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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Derbyshire => Topic started by: CrichCarr on Friday 28 September 18 11:02 BST (UK)
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Dear All,
I am trying to help a friend by building up the beginnings of a Family Tree for her. Her mother's maiden name was Beatrice BEERS. Beatrice's father, George BEERS (bn. 1873) had seemingly moved to Nottinghamshire, presumably to work in the coal mines around Jacksdale, the family settled in an area known as Westwood.
However, George BEERS was born in Sawley, Derbyshire in 1873. His father (another George BEERS) was born somewhere between 1832-1834. Where I am stuck is trying to find information relating to Beatrice's 1x Great Grandfather (yet another George BEERS). At the moment, although I suspect he may have been born in SAWLEY, I have no date for his birth, or indeed any other information about him. I have not been able to find the name of his wife, or locate any marriage information.
What I have thus far is:
Beatrice BEERS - 1916-1997 = Frank HANSON bn. Basford RD 1915
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George BEERS - bn. Sawley 1873 = Sarah ALDRED - bn. Ilkeston 1873
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George BEERS - bn. Sawley 1832 (or 1834) = Mary KIRK - bn. Strelley, Notts 1835
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George BEERS ?? = ??
My friend only knows family information from the Nottinghamshire section of the family. She didn't even know that there was a connection in Sawley, Derbyshire.
Are there any other BEERS researchers out there, or indeed any other kind soul who may be able to throw any light on the currently unknown information concerning the third George BEERS and who he married and where?
Yours in hope...,
Alan
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Not sure if this is the correct family but the 1841 Census has a George Beer and family in Sawley
HO107/9/F24/p9
Back St. South, Sawley
George Beer 35 Waterman
Ann Beer 14
William Beer 12
George Beer 9
Joseph Beer 5
Thomas Beer 3
All born Derbyshire. No sign of a wife for George.
There is a raft of baptisms in Sawley in 1842 but no years of birth given
Ann, William. George and Joseph were all baptised 29 May 1842, parents George and Hannah.
There is a marriage in Sawley 9 September 1823 for a George Beer to a Hannah Poxon and a burial in Sawley 5 June 1840 for a Hannah Beer.
Emeltom
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Hi
On the original of those baptisms in the margin
John is aged 15 father William a boatman
Ann 13
William 11
George 8
Joseph 7
witnesses to that marriage John Poxon and Sarah Beer
Ciderdrinker
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Baptism records -image gives age at baptism
Sawley Page 98
29th May 1842
all to parents George and Hannah Beer (squiggle on end of name -possibly "S")
father's occ Boatman
address Sawley
ages at baptism are given
John age 15
Ann age 13
William 11
George 8
Joseph 7
Burials Sawley Page 90 entry 718 5 June 1840
Hannah Beer age 35
Suz
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I'm concerned that you are following the wrong George Beers line - although he married Sarah Aldred as plain George, last census he's shown as George Henry, in 1901 he's George H. bc.1874 Ilkeston, in 1891 he's in Ilkeston with parents George (bc.1847) and Matilda (bc.1847) and shown again as bc.1874 this time in Winfield, Derbyshire. (He and Sarah had a dau. Matilda).
What do other Rootschatters think?
Having said all that, I cannot find him in 1881, nor can I find parents George and Matilda, nor indeed a marriage for them. All most bizarre!
One line is a George bc.1832 Sawley but the father of George (married to Sarah) is shown as George bc.1847 Sawley or Ilkeston???
Unfortunately, looks like I can tell you what's wrong but, alas, not what's right!
Annette
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Think I've now found George bc.1847 on 1851 and 1861 census in Sawley as 'Beer' son of a William and Jane.
Annette
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I am immensely grateful to you all for your interest, especially so if indeed I have been following the wrong George BEERS line... However, I just wondered whether any of you might be able to locate a baptismal record, Index or otherwise, for my friend's mother, Beatrice BEERS.
