RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: Cockneyrebel on Sunday 07 April 19 10:59 BST (UK)
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The above was the eldest son of 6 children of John Joseph Ham 1824-1905 and Jane Eliza Waymark 1838-1918. He was baptised 24 Jan 1869 at St James Westminster and appeared on the 1871 & 1881 UK censuses at Westminster then Bedford, Bedfordshire.
According to some Anc trees he ended up in NZ and married and passed away there in 1913. However they have no sources for these 'facts' and seem to have copied them from other trees?
Cr
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Can you see him on a passenger list going to NZ?
Do the trees indicate the year he arrived?
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Ok I see a tree that has marriage in Australia 1889 but children for some reason have the surname Hammond not Ham.
Wife is shown as Eliza Jane Boylan died Australia 1932.
I would contact the tree owner and ask a few questions :)
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Ok I see a tree that has marriage in Australia 1889 but children for some reason have the surname Hammond not Ham.
John Samuel Hammond was found dead in his bed, 25 March 1913
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/MS19130327.2.69
Death notice
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/EP19130325.2.4
Age given in the NZ death index for John Samuel Hammond is 46.
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His 1913 Probate is on Familysearch.Org. Leaves everything to his dear friend Agnes (Nellie) Bazley/
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Hello Cr,
This from the cemetery records although I think there is an error in the age..... ???
Last name HAMMOND
First name JOHN SAMUEL
Age 0 Years
Deceased date 25/03/1913
Service provided Cremation
Cremation date 27/03/1913
Cemetery Crematorium
Record number 42
https://wellington.govt.nz/services/community-and-culture/cemeteries/cemeteries-search/details?id=42&serviceType=Cremation&previousPage=%2fservices%2fcommunity-and-culture%2fcemeteries%2fcemeteries-search%2fresults%3fserviceType%3dAll%26firstNames%3djohn%26lastName%3dhammond%26fromDate%3d01%252f01%252f1840%26toDate%3d08%252f04%252f2019%26cemetery%3dAll
1913/1872 Hammond John Samuel 46YA
Added:
Funeral Notices [three]......
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/EP19130326.2.116.3?query=j.%20s.%20hammond&phrase=2&start_date=01-01-1913&end_date=31-12-1913&snippet=true
Minniehaha.
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Death notice for Eliza....
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/4450962?searchTerm=eliza%20jane%20hammond&searchLimits=exactPhrase|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1932-01-01|||dateTo=1932-12-31|||l-advcategory=Family+Notices|||sortby
Minniehaha.
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Marriage of daughter Daisy in the State of Victoria....
EVANS
Neville
Marriage
HAMMOND, Daisy
1931
3219/1931
[Without the names of "Brooks" & "Ham" we may not be on the correct pathway with these posts?]
Minniehaha.
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Looks like you've disproved the Anc trees idea that he changed 2 parts of his name; unless you have fallen into the same trap as the Anc tree owners. They have someone called John Samuel Hammond but have no sources to back up a name change, you must admit he has a distinctive name, there are no sources whatever about his alleged marriage or migration/marriage, they seem to have copied from each other!?
There was a John Samuel Hammond b1867 in Norfolk so could be him?
Cr
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Sticking with John Samuel Hammond, he was accused of incitement to defraud the Melbourne Tramway in 1898:
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/114044199
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/241858658
and was imprisoned for 6 months
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The contributions we have put up would all appear to be part of the same family BUT I'm not yet certain that they relate to your John Samuel......
Minniehaha.
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Me too, minniehaha.
Cr
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Throw this in -
The Age (Melbourne), 14 Feb 1889
Marriage.
HAMMOND—BOYLAN. On the 11th February, at Fitzroy, by the Rev. Kinsman,
John Samuel Hammond, of Bedford, England, to Eliza Boylan, of Moonlight.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/196996901
In Bedford in 1881 was John S Ham, 14
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q27C-67HW
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The above was the eldest son of 6 children of John Joseph Ham 1824-1905 and Jane Eliza Waymark 1838-1918.
