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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: Viktoria on Sunday 07 October 18 19:34 BST (UK)
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It was decided today that we ought to do something special to mark the 100 th anniversary.
We have been asked to lend any material we have,photographs etc for two weeks.Medals etc will be put in the safe overnight.
I was seeking inspiration,we have a lovely stained glass window in memory of s young man aged 19 ,killed September 9th 1916,at Delville Wood
at the Southern end of the main site of the Somme,across the road to Albert.
He was Percy Turnbull, of the hereabouts well known family who were in business with Stockdales.
Turnbull and Stockdale.
Sadly gone the way of many textile firms.
We ought to get in touch if possible,I will have to look into that.
But any ideas,as yet we do not know what exactly there is to display.
I thought RootsChatters may have some brilliant ideas,they usually do.
Thanks in advance.
Viktoria.
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I have just presented something to my local church which can be displayed and kept permanently.
It's a folder containing one-page mini-biographies for every name on the Roll of Honour (quoting sources such as parish records, censuses, newspapers, medal rolls, war diaries etc).
To be fair, it doesn't have much visual impact, but it does (I hope!) give a sense that these were real people who lived, loved, worked, played, worshipped, served and sacrificed.
Would that be an idea you would be interested in?
(if yes, and if I can help, send me a p.m. - I have some free time to help)
Philip
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I think that is a lovely idea Philip. So many are just names long forgotten, but that will help keep them alive in memory.
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Turnbull & Stockdale Printworks
War Memorials Register, Imperial War Museums.
https://www.iwm.org.uk/memorials/item/memorial/18739
Memorial type: Roll of honour or book of remembrance
Town: Rawtenstall
District: Rossendale
County: Lancashire
Commemoration: First World War (1914-1918)
Description: Illuminated address
Current location: Rossendale Museum, Rawtenstall
Previous location: Rosebank Printworks, Stubbins
There's no illustration of it in Imperial War Museum's online catalogue.
I was pleased to see Turnbull lives on in Turnbull design archive online. It's a design and consultancy service for historic fabrics & furnishings and for films, tv and media.
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Just a thought - not sure how many people you have to commemorate.
If you know the names of those who died, then you could download a Commemorative certificate for each of them, and display them in the church - from www.cwgc.org
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Not sure how many names would be involved in your church but our local parish church had people stand up and say the name for each of the soldiers from the Roll of Honour. In many cases it was a close (or distant) connection of the soldier who recited the name.
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Just what I am doing for our Church, Philip. Though probably not as thorough as the ones you have done.
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Thankyou all so much,lots of lovely ideas there.
I will speak to Rawtenstall museum ,perhaps I could get a copy of the page where Percy Turnbull ‘s name is entered.
I did look up the firm who were at Rosebank Works ,on the banks of the Irwell but they were listed as closed.
The Turnbull ‘s lived in a lovely house “Fernclough”, just above the river on the other side.
I will be in Belgium for 11th Nov, but will be back for the second Sunday.
I think if the names were read out during the Sevice on Sunday 11th Nov
it would be really fitting.
We have been struggling for about four years to get a memorial with all the names of the men from our town who were killed (in both wars and all the other conflicts since -Korea for eg)at the moment there is a cross but no names are on it.
Whatever the hold ups are it is disgraceful. it really ought to have been in place for this hundredth anniversary.
A young reporter ( and much more) did such a presentation at the Church in a nearby village,the photographs were projected on a blank wall and their names read out and if known the date and place of their deaths.
It was really personal.The school Headmaster had kept in touch with all “his boys”and wrote to each one regularly throughout their service.
His letters for the most part had survived and there were copies in the school archives and of course originals held by families.
A poppy spray was attached to the door or gate of their homes ,and we walked through the village where there had been very few houses demolished,so most stil remained.In such a small place the percentage of lads lost to overall number of inhabitants was very high .
Imagine that in Accrington,after the first day of the Somme.
This idea was only aired yesterday at the end of the service so not much time ,so it was decided any artifacts would be welcome whether they pertain soldiers of our town or not.
I will get in touch with the person who has taken on the task and air your lovely ideas with her.
