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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Cornwall => England => Cornwall Lookup Requests => Topic started by: dsmillers on Tuesday 15 January 19 17:01 GMT (UK)
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Hi am looking for Loveday Stranger on 1841 census
She was baptised as illegitimate on 20 march 1827 in Sithney. She married William Bosanko in Sithney 13 nov 1843. She died 1844 Sithney
can anyone find her in the 1841 census? Thank you
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Could she be the 1841 entry on Ancestry indexed as Loveday Stonman?
Piece 151 book 6 folio 9 page 9
1841 entry can also be found on Family Search www.familysearch.org
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I see from the marriage entry
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DTT5-YN?i=344&cc=1769414
she was a foundling aged 18 in 1843 so born ca 1825.
ADDED: Sorry to be negative but I think Loveday Stoneman is daughter of John & Mary Ann
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N5ZT-FYD
ADDED 2:
Here is the baptism transcription record http://www.rootschat.com/links/01n9b/ from Cornwall OPC [I have not seen the original]
Year Parish Or Reg District Forename Surname Father Mother
1827 Sithney Loveday Stranger MARTHA ?---
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Hi another possible, I would like to know if this young lady was a Date?George Date 55
Lovdy 65
Lovdy 15
Residing Chenhall,Sithney
Census ref H0107/139/2/35 / 10
The death of Loveday Date in 1843 was aged 70
Keyboard86
Amended.
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GRO Online Indexes give Loveday Bosanko's age at death as 18 in 1844. Death registered in Helston Jan-Mar 1844. Helston District is correct for Sithney.
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GRO Online Indexes give Loveday Bosanko's age at death as 18 in 1844. Death registered in Helston Jan-Mar 1844. Helston District is correct for Sithney.
Looks to have died in childbirth or shortly afterwards, as a William Bosanko birth registered March qtr 1844 Helston mmn Stranger, along with her son aged 0
William Bosenko was baptised 11th February 1844 Sithney Father William Mother Loveday.
Loveday Basenko was buried 11th February 1844 Sithney, William 16th February 1844 Sithney
Keyboard86
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GRO Online Indexes give Loveday Bosanko's age at death as 18 in 1844. Death registered in Helston Jan-Mar 1844. Helston District is correct for Sithney.
Looks to have died in childbirth or shortly afterwards, as a William Bosanko birth registered March qtr 1844 Helston mmn Stranger, along with her son aged 0
William Bosenko was baptised 11th February 1844 Sithney Father William Mother Loveday.
Loveday Bosanko was buried 11th February 1844 Sithney, William 16th February 1844 Sithney
Keyboard86
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Thank you for your help everyone.
I was just wondering why the baptism record says forename: loveday stranger and surname :Martha....why would surname be Martha or does that stand for something else?
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Thank you for your help everyone.
I was just wondering why the baptism record says forename: loveday stranger and surname :Martha....why would surname be Martha or does that stand for something else?
Loveday was the illegitimate daughter of Martha Stranger it would seem, it would be interesting to find out if their is a connection to the Loveday Date in 1841 and death 1843 aged 70?
Keyboard86
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The date family look to be of interest but the ancestry 1941 census has him as George Date not William Date...or is this another family
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:D Oops where did I get William from, correct it is George!
Keyboard86
George Date dies aged 62 March qtr 1844 Helston.
George Date married Loveday Blewet 22nd February 1814 Sithney
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I was just wondering why the baptism record says forename: loveday stranger and surname :Martha....why would surname be Martha or does that stand for something else?
Loveday was the illegitimate daughter of Martha Stranger it would seem,
Could it not be that the surname Stranger was given to her as she was a foundling [as shown on her parish register marriage entry]? And her mother would also be unknown as shown by the '?' in the baptism transcription? It would be very useful to see the actual baptism entry rather than the transcription- I wonder if the OPC would provide an image if requested? ADDED: I have emailed OPC to ask for one, also if there are any parish documents relating to Loveday. She may have been placed with the Dates.