She was born, as the 1939 Register has it on 5th April 1916. Unfortunately, I do not know exactly where, whether in Nottinghamshire, at Westwood near Jacksdale, where the family spent most of their married life, or in Sawley, Derbyshire.
I ask the baptismal question because being after 1911, the Index should have her mother's maiden name on it. I would then, hopefully, be able to cross-reference the father in question, namely with a marriage record for the correct George.
Any thoughts?
Again, yours hopefully...
Alan
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Beatrice Beers Jun 1916 Basford 7b 433 mmn Aldred
Emeltom
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You've definitely got the right parents for Beatrice i.e. George Beers and Sarah Aldred (it's also the only Beers/Aldred marriage) - it's from George himself bc.1874 (who is shown as George H. in 1901 and George Henry in 1911) we need to concentrate.
The George son of George and Mary was born 1/9/1872 (birth reg'd Dec.1872 Shardlow) which all ties up. 'Your' George is shown as George Henry more often or not and dies as George H. too - he is said to have been born 9/2/1874 which ties in with a birth entry of George Henry Beers in Mar.qtr.1874 Chesterfield - as a baptism doesn't seem to be available I would get this birth certificate to confirm parents names and also the birthdate.
Annette
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The George Beers born Chesterfield 1874 has mmn Hoaksley
George Beers Dec 1872 Shardlow 7b 381 mmn Kirk
Emeltom
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The George Beers born Chesterfield 1874 has mmn Hoaksley
I am sorry to be a continuing pain on this but can you advise which record gives George Henry Beers mothers maiden name as HOAKSLEY?
Alan
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Gro Birth Ref
Beers George Henry March 1874 Chesterfield 7b 587 mmn Hoaksley
This birth was mentioned by Annette& in Post #8
Emeltom
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I ask the baptismal question because being after 1911, the Index should have her mother's maiden name on it.
It is the birth registration not the baptism which shows mother's maiden name. The GRO indexes show maiden name from 1837.
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/default.asp
Debra :)
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Details from Parish register
Marriage after Banns
St Marys Ilkeston Derbyshire
6 Aug 1894
George beers 21 Bachelor Miner address Ilkeston father George Beers occ labourer
Sarah Aldred 21 spinster address Ilkeston father Aaron Aldred occ Lace Maker
witnesses Frederick Bannister & Mary Ann Jowett
all signed
1901
32 North St Ilkeston Derbys
George H Beers Head M 27 Coal Hewer below ground
Sarah wife 28
May daughter 4
Matilda daughter 3
George W son 1mth
all b Ilkeston Derbys
RG13 3150 106 7
in later census George henry gives his p.o.b. as Nr Shirland Derbys
this would fit with his birth being registered in Chesterfield district
At least 5 of George Henry and Sarah's children died
I can't find George henry in census earlier than 1901
Suz
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think I have found him
1891
10 Belfield St Ilkeston Derbys
George Beers Head M 44 coal miner Sawley
Matilda wife 44 Sawley
GEORGE son 17 coal miner Wingfield Derbys
Thomas son 13 coal miner Wingfield
Frederick son 10 Hucknall Huthwaite
Ellen daughter 8 Hucknall Huthwaite
RG12 2665 82 57
However I think Matilda was George Henry's step mother
Marriage reg Sept qtr 1890 Nottingham
George bears Matilda Harrison
7b 397
but it seems this was not Matilda's first marriage
Marrige 13 Sept 1890 St Peters Nottingham
George Bears father William Bears
married
Matilda Harrison fater Thomas Hickton
(Matilda Hickton married 7 Oct 1869 St Peters Derby to Joseph Harrison)
More tomorrow
Suz
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This could be the first marriage of George Beers bc.1847 - George Beers, 20, son of William Beers, married Sarah Ann Bradley 21, 18/2/1867 Wessington, Derbyshire (Chesterfield regn. district).
A son William Beers, mmn Bradley, birth reg'd Mar.1867 Chesterfield, death reg'd Jun.1867.