There will therefore be a general commemoration,which will include”our lads”
amongst all who served.
Thanks again to you all.
Viktoria.
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The church nearest my home is holding a vigil on Saturday 10th and a children's service earlier.
The congregation has provided several hundred knitted or crocheted poppies for the town hall commemorative display.
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On the lunchtime news yesterday,74,000 figures of soldiers in shrouds have been placed by the artist who created them on the grass in front of the
Thiepval memorial to remember those with no known grave from The battle of The Somme.
The display is known as “Shrouds of the Somme”.
That there were very many we know about but I could not visualise so many, but to see the small figures all laid out in neat rows as are the graves in the cemeteries was dreadful.
What a shocking number and that with the 33,000 plus on The Menin Gate-
well words are not enough.
Viktoria.
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Yes I saw that too, Viktoria. And what a wonderful thing that Artist had created! But very moving too.
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My grandad is one of those named at Thiepval. I've visited the site on a number of occasions, as well as Menin Gate, Tyne Cot and numerous other CWGC sites. My admiration is not only for those who lost their lives in battle, but also the staff of CWGC who take such wonderful care of the memorials.
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Perhaps when a name is read out a small candle could be lit for each person being commemorated. Perhaps poignant poetry which may have been printed in local newspapers at the time could be read out and put up on a display.
This local North East website has some examples of poetry which was written during and just after the Great War in our local papers.
I like many of these poems including 'Two Silent Minutes' which appeared in the Whitley Seaside Chronicle & Visitor's Gazette on the first anniversary. Scroll down to see this. Some poems were sent home by soldiers and printed in the newspaper.
http://www.newmp.org.uk/article.php?categoryid=100&articleid=120&displayorder=11
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Thank you all so much,a little later in the year before Christmas we have a bauble service,when people,not just the usual congregation put a bauble on the Christmas tree in memory of whoever they wish.
Names are read out and families hang their bauble with names attached.
We are having a special tree for Ramsbottom men who were killed in WWl and whose names are to be read out during the service.
The Ramsbottom branch of the British Legion will as always carry the flags
and there is a definitive list of those who did not come back home so we will have every name.
Hopefully some family members will be there as they always are ,proud ,grandchildren etc.
Rawtenstall museum have contacted me and will get back re a copy of Percy Turnbull’s memorial there.
If there is time we will try to get family members organised to put the baubles on the tree,otherwise Legion members will stand in I think.
Lots to do and it is a great privilege to do it,whatever we can do is so little
for so much.
Thanks again everyone.
I include a poem,
Down in the viscous dragging mud they lie
Adding to the mire their youthful blood.
No peaceful graves for them as yet while
Each explosion brings about their savage resurrection
Then see we yet again their ghastly moon white faces
Grinning a mockery of “Grant unto them eternal rest”.
Their feeble comedy of “A Blighty one” seems now a cruel ,tasteless obscene jest.
Into holes “known only unto God “ we push them
Then throw a slimy board across to gain
Another yard of blood soaked Flemish ground,
While screaming shells and bullets vie with the louder,silent cry of
“Dear God will it never end”?
And meanwhile far behind the lines in some elegant chateau
The C.inC plots and hones his foolproof plans
For how to use to best effect the cavalry.
The poor and bloody infantry must prepare the ground
But what he does not see,is the infantry
Are now the ground he’ll send the cavalry over.
In heroic waves they will face the vicious guns
And for cavalry read Calvary but for Judas ,not The Huns.
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A slight aside,I wrote the following some years ago as a tribute to the last surviving serving soldiers nearing the end:
They are all but gone now,
Grandsons of Crimea,
Fathers of Normandy,
Survivors of The Somme
Compatriots consigned
To winding sheets
Of mud
Their century beckoned
Young blood enthralled
The spectre of slaughter
Unformed
They have aged no more
Since battle
They will age no more
Soon enough
Regards
Roger
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That is lovely, if such a subject can be but you know what I mean.
We two will meet again and kiss our fond hellos.
We’llwalk together hand in hand just as we used to go.
But age will not have wearied you nor the years condemned,
But I am changed,I am not as I was then.
