RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: janjim on Monday 01 April 19 10:00 BST (UK)
-
Hi,
I have been trying to find any information in regard to George Charles Goddard shown in 1922 census, as being a Manager at the Star Hotel, Broome Western Australia. We have some credible information that a Goddard gentleman was the Father of two illegitimate children back in 1924, according to Court Records. We have no christian names listed in the Court Document, but it is a case taken up by E. Corpus for financial assistance for her two children.
Checking 1922 census, we have two Goddard gentlemen, the above George Charles Goddard and a Harry Goddard, whom we think was a Pearler in Broome, living a the Roebuck Bay Hotel in 1922 census as well.
The Court records are for 1924, and we are desperately trying to find the whereabouts of both of these gentlemen after this date.
If anyone can assist me, would really appreciate that. Trying to find history of the Star Hotel, also the Roebuck Bay hotel in those days, has been quite difficult.
Regards Jan
-
GODDARD.-On November 9, 1927, at Perth, George Charles Goddard, of Margaret River, via Busselton, born Calcutta 1873. https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/37665716
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/32063932
The Daily News 15Nov1927 https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/78967582
Funeral notice: https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/78961164
Karrakatta Cemetery:
http://www2.mcb.wa.gov.au/NameSearch/details.php?id=KB00036010
http://www2.mcb.wa.gov.au/NameSearch/details.php?id=KB00086322
Death 1948 Wife Olive Christine GODDARD https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/47633272
-
Thank you Cupoflife that gives me an idea of his life, appears he moved to Margaret River some 3 years after these Court Records of 1924.
Wonder if anyone can assist me with records of his migration to Australia, I have had no luck so far, though I think I found some information on his wife arriving in Fremantle.
Also wondering why he was in Broome?
Jan
-
May be of interest http://www.graemecheeseman.com/samuelschildren.html
George Weavings Goddard (1843-1935) and Harriet Sarah Hickmott (1848-1907) had eight children between 1871 and 1883 where all but two were born at Calcutta: Edward William Leonard (born in 1871), George Charles (1873), Harold Percy (1875, Fulham), Eveline Emma Campbell (1876), Kathleen Marion (1878), Frank Ernest (1879, Brixton Surrey), Henry Archibald (1882) and Harriet May Hickmott Goddard (1883)...
Wondering if Harry is possibly Harold GODDARD his brother?
George Charles Goddard married Olive Christina Hurley in 1901 Cardiff, Glamorganshire, Wales
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2637-H2C
1911 ship BELGIC from Liverpool to Fremantle pg11: Olive GODDARD 36, George 8 and EILEEN 4
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=9878995&S=11
http://www.naa.gov.au
Item details for: MT1486/1, GODDARD/GEORGE CHARLES
Title: Goddard, George Charles; age 44; address - Claremont
-
Hi,
Western Australia Post Office Directories.
1920, BROOME
GODDARD, Harry, Prlr.
1921, BROOME
GODDARD, Harry, Prlr.
1922, BROOME
GODDARD, Hy, Pearler and Dampier Hotel.
1923, BROOME
GODDARD, Hy, Pearler and Dampier Hotel.
1924,BROOME
GODDARD, Hy, Pearler and Dampier Hotel.
1925, BROOME
GODDARD, Hy, Dampier Hotel.
1926, Nil for BROOME.
Gerry
-
A few suggestions from someone who lived there for a while 8)
Museum - run by excellent volunteers - https://broomemuseum.org.au/
Library - the best - http://www.broome.wa.gov.au/Facilities-Recreation/Broome-Public-Library
Local paper - might run your story - https://www.broomead.com.au/
There's also a local TV station (apart from ABC) that shows a lot of documentaries about old Broome. Can't think of their name right now ::)
Hope some of this helps :D
Carol
-
Hi everyone, thanks so much for this information, I will take this matter further now. Hopefully we can finally succeed in finding our relation now.
Jan
-
Hi,
I but it is a case taken up by E. Corpus for financial assistance for her two children.
Regards Jan
The death in Broome of a 74 year old woman.
CORPUS Emma
Aged 74
Parents Nyobing & Chimbere
At Broome Reg 1 Year 1954
There are various news snips regarding people in Broome surnamed CORPUS
Sue
-
Thanks Sue, yes we are aware of that. Emma was b. 1880, her daughter Esther was born 1902, she had two children 1921 and 1923, so this would be reasonable to assume that the E Corpus would be her, when looking at Court Records for financial assistance by this gentleman.
However we are still searching, I have contacted Broome Museum, and they have been very helpful.
They advise that George Charles Goddard was the Assistant Manager at Robison & Norman, the Pearling Company. He lived at the "Star" Hotel in 1922 census. They also inform me that he arrived in 1909 on board the "Orvieto", but I still haven't found that information.
Regards
Jan
-
Don't know if this is another Harry GODDARD in Broome a year before Gerry's sightings.
Harry GODDARD, a baker of Broome in Oct 1911
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/27665760
Sue
-
Yes, wish we knew that he was a Brother, we do have a Henry Reginald Goddard, a Brother, born in 1882 Calcutta.