Parents both died in Bedford. JJ left a will proved 1906
https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/Calendar?surname=ham&yearOfDeath=1906&page=2#calendar
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No John on birth reg?
March 1867 St James 1a 424
Ham, Samuel Brook
In new index Brook becomes Brookes
HAM, SAMUEL BROOKES
Mother's Maiden Surname: WAYMARK
GRO Reference: 1867 M Quarter in SAINT JAMES'S WESTMINSTER Volume 01A Page 424
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Samuel Brooks Ham born 10 January 1867 attended Harpur Trust Boys' Elementary School in Bedford from 4 May to 5 October 1875. Father John, 18 Silver Street.
John Samuel Brooks Ham's baptism in 1869 (St James, Piccadilly) gives his birth date as 7 January 1867.
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That is much better and proves that he must have changed his surname at marriage or before, johnw and shaun. It's amazing how these relations changed their names to keep us searchers from finding them!
Thank you.
Cr
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Here are the birth registrations in Victoria for the three children of Eliza & John Hammond..........
HAMMOND
Herbt John
Birth
<Unknown Family Name>, Eliza
BOYLAN
<Unknown Family Name>, Jno Saml
SOUTH MELBOURNE
1890
25225/1890
HAMMOND
Daisy May
Birth
<Unknown Family Name>, Eliza Jane
BOYLAN
<Unknown Family Name>, Jno Saml
NCOTE
1895
14849/1895
HAMMOND
Edwd Chas
Birth
<Unknown Family Name>, Eliza Jane
BOYLAN
<Unknown Family Name>, Jno Saml
C HILL
1897
9934/1897
Minniehaha.
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Death of Daisy May.......
EVANS Daisy May Death notice 25APR1983 Death at Box Hill Hospital The Age (Melbourne) 26APR1983
EVANS Daisy May Funeral notice 28APR1983 Funeral The Age (Melbourne) 27APR1983
Registration:
EVANS
Daisy May
Death
<Unknown Family Name>, Eliza
BOYLAN
<Unknown Family Name>, HAMMOND John Samual
Northcote
Box Hill
<Unknown Family Name>
1983
9561/1983
Minniehaha.
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Going by the stated age and place, this Edward Charles may be a son of John Samuel Hammond.....
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/204423171?searchTerm=%22mary%20florence%20hammond%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=mary+florence+hammond|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1914-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby
Minniehaha.
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Thank you minniehaha, I also found that Herbert's wife Amy Catherine Donnelly appears to have passed away in 1928 at S Lake-wherever that is and on his WW2 war record his wife is given as Essie and his dob as 2 Jul 1890 enlisted at Caulfield Victoria. Any chance of finding out when he married Essie and her mmn, could also do with their dod's?
Looks like Neville Evans is difficult to find any details about?
According to a tree on My Heritage, Edward's wife's mmn was Pascoe but whether she was Florence or a 2nd wife I don't know and the tree owner hasn't been on site for over a year, Edward passed away 14 May 1964 in Queensland, I think?
Yet more questions!
Cr
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From reply #4.....
Not part of the brief but just my curiosity ;D.
Re the "dear friend" mentioned as the beneficiary in the will of John Samuel:
She married:
1926/2660 Ellen Agnes Bazley Frank Moring
She died:
1928/11100 Moring Ellen Agnes 45Y
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers?snippet=true&query=ellen+moring&start_date=01-01-1928&end_date=31-12-1928
Minniehaha.
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She wasn't married long before passing away, perhaps she 'knew' John before her marriage especially as he passed away in 1913?
Coincidentally, minnie you've Hammonds' in your tree?
Cr
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Yes I have Cr. However mine were in Shropshire.......... ;D
Minniehaha.
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Hi Cr,
This is as far as I can get at the moment.......
HAMMOND
Herbert Samuel
Marriage
DONNELLY, Amy Catherine
1925
965/1925
HAMMOND
Amy Catherine
Death
<Unknown Family Name>, Annie
HUDDLESTONE
<Unknown Family Name>, UNKNOWN
SEA LAKE
<Unknown Family Name>
0
1928
12438/1928
[
ErrorSPAM
REPORT THIS POST AS SPAM (Use 'Report to Moderator'). DO NOT CLICK ON ANY LINKS IN THIS POST. DO NOT REPLY TO THIS PERSON.