But love they say changes not when it alteration finds
And even though the years have passed
The marriage of our minds has stood the test of time.
And all the lonely years will seem but fleeting days
When we two meet again on God’s serene tomorrow.
The first and last lines are borrowed from Vera Britten’s Testament of Youth.
It was a little excercise in a writing class.
Viktoria.
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...and a little of Laurence Binyon inbetween?
Regards
Roger
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And a bit of Shakespeare,am I right,?
Love alters not when it alteration finds?
It was just an exercise in a writing class I attended for a while,plagiarising other writers.
We had just a few minutes to produce something but I did not know Binyon
only aware of those lines from The Armistice day readings along with the Kohima epitaph.
I must look him up.Cheerio. Viktoria.
not know zBinyon
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Laurence Binyon "For the Fallen" - has the stanza beginning "They shall not grow old"
Philip
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Thankyou,——-“age shall not weary them nor the years condemn.”
I honestly only knew that from words spoken at the Remembrance service.
Did Binyon serve at the front ?
I have really only read the poems of those I knew that did,in the context of war poetry.
A lovely,if that is the appropriate word,anthology is Anthem for Doomed Youth,the collected works of twelve soldier poets:- Brooke,Grenfell, Sorley,Ledwidge,Sassoon,.Graves,Owen,Blunden,Thomas,
Gurney,Rosenberg,Jones.
It is so heartbreaking,such a waste and such a betrayal of high ideals.
I keep saying that all we can do is to remember,and so many kind people are making great efforts to ensure that at this very special anniversary.
Nice “talking “ to you.
Viktoria.
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Another possible idea for the Commemorations at Church .. after the two minute silence the children in the Church could be given bells to ring out the 'Peace'. (Hand bells/chimes etc)
I have heard that Church bells are going to ring out right across the nation on remembrance Sunday and I think this might be a good way of getting children to participate.
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Laurence Binyon "For the Fallen" - has the stanza beginning "They shall not grow old"
Isn’t it ‘They shall grow not old’ ?
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Yes, it is,I don’t have a copy but remember that from the Armistice day service.
The Sunday school children do come into church at the end of morning service to explain and show what they have been doing in S. School .
I will mention to the person who takes Sunday school but the S,School
room is a sectioned off part of church and on occasions like11th November
it serves as an overflow area as the church is full .
Not sure given the young ages of some of the children what people feel is
appropriate,but perhaps they could do the baubles for that service as that is
something they would like to do I am sure. Not Nov 11th I know but a
special time and if we don’t get the descendants of those men who did not get home I think the children would be a lovely idea and another generation
will perhaps in the future continue to remember.
Thanks everyone .
Viktoria.
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Not our church,although we will have a service of Remberance,there is going to be a piece of holographic art work here in Exeter on November 10th until dawn on the 11th. On the side of the Cathedral will be a soldier at rest and on one of the shops there will be a young woman looking towards Central Station waiting for her sweetheart. It was good to see the shrouds again,the artist comes from Somerset and they were displayed here originally.
Barb
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I have not heard of the shrouds until a day or so ago.
What a effective and heartbreaking way to remember the men who have no known grave and indeed all who died and also any man who served.
Spoke with the Sunday school lady this morning at our coffee morning ,she thought the children putting the baubles on the special tree was a lovely idea.
Will keep you posted.
Viktoria.
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http://oldlowlight.co.uk/exhibition-100-hearts-war-stories-3rd-october-to-30th-november/
Perhaps if there are some creative people in your Church they could make some individual items in commemoration for the display.
This link shows a most beautiful textile heart. I have just posted about this now - I must go to see this exhibition as soon as I can!
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Now there is something going on in Ramsbottom called ”Rammy rocks”,
people leave decorated pebbles in nor very well hidden places for others to find and either place somewhere else or keep if they wish.It involves many teenagers,and if we get the names of the men from Ramsbottom and put it on the Facebook page for Ramsbottom and the pebbles decorated suitably and with a name on each one.no matter if there are far too many.
Not as pretty as your hearts but something already going on which can be adapted very easily given shortage of time.