Jan
-
Yes, wish we knew that he was a Brother, we do have a Henry Reginald Goddard, a Brother, born in 1882 Calcutta.
Jan
Maybe you mean this birth and baptism
Henry Archibald GODDARD
Christening Date 15 Jan 1882
Christening Place Calcutta, Bengal, India
Birth Date 26 Dec 1881
Father's Name George Wendings GODDARD
Mother's Name Harriet Sarah
Sue
-
Thanks Sue, yes we are aware of that. Emma was b. 1880, her daughter Esther was born 1902, she had two children 1921 and 1923, so this would be reasonable to assume that the E Corpus would be her, when looking at Court Records for financial assistance by this gentleman.
However we are still searching, I have contacted Broome Museum, and they have been very helpful.
They advise that George Charles Goddard was the Assistant Manager at Robison & Norman, the Pearling Company. He lived at the "Star" Hotel in 1922 census. They also inform me that he arrived in 1909 on board the "Orvieto", but I still haven't found that information.
Regards
Jan
The maiden voyage of the Orvieto arrived Fremantle 30 December 1909 as per the following cuttings.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/90983042 8 July 1909 launch of the Orvieto.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/76517841 10 Nov 1909 sea trials proved satisfactory
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/26243787 2 Dec 1909 due to Fremantle 30 Dec 1909
The same vessel included a passenger surnamed GODDARD on a voyage arriving May 1910 see attached passenger list... http://soda.naa.gov.au/record/9255474/1
JM
-
re: Harold Percy GODDARD
https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=335177h&id=I1766
...His miliary record also shows that during his time in the Army Harold married Armeria W. Reis at St Barnabas in Middlesex on 4 May 1915 (the wedding was witnessed by G. W. Goddard and A. E. C. Goddard)
https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=335177h&id=I2460
... Armenia W. Goddard, aged 30 years, travelled from Sydney to London on the Mantua in 1920. The Catherine House records show that an Armenia Werneck Goddard, born on 1 July 1889, died in the Brentwood registration district of Essex in 1971 (4a, 1197)
https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Harold_Percy_Goddard
The Singapore Free Press and Mercantile Advertiser, 2 March 1920, Page 6 http://eresources.nlb.gov.sg/newspapers/Digitised/Article/singfreepressb19200302-1.2.20
PENANG NEWS. [From Our Own Correspondent]. Penang Mar. 1. Harold Percy Goddard, of the Construction Department of the F.M.S. Railways died at the General Hospital here to-day. He was 45 years of age.
Malaya Tribune., 2 March 1920, Page 4 http://eresources.nlb.gov.sg/newspapers/Digitised/Article/maltribune19200302-1.2.12
http://goddard-association.org.uk/secure/military-indexes/ww1-british-goddard-pensions.htm
Harold Percy Goddard; abt 1875; Fulham; Middlesex
-
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/58056031
Wills of the Week
...Henry Archibald Goddard, late of Mundaring (died January 23, 1924)..
Maybe try contacting the Mundaring and Hills Historical Society (Inc.)
http://www.mhhs.org.au
-
Hi,
Commonwealth Electoral Roll.
1913, Broome.
GODDARD, Harry., pearler, Broome.
Commonwealth Electoral Roll.
1914, Broome.
GODDARD, Harry., pearler, Broome.
Gerry
-
Perhaps this hint connects H GOODARD to the George Charles GODDARD who was well-positioned in the pearling industry in Broome. Not sure..
1915
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/192243780
Reminder. A lugger is a type of vessel commonly used in pearl retrieval in Broome.
Sue
-
Thank you all for this wonderful information. Such an interesting family, they are all over the world working.
Jan
-
Hi Carol,
Thanks for this, I contacted Museum, they were great. As far as running something in the newspapers, I think I have to be a little discreet at this stage. Jan
A few suggestions from someone who lived there for a while 8)
Museum - run by excellent volunteers - https://broomemuseum.org.au/
Library - the best - http://www.broome.wa.gov.au/Facilities-Recreation/Broome-Public-Library
Local paper - might run your story - https://www.broomead.com.au/
There's also a local TV station (apart from ABC) that shows a lot of documentaries about old Broome. Can't think of their name right now ::)
Hope some of this helps :D
Carol
-
Well, it looks like we Harry Goddard of Broome came from England in 1910 on board the Orvieto, and that George Charles Goddard is no family connection at all.
Harry Goddard b. 1.7.1891 was son of Kate Goddard (nee Thorn) who came from Reading, Berkshire, England. We could not find Harry in 1911 Census in UK, so believe this would be our man now.
After a lot of searching through DNA matching, we have come up with this Thorn family connection now. It seems that he returned to England in 1927 on board the "Ausonia" bound for Reading England.
If anyone can assist me with any further information, other than the Pearling days in Broome, would really appreciate that.
This has been quite an amazing journey trying to find the family link.
Regards Jan
-
the free part of the 1939 register has Harry GODDARD b 1891 living at 92 Bulmershe Road, Reading.
there is one other person in the household
1945, 1950 electoral roll has Harry GODDARD & Kate GODDARD at 92 Bulmershe Road
possible deaths?
