RootsChat.Com
Some Special Interests => Occupation Interests => Topic started by: rubymelia on Tuesday 20 November 18 16:02 GMT (UK)
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On a marriage certificate, my ancestor's father's profession was named as a "gentleman" does anyone know what this means?
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Generally speaking a Gentleman, needed to do no paid work to support himself and did not rely on handouts of any sort from others, he would live off his investments.
In legal documents used as the designation of a socially respectable person who has no specific occupation or profession.
From the OED In recent use often employed (esp. in ‘this gentleman’) as a more courteous synonym for ‘man’, without regard to the social rank of the person referred to.
Stan
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Details on marriage certificates should be taken with a pinch of salt, I have come across numerous examples, in both my own research and that of others, where the father is termed a Gentleman but in reality was a tradesman or a labourer. It was quite common to exaggerate occupations.
In the same way, someone who was illegitimate sometimes named a fictitious father, or were less than truthful about their age.
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On a marriage certificate, my ancestor's father's profession was named as a "gentleman" does anyone know what this means?
Have you got him in a census to see what his occupation was?
In the 1881 England Census 6,207 men, head of household, give their occupation as Gentleman. :)
Stan
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On a marriage certificate, my ancestor's father's profession was named as a "gentleman" does anyone know what this means?
Have you got him in a census to see what his occupation was?
In the 1881 England Census 6,207 men, head of household, give their occupation as Gentleman. :)
Stan
I have found numerous occupations for him including labourer, police court porter and fireman! So i'm assuming naming him as a gentleman was maybe a little fib!
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When was the wedding? The meaning of "gentleman" altered over time.
A 3xGGF of mine put gentleman as occupation at his wedding in 1830. He had many occupations in a long life. 2 documents in 1823 relating to the birth of an illegitimate child had his occupations as "innkeeper" and "labourer". The inn was his father's and was very successful. By 1830 his father had retired and was styled gentleman in 1832 poll book. The father died 1835. Widow and 2 unmarried daughters had "Independent" as occupation on 1841 census, meaning they had private income.
3xGGF had ceased to be a gentleman by 1841 and was a shopkeeper. By 1851 his wife was keeping shop while he worked at the docks as a "vessel discharger". He was a miller later - milling being one of several businesses his family members had been involved in. His occupation was never the same twice on records. His 4 brothers had businesses and also worked for other people at various times. One brother lost a civil court case and his house had to be sold. Their sisters married men who had small businesses and one married a doctor. The unmarried sister lived in a nice new house and left about £600 when she died in 1853. A legacy went to a nephew who was a priest. He attained high office and rubbed shoulders with some famous people.
3xGGF's grandfathers on both sides were styled "yeoman". His mother was related to minor gentry - men who had "Esquire" after their name and who could afford to buy an army commission and pursue hobbies.
3xGGF's cousin's husband was also a "gentleman" after his wife inherited all her yeoman father's assets, about £1000 in 1822. His career had been gamekeeper to the lord of the manor.
3xGGF's priest-nephew's maternal great-aunt was listed as "gentlewoman" in a county directory. She was a yeoman-farmer's widow. She was down as farmer or land proprietor on a census.
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I have found numerous occupations for him including labourer, police court porter and fireman! So i'm assuming naming him as a gentleman was maybe a little fib!
He might have been like my afore-mentioned family. Their investments may have collapsed or they lived above their means. Businesses failed. In the case of my 3xGGF his private income may have been adequate for himself as a single man but not when he had a wife and children. While he was being a gentleman his brother was operating 2 pubs.
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"gentleman" was still used in the 1960's to fill the occupation slot in Account Application Form of a prestigious Bank near Green Park in London. ;D ;D.
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"gentleman" was still used in the 1960's to fill the occupation slot in Account Application Form of a prestigious Bank near Green Park in London. ;D ;D.
Did the occupation "Prince of the United Kingdom" also feature? That occupation is on birth registrations.
Brothers and a sister of my gentlemanly 4xGGF had a titled godmother, as did one of their cousins - same lady for all baptisms.
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Hi, joining in for any notifications; as I also have the same/similar query of “Gent” used in a marriage and a baptism, in Gloucestershire 1780 - 1790.
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Still in use today. The staff list I saw some little while ago of an eminent London Reserve Forces unit among whose members are a number of solicitors, bankers, stock-brokers and the like, are some who put their profession as Gentleman, indicating that they have nothing as sordid as a need to work for a living.
MaxD
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The term is fluid. Definition has altered over the centuries, as society has changed and become less rigid.
Read Encyclopedia Britannica online "Definition of gentleman" for historical background.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/gentleman
An article "Gentlemen - Formerly" in "The Morning News", although American, has a paragraph about "gentlemen" in England in 18th century.
https://themorningnews.org/article/gentlemen-formerly
See also Statute of Additions 1Henry V (year 1413).
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Hi, joining in for any notifications; as I also have the same/similar query of “Gent” used in a marriage and a baptism, in Gloucestershire 1780 - 1790.
I can't resist quoting Austen in the words of Elizabeth Bennet. "He is a gentleman and I am a gentleman's daughter". A riposte to arch-snob, Lady Catherine de Bourgh who was horrified at the prospect of her nephew, Darcy marrying Elizabeth, whom Lady Catherine considered to be his social inferior. Mr Darcy owned a stately home and a huge estate and was reputed to have an income of £10,000 p.a. Mr Bennet owned a modest home and a farm, he kept a couple of house servants, his carriage was pulled by farm horses and his annual income was a small fraction of that of his future son-in-law.
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Thank you for the literary enlightenment Maiden Stone. I like having a Gentleman ancestor, a change from Ag Labs.
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I missed a zero from Mr Darcy's annual income. Lady Catherine de Bourgh would have considered talk of money to be vulgar.
Grandfathers of my 1830 gentleman were yeoman farmer and innkeeper in 1780. They were respectively husbandman and innkeeper & butcher on 1767 Return of Papists. Among almost 400 names on the list for the parish were 3 gentlemen - the lord of the manor, his step-brother (who inherited property from his father) plus one other.
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Gentlemen are the ones who don't have to buy any furniture (they inherit it) - Michael Heseltine
Max
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Gentlemen are the ones who don't have to buy any furniture (they inherit it) - Michael Heseltine
Max
Michael Heseltine was disqualified as gentleman because of that. ;D He's a lord now though.