RootsChat.Com

General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: 50sqnwopag on Friday 26 October 18 11:53 BST (UK)

Title: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: 50sqnwopag on Friday 26 October 18 11:53 BST (UK)
how do,
   how would I go about locating (if they survived the NA bombing in ww2) his service records or even number so I can research him more?
  All I have to go on for sure is his name and address (prior to the war), he was with the 66th Div working with the anzacs, and he was gassed.  I've had no joy with absent voter registers. 
  Would attestation forms be about anywhere in either the NA or Royal engineers archives to help me positively ID/link him to a service number?

thanks

mat
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Friday 26 October 18 13:13 BST (UK)
If his service record has survived then it will be on one/other or both of the sub sites Findmypast and Ancestry having been put there by the National Archives.  The sites will also have medal records and there are some casualty records to be found.  Regiments (including the RE) do not have individual service records.

If you don't have his number and his name is not out of the ordinary, then the process can be difficult.  That said, try posting his full name, place and date of birth if you have them and folk will see what can be done I am sure.

MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: jim1 on Friday 26 October 18 13:24 BST (UK)
You say he was a dispatch rider RE in the 66th. Div. Where has this come from?
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Friday 26 October 18 15:03 BST (UK)
Getting well ahead of myself but 66 Div Signals Coy RE which had DRs among other things were working alongside the Australian Corps in autumn of 1917.  Awaiting more info.

MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: 50sqnwopag on Saturday 03 November 18 22:26 GMT (UK)
thanks for the replies.

His details as follows

-John Sutcliffe
-born 8/april/1889 in hepponstall, near Hebden bridge yorkshire.
-his wartime address was 7 beechwood view, oakville rd, charlestown, hebden bridge.
-He was married in Jan 1910.
The only info I have on his ww1 service came from a newspaper clipping from 1960 about his 50th wedding anniversary, in which it states that 'during the first world war he served in France as a despatch rider with the 66th Division of the Anzacs and was gassed.....

 I've looked into it a bit a while back and with help from a few people I may have found him
J sutcliffe, 281981 Pioneer RE...... if it is him I've a copy of his M.I.C and Silver war badge roll but no joy on any service records as I cannot tie him/his number to his home address....so it may not even be him....
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Sunday 04 November 18 10:19 GMT (UK)
The newspaper report is a bit mixed up.  The 66th Division was a British formation although it did work alongside the Australian Corps in 1917.

As you've realised, without a service record to tie a John Sutcliffe to the address/date of birth etc, and there are other RE John Sutcliffes, one just can't say that or another medal card is his.


I'm not sure what evidence other people may have provided but I am afraid I find none that so far that ties 281981 to the RE in 66 Division.


MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 04 November 18 10:36 GMT (UK)
It may also be worth mentioning that a Pioneer is different from a despatch rider. A Pioneer was involved in labouring work for the RE Field Coys. A despatch rider would have been RE Signals.
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Sunday 04 November 18 10:55 GMT (UK)
I would also expect him to have been a corporal at least.

If you felt it worth gambling 7, there are two war diaries for 66 Div Signal Company at the National Archives here:

(the top two) http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/browse/r/h/C7355515

These may have mention of the DRs in the company.  The diaries are on Ancestry also.


MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 04 November 18 11:20 GMT (UK)
did he have a middle name?
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: 50sqnwopag on Sunday 04 November 18 12:06 GMT (UK)
no middle name unfortunately, I agree on the rank issue which was another reason I'm doubtful its him.....
     I've tried both the RE museum and RS lot to try and see if attestation forms are still about but no joy so far......
Max I've got the sigs diary but alas him being a lowly ranker he isn't deemed worthy a mention......

there was a paper clipping from his local (ish) rag about him but his rank is sapper....
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Sunday 04 November 18 20:13 GMT (UK)
Is the newspaper date 9 February or 2 September 1918?

MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: 50sqnwopag on Sunday 04 November 18 23:26 GMT (UK)
evening,
    I've just had a look through old emails and its the Halifax courier 2nd feb 1918, going on the time line of being out of action, he would have been gassed at ypres/passchendaele.?
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Monday 05 November 18 09:27 GMT (UK)
It is highly likely that he was gassed in the early part of October 1917 when 66 Division (with the Australian Corps on their right) were badly mauled in the Battle of Poelkapelle in what were the latter stages of 3rd Ypres/Passchendaele.  The Sigs Coy war diary from about 7 October illustrates the difficulties the company had in maintaining communications so whatever his role at the time, the likelihood of being caught in an enemy bombardment (they were usually shells and gas together) was pretty high. 

MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: 50sqnwopag on Monday 05 November 18 15:25 GMT (UK)
Do you know if there is a way of finding the cas evac records for the div?

thanks  M
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: MaxD on Monday 05 November 18 15:44 GMT (UK)
There is no way.  Only a small proportion of medical records were retained see:
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C10949
The remainder are on FindMyPast but I have already looked there without result.

MaxD
Title: Re: finding my gt grandfathers dispatch rider service number/ records
Post by: 50sqnwopag on Monday 05 November 18 22:42 GMT (UK)
ah, tis a shame....thanks for looking mind.....