Deaths Jun 1955 (>99%)
GODDARD Harry 63 Reading 6a 75
Deaths Mar 1953 (>99%)
GODDARD Kate 89 Reading 6a 153
-
Thank you, yes I have that information, I would just love more information, if possible, from 1924 in Australia right through to when he arrived in England in 1927,and from then until around 1939.
He appeared to have various occupations during the period, having a bakery, then a Pearler in Broome W.A., shipping records shows him as a Carpenter, and then he becomes a Manager of a Hotel. So just need total confirmation, if we can find anything. This has been a difficult one, as he fathered two children in Broome, and we have these good DNA matches, which match up with so many of our Thorn family. Katie Thorn married a Goddard, and Harry went back to Reading to live with his Mother, who was a Widow.
the free part of the 1939 register has Harry GODDARD b 1891 living at 92 Bulmershe Road, Reading.
there is one other person in the household
1945, 1950 electoral roll has Harry GODDARD & Kate GODDARD at 92 Bulmershe Road
possible deaths?
Deaths Jun 1955 (>99%)
GODDARD Harry 63 Reading 6a 75
Deaths Mar 1953 (>99%)
GODDARD Kate 89 Reading 6a 153
-
Thank you all for your assistance.
We feel now that this may not have been the correct Henry or Harry Goddard that arrived on board the Orvieto in 1910. We have found a Henry Goddard arriving October 1910 on board the "Orsova" with the occupation of Butcher. Having found the Goddard family back in Reading having a Butchery Business, we feel that this would be more likely to be him. As he was born in 1891, he would have been 19 years of age at that time, it would seem more likely that he opened this Bakery business (different product of course) before he became a Pearler.
We have found a Harry Goddard in 1926 census living in Perth, working as a Barman. Appropriate that he left Broome then for Perth, and it appears he returned to England 1927, via Canada.
We just want to make sure that we have the right Harry Goddard.
I am sorry if I went off the track with this Goddard family, but it was due to finding a family member in Reading Berkshire, who married George Goddard and then had son Harry, that led us on the correct trail.
Are there any shipping records available from Fremantle to Sydney to confirm his departure from Australia, I mean more local shipping records from Derby or Broome as well.
Thank you for all of your assistance, am so grateful. Jan
-
.....
We have found a Harry Goddard in 1926 census living in Perth, working as a Barman. Appropriate that he left Broome then for Perth, and it appears he returned to England 1927, via Canada.
We just want to make sure that we have the right Harry Goddard......
Are there any shipping records available from Fremantle to Sydney to confirm his departure from Australia, I mean more local shipping records from Derby or Broome as well.
Thank you for all of your assistance, am so grateful. Jan
I am confused.... what Census in 1926?
Here is a carpenter who departed Montreal (Canada) for London in 1927, showing his last permanent address was Australia... no mention of which Australian state or of when he had arrived in Montreal.
My Transcription
Incoming passenger lists to London.
Montreal to London
Ausonia, arriving London 19 July 1927.
Harry GODDARD,
Proposed address in the UK : 10 Bulmarshe Road, Reading
Profession/Occupation: Carpenter
Age 36
Country of last permanent residence : Australia
Country of intended future permanent residence: England.
JM
-
Outward passenger lists from Sydney from 1923 :
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/DetailsReports/SeriesDetail.aspx?series_no=SP1148/2
Are you sure he departed from Sydney?
JM
-
Oops, sorry, I used the wrong word, should have been electoral roll.
And yes, that is him, but he changed his occupation to Carpenter, I guess not unusual for those days, but definitely our family in Reading.
Jan
Jan.....
We have found a Harry Goddard in 1926 census living in Perth, working as a Barman. Appropriate that he left Broome then for Perth, and it appears he returned to England 1927, via Canada.
We just want to make sure that we have the right Harry Goddard......
Are there any shipping records available from Fremantle to Sydney to confirm his departure from Australia, I mean more local shipping records from Derby or Broome as well.
Thank you for all of your assistance, am so grateful. Jan
I am confused.... what Census in 1926?
Here is a carpenter who departed Montreal (Canada) for London in 1927, showing his last permanent address was Australia... no mention of which Australian state or of when he had arrived in Montreal.
My Transcription
Incoming passenger lists to London.
Montreal to London
Ausonia, arriving London 19 July 1927.
Harry GODDARD,
Proposed address in the UK : 10 Bulmarshe Road, Reading
Profession/Occupation: Carpenter
Age 36
Country of last permanent residence : Australia
Country of intended future permanent residence: England.
JM
-
1925 Electoral Roll
Broome
Harry GODDARD, a shop assistant, residing Roebuck Bay Hotel, Broome.
1925 Electoral Roll
Perth
Harry GODDARD, a barman, residing McNeil Chambers, Barrack St, Perth .
