - so he survived the war ..
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Kezia's Red Cross involvement had ceased.
The engagement by the Red Cross was from 14 July 1915 - 31 Dec 1917.
Her address down as 99, Hardshaw Street St. Helens.
The war had finished a month by the time she died.
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Thanks, Alan (Garstonite)
Sadly, Cassie died in the Spanish Flu pandemic - but in Westcliff on Sea, Essex. As yet, no idea how she came to be there but as a Red Cross VAD, she moved about between 1915 and the time of her death.
Yes, her parents were still alive, mother Harriet present at death, so I would have expected them to attend her funeral - and hopefully that event was reported in the St. Helens newspapers. As yet, not found any location for these newspapers.
Roy survived the war and died in 1929.
Best
John
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Kezia's Red Cross involvement had ceased.
The engagement by the Red Cross was from 14 July 1915 - 31 Dec 1917.
Her address down as 99, Hardshaw Street St. Helens.
The war had finished a month by the time she died.
Thanks, Medpat. Yes, see https://livesofthefirstworldwar.org/lifestory/27552
After the Armistice, the wounded still needed nursing, of course.
Best
John
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Old newspapers for St Helens are kept on microfilm at the History and Archives room at the main library The Gamble Building, Victoria Square.
Unfortunately, it has been closed now for a few years due to "ceiling damage" I'll say no more on that.
You can visit the archives if you book a visit over the phone and some of the data is available at Eccleston Library about 20 minutes outside of the town.
Here's a link for the archive catalogue, perhaps if you are not able to visit the staff would kindly search for you and send a copy should they locate what you are after.
http://calmview.sthelens.gov.uk/calmview/
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Thanks for your message. I knew that the Eccleston library had some old newspapers but did not know that the main old newspaper collection had been retain in the main library, which has been damaged by water leakage. Indeed, the Eccleston staff have kindly carried out a search for me but without result.
As I live 230 miles away, I cannot visit the main library myself. However, as you suggest, I will check the online catalogue. But, assuming I find a suitable publication in the catalogue, will there be search staff available in the main library to search for me, please?
Best
John
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I'm not sure but if you require to see something in the archive they have to make an appointment for you to do so. Whether that means making it available in a safe place or making a copy and supplying it I don't know. I will ask around, see if anyone else has tried. The staff are lovely there (used to be) and I am sure for little or no expense they will get the info you require if it is at all possible. You could also try the St Helens Star archives or phone them for help. I will try to find a link for past obutuaries there.
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I just remembered I have a card for Manchester online archives somewhere too, give me a day or so and I'll get back to you.
By the way is Lives of the First World War your work?
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That would be very helpful, thanks. I loom forward to hearing from you again.
Best
John
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Sorry, I don't seem to be getting anywhere, my Manchester Library access is no longer working. I did a search on Lancashire archives and digitised old newspapers there with no luck. Still waiting on my contacts elsewhere to answer my query about the library. Perhaps they are all stranded by Thomas Cook somewhere.
I just joined Liverpool Central Library and await the link, perhaps their digitised news can help.
The St Helens Archives has a thing in place whereby you ring to ask for an appointment and then turn up to the Gamble Building Search Room and they get you what you want to read after signing in with photo ID so there must be some staff around that could do your searches, if the microfilms are still accessible there. I mean you have the exact date and details so it should be fairly quick to find.
The times available are
Monday: 10.00am – 4.00pm
Tuesday: 10.00am – 2.00pm
Wednesday: 10.00am – 2.00pm
Thursday: 2.00pm – 4.00pm
and the email for that is
archives@sthelens.gov.uk
Phone no. 01744 671748
The only other thing I can suggest is to contact the family history centre folks and ask them to help, that is these people
http://www.sthelenstownshipsfhs.org.uk/
They meet every week at Eccleston Library for research and transcription of local parish records etc.
I'll get back if I find anything else.
Oh, I forgot to say I came across this:
http://rcnarchive.rcn.org.uk/data/VOLUME058-1917/page435-volume58-23rdjune1917.pdf
[Cntrl F search her name]
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Many thanks again.
Yes, I have this reference to Cassie's service at Park Street, which was the Mayfair Hospital for Officers, as well as many others reflecting her service in other VAD hospitals.
Thanks for checking the Lancs archives and also for the info on the St Helens archive, which I shall follow up together with the family history centre folks.
One other point, which I cannot remember whether I mentioned previously. Cassie was buried 10 December 1918 in St. Helens Cemetery, Rainford Road, St. Helens. She's in grave No. 190/Section 9 and buried with brother Robert William (d.1899), parents, and Aunt Ann. At that time, her parents were both alive and lived in Hardshaw Street.
Any further assistance would be most welcome.
Best
John
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It could take a few days but as soon as I get the email from Liverpool Libraries I will try there.
Better mention, You may be charged for any lookups the library does by the way, although in my opinion that would be extortion as they have made it almost impossible to do any decent research.
Are you far away? would you like an image of the grave?
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Thanks again.
Yes, 230 miles away. However, the staff at St Helens cemetery were kind enough to send me photos of the grave. Thanks, anyway.