Here's another version of the OPC transcription
Day Month 20-Mar
Year 1827
Parish Or Reg District Sithney
Forename Loveday Stranger
Surname MARTHA
Sex
Father Forename
Mother Forename ?---
Residence Chenhale
Father Rank Profession
Notes base child
Transcriber Notes
[Transcribers' names were given but I'm not putting them here]
I cannot explain why Martha would have appeared in the surname especially if Loveday married with surname Stranger.
ADDED: I see residence is same as in keyboard's census find reply #3 ::)
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I wonder if William & Loveday Date had a daughter Martha?
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The Exeter BTs show that Loveday Stranger Martha was baptised to Thomasin Martha.
Fizzy
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Ahh very interesting...good find.
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It wasn’t uncommon for illegitimate children to be given the fathers surname somewhere in their name.
So this could be the child of Thomasin Martha and someone with the surname of Stranger.
Fizzy
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That makes more sense. Loveday may only have said she was a foundling rather than illegitimate when she married to explain no father's name.....it will be interesting to see if the parish have any documents about her. I will come back when I have a reply. I can see no children baptised to George & Lov[e]d[a]y Date on the OPC site, so perhaps they took the baby in. She would have been 40ish in 1814 when they married if the age of 65 in 1841 census is in any way correct. She was listed as 70 in 1843 when she was buried
Day Month 03-Jul
Year 1843
Parish Or Reg District Sithney
Forename Loveday
Surname DATE
Age 70
Residence Chenhale
Yes, there are several cases of father's surname as middle name for illegitimate children in my tree.
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Thank you everyone so much for your help - I am actually beginning to feel that we are getting somewhere with her!
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http://www.rootschat.com/links/01n9i/
copy of the baptism entry, not sure about mother's name
and of the marriage
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01n9j/
One of the witnesses, Thomas Russell was the parish clerk.
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Good find with the baptism entry osprey. I did give link to marriage in reply #2 but hadn't realised about Thomas Russell being parish clerk - I now see he witnessed the marriage before.
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Sorry, hadn't remembered your link to the marriage entry. :-[
Both Thomas Russell & his uncle William Russell were parish clerk of Sithney. I tend to look out for them as William is my 4 x greatgrandfather.
;)
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I can see the name in your interests now!! I have Bosankos from Crowan as direct ancestors but I don't think I have any connection to William.
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I heard back from the kind OPC who not only attached the baptism entry [already uploaded by opsrey] but said I've checked for Sithney Poor Law Records, but unfortunately those which have been filmed are from 1744-1823 only, but there could be others at the Cornwall Record Office.. Perhaps OP can contact them to ask?
https://www.cornwall.gov.uk/community-and-living/records-archives-and-cornish-studies/cornwall-record-office/
She also suggested that Loveday felt it was more 'romantic' for a 17/18 year old girl to have told the minister at her marriage she was a foundling [which fact would certainly have been entered in the parish register].
I think Loveday was a fairly common forename in Cornwall at the time so perhaps no inference can be made from the family she appears to have been living with in 1841 having an older Loveday.
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On the OPC database the marriage entry read Loveday Meager. I have now had that changed to Stranger.
Fizzy
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Hi josey, also Stranger looks to be a fairly common surname in Cornwall?
Keyboard86
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Indeed keyboard, and I agree that it may be an indication of her father's surname. Have we located a Thomasin Martha at all?
That's good, fizzybubble.
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I’m not at all sure about this Thomasin Martha in the BTs now I have seen the original entry.
Apart from Loveday Stranger, the rest is rather indecipherable, as though the vicar was totally confused, so perhaps she was a foundling who someone else brought to baptism.
Interestingly in 1810 Helston a William Stranger was baptised having been found on someone’s doorstep. Was he really William Stranger by a note pinned to him or did they name him William Stranger because he was one. He would have been old enough to father Loveday.
Fizzy
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I agree about baptism entry [can't attach here as it is a lookup board]. Mother's forename seems to have
'ade' 'iade' at end. Maybe starts with an 'M' same letter as in the column where 'Minister' has been written. The surname of the next entry [different hand] is Vartha.
ADDED: Perhaps minister started to write 'Martha' in forename column then overwrite it.
Ah I see what you mean - maybe Loveday is saying her father was a foundling. What a good find that 1810 baptism was.