So perhaps at least two possible chaps named Harry GODDARD in W.A in 1925…
JM
-
Well as far as we know he left Sydney, maybe he left Fremantle. Due to the various change of occupations, from Butcher to Baker, to Pearler for a number of years, Licensee of Dampier Hotel in Broome, then Barman in Perth, then back to Butcher over in Canada, and Carpenter. When he got back to England he was Licensee of a Pub in Reading, so that hopefully fits in with him.
Due to this amazing family DNA match in Broome, where he allegedly fathered 2 children, we just want to get all the facts absolutely correct.
Jan
-
Hi again,
Yes that is what worries me, I also saw one for 1926 in Perth. But I have also heard that Electoral Rolls may not always be correct, they can overlap with the years.
But certainly we have Court records of January, 1925, saying that a Goddard had fathered two children in 1925, but unfortunately no christian name given. We have a Henry Goddard in our family.
Jan
1925 Electoral Roll
Broome
Harry GODDARD, a shop assistant, residing Roebuck Bay Hotel, Broome.
1925 Electoral Roll
Perth
Harry GODDARD, a barman, residing McNeil Chambers, Barrack St, Perth .
So perhaps at least two possible chaps named Harry GODDARD in W.A in 1925…
JM
-
If we can find shipping records from Broome or Derby to Fremantle, we may then be able to confirm the correct gentleman.
Jan
-
Hi again,
Yes that is what worries me, I also saw one for 1926 in Perth. But I have also heard that Electoral Rolls may not always be correct, they can overlap with the years.
But certainly we have Court records of January, 1925, saying that a Goddard had fathered two children in 1925, but unfortunately no christian name given. We have a Henry Goddard in our family.
Jan
....
Yes, in that era, the electoral office relied on people notifying them when they moved, and when they re-enrolled, the electoral office could of course follow up and check that they had been removed from their previous electoral roll.
But you mention births of two children. The W.A. bdm has births indexed and displayed online up to 1932... So perhaps you could consider seeking the birth certs... https://bdm.justice.wa.gov.au/_apps/pioneersindex/default.aspx
Here is the live link to shipping info 1920s Western Australia
http://www.sro.wa.gov.au/archive-collection/collection/passenger-lists-and-immigration-records
Here is the live link to shipping info 1920s New South Wales
https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/archives/collections-and-research/guides-and-indexes/immigration-shipping-guide
Notice it shows Departures from Sydney after 1922; from Newcastle 1865-1935
The National Archives of Australia (NAA) holds Sydney outward passenger lists from 1923 onwards and lists of departures from Newcastle between 1865 and 1935.
Here is the naa fact sheets index:
http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/fact-sheets/index.aspx
http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/fact-sheets/fs56.aspx Passenger lists held in W.A.
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/DetailsReports/SeriesDetail.aspx?series_no=PP240/2
JM
-
Have you found the arrival to Canada for that chap who departed from Montreal to arrive London July 1927...
JM
-
Yes have found Harry Goddard sailed from Sydney to Victoria BC arriving October 1926, fare paid by Mother, Mrs. K. Goddard, his occupation Butcher. He landed as an Immigrant and he left Montreal in July 1927 heading to England, occupation now a Carpenter, last place of residence Australia.
Jan
Have you found the arrival to Canada for that chap who departed from Montreal to arrive London July 1927...
JM
-
what ship from Sydney?
JM
-
"Ausonia"
-
Does that passenger list give you information about any relatives - names/addresses etc remaining in Australia? Or perhaps where his passport was issued?
JM
-
JM
Thanks for those websites, no information for these two children on-line, I know the exact dates, I believe though that one of the children's grand-daughter has the birth certificate, with no father named thereon.
I do not have any further information on the passengers list either. I was assisted by Canadian Rootschat member, who had access to that information. No nothing about passport being issued.
Jan
-
Passports for British Subjects basically start being a UK requirement from 1914. So he would have needed a British Passport issued in perhaps 1926, so NOT from Canberra (parliament moved to there 1927)... most likely from Melbourne where all the various federal departments would have been working. I would expect the passenger list would be available to inspect on one of the commercial websites - perhaps Ancestry or FindMyPast. I think (from memory) that the 1920s ones were across two pages, but I seem to recall that the occupation was on the same side as the passport details, so perhaps I am not as confident as I could be. BUT I am absolutely certain there would be passport info on the incoming passenger lists to Canada.
I am also sure that it will be unlikely for you to find much info on any passenger lists for coastal movements or interstate movements that would give you the vital clues for determining how your Harry got from W.A. to anywhere in 1926. Sorry, but it was not actually a significant administrative matter for the powers that be in that era in the Commonwealth of Australia's admin :D (as per phone advice from one of my retired rellies - formerly an Archivist ).
JM
-
:D Some info that may be very helpful
WA electoral roll, 1925 PERTH,
John Clifford PURVIS, 117 Zebina Street, a labourer
William Ransom PURVIS, same address, also a labourer.
Canada Incoming passenger list
right hand page for entry re Harry...
