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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: pughcd on Tuesday 23 October 18 21:38 BST (UK)
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There is well documented 18/19th century merchant family in Liverpool named Drinkwater. The family provided a number of Lord Mayors to Liverpool; James Drinkwater in 1810, Peter Bourne in 1825 (husband of Margaret Drinkwater) and Sir George Drinkwater in 1829.
My 3rd great grandfather is a brewer named George Drinkwater. He marries Cicely Spooner, 27 Feb 1832 at St Peter's Liverpool. The parish register states he was a brewer. They have children; George 1833-1833 and Margaret b 1834. They live at Pontack Lane, off Christian Street, near the original Adelphi Theatre. I have found this area on the Liverpool (Shaw Street) 1848, Godfrey Edition maps from Liverpool Library. Unfortunately, Cicely dies in 1835 and George Drinkwater marries Martha Darlington of Sandbach and they have three daughters; Sarah 1838-, Rosa 1841-1841 and Mary 1842-1845. Although the 1841 census shows George as a labourer, they do appear to be living close to Christian Street at Mansfield Street. However when Sarah Drinkwater marries John Phiner Jones in 1865 it states that her father George Drinkwater is (or was) a Brewer.
My question here is whether our George Drinkwater might be the landlord of the Pontack Inn, corner of Pontack Lane or whether he is working at the Myrtle Brewery on the corner of Myrtle Street and Christian Street? Are there any early licensing documents I could search at Liverpool Library? Or are there dozens of local Brewers all working for the Myrtle Brewery?
I suspect that this George Drinkwater is unrelated to the merchant Drinkwaters who feature in Liverpool and Isle of Man society. More questions to follow but just getting started at RootsChat.
Thanks in advance.
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Low Hill Cemetry ,Everton,
20th Feb 1835
Cecilia Drinkwater
aged 35 years
abode only given as Pontack Lane
grave 5705
on their sons death,George,aged 1 month from convulsions mums name has been written as Caroline,the address is given as Christian St, grave 5997,also buried Low Hill,his baptism is St Peters Liverpool,three days before he is buried,here they give Pontack Lane and Christian St,
cause of death Bowels,comp
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Liverpool Mercury,June 28th 1839
To be let
A Tavern,situated in Christian Street
with Qouiting and skittle ground attached,coming in with the value of fixtures only
Aplly at the Myrtle Brewery adjoining
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in the 1833 electors register for Liverpool
Thomas Wade is registered as having a public house and Brewery in Christian Street
I see no George Drinkwater at this time registered to vote in Christian or Pontack St,
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at what point did your George Drinkwater Syers drop the Syrs from his name,if this is the one you are researchin
siblings
George Drinkwater Syers
Helen Harper Syers
Robert Meadows Syers
John Milne Syers
Thomas Henry Syers
Alexander Syers
Mary Alice Syers
children of Robert a merchant and his wife Martha
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The partnership hitherto subsisting between us the undersighned George Drinkwater Syers and John Milne Syers,was this day dissolved by mutual consent and all accounts owing to and due by the said firm will be recieved and paid by the said George Drinkwater Syers
as witnesses our hand this third day of December 1835
Syers George Drinkwater and John M Syers ,chemists,Liverpool
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Georeg Drinkwater Syers chemist and druggist 24 Richmond Row,Gores 1825 directory
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Looking at this yours isn't George Drinkwater Syers
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He's a brewer on the 1833 and 1834 baptism records but a labourer on the later baptisms.
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He's also a brewer on the 1836 marriage record.
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big change in occupation,perhaps there is a will for his father Robert floating around this might be usefull
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Do you have any census returns with George and his wife and children n Liverpool together
,I can not find him could you let us know when and where he is,and also do you have a confirmed death recorded for George
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Thanks for all the above content.
I have discounted the Syers family connection because whilst the databases are telling us that this could be a match , if you actually check the parish register it reads as if George Drinkwater are the given names of George Drinkwater Syers. One can then follow this individual on a different life as a druggist pharmacist in a 1827 UK Trade directory and living in the 1832 and 1835 and 1840 Liverpool Electoral Register, 1832-1970. In the 1856 Freemasons, Liverpool he is a merchant. I have two marriages fro George Drinkwater Syers; 1828, Preston, Lancs to Margaret Taylor and once more in 1865, Chorlton, Lancs. before he dies in 1867, Chorlton, Lancs.
I will show my research on George Drinkwater, brewer below
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So Radcliff I have found a 1841 census on Find My Past but I cannot find it on Ancestry.
