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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Kent => Topic started by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 October 18 07:52 BST (UK)

Title: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 October 18 07:52 BST (UK)
can anyone see this family in 1881?  I've found quite a few of them in subsequent censuses and other events.

At this point I just want to find them in 1881

they ought to be in the Gillingham, Kent area.  I don't think Margaret (the mother) died until 1885

This is them in 1871 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VFXX-KZM

Later John MARSHALL is recorded as a Naval Pensioner

In addition to children listed here are Eliza age 3 and Ann age 8 (although I think this is Sarah Ann age 8 months) who are both on the next page of the 1871 image.

Additional children born between 1871 and 1881 (all Gillingham)  are
Elizabeth Ellen b 1872
Julia Alice b 1875
Edith Mabel b 1880   all three of these can be accounted for later, so definitely alive in 1881.
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Thursday 18 October 18 11:26 BST (UK)
Nope drawing a blank as well I'm afraid  :-\
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Thursday 18 October 18 17:48 BST (UK)
I can't find them either.  Perhaps John was posted overseas  ???
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: rosie17 on Thursday 18 October 18 18:35 BST (UK)
I can't find them either.  Perhaps John was posted overseas  ???

Not seeing anything on the incoming passengers list ..before 1891 when John is back in Kent nothing in Scotland either ???

Rosie
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Thursday 18 October 18 19:02 BST (UK)
where is John in 1891?
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 October 18 19:17 BST (UK)
Frindsbury. In 1891

Boarder, widower, retired diver. (On prev page)  With youngest daughter Edith and Annie (Sarah Ann) is visiting

https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&query=%2Bgivenname%3AEdith~%20%2Bsurname%3AMarshall~%20%2Bbirth_place%3AKent~%20%2Bbirth_year%3A1880-1882~&collection_id=1865747&collectionNameFilter=true

Thank you all for looking.
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: rosie17 on Thursday 18 October 18 19:23 BST (UK)
where is John in 1891?
[/quote

John Marshal boarder Frindsbury Kent
Piece 653 ,Folio 63  ..if I have the right person

Rosie
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 October 18 19:33 BST (UK)
where is John in 1891?
[/quote

John Marshal boarder Frindsbury Kent
Piece 653 ,Folio 63  ..if I have the right person

Rosie

Yes, that’s correct
In 1901 still Frinsbury. The three youngest daughters with him, 2 married, and 2 grandchildren

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9XY-J8D


1911 he’s with Edith Mabel and her husband Walter Frederick CHILD and children in Strood


https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWDF-DZP



Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: rosie17 on Thursday 18 October 18 19:44 BST (UK)
Yes found him on all the other census forms ...just the 1881 which is a mystery ???

Rosie
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 October 18 19:46 BST (UK)
And even if he was at sea, there should be at least one of the rest of the family somewhere!!
So frustrating, as a number of the children I cannot find subsequently so I would like to know if they were around in 1881.

Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: rosie17 on Thursday 18 October 18 20:07 BST (UK)
I did see this one although the birth year is out
1881 Census
John Marshall at 46 born abt 1835 Portsmouth ..gunner royal navy married

Civil Parish vessels Minotaux ..

Rosie
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Thursday 18 October 18 20:15 BST (UK)
And that one is a gunner.

I think he is another John Marshall. Married to Mary.  (There are at least three born at the right time in the Gosport/Portsmouth/Portsea area and everyone went to sea down there!

Would help if I could also find MY John’s navy record.  I’ve seemingly everyone else’s except him.
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Friday 19 October 18 10:02 BST (UK)
I can see 3 John Marshalls at sea in the 1881 census

born 1845 Southsea Stoker married
born 1835 Portsmouth Gunner married
born 1844 Landport Quarter Master single
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Friday 19 October 18 10:09 BST (UK)
Just for completeness - to confirm John James MARSHALL's   dob.

Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Friday 19 October 18 15:05 BST (UK)
A couple more daughters for John & Margaret baptised at St Mark, Gillingham

Fanny Ellen & Liah Maude of Exmouth Terrace on 29 March 1880


http://www.rootschat.com/links/01mvr/

scroll down to page 99

Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Saturday 20 October 18 10:16 BST (UK)
It might be worth looking at Gillingham Street Directories between 1880 and 1885 to see if the family are around.
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Saturday 20 October 18 11:42 BST (UK)
A couple more daughters for John & Margaret baptised at St Mark, Gillingham

Fanny Ellen & Liah Maude of Exmouth Terrace on 29 March 1880


http://www.rootschat.com/links/01mvr/

scroll down to page 99

Well! I hadn't found them, and I thought I had crawled through the GRO with a fine tooth comb. Just shows you. Always keep looking!
Leah Maud is a servant in 1891 in Rochester, so perhaps I can find HER In 1881!

Found her marriage, children and death.

CANNOT see Fanny Ellen's GRO reg. All other children were registered.  Edith Mabel reg December qtr 1880 and Leah Maud dob 6 April 1877 so Fanny Ellen should be in between somewhere.
Or what about a death?
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Saturday 20 October 18 12:50 BST (UK)
It does seem strange. The children's names weren't common so should be easy to find.

There are very few missing bits of the 1881 census

I was researching a Chatham Dockyard family years ago who went to America and came back again (between 1872 and 1880). Someone said that a notice had been pinned to the dock gates inviting men to go.  Perhaps a similar thing happened to your Marshall family.

If the family went overseas with the Royal Navy then they wouldn't appear on any passenger list. There are RN ships on the 1881 census though.
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: mckha489 on Saturday 20 October 18 13:08 BST (UK)
I cannot see an Exmouth Terrace or any other type of street in New Brompton or Gillingham in 1881
closest is in Greenwich.
I'll get someone to check directories. 
I really don't think they would have gone to sea with the RN as John was not of high enough rank.  I need his RN record. 

I suppose they might have gone off to America for a year or two (and had Fanny there?) It's worth looking at.   Especially if some of the children I cannot account for stayed there.

Some of Margaret's nieces and nephews did go, but not until somewhat later.

 
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Saturday 20 October 18 13:12 BST (UK)
I couldn't find Exmouth Terrace either but it could have been a row of houses in an unnamed street.  The addresses on the page of baptisms have NB after them which I presume means New Brompton.

This post on the Kent History Forum explains where it was

http://www.kenthistoryforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=10525.0

The 1861 census has the pub listed at 27 Exmouth Terrace.
There is a map on Google images.
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: rosie17 on Saturday 20 October 18 14:28 BST (UK)
There is no record of any of this family on the UK Incoming Passenger Lists from 1878-1891 not found any of them on the 1881 census ...Perhaps missing records ? ...There are 2 private tree's on Ancestry if you have access you could maybe send them a message to see if they can help

Rosie
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Saturday 20 October 18 14:38 BST (UK)
is this his service record?

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C9523100

and

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D6580031

you can look at the preview to get an idea of what it says
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: rosie17 on Saturday 20 October 18 14:55 BST (UK)
Don't think that's him he was born 1832... the other John James Marshall was 1829

Rosie
Title: Re: family of John James MARSHALL and Margaret Nichols nee NUTCHER in 1881
Post by: bearkat on Saturday 20 October 18 15:11 BST (UK)
You're right - he was born  8 Nov 1828.