Butcher
mother Mrs K Goddard, 4018 Avenue St, Vancouver
Friend, Mr J Piervis, 117 Zebina St, Western Australia
Melbourne/A45441 21/07/26 (Passport issued for Harry/ the number of that passport/date issued)
And, my apologies, my retired rellie is not a former Archivist, he is STILL an Archivist, but not gainfully employed. And he ought to join RChat :D
JM
-
I have posted on your other current thread on the Canada board re the incoming Canadian Passenger list, including giving his passport number issued in Melbourne 21 July 1926.
Have you considered that J Piervis and John Purvis likely same person in W.A.
JM
-
JM
Thanks for that, and yes I did receive this information last night, and searched through Ancestry regarding this Purvis gentleman. Maybe he was just a friend he had to name for his passport here in Australia, could not find Purvis having any association with Harry Goddard. Harry Goddard had no other family member living in Australia, and we do know that he left this lady Esther Corpus in Broome and Court records in 1925 indicated that a Goddard was the Defendant in the Children's Court arrangements.
Jan
-
WA BDM has a still birth (deaths) for unnamed CORPUS male at Broome in 1927, and also a birth at Broome in that surname in 1928. I won't mention the given name for the birth as it is less than 100 years, so privacy and RChat rules. But there were others with surname GODDARD in Broome and elsewhere in W.A in the 'right' timeframe.
I do find it unusual that a person would claim a trade as a baker then a trade as a butcher and then a trade as a carpenter ... three very different trades. And of course a Pearler and a Barman and a labourer... I have ancestors in the 1880s through to the 1930s in Broome, Pearling across from there all the way across to Thursday Island. I found it a very interesting learning curve, very multi-cultural, across huge religious differences, and with ethnicity barriers too ... Malay, Japanese, and first generation English/European. Many many years/decades ago, I learnt that the treatment of Aboriginal Australians, particularly vulnerable young females living on the fringes of Broome was harsh; I found it to be a wrong (that) has not yet been reconciled.
JM edited to sort some grammar.
-
Search as a guest and enter the name
http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/search/
Some notes on John Clifford PURVIS.
He enlisted in WW1 in 1915 aged about 20. He was a miner at Kalgoorlie and his mother Sarah Jane, was his NOK. Her surname was COULTER, so perhaps she had made a second marriage.
Electoral Rolls show her at an address in Kalgoorlie up to 1920.
After that she was living at 117 Zebina St My Lawley.
PURVIS was twice wounded in action and was discharged in 1919.
There is also an unexamined record for one Harry GODDARD at the site I have given. It is a service record undigitised with a span of 1919/ 1920.
Sue
-
Good point Sue. I think that naa.gov.au record for a Harry GODDARD could be helpful. The series it belongs to shows in part that it is
' Assistance and medical files, 1914/18 War, single number series with 'R' prefix'
There is a service number for that Harry Goddard at the naa index. Perhaps it is a UK service number ??
GODDARD, Harry - Service Number - 377004
ADD ... that file's location is in the Perth office of NAA.
JM
-
Hi JM.
Yes I am aware of the birth in 1928, and know his name, still alive. We are absolutely amazed at all the different occupations for this Harry Goddard, but certainly the occupation in Perth as Barman and his final occupation in Reading coincide. Of course we have him also being Licensee in Broome after being a Pearler. So the family trade in Reading Berkshire, they were definitely Butchers, Henry came to Australia as a Butcher, went to Canada likewise, but then left Canada as a Carpenter. Why, we don't know. We have family members in Broome area, who are DNA connections through this Goddard family in Reading, Berkshire.
Oh yes, this family in Broome and Derby have been most interesting, they were treated badly. We are looking at a well known Pastoralist marrying one of the Corpus family members.
Jan
WA BDM has a still birth (deaths) for unnamed CORPUS male at Broome in 1927, and also a birth at Broome in that surname in 1928. I won't mention the given name for the birth as it is less than 100 years, so privacy and RChat rules. But there were others with surname GODDARD in Broome and elsewhere in W.A in the 'right' timeframe.
I do find it unusual that a person would claim a trade as a baker then a trade as a butcher and then a trade as a carpenter ... three very different trades. And of course a Pearler and a Barman and a labourer... I have ancestors in the 1880s through to the 1930s in Broome, Pearling across from there all the way across to Thursday Island. I found it a very interesting learning curve, very multi-cultural, across huge religious differences, and with ethnicity barriers too ... Malay, Japanese, and first generation English/European. Many many years/decades ago, I learnt that the treatment of Aboriginal Australians, particularly vulnerable young females living on the fringes of Broome was harsh; I found it to be a wrong has not yet been reconciled.
JM
-
Hi
I have just looked at this now, so how do we find out any further information on this.
Jan
Good point Sue. I think that naa.gov.au record for a Harry GODDARD could be helpful. The series it belongs to shows in part that it is
' Assistance and medical files, 1914/18 War, single number series with 'R' prefix'
There is a service number for that Harry Goddard at the naa index. Perhaps it is a UK service number ??
GODDARD, Harry - Service Number - 377004
ADD ... that file's location is in the Perth office of NAA.
JM
-
Access can be sought, you click on the item, and then it will have an option 'request copy' and you click on that and follow the prompts. There will be fees/charges.