Looks like wife Sarah died as a result of childbirth - Sarah A. Beers bc.1848, d.Mar.1867 Chesterfield.
Have found a possible 1871 census entry at Unstone, Derbyshire:
George Beers 25 Collier born Sorley, Derbyshire (think this should be Sawley)
Ellen Beers 32 born South Wingfield, Derbyshire.
However, cannot find a marriage a George Beers/Beer and an Ellen??
I'm wondering whether the mmn of Hoaksley on George Henry Beers birth in Mar.1874 should in fact be Hawksley?
GRO births index shows:
George Henry Beers Mar.1874 Chesterfield, mmn Hoaksley
Bertha Beers Mar.1876 Chesterfield, mmn Hawksley, died Sept.1877 Belper
Thomas Beers Jun.1877 Belper, mmn Hawksley
James Beers Jun.1878 Chesterfield, mmn Hawksley, died Sept.1878 Chesterfield
The 1891 census of George with possible new wife Matilda shows children as:
George 17
Thomas 15
Frederick 10
Ellen 8
The only Frederick Beers I can find in birth index is:
Frederick in Sept.qtr.1881 Mansfield, mmn Oxley (is this a corruption of Hoaksley/Hawksley?)
Only Ellen Beers I can find was also born Mansfield, in Mar.qtr.1883, mmn Poley??? (cannot see any marriage between a Beers and a Poley so is this a mistake on GRO's part?)
With the Ellen Beers birth in Mar.qtr.1883 Mansfield, we also have a death entry for an Ellen Beers b.1840, also in Mar.1883 Mansfield - again, did mother die in childbirth?
It's looking like the wife 'Ellen' on 1871 census was the mother of these later children although can only find a baptism for James b.1878 - bp.20/8/1878 Pilsley, son of George and Ellen, bur.25/8/1878 Pilsley.
The son William of the first marriage was bp.19/4/1867 Wessington, bur.27/4/1867 Wessington. His mother Sarah Ann bur.30/3/1867 Wessington.
So George's second wife (although can't find a marriage) was an Ellen Hawksley (or some variant thereof).
Annette
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What can I say? The BEERS were a family, some of whom certainly moved around quite a bit. A number of them, including George Henry, were born locally. Indeed, George Henry BEERS appears to have been born in South Wingfield, which is only about three miles from where I live (at Crich). Wessington is also mentioned with a BEERS connection. Again, that is just up the road from South Wingfield and was once in Crich Parish.
HAWKSLEY is a known name in South Wingfield, so if that somehow has been corrupted along the way might explain some of the confusion. Also, Second and possibly third marriages certainly complicate the issue and I am coming round to the conclusion that getting a PDF version of George Henry's birth certificate might be the only way of resolving his birth parents (providing they have spelt the names correctly).
The village of Unstone which you found Annette is in North-East Derbyshire and is close to Chesterfield and the then coal mining area around Dronfield. Finding George & Ellen BEERS there, would I suppose, be no great surprise. It's a pity that a marriage record is not more prominent.
One thing for sure, there are far more people named BEERS than I ever expected.
As I have said before, I am so grateful for all the help I am receiving. You folk are just wonderful!!
Alan
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Yes, as you say, there were HAWKSLEYs living in South Wingfield and in 1841 there were at least three families. The ones I glanced at were headed by men George, James and Thomas HAWKSLEY who were all stocking makers ( as were many in the village) Each had a number of children. Perhaps ELLEN HAWKSBY was one, but I do not see her under that given name.
As shown above, Matilda HICKTON married 7 Oct 1869 St Peters Derby to Joseph HARRISON
Her birth perhaps
Births Dec 1847
HICKTON Matilda
At Shardlow
19/505
In 1871 Joseph and Matilda HARRISON lived in Jail Street Sawley. He was a smith The couple can be seen on the 1881 census but I do not see births to them.
As given previously, Matilda married George BEERS in 1890. Perhaps Joseph had died.
