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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Topic started by: snuttall on Friday 18 January 19 14:15 GMT (UK)
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I have an ancestor who it seemed had families by two women at the same time, neither of which he married.
Samuel Marland had 3 children by Margaret Jane Bather of Preston:
Allen (1889)
William (1890)
Margaret Alice (1892)
He also had 2 children by Fanny/Frances Eyes of Oldham/Widnes:
Mary Elizabeth (1887 Ashton Under Lyne)
Edith (1891 Widnes)
I know it's the same Samuel Marland as there are multiple references on both sides (certificates, censuses etc) to him being a musician.
Censuses:
1891 - Samuel Marland living with wife Margaret J Marland and children Allen and William Marland, Preston
1891 - Fanny Eyes living with parents Samuel and Sarah and child Mary E Eyes, Widnes
So Margaret appears to have been his 'live-in' wife and taken his surname, whilst Fanny was potentially the 'other woman', however I can find no evidence of a marriage for either, and on Allen Marland's baptism, the vicar has pointedly written "son of Samuel Marland and Margaret Bather" whereas for all the other kids he's written say, "son of John Smith and Mary"
Samuel dies in 1896 after which point Margaret Jane Bather remarries. Fanny Eyes moves in with a James Kennedy of Oldham (appearing on the 1901 census with him as his wife Fanny Kennedy, with step-children Mary and Edith Marland) and continues to pretend to be his wife until 1928 when she actually marries him!
Do you think the women were aware of each other or what was going on? Surely a Victorian woman would question why a man wouldn't marry her or would ask her to pretend to be married, especially if he was a musician who kept mysteriously disappearing to other cities?
And why would Fanny pretend to be James' wife for almost 30 years when it doesn't appear there was anything (other husband etc.) keeping her from just marrying him?
Any context/thoughts appreciated!
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GRO birth info gives Mary Elizabeth Eyes Oldham 1887 with no mmn
but Edith Marland 1891 Prescot with mmn Eyes
The other 3 children were all registered as Marland with mmn Bather although both boys have the middle name Broadbent.
Pheno
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GRO birth info gives Mary Elizabeth Eyes Oldham 1887 with no mmn
but Edith Marland 1891 Prescot with mmn Eyes
The other 3 children were all registered as Marland with mmn Bather although both boys have the middle name Broadbent.
Pheno
I think Broadbent as a middle name must come from Samuel's mother Sarah Broadbent
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Do you think the women were aware of each other or what was going on? Surely a Victorian woman would question why a man wouldn't marry her or would ask her to pretend to be married, especially if he was a musician who kept mysteriously disappearing to other cities?
I think it's one of those things which you'll just have to accept is a mystery. You can make up your own stories about what might have happened..... maybe both women were completely in the dark about each other, and Samuel spun them some tales about why he couldn't marry them. If you've ever seen the musical Guys And Dolls, I'm reminded of Nathan stringing Adelaide along for years (though he didn't have another woman....)
Since he didn't actually commit bigamy, there won't be any criminal records to find, which is a shame.... some of the bigamy records I've found make for great reading!
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Censuses:
1891 - Samuel Marland living with wife Margaret J Marland and children Allen and William Marland, Preston
1891 - Fanny Eyes living with parents Samuel and Sarah and child Mary E Eyes, Widnes
Is this a typo - or maybe you have yet another potential partner?
Where did you get Sarah from? . . . . and the second Fanny? Or is this another family altogether? :-\ :-\ (or have I missed something??)
Wiggy
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Hi Wiggy :)
I read it this way:
'1891 - Fanny Eyes (the same one as mentioned above) was living with her parents (Samuel and Sarah Eyes), and her (Fanny's) daughter Mary E Eyes in Widnes.'
So just the one Fanny, and Sarah was her mum.
Hope this helps :D
Carol
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OK reread and finally got it. I think. :-\ ::) ;D
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Can I confirm that the reason you think Samuel Marland was the father of Fanny Eyes’ two children is that their surnames are Marland in the 1901 census? Do you have any other documentation naming Samuel Marland as their father?
Do you have those children in any other census, and if so, are they Marland there as well?
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Reply by PHENO reference the GRO registrations with surname Marland
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Can I confirm that the reason you think Samuel Marland was the father of Fanny Eyes’ two children is that their surnames are Marland in the 1901 census? Do you have any other documentation naming Samuel Marland as their father?
Do you have those children in any other census, and if so, are they Marland there as well?
Hi Ruskie when Mary Elizabeth Marland marries in 1907, she gives her father's name on the certificate as Samuel Marland, Musician, deceased. He is also a musician on the 1881 and 1891 censuses (then dies 1896).
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Thanks for the clarification snuttall and amondg. ;)
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I would suggest the relationship with Fanny EYES pre-dated the one with Margaret BATHER and
Edith's father was not Samuel.
Fanny simply registered Edith with the same surname a the sister Mary Elizabeth. It was probably the surname she was using herself.
Sue
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Daughters of Fanny Eyes Read the reply from PHENO and the GRO registers.
Mary Elizabeth was registered with the surname EYES
It was Edith who has the surname MARLAND