ADD, they will need to examine before opening the access.Hi
I have just looked at this now, so how do we find out any further information on this.
Jan
JM
-
Okay, thanks for this. Before I go any further, these two children of the Goddard gentleman were fathered in Broome from 1923 onwards, and the only Goddard in Broome at that time was this Harry Goddard,and of course the other George Charles Goddard who we have completed discounted now. The Court records were from Broome in 1925.
I know we are looking for the period of military 1915-1919, but I still have have doubts about this fellow being him. Every electoral records from 1913 right through to 1924 show him as a Pearler.
Anyway I shall go ahead and request copy, see what happens
-
I am attaching a much clearer image for the passport info.
JM
-
Thanks JM, just stepping out for DR appointment, will be back later in the morning
-
When did it become compulsory to enrol in Western Australia? Google says not until 1936...
In the 1920s ... They needed to have residency (I think six months at same location) and be a British Subject ('Australian citizenship not a factor until 1949) and they needed to be aged 21 years or over.
I think it is not safe to say your Harry was the only GODDARD in Broome in 1923 or thereabouts.
JM
-
Well certainly electoral rolls certainly showed two Goddards there in Broome, one Harry and the other George Charles Goddard. On some records that our family has provided us from Broome dated 1938 where the young lady that was born in 1923 was applying for a permit to work, her being half aboriginal, someone has written beside her birth date Henry Goddard, Clerk.
So who knows what this is all about. However the daughter of this lady born in 1923 is my 4th Cousin through DNA testing.
Jan
When did it become compulsory to enrol in Western Australia? Google says not until 1936...
In the 1920s ... They needed to have residency (I think six months at same location) and be a British Subject ('Australian citizenship not a factor until 1949) and they needed to be aged 21 years or over.
I think it is not safe to say your Harry was the only GODDARD in Broome in 1923 or thereabouts.
JM
-
Yes, 377004 is a significant number for an English enlistment WWI as per the TNA, Kew, website. I searched using just the number ! http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/british-army-medal-index-cards-1914-1920/
Medal card of Harry GODDARD, Royal Berkshire Regiment, Regiment number 22464, Private.
Reference WO372/8/41609
So I would expect that the chap who served in WWI with the Royal Berks Regiment is the same chap who has a file at the National Archives of Australia’s Perth office.
I am sure Jan will have Ancestry access to the relevant image of the medal card index for that chap.
JM
-
From my desk during lunch today...
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/2766689 The West Australian 5 Nov 1919, the Perth Bailiff for the Local Court, Perth, selling land, unpaid rates. Including Item 70, where there was £4/1/3d owed.
Lot 30, of Canning, Location 2. Registered proprietor being Henry Seeligson (the younger) of Perth, a financier and Harry Goddard, baker of Broome as owner.
I am fairly sure that would be Canning, a suburb of Perth. Is it possible that the baker of Broome had outstanding rates on land in Canning, Perth - perhaps unpaid because he was not actually in Broome, perhaps not actually in Australia, but was in England taking his discharge after serving in WWI …. perhaps the financier was strapped for cash and did not want to wait any longer to hear from Harry. Speculations of course ...
Most likely Jan has already thoroughly researched the baker of Broome.
I can see that the broomemuseum’s online list of names has H GODDARD as a Pearler, no mention of H being for Harry, or any Goddard as a baker.
https://broomemuseum.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/family-file.pdf
JM
-
Hi JM, doing this in your lunch-hour, you are very dedicated. The Trove add is for 1950, will try to find this myself later. Yes we had that list from Broome Museum.
I will check this military one now. Wow this is getting quite complicated.
Jan
-
I have not found George Charles GODDARD at Broome on those rolls ... what year/s
No Harry in Broome during War years ...
JM.
-
We have found Harry Goddard as a Pearler 1913 and 1914, next lot from 1920 as a Pearler through to 1922, then at the Dampier Hotel right through to 1925.
George Charles Goddard we have cancelled out, as he comes through another Goddard family, he was born in Calcutta, India. George Charles Goddard was at the Star Hotel Broome in 1922 through to around 1924, he was Assistant Manager at Robison & Norman, a Pearling Company in Broome. He was then found at Margaret River, Bussellton.
You are right no Harry Goddard shown in electoral rolls during the War years. Wouldn't you think we would find shipping records from England, for him returning to Fremantle after that. I will have to do more searching now.
Quite clearly we have a Goddard who fathered these two children in Broome, from 1923 onwards. The search continues.
Have just checked shipping and found Henry Goddard b. 1891 aged 23 years embarking "Otranto" from Fremantle for London, arriving 1.8.1914, his occupation Plumber !!!! Resident of Western Australia. So must be someone else, a Plumber now.
-
May I mention that there was no need for the electoral roll covering Broome to be printed in 1923 or in 1924 - no elections, so how can you be certain that either George Charles GODDARD or Harry GODDARD were in Broome in those years ... Remember that even now, you do not need to provide documentary ID when attending a polling place to have your name marked off the roll.