]Cr[/color].......Incorrect couple[/color]]
Minniehaha.
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HAMMOND Edward Charles Death notice 14MAY1964 Death The Age (Melbourne) 18MAY1964
HAMMOND Edward Charles Death notice 14MAY1964 Death 67 at Ipswich, Qld The Age (Melbourne) 16MAY1964
From Queensland births, deaths & marriages........
Minniehaha.
Death registration:
Edward Charles Hammond
Death date: 14/05/1964
Mother's name: Eliza Jane Boylan
Father/parent's name: John Samuel
Registration details: 1964/C/2029
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'Your' Herbert John?
HAMMOND Herbert John Death notice 17JUL1981 Death 91 late of War Veterans Home, Narrabeen Sydney Morning Herald 22JUL1981
HAMMOND Herbert John (Bert) Death notice 17JUL1981 Death 91 late of War Veterans' Home, Narrabeen The Age (Melbourne) 22JUL1981
Could this be his wife?
HAMMOND Essie Eliza (Gar) Death notice 01MAR1973 Death 84 late of Narrabeen Sydney Morning Herald 05MAR1973
Minniehaha.
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Death registrations- New South Wales.........
HAMMOND HERBERT JOHN
16081/1981
JOHN SAMUEL
ELIZA
**
[Name
Registration Number
Father's Given Name(s)
Mother's Given Name(s)
District]
HAMMOND ESSIE ELIZA
44686/1973
GEORGE
ELIZABETH ANN
ST LEONARDS
**District not shown.
Minniehaha.
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I'm at confused.com now minniehaha, was he Herbert Samuel Hammond or Herbert John Hammond, son of John Samuel and Eliza Boylan or perhaps both?
Cr
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Cr he was Herbert John HAMMOND. Did you get the marriage of Herbert to Amy Donnelly from someone's family tree? If so, this information is incorrect. Essie appears to be his wife, although not proven.....
Minniehaha.
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minniehaha, I got it from you further down the page but didn't notice the red error! Sorry.Now I've found out that Essie's mmn was Briscoe.
Cr
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Hello Cr,
Good to get that sorted out........ ;D
I have not found anything further as yet.
Minniehaha.
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Here we are Cr.........
BRISCOE
Essie Eliza
Birth
<Unknown Family Name>, Elizabeth Ann
FLETCHER
<Unknown Family Name>, George
WILL
1887
32941/1887
HAMMOND
Herbt Jno
Marriage
BRISCOE, Essie Eliza
1910
6291/1910
And the birth of one child found:
HAMMOND
Edna May
Birth
HAMMOND, Essie Eliza
BRISCOE
HAMMOND, Herbert John
Williamstown
1911
13749/1911
Added:
HAMMOND
Robert Felix
Death
<Unknown Family Name>, Essie
BRISCOE
<Unknown Family Name>, HAMMOND Herbert
WILLIAMSTOWN
BRUNSWICK NORTH
<Unknown Family Name>
0**
1921
625/1921
** All entries have '0' for the age.
[all events registered in Victoria.]
Minniehaha.
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And a little more......
FIELD
Ernesr Vincent
Marriage
HAMMOND, Edna May
1932
9914/1932
Death notices:
FIELD Edna May Death notice01APR2003Death91Herald Sun (Melbourne)07APR2003
FIELD Ernest Vincent Death notice 15AUG1966 Death 55 late of Doncaster The Age (Melbourne) 16AUG1966
[Always assuming we have the correct family branch :)]
Minniehaha.
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And this about Daisy May Evans nee Hammond.........
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/11014191?searchTerm=%22daisy%20may%20evans%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=daisy+may+evans|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1931-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/205869466?searchTerm=%22daisy%20may%20evans%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=daisy+may+evans|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1931-01-01|||dateTo|||sortby
Minniehaha.
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And in case you