Sue
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This could be the first marriage of George Beers bc.1847 - George Beers, 20, son of William Beers, married Sarah Ann Bradley 21, 18/2/1867 Wessington, Derbyshire (Chesterfield regn. district).
A son William Beers, mmn Bradley, birth reg'd Mar.1867 Chesterfield, death reg'd Jun.1867.
Looks like wife Sarah died as a result of childbirth - Sarah A. Beers bc.1848, d.Mar.1867 Chesterfield.
Have found a possible 1871 census entry at Unstone, Derbyshire:
George Beers 25 Collier born Sorley, Derbyshire (think this should be Sawley)
Ellen Beers 32 born South Wingfield, Derbyshire.
Annette
I too found this 1871 census (and most of other information posted) but have only just got back to it - but something is puzzling me
1871 (as posted by Annette)
Cravens(?) Buildings Unstone
George Beers 25 Collier Sorley
Ellen wife 32 S Wingfield
Thomas bates Lodger M 24 lab Belper
Ralph Wildgoose Lodger 22 S Collier
Henry Jones Lodger 31 Wessington
RG10 3624 62 5
then
1881 Town St Hucknall Huthwaite
George Beer Head M 38 Coal Miner Sawley Notts
Ellen wife Draperess S Wingfield Derbys
Sarah daughter 12 scholar S Wingfield
Elizabeth daughter 10 S Wingfield
Eliza daughter 7 Amber Row Derbys
George son 6 Amber Mill Derbys
James son 4 S Wingfield
RG11 3316 143 39
so where are daughters Sarah and Elizabeth in 1871????
another snippet of information
this looks like George (Henry) Beer's school admission
South Wingfield Infants
George Beers born 6 Feb 1874
father George Beers
address Whitehall
School admission 9/4/1877
Left 14/6/1877
(could this be the date they left the area to go to Hucknall Huthwaite??)
Suz
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Well, at least there is a clear answer to who George BEERS married first, as Annette suggested and what happened to Sarah and their firstborn, William:
This could be the first marriage of George Beers bc.1847 - George Beers, 20, son of William Beers, married Sarah Ann Bradley 21, 18/2/1867 Wessington, Derbyshire (Chesterfield regn. district).
A son William Beers, mmn Bradley, birth reg'd Mar.1867 Chesterfield, death reg'd Jun.1867.
Looks like wife Sarah died as a result of childbirth - Sarah A. Beers bc.1848, d.Mar.1867 Chesterfield.
George BEERS = Sarah Ann BRADLEY (Md: 18 Feb 1867) ... Age is given as 21?
William BEERS - Born: March 1867 - Died: April 1867 - Buried: 27th April 1867 - Aged 4 weeks
Sarah Ann BEERS - Died March 1867 - Buried: Wessington, Derbyshire 30th Mar 1867 - Age given as 19?
Sarah Ann died before William. Two years age difference for Sarah Ann between ages given at marriage and burial.
Still looking for George's apparent second wife, the mysterious Ellen. I've not come across a marriage yet, just noted from Census returns that Ellen was apparently seven years older than George, which makes the number of children shown on the 1881 & 1891 Census another interesting thought, and the fact that Ellen would have still been bearing children approaching her early fifties, when giving birth to Thomas, Frederick and possibly Ellen (three of the children shown on the 1891 Census) when the family was in Ilkeston.
In a recent post Suzard asks "where daughters Sarah and Elizabeth were" after the 1871 Census when George and Ellen appeared on the Census in Unstone? The same question might also be asked concerning some of the later children..............I acknowledge that elements of the above have already been mentioned in earlier posts............but, the confusion and the mystery continues.
Alan
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Re my last post in which I commented on the 'mysterious' Ellen. I mentioned the fact that the 1871 & 1881 Census listed her as being about seven years older than George BEERS. George's birth was registered in 1846 but according to the Census entries in which Ellen appears, I calculate that she is estimated to have been born around 1839/1840.