There's a newspaper cutting showing someone was caught using 'Charles GODDARD' as their alias... Using an alias was a much easier matter in that era ... this chap was caught out, and eventually gave up his actual name... but it was March 1925 ... where did this chap learn of the surname GODDARD ... https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/208125024 Warning, a nasty chap, two young children involved, people protected the children. Not at Busselton, nor at Broome, but at Fremantle.
I am not meaning to side track you, or to complicate your research, but there are plenty of gaps, (time wise and locality wise and occupation wise) and it is possible there was more than one chap named Harry GODDARD in W.A. in the years leading up to 1926. Occupations like Plumber, Carpenter, Butcher,Baker these are trades which even in the 1920s surely would have required training/apprenticeships etc under the Master/Servant Acts.
JM
-
JM.
Yes I understand all of that, but here we have the Court records for Broome for Esther Corpus and Defendant Goddard in regard to child support for 1925, we have two Solicitors in Broome, as well.
Why cant we find Harry Goddard's records of migrated by ship to England to join the Royal Berkshire Regiment, he was not a Plumber, as is shown for one Harry Goddard who went to UK in 1915, far off the track in his trade. We do know that he definitely was a Butcher as he came to Australia, as was the family business back in Reading Berkshire, and this trade popped up once again, when he went to Canada to be with his family before he continued on to Reading in Berkshire, where he once again became a Licensee of the Hotel in Reading. He was Licensee of the Hotel in Broome.
I am not doubting your thoughts, but how far do we go with this search, of course I know people change their name, have experienced quite an amount of this within our family, but this one seems to come together in the end.
If anyone else can come up with any other ideas, I am happy to consider this, and take it further.
Wow this has been one long journey, six months of very intense searching, on our part, but the DNA match tells us all. We don't believe that this indigenous lady Esther Corpus would have gone to Perth in those days, it appears she already had two children before 1923, aged 18 years, so hard to believe that she would have been down there. Those days were very difficult days with the mixed cultures in Broome, especially with all of the riots etc. at that time.
Jan
-
Are you sure that your Harry is the one in Broome prior to WWI? Did you search for his passage to W.A. after finding W.A.Broome electoral rolls for that name in 1910s ie pre war? He may not have come to Australia until after WWI.
JM
-
JM
Could not find our Henry Goddard in 1911 census in Reading Berkshire, but found him arriving in Fremantle, Western Australia, arriving on board the "Orsova" on the 18th October, 1910, occupation Butcher, same occupation as the family business in Reading.
Jan
-
So Henry Goddard arriving in Fremantle Western Australia on board the "Orsova" 1910 as a Butcher from Reading,definitely now shows up as returning to London on board the "Ontranto" 10.8.1914 aged 23 years, but occupation now a Plumber.
He enlisted with Royal Berkshire Regiment Reading, England, 14.2.1916 aged 24 years 7 months, occupation back to Butcher again. Father George Goddard of 51 Southampton Street, Reading. He was discharged 1.5.1919. Harry was admitted to the Australian General Hospital in Rouen France 27.2.1917. The records in Perth Office appear to now relate to the same Henry or Harry Goddard.
Just need to find him returning to Australia in 1919 and his occupation this time ! No luck so far.
Jan
-
https://www.carnamah.com.au/car-registrations?starts_with=G&page=41
W.A. car regos, 1915 to 1928. Not too many had a car, but a Harry GODDARD in Broome had a Ford in 1922-23 and a Harvey GODDARD (so another H GODDAD) also had a Ford in Broome in 1923-24
JM
-
JM
Thanks for that, I believe the Goddards must have been fairly well off in Reading in the first place.
Well that does not surprise me to see this.
Jan
-
So in 1923-24 there was a Harvey GODDARD in Broome. - not listed on any electoral roll, but he had a motor car ... also NOTE, 1923-24, no one named Harry GODDARD had a motor car in Broome. Remember there are no electoral rolls uploaded for Broome for those years.
JM
-
JM, do you think that may be a mistake Harvey Goddard, also we did find electoral roll records for those dates you mention.
Jan
-
See Reply #4 and Reply #15 for Gerry's contribution of electoral roll sightings from 1913 to 1926
Not annual of course.
Sue
-
Also let us revise
Reply #18
The selling of a lugger for H GODDARD, 1915
His Attorney seemed to be acting for him according to the advertisement.
Sue
-
:) Hi Sue,
Have you had a chance to read the other thread, re the WWI sighting you found? https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=813306.0
Re Harvey GODDARD ... and Harry GODDARD ... it is possible they are one and the same, but it is also possible they are two different people. Also with the electoral rolls, Hy is the usual abbreviation for Henry, but it could also be for H'(arve)y and for H'(arr)y and similar.
JM
-
Thanks JM
No I had not caught up with the WW1 service findings.
Big help for the search.
Sue
-
Thanks all of you, getting closer and closer to the whole picture on this gentleman, Harry or Henry Goddard.
