RootsChat.Com
Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Lorna Liggett on Tuesday 05 February 19 18:26 GMT (UK)
-
Hello. I am searching for my gg grandfather john Fegan. I found his name on his sons marriage in 1874. His son was Samuel Fegan born in coleraine n Ireland and at age 25 I found him in 1861 census on the HMS Marlborough in Portsmouth dock. Samuel came to live at ballynaleck poyntzpass Co Armagh and passed the home to his son.
I would love to find out where John Fegan was born and who he married and if they had any other children. Thank you
-
You found his name on his sons marriage in 1874 but don't say where Marriage was.....England? Ireland? etc
-
Oops sorry. Marriage was in Loughgilly parish church. Co Armagh.
-
No problem, have you the Marriage cert?
is there an address on it?
-
I have it saved on family tree. Not a paper copy. No address for John on it. Says he’s a labourer.
-
Party 1 Name SAMUEL FEGAN
Party 2 Name MARY RAFFERTY
Date of Event 13 July 1874
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1874/11243/8123158.pdf
.
,
,
-
Yes that’s the right one he married rafferty.
-
His residence is Balenan - Ballenan.
-
Or spelt Ballenon. Yes Samuel lived in ballnaleck which is within walking distance of ballenon. However I cant find where his father John lived/married/died.
-
at age 25 you found him in 1861 census...so born 1836
I guesstimate father born c.1810
C Reg Death results for John Fegan from 1874 to 1900 (as father is not deceased on Marr Cert) Area - Newry
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ncq/
-
His residence is Balenan - Ballenan.
Ballenan https://www.logainm.ie/56707.aspx
-
at age 25 you found him in 1861 census...so born 1836
I guesstimate father born c.1810
C Reg Death results for John Fegan from 1874 to 1900 (as father is not deceased on Marr Cert) Area - Newry
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ncq/
Aged 60 on 1901 census!
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Armagh/Poyntzpass/Ballynaleck/1037090/
-
1861 shows Samuel born Coleraine, Londonderry
1901 shows Samuel born Ireland
1911 shows Samuel born Co Armagh
-
Yes I was guessing John born 1810 ish.
I wondered if son in Royal Navy was he in services too??
-
So confusing when they put down various places for birth.
-
Do you know for sure that it is the same Samuel?
-
1861 shows Samuel born Coleraine, Londonderry
1901 shows Samuel born Ireland
1911 shows Samuel born Co Armagh
So he was born! ;D
-
Yes. All information is correct. I even noticed on different census they changed from Covenanters to reformed Presbyterian but even that fits our history.
-
1861 shows Samuel born Coleraine, Londonderry
1901 shows Samuel born Ireland
1911 shows Samuel born Co Armagh
So he was born! ;D
He was - somewhere ;)
-
Yes. All information is correct. I even noticed on different census they changed from Covenanters to reformed Presbyterian but even that fits our history.
Is there any information in his Naval record?
-
Yes. All information is correct. I even noticed on different census they changed from Covenanters to reformed Presbyterian but even that fits our history.
It's not a change- Covenanter same as Reformed Presbyterian.
Have you seen this?
https://www.geni.com/discussions/168723
-
So, now that you have Townland....have you checked other Marriages for siblings??
C Reg Marriage results for Fegan of Newry DISTRICT from 1870 to 1880 (as these have Images!)
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ncr/
-
I don’t know if samuel had any siblings. 😩
Would have been a help if I did.
-
Yes I read that re fegans in Londonderry. Couldn’t make a connection there at all.
-
Administration of the Estate of Samuel Fegan late of Ballinaleck County Armagh Farmer who died 3 May 1913 at Ballenon in said County granted at Armagh to James Samuel Fegan Farmer.
A John Feagan died 11 Apr.1870 age 82 Coleraine registration district.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGFD-BN5 (quarryman, married)
A Matty Feagan died 1877 age 86 Coleraine district.
An Isabella Fagan (born c1832, daughter of John) married 14 May 1852 Coleraine district to William John Brown.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FG66-VFY
-
I don’t know if samuel had any siblings. 😩
Would have been a help if I did.
No harm in looking....
-
Yes found the will of Samuel at PRONI.
I will have to spend some time looking at these new names from coleraine.
Thank you 😊
-
Hello I’m back again. I searched the names you gave me. Yes Isabella fagan b 1832 married W J Brown in coleraine and went to NSW in 1855. Her brother William john b 1828 was already in nsw. Then I found another sister Mary Jane b 1826 who also went to NSW. then I found another sister olive esme not sure if she born in Ireland but died in NSW.
I’m not sure if father William john b 1798 in agherton coleraine, with his wife Nancy, went out to NSW and they had olive there. But I can’t track her back to ireland. I suppose I have to find out if the parents came back to Ireland and had Samuel b 1837 in order to make a connection. Confusing to say the least. I have searched Coventry graveyards in coleraine for John fagans burial but nothing so far. Maybe some day a little nugget will put me in the right direction. Thank you.