Best
John
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Thanks again.
Yes, 230 miles away. However, the staff at St Helens cemetery were kind enough to send me photos of the grave. Thanks, anyway.
Best
John
British Library in London may have copies. They are near to St Pancras station
As for Manchester library access mentioned earlier, there have been problems with the Gale newspapers site used by local libraries where it was stopping you from signing in. Mine with Surrey has now been sorted, I know Lancashire libraries were having problems.
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OK, so the St Helens newspapers are online on a Gale database? If so, I may be able to access remotely. Could you pls send me the url?
Best
John
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You have to access through your local library website using your library card number to log in.
I have not looked to see if St Helens newspapers are on there
ADDED Have just read your post again They are for C19th so would not cover Kezia
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OK. Many thanks.
I'm now trying the St Helens FHS.
Best
John
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Yes, I entered Cassie @ https://livesofthefirstworldwar.iwm.org.uk/lifestory/27552 Also her husband Roye. I was also able to enter Cassie at http://www.sthelensrollsofhonour.co.uk/casualty-3537-Kezia_Esther_McConville.html Her full story is in my Ancestry family tree, which is public.
John
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Yes the Manchester ones I had a problem with but it turns out you can no longer access them unless you are a resident or student I will miss that source.
I just got my card for Liverpool but it might be end of next week before I can go and complete the registration and search. Hope you have some luck with the townships.
The Rolls of Honour was compiled by a friend of mine from St Helens Connect, very sadly he's no longer with us.
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So sorry to hear about your roll of honour friend. I made the point to him that i could not find any women on the Ww1 roll of honor. He accepted Cassie for which I am grateful.
No rush with Liverpool,thanks. Still waiting to hear from StHelens.
Best and thanks
John
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So sorry John, this went by the wayside as my mother in law had a stroke so it's been all hands on deck for a few weeks, then because of that my temporary library card lapsed because I didn't make it in there the confirm. I would have to start all over again. Hope you have had some luck with the historians and the library.
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Hi MummyG
No worries. As it happens, just a couple of days ago, I received an email from StHelens township with copies of the relevant reports from St Helens newspapers. So, thanks for your offer but I think I have what I want now.
Best wishes and thanks again
John
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Oh excellent news, I don't feel so guilty now. Have a nice Christmas.
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Thanks. Happy holidays to you, too.
John
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Hi John
Kezia & Mark were the parents of James Roye McConville who was my grandfather. The Roye is taken from Marks mother's maiden name, Alice Roye. My family have some information about Kezia, including access to a portrait of her & her records book from her time as a midwife at a Lying-In Hospital in London. The painting suggests she was a redhead, as was my grandfather. There is also something else relating to her parents.
There are family stories about the Allens and the McConvilles not getting on and that Kezia was supposed to have married beneath herself. Would you be able to shed any light on this at all? James was born 4 months after the marriage so that may have been a factor as well. We don't really know who brought up James but we suspect it was an aunt from Crossley St in Warrington as his marriage cert gives that address for him and he definitely had family at that address on a previous census.
I know very little about Alice except that she was born in Ancoats in 1847, seems to have been the 3rd wife of John McConville and died 18 Oct 1914 in Warrington. No info about her parents. John McConville's father Edward was born in Ireland, possibly Co Down, in 1811. I think his wife was also originally from Co Down but cannot confirm that.
Also, thank you for posting the info on Lives of the First World War. It filled a few gaps for us.
Kind Regards
Brian
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Dear Brian
Great to hear from you.
Cassie was my great aunt, sister of my grandmother Ada Elizabeth Allen.
I'm guessing that you or to our father was Brian James MConville, 8 Jul 1935.
Could you pls pm me and we can go from there?
Best
John
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Hi Brian
We seem to have lost touch. I have just seen that I did not pick up on you having Cassie's her records book from her time as a midwife at a Lying-In Hospital in London. Could you please send me details of which London hospital, over what period, and what was her status. I know she qualified as a midwife in August 1918, 4 months before she died.
Best
John
Hi John
Kezia & Mark were the parents of James Roye McConville who was my grandfather. The Roye is taken from Marks mother's maiden name, Alice Roye. My family have some information about Kezia, including access to a portrait of her & her records book from her time as a midwife at a Lying-In Hospital in London. The painting suggests she was a redhead, as was my grandfather. There is also something else relating to her parents.
There are family stories about the Allens and the McConvilles not getting on and that Kezia was supposed to have married beneath herself. Would you be able to shed any light on this at all? James was born 4 months after the marriage so that may have been a factor as well. We don't really know who brought up James but we suspect it was an aunt from Crossley St in Warrington as his marriage cert gives that address for him and he definitely had family at that address on a previous census.
I know very little about Alice except that she was born in Ancoats in 1847, seems to have been the 3rd wife of John McConville and died 18 Oct 1914 in Warrington. No info about her parents. John McConville's father Edward was born in Ireland, possibly Co Down, in 1811. I think his wife was also originally from Co Down but cannot confirm that.
Also, thank you for posting the info on Lives of the First World War. It filled a few gaps for us.
Kind Regards
Brian