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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Cheshire => England => Cheshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Olicana on Sunday 09 December 18 00:05 GMT (UK)

Title: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Olicana on Sunday 09 December 18 00:05 GMT (UK)
Charlotte Louisa Cooper married Charles David Elen Q2 1922 in Chester. Please could someone look this marriage up and let me know the details, e.g. marital status/fathers' names/address etc.? Thank you :)
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: CaroleW on Sunday 09 December 18 00:55 GMT (UK)
See www.cheshirebmd.org.uk - it was a civil marriage etc so cannot be looked up.  You will need to buy the cert

Charles was b 1891 and his birth reg can be found on freebmd

Death    Charlotte Louisa Elen  81  Birth Date 14 Mar 1891  Registration Sep 1972
West Cheshire  Volume 10a   Page 1735
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 01:08 GMT (UK)
When was Charlotte born? One of these?:

COOPER, CHARLOTTE  LOUISA mmn MATTOCK
GRO Reference: 1894  J Quarter in SUDBURY  Volume 04A  Page 699

COOPER, CHARLOTTE  LOUISA mmn TURNER
GRO Reference: 1902  J Quarter in HOLBORN  Volume 01B  Page 665

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 01:22 GMT (UK)
Charlotte Louisa Elen  81  Birth Date 14 Mar 1891

I can’t see birth to fit, on GRO or FreeBMD

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 01:27 GMT (UK)
Is this the death of Charles?

Deaths Mar 1977 CHESTER/E P 35 300
ELEN Charles 26 OC 1890

Birth:

ELEN, CHARLES  DAVID mmn TARLING
GRO Reference: 1890  D Quarter in KENSINGTON  Volume 01A  Page 151

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 09 December 18 01:29 GMT (UK)
Charlotte birth is same (14 Mar 1891) in 1939 reg
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: avm228 on Sunday 09 December 18 01:30 GMT (UK)
Charlotte Louisa Elen  81  Birth Date 14 Mar 1891

I can’t see birth to fit, on GRO or FreeBMD

Jamjar

I have a hunch things may be more complicated than expected.  Parents Sidney and Ann(i)e Cooper, in Churton, Cheshire in 1891 and 1901, may have married as Sidney George Prestige and Annie Taylor (dau of John Murphy) on 5 November 1883 at St Mary, Chester.
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 01:31 GMT (UK)
Marriage:

Jun 1880 Chelsea 1a 539
ELEN Edwin
TARLING Amelia

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: avm228 on Sunday 09 December 18 01:32 GMT (UK)
Charlotte Louisa Prestige, mmn Murphy, Jun qtr 1891 Chester 8a 414.
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 09 December 18 01:38 GMT (UK)
Matches

PRESTIGE, JOHN       MURPHY     
GRO Reference: 1897  S Quarter in CHESTER  Volume 08A  Page 387

He is single and in household with Charlotte 1939

Added forgot to add, he is John COOPER 1939
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 01:38 GMT (UK)
Children for Elen’s on the 1901:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9CC-YV3

I can’t find the page with the folks.  >:(

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: avm228 on Sunday 09 December 18 01:48 GMT (UK)
It looks as though Charlotte’s father was born Sydney George Prestige, mmn Skinner, Dec qtr 1853 St Martin in the Fields.  Parents were John and Caroline.
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 01:56 GMT (UK)
It looks as though Charlotte’s father was born Sydney George Prestige, mmn Skinner, Dec qtr 1853 St Martin in the Fields.  Parents were John and Caroline.

Mother and children on the 1881:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q273-FVWY

To confirm:

PRESTIGE, CAROLINE mmn SKINNER
GRO Reference: 1851  M Quarter in SAINT MARTIN IN THE FIELDS  Volume 01  Page 143

Sidney on the 1871, with family:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VRNB-294

1861, no Sydney:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2M2-GRM8

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 09 December 18 01:57 GMT (UK)
Children for Elen’s on the 1901:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9CC-YV3

I can’t find the page with the folks.  >:(

Jamjar

Page before. Thomas age 50 coachman, groom b Paddington and Amelia 40 b Westminster
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 02:05 GMT (UK)
Children for Elen’s on the 1901:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9CC-YV3

I can’t find the page with the folks.  >:(

Jamjar

Page before. Thomas age 50 coachman, groom b Paddington and Amelia 40 b Westminster

Thank you, Mckha.  :)

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 09 December 18 02:11 GMT (UK)
So..was he really Thomas or Edwin.
Not Edwin Thomas at marriage which would be convenient.
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Jamjar on Sunday 09 December 18 02:29 GMT (UK)
So..was he really Thomas or Edwin.
Not Edwin Thomas at marriage which would be convenient.

He’s EDWARD in 1891.  ;)

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:3T21-KW2

Jamjar
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: mckha489 on Sunday 09 December 18 02:41 GMT (UK)
Edwin at children’s baptisms. The ones I’ve looked at anyway.
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: Olicana on Sunday 09 December 18 16:59 GMT (UK)
Thank you everybody for all your replies   :)  :)

I have a hunch things may be more complicated than expected.  Parents Sidney and Ann(i)e Cooper, in Churton, Cheshire in 1891 and 1901, may have married as Sidney George Prestige and Annie Taylor (dau of John Murphy) on 5 November 1883 at St Mary, Chester.


Yes, things do seem complicated. Charlotte and her four siblings were born between 1884 and 1897 and registered on GRO with the surname Prestige, even though they were using the surname Cooper on the 1891 census! If they had legally changed their name, why would they still be registering births under their old name? And if they hadn't changed it legally, how could all the children go on to have their marriages or deaths registered under the name Cooper?  :-\

So..was he really Thomas or Edwin.
Not Edwin Thomas at marriage which would be convenient.

Another mystery! Edwin Elen was registered on GRO in 1850 as Edwin Charles. He was baptised and appears on 1851/61/71/81 censuses as just Edwin. On 1891 census he was Edward (most likely a transcription error). He was also Edwin on his marriage and death registrations, and on his children's baptisms, so why would he be Thomas on 1901 census?  :-\
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: avm228 on Sunday 09 December 18 17:38 GMT (UK)
There’s no need to go through any particular formalities to change a name in England; a person can use any name so long as they’re not doing so fraudulently.

In this case it looks more like an alias/alternative name was used by the Prestige/Cooper family at some times and for some purposes, for reasons as yet unknown.
Title: Re: 1922 Chester marriage look up please
Post by: avm228 on Sunday 09 December 18 17:51 GMT (UK)
I see that Sidney & Annie’s son Sidney, born 1893, emigrated to the US in 1920* and died in Virginia in 1977 as Sidney Prestige Cooper. 

Wife: May Hopper Cooper
Father: Sidney George Prestige
Mother: Annie Murphy

*On the passenger list (SS Baltic, Liverpool - New York, dep 9 June 1920) his next of kin at home was said to be his mother, Mrs Cooper, of Churton nr Chester.