There is a death recorded for an Ellen BEERS in Mansfield Registration District in 1883. That would include Hucknall under Huthwaite, where Ellen & George were recorded as living during the 1881 Census. At the time of her death, the Ellen listed on the 1883 Index is listed as age 43. That would just about fit with the suggested birthdate.
Another interesting aspect is that on the 1891 Census there is a daughter to George BEERS, called Ellen, listed as 18 years old. Her age on the 1891 C would put her birth date around 1883 (the same year as the older Ellen's death. Could that reflect another death following childbirth?
The strange thing is that on the 1881 Census the 'child' Ellen's age is given as 2 years old. Most peculiar, a 16 year age difference between the 1881 & 1891!
I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that some members of the BEERS family were not careful about total accuracy on such official forms.
Given the death date for Ellen senior, it's no doubt safe to ignore my previous comment about her approaching 50 and still bearing children.
I have been backwards and forwards through what I thought might be the relevant years of the South Wingfield Registers but have not come up with any clues as to Ellen's family name. I have therefore sent off for the PDF version of George Henry BEERS birth registration, in the hope that it may clarify the peculiar name on the GRO indexes. Well, I can at least hope!
I'm sorry if all this is becoming a bit tedious as you will have plenty of other desperate souls to help.
Regards,
Alan
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Another interesting aspect is that on the 1891 Census there is a daughter to George BEERS, called Ellen, listed as 18 years old. Her age on the 1891 C would put her birth date around 1883 (the same year as the older Ellen's death. Could that reflect another death following childbirth?
The strange thing is that on the 1881 Census the 'child' Ellen's age is given as 2 years old. Most peculiar, a 16 year age difference between the 1881 & 1891!
I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that some members of the BEERS family were not careful about total accuracy on such official forms.
Regards,
Alan
I think you have your census years a little muddled
If George Beers had a daughter Ellen listed as age 18 in 1891 that would put her y.o.b. c.1873 not 1883
Ellen daughter of George Beers is age 18 on 1901 census
on 1891 census her age is transcribed as 1 on one site and 2 on another - the enumerator has not filled the census in very clearly -image to me at first glance looks like age 2 but on closer study I think it is 8 (kind of scribbled and on its side)
The birth of Ellen is registered mar qtr 1883 and the most probable death of her mother Mar qtr 1883 -so it does seem a possible death in childbirth -only purchase of the death certificate will tell
My family always believed my Great Grandmother died giving birth to my Grandmother - purchasing the death certificate showed she died 2 months after my Gran was born (both reg same quarter) she died of consumption having been suffering for 18 months!
By the way My Grandmother had her first child when she was 18 and she was 47 when my father was born !
Suz
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I think you have your census years a little muddled.....
If George Beers had a daughter Ellen listed as age 18 in 1891 that would put her y.o.b. c.1873 not 1883
Ellen daughter of George Beers is age 18 on 1901 census
on 1891 census her age is transcribed as 1 on one site and 2 on another - the enumerator has not filled the census in very clearly -image to me at first glance looks like age 2 but on closer study I think it is 8 (kind of scribbled and on its side)
I think that you were right on all counts!! I did muddle things up, didn't I? Apologies. I had spent so much time looking at this whole query, that I just had to lay it down for a few days. I applied for the George Henry BEERS birth certificate (pdf) version, in the hope that the situation re Ellen, his mother, may have become a little clearer.
Having received it today, the only thing I can say is that I am convinced you are right and that Ellen's maiden name was HAWKSLEY, although it is clearly shown on the birth certificate as HOAKSLEY (which you and others have consistently said).
George Henry's dob was 9th Feb 1874. His place of birth is given as Amber Mill, Wessington. That is nearer South Wingfield than Wessington
I have been backwards and forwards in several parish records including South Wingfield and nearby Wessington baptismal records, but nothing!
Also, still can't find a marriage between father George and mother Ellen. Ah well, will keep thinking and hoping something turns up.
Regards,
Alan