-
I have searched Coventry graveyards in coleraine for John fagans burial but nothing so far.
Covenanter/Reformed Presbyterian burying grounds? Around Coleraine there's Ballyclabber, Ballylaggan, Ballymoney R.P., Kilraughts, etc. but the family might not have put up a headstone. None of those places are that close to Agherton (which is outside Portstewart not Coleraine). The burial grounds in Agherton (broken up into several sections) would be worth checking but again possibly no headstone.
Seems unlikely that family went to Australia, had a child (Olive Esme) then returned to Ireland by 1837.
Isabella Fagan married William John Brown in Coleraine district in 1852- the actual certificate isn't online yet. Where exactly did the marriage take place? Registry Office perhaps? The marriage will also list her residence and names of 2 witnesses.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QGVD-3Z98
-
Thanks for this info.
I have searched and searched for the elusive Samuel Fegan born 1835 ( son of John Fegan)
On samuels marriage record 1874 it looks like James wascrossed out and Samuel written above it?? Strange.
Anyhow I am now looking at a James Fegan born 1835 in rathfriland to a John Fegan - originally from Cavan. In johns will he leaves £1 to James - where abouts unknown?? So where did this James/Samuel work???
I will just have to keep searching.
Lorna
-
Samuel's marriage (1874) clearly says father John Fegan- the wedding took place in Church of Ireland but marriages usually take place in bride's church-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1874/11243/8123158.pdf
On samuels marriage record 1874 it looks like James wascrossed out and Samuel written above it?? Strange.
Not strange at all. Just a clerical error as noted in margin.
In 1901 Samuel, wife Mary & 2 children are here-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Armagh/Poyntzpass/Ballynaleck/1037090
Samuel & family here in 1911-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Armagh/Poyntz_Pass/Ballynaleck/307435
Samuel's death-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1913/05338/4486442.pdf
Posted earlier (reply #24)-
Administration of the Estate of Samuel Fegan late of Ballinaleck County Armagh Farmer who died 3 May 1913 at Ballenon in said County granted at Armagh to James Samuel Fegan Farmer.
Why do you think that the Samuel in 1861 English census is the same man?
And why do you think Isabella & William John (& Olive Esme) are related?
-
Anyhow I am now looking at a James Fegan born 1835 in rathfriland to a John Fegan - originally from Cavan. In johns will he leaves £1 to James - where abouts unknown?? So where did this James/Samuel work???
The £1 bequest was to ensure that son James couldn't turn up later and contest his father's Will by claiming he had been unintentionally omitted.
Rather than jumping all over the place looking at Fegans in Australia, Coleraine, Agherton, etc. have you checked the valuation records to see whose name is listed for the pace Samuel lived?
-
Hello. In my initial search for Samuel I thought get the coleraine one was a match but now I’m sure it isn’t.
Good to know it was a mistake on the marriage certificate.
From research on John Fegan I believe he died in 1867 which was before samuels marriage in 1874?? Yet not recorded as deceased?? But if his father didn’t know of samuels where about when he made his will maybe they were estranged??
Got the census records ok but can’t find samuels whereabout before his marriage.
We think he may have worked at Raffertys farm near markethill which was his wife’s maiden name but so far nothing found
It’s uphill all the way.
Lorna
-
From research on John Fegan I believe he died in 1867 which was before samuels marriage in 1874?? Yet not recorded as deceased?? But if his father didn’t know of samuels where about when he made his will maybe they were estranged??
That doesn't really make sense. If he mentioned James getting £1 to prevent any claim he would have mentioned Samuel.
Irish marriage certificates don't always note if deceased father is dead.
You still haven't explained the Australian bit.
-
Hello
Yes we searched tithe etc but can’t get anything to say who owned this 4 acres before Samuel.
-
In relation to Australia that was when I was looking at the coleraine fegans.
-
The Valuation Books for Ballynaleck show that #30 was changed from Wm. Griffith to Saml Fagan in 1893 (actual tenancy could have started a year or two before that year). In 1915 name was changed to Jams Fagan. The previous property (#29) was the Reformed Presbyterian Church. You would need to check their records if you haven't done so already.
-
Thanks for this info. My Neice is going up to proni soon so I’ll ask her to check.
Lorna
-
Always best to check what's available before going to archives. Here's the listing for Ballenon R.P. Church[
R.P. Ballenon (formerly known as Tyrone’s Ditches) [sic Ballenan] [see also Ballylane]
Baptisms, 1860-77; marriages, 18511934; deaths, 1850-68, with three references, 1880-95; register of admissions, 1849-67; register of departures, 1849-68; session minutes, 1820-67 with list of members, 1820-21; session and committee minutes, 18971905; diary entries, 1850-67; stipend list, 1853; stipend accounts listing names, 1854-1913; collection accounts, 186065; session minutes, accounts and correspondence, 1819-83; accounts, 1954-85; Sunday School roll book, 1928-40.
https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/sites/default/files/publications/PRONI-Guide-to-Church-Records.pdf