If the pebbles were left at places where those men would have regularly walked,churches,chapels,shops ,pubs ,main streets etc it would bring them into eveyone’s minds,possibly poppies would be the best and most poignant decoration.
Once again something for S.School but also the wider community and especially teenagers. We will be able to get the names from the British Legion and perhaps liase with schools.
Brilliant,you are all such clever people.
Viktoria.
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Well ,looked on the site about what is going on in our town and Rammy Rocks have already organised for lots and lots of rocks painted with poppies to be placed in Nuttal Park for Nov 11th.
That is good,it does not matter who does it it will be done.
They are asking for as many as possible so the S.School’s efforts will add to that.
Day schools have already been approached.
I did not know hence my suggestion but I am glad something is being done.
Just did not want people to think it was all my idea.
Viktoria.
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Pictures of poppy displays in Bury Parish Church on the church's FB page. Scroll down past pictures of the Victorian wedding dress. The post is dated 29th Sept.
https://en-gb.facebook.com/buryparishchurch
Bury Archives has obtained Heritage Lottery funding to remember WW1. Results will be shown on a new website. See "Bury Times" 1st November, pages 7 & 19.
Also in "Bury Times" 1st. Nov. p.28, a report on the restoration of a war memorial to employees of Porritt & Spencer, Stubbins Vale Mill. The memorial has been handed over to Ramsbottom Royal British Legion.
The memorial is a roll of honour. It was damaged in the Boxing Day floods 2015. Photos of the damaged and restored plaque are on website of Rossendale branch of Lancashire Family History & Heraldry Society www.rossendale-fhhs.org.uk/files/war_memorials/stubbins_vale_mill_roh.html
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Colonel Austen Townsend Porritt served in WW1; his name is on Stubbins Vale Mill roll of honour. He gifted Chatterton Playing Field in thanksgiving for peace following the Great War.
Names of employees of Stubbins Vale Mill who died in both World Wars are engraved on 2 plaques set in a wall of Stubbins Vale Mill memorial garden. Among the names is that of Colonel Porritt's son, Captain Richard Porritt, a director of Porritt & Spencer.
Richard Whitaker Porritt (1910-1940) of Grange-over-Sands and Ramsbottom was the only child of Austen Townsend Porritt and Annie Louse (nee Law-Schofield). He was elected M.P. for Heywood & Radcliffe in 1935, becoming the youngest M.P. in the House of Commons. Ramsbottom was then in Heywood constituency. A captain in the Lancashire Fusiliers, he was killed at Seclin, 26th May 1940 during the Dunkirk retreat. He was the first British M.P. to be killed in WW2. Another M.P. was killed 4 days later. Heywood's M.P. in WW1, Captain Harold Thomas Cawley, was killed in action, Dardanelles 1915.
A town square in Seclin was named in memory of Captain Richard Porritt.
Richard's parents are buried in Grange Fell cemetery, Grange-over-Sands. Richard's name is on the gravestone. Colonel Austen Porritt gifted pews to a church at Grange in memory of his wife and son.
Colonel Porritt also gifted the Stubbins Estate to the National Trust in his son's memory.
www.rossendale-fhhs.org.uk/files/war_memorials/stubbins_estate.html
Pictures of war graves at Seclin and the town square naming ceremony are on a website about Lancashire Fusiliers.
https://www.lancs-fusiliers.co.uk/features/HarryWroe/Harrywroe.htm
This has personal memories of the Dunkirk retreat.
Website of Rossendale branch of Lancashire Family History & Heraldry Society contains a list of war memorials in Rossendale. The oldest of these is in Rawtenstall Municipal Cemetery. It is reputed to be the earliest Great War community memorial in England. It was erected in 1915 and had only 8 names at the time. www.rossendale-fhhs.org.uk
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The last time I walked through Stubbins Estate the plaque telling of Colonel Porrit’s gift in memory of his son was so badly decayed,it was literally falling to bits.
I reported it but nothing was done by N.T.
I have not walked there for a couple of years ,hopefully it will now be renewed if it has not already .
Thankyou you for the information,I don’t take The Bury Times anymore .
Viktoria.