Jan
-
That is interesting about Harry selling the Lugger in late 1915. I checked records and found that the Lugger was registered in the name of H. Goddard, selling on behalf of the Estate of Frank Ulrich. Frank had enlisted in WWI on the 7.2.1915, he was a Pearler, and was killed on the 8th August, 1915 aged 28 years, he was buried at Shell Green, Gallipoli.
Harry Goddard then enlisted for WWI on the 14th February 1916. All seems to come together, I am thinking.
Jan
Also let us revise
Reply #18
The selling of a lugger for H GODDARD, 1915
His Attorney seemed to be acting for him according to the advertisement.
Sue
-
I wonder if you might also have a careful browse through the digitised file of John Clifford PURVIS.
The two men, PURVIS and GODDARD, met somewhere and became friends.
Did they share anything of their war experiences?
OR
Did they encounter each other prior to, or just after in 1919?
Any clues in there?
Sue
-
Yes, good thought, where do you suggest searching, through NAA records.
Jan
I wonder if you might also have a careful browse through the digitised file of John Clifford PURVIS.
The two men, PURVIS and GODDARD, met somewhere and became friends.
Did they share anything of their war experiences?
OR
Did they encounter each other prior to, or just after in 1919?
Any clues in there?
Sue
-
Great researching, got into War Records, and yes, occupation when he enlisted in Reading Berkshire WWI was Butcher, and later shows trades as Butcher and Baker.
Jan
Don't know if this is another Harry GODDARD in Broome a year before Gerry's sightings.
Harry GODDARD, a baker of Broome in Oct 1911
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/27665760
Sue
-
Yes, good thought, where do you suggest searching, through NAA records.
Enter the name John Clifford PURVIS here and click on the little paper looking thing beside his name to open the fully digitised file.
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/SearchScreens/BasicSearch.aspx
Sue
-
Here's the soda link for that file that Sue refers to: http://soda.naa.gov.au/record/8020892/1 you should be able to click through each page and enlarge etc.
JM
-
Sparrett
Thanks for that, yes have found John Clifford Purvis War Records and been through Fold 3 which is free until next Tuesday.
35 pages did not show any connection to our Harry Goddard. He was wounded in France though but at a later date than when Harry Goddard was in the Australian Field hospital in Rouen.
Found him returning on board the "Kildonian Castle" 27.4.1919.
Unfortunately I cannot find where Harry Goddard came back to Australia, so maybe they met up after their return. Harry Goddard changed his occupation consistently, his records showing he was Butcher when he arrived in 1910, Butcher and Baker in Military Records and having his own business, which could have been the Pearling Lugger etc.
I feel fairly positive now, that we have the right Harry Goddard.
Jan
-
Thanks J.M.
Here's the soda link for that file that Sue refers to: http://soda.naa.gov.au/record/8020892/1 you should be able to click through each page and enlarge etc.
JM
-
Something else digitised at the NAA, definitely your chap, but not much except the date :D http://soda.naa.gov.au/record/6032145/1
-
JM,
Interesting isn't it, see has Australian Imperial Forces, but Australian crossed out in red. 1919 is when he has returned.
Jan
-
Interesting timeline towards the end of his Australian stay.
Court appearance 1925 (I don't have the date)
Probably on Electoral Roll in 1925 at McNeil Chambers, Barrack St, Perth,for the Federal Election held 14th Nov 1925.
Passport issued 21st July 1926
There were documents required and a degree of preparation needed for this issue
https://www.legislation.gov.au/Details/C1920A00046
Out of the country by ?? to arrive in Canada in October 1926.
With Mum paying and providing accommodation when he arrived :-\ ::)
Wonder if he sold the Ford to cover costs at all :P
Sue
-
Sparrett,
In the Children's Court, Broome
Court Case 141/24 and 142/24 E. Corpus -v- Goddard (no christian name) 5th September, 1924
Illegitimate children
Forbes for the complainant and Florance for the Defendant (both Solicitors in Broome)
Satisfactory arrangements had been made for the children
Adjourned to 27.1.1925 Broome - withdrawal of Complaints - Withdrawal granted
So maybe he sold the Ford, and if he owned the Pearl Lugger as believed by records, he paid Esther Corpus out. He had no money left and his Mother paid for his fare to Canada, he worked there for 12 months, (now as a Carpenter !!) and back to Reading in Berkshire where he worked at the Osborne Arms Hotel.
-
I would accept that as a plausible, though not totally verifiable, course of events.
That seems likely to have been the end of contact between him and his Australian wife and children.
Interesting and sad.
Sue
-
Yes I agree Sue, very sad, and they were the days back in Broome in the early 1900's. But however, the daughter of Esther had the most amazing life, she married a Pastoralist, who was very involved with Sir Sidney Kidman with the Glenroy and Mornington Stations in the Kimberleys, plus much more interests in the town of Derby W.A.
It was a DNA match that we had with the granddaughter of Esther, we never thought we would ever connect with. This lady really wanted to know who her Grandfather was. It has taken us 6 months in research back in England firstly, believing that we had an issue from a child born out of wedlock way back, was not the case, and finally now, we believe we have the right connection.
Thanks Sue so much for all your help.
Jan