My George Drinkwater, brewer marries Cicely Spooner on 27 Feb 1832, St Peter, Church St, Liverpool. His son George Drinkwater b 1833, bt 22 Sep 1833 St Peter, d 1833, bur. 25 Sep 1833 Everton. At this time they are at Pontack Lane, Christian St.
Their next child is Margaret Drinkwater b 17 Sep 1834, Pontack Lane, Christian St, Liverpool. At this time Mrs Drinkwater dies in Feb 1835 and she is buried in the Everton Necropolis on 20 Feb 1835. Now the child , Margaret ends up with another family in the 1841, census. A Marn (sic) but looks like Mar Drinkwater aged 8 is living in Toxteth Park, Dist 44.
The father George Drinkwater, brewer has remarried 25 Dec 1836, St Nicholas, Liverpool to Martha Darlington. I can find three children to this union. Sarah Drinkwater b 1838. Rosa Jan 1841- Jul 1841 Liverpool St Peter , they are living at Mansfield Street. Lastly Mary Drinkwater bt 18 Dec 1842, Liverpool St Peter, - Jan 1845. Father George is a labourer now living at Mansfield St.
Family Search has a 1841 census "England and Wales Census, 1841," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQ2B-Q9R : 13 December 2017), George Drinkwater, Liverpool, Lancashire, England; from "1841 England, Scotland and Wales census," This has George, living at Mansfield Street, Liverpool Martha, with children Sarah and Rosa. Also living with them is John Darlington, brother of Martha Drinkwater nee Darlington.
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When Sarah Drinkwater marries John Plimer or Phiner Jones in 30 Aug 1865, St Nicholas, Liverpool the certificate records her father as George Drinkwater, Brewer. So whilst he may have worked as a labourer at some point in Mansfield Street about 1841 it does seem as if he was a Brewer most of the time but then moved out of Pontack Lane so may have lost his licence in 1841.
Thus my original question was around the brewing industry and licensing trade. There is a pub on the corner of Pontack Lane called the Pontack Inn. I cannot find George on any directory around 1835. I am fairly sure he is not part of the Drinkwater merchant house connected to the Isle of Man. The Drinkwaters were Lord Mayors of Liverpool but I think my individual is a lower class entirely.
Anyway, thanks for your suggestions so far. I think another trip up to Liverpool is needed to check for Licensing applications.
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Thanks for coming back to your post with lots of information,I know nothing of Brewing Trade in England and Wales but a quick google shows a few key points as in 1830 the Beer act was passed,
I wonder if any records still exist for the,The Friendly Licenced victuallers society,it was around in 1812
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Many thanks for that info. I will pop into the library when I am next up in Liverpool.
My interest in the family is actually the orphaned daughter, Margaret Drinkwater b 1834, who is my x2 great grandmother. I have managed to find her on the 1851 census of Silverdale, Lancashire as a 16 year old servant born Liverpool, working at Bank House working for the Middleton family. This move north away from Liverpool was expected as she marries John Dixon at Kendal, Westmorland in Oct 1853. The rest of her life is spent at Crosthwaite cum Lyth, Westmorland as a farmer's wife.
I cannot find a death for my George Drinkwater at present or a 1851 census record so he may have died around then. I have found a death for a Martha Drinkwater (second wife), 1879 (aged 69), Liverpool 8b, p 93 which may be our Martha.
Thanks again all.
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So Radcliff I have found a 1841 census on Find My Past but I cannot find it on Ancestry.
Family Search has a 1841 census "England and Wales Census, 1841," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQ2B-Q9R : 13 December 2017), George Drinkwater, Liverpool, Lancashire, England; from "1841 England, Scotland and Wales census," This has George, living at Mansfield Street, Liverpool Martha, with children Sarah and Rosa. Also living with them is John Darlington, brother of Martha Drinkwater nee Darlington.
Just for information
1841 559/6/4
The family are transcribed as ‘Quinkwortin’ :o
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@heywood You are a star!
Drinkwater = Quinkwortin lol
Many thanks :)
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I did know that the eldest son Samuel born 1790 had survived married Mary Jane Dodson, who was actually his maternal cousin and gone on to produce a family of 15 children, sadly not all lived but they did later live on the IOM i have a contact who is descended from them and he now lives in New Zealand.
So it is with great interest that i have been reading this thread. You would find a connection to the Liverpool merchants connections to the Syers and the Leece family if you traced the Drinkwater family backwards to Peter Drinkwater of Grappenhall died at Masssie Green , i am descended from the eldest son George and the link that leads to the Liverpool merchants and peerage is from Georges younger brother Nathaniel Drinkwater. Hope this has helped and been of interest kind regards