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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: sallygray on Wednesday 19 September 18 16:01 BST (UK)
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Born 11/3/1919 possibly West Ham. Her mother was given as Clayton on her birth certificate. She was brought up by Gertie Jones but I believe she was the child of Gertie's sister Dorothy Kate Clayton and my grandfather Douglas Thomas Lowe. Does anyone have any information on this please?
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Hi did Dorothy M Jones marry a Woolener?
Keyboard86
PS the Jones/Clayton birth was June qtr 1919 Billericay 4a 847
So if you have the birth certificate what details of her birth registration does it provide?
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Billericay Registration District doesn't cover West Ham. The birth cert will give you a better idea of where she was born. Have you actually got the cert?
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If your Dorothy was born West Ham, then this looks like her birth registration:
Jan/Feb/Mar 1919
West Ham
4a 467
Dorothy M Jones
mmn Seely
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Hold on ….. someone born illegitimately to a Clayton (and a Lowe) but then brought up by a Jones would not be registered with the surname Jones - that name entered the equation after their birth! They would be Clayton, unless Mr Lowe was there at the registration and is named as father.
No birth reg for a Dorothy M Clayton in 1919 though.
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The West Ham birth could well be a child of this couple:
Marriage
Oct/Nov/Dec 1917
West Ham
4a 644
Emma E Seely / Walter E Jones
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Hi did Dorothy M Jones marry a Woolener?
Death in 1999 (Havering) as Dorothy Maud Woolener, born 11.03.1919.
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Marriage I believe Dec qtr 1940 Brentford to Frederick J Woolener
Keyboard86
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Dorothy was registered as Jones but her mother's name was given as Clayton so she could be an illegitimate daughter of Gertie. Gertie had 4 sons and her husband was killed in WW1. The family think Dorothy was the daughter of Dorothy Kate Clayton, her sister, and Douglas Lowe who were married in 1915 but living apart by 1920. I don't have the birth certificate as this is just initial branching out from my original Lowe family search because I picked up this first marriage of my grandfather and a link came up to Dorothy's grandson which now seems to have closed!
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An Albert Edward Jones married possibly a Gertrude Clayton Dec qtr 1905 Billericay 4a 989
Keyboard86
So is this Gerties marriage?
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I think you need the birth cert.
Very unusual (impossible?) to be registered with a third persons surname, neither mother nor father.
You will see who registered the birth too.
If it is the Jones/Clayton birth then it wasn't West Ham where she was born.
The birth cert should make it clearer what her parentage was.
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OK with help from a tree on Ancestry, Gertude Lily Jones nee Clayton did indeed marry Albert Edward Jones, sons Albert Edward 1906 Brentwood/Leonard Cyril 1909 Aldershot/Sydney Ernest 1911 Valetta/Archie F Valetta
Albert Edward snr died 1915 France & Flanders, Gertrude L 1959 Brentwood.
Keyboard86
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So - if we are on the right lines, it looks as if Dorothy Maud was most likely to be Gertrude's, who must have had a fling with someone after the death of Albert.
If sister Dorothy Kate had married Lowe in 1915, she would be Dorothy Lowe, and if Dorothy Maud was her child then she would have been registered as Lowe with mmn Clayton, or if Dorothy Kate had reverted to her maiden name for any reason, then as Dorothy Maid Clayton.
The birth cert will clarify though. Seems like the Billericay one is correct (that covers Brentwood area where Gertrude obviously was)
My money is on her being Gertrude's child!
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Thanks for that. I think she was Gertrude's child--it may have been "convenient" to let the belief grow that she was her sister's from her failed marriage!
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Hi where was Dorothy Kate b c 1896 in 1939, in fact both her and Gertrude/Gertie b c 1886?
When/where did Dorothy K die?
Dorothy appears to have had only one child a Violet D P Lowe in 1915 died very young.
Keyboard86
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Hi where was Dorothy Kate b c 1896 in 1939, in fact both her and Gertrude/Gertie b
Gertie is living with the Woolener family incl future hubby.