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Hi so was he the possible William Stranger who married a Sarah Hodge 9th October 1834 Sithney?
1841 ref HO107/139 / 7/17 / 26
Keyboard86
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They could be linked.
Fizzy
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And - osprey - Thos Russell was a witness at that marriage too.
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FindMyPast has this baptism as Loveday Stranger (male) son of Martha Chewaile.
Fizzy
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Hi so was he the possible William Stranger who married a Sarah Hodge 9th October 1834 Sithney?
1841 ref HO107/139 / 7/17 / 26
Indexed as Straup on ancestry.
FindMyPast has this baptism as Loveday Stranger (male) son of Martha Chewaile.
Having seen the original they got their columns a bit mixed up I think....
And I can see that the last few letter of the forename were probably 'Chenhaile' not the ending in 'iade' I possited earlier. So the minister got his columns mixed up as well.
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:) Where did the 1841 family go?
William Stranger 30
Sarah 25
James 5
Sarah 3
Mary 1
Elizabeth 2 months
3 more children with mmn Hodge in Helston, James 1842 Sally 1845 and Sarah Jane 1844 dies same year.
Keyboard86
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William I think dies in 1845
STRANGER, WILLIAM 36
GRO Reference: 1845 D Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 74
Maybe James Hodge Stranger buried 1842 aged 7
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2Z4-R9K7
And maybe another James born after his death?
Birth
STRANGER, JAMES MMN HODGE
GRO Reference: 1842 J Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 126
Deaths
STRANGER, JAMES HODGE 7
GRO Reference: 1842 J Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 96
STRANGER, JAMES 0
GRO Reference: 1842 S Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 75
ADDED~; Oh no Elizabeth as well
Birth
STRANGER, ELIZABETH MMN HODGE
GRO Reference: 1841 J Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 125
Death
STRANGER, ELIZABETH 1
GRO Reference: 1842 J Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 96
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Mary's birth
STRAINGER, MARY ANN HADGE
GRO Reference: 1840 M Quarter in HELSTON Volume 09 Page 149
she was baptised in 1840
Day Month 19-Jan
Year 1840
Parish Or Reg District Helston
Forename Mary Anne
Surname STRANGER
Sex dau
Father Forename William
Mother Forename Sarah
Residence Helston
Father Rank Profession labr.
1851 HO107; Piece: 1918; Folio: 685; Page: 17 North St Madron
Sally Stranger 39
Mary Ann Stranger 11
Sarah Stranger 6
Sally/Sarah snr maybe died 1856
STRANGER, SALLY 44
GRO Reference: 1856 D Quarter in PENZANCE Volume 05C Page 212
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Josey
Chenhaile was the place she was living not anybody’s name.
She was living there when she wed too.
Fizzy
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Sorry I read your post as her full name :-[
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Josey
Chenhaile was the place she was living not anybody’s name.
She was living there when she wed too.
Fizzy
So would the mother therefore be with William/Loveday Date c 1841?
Keyboard86
Possibly no, as Loveday Stranger was a foundling so abandoned?
William and Sarah had another child baptised 14th Augusr 1836 who was buried 13th September 1836 Helston a William Henry Stranger.
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Hi again, I think the Sarah Stranger in 1841 with William & family is Sally in 1851:-
Sally Stranger 39 Widow
Mary Ann 11
Sarah 6
All born Helston
Residing North Street, Madron, Penzance
Census ref HO107/1918/685/17
Sarah Stranger b c 1844 is a Servant b Helston in 1861
Keyboard86
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In the OPC database Mum is recorded as Sally for the last two children.
Fizzy
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Hi again, Sally Stranger dies Dec qtr 1856 Penzance aged 44
Keyboard86
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I did give 1851 census & Sally's 1856 death in reply #35 ;)
Possibly no, as Loveday Stranger was a foundling so abandoned?
As this wasn't mentioned in the parish register at Loveday's baptism, just that she was a 'base child', I think it was mooted that it was her FATHER who had been a foundling [and possibly was the foundling William Stranger] - the marriage register entry doesn't make it clear who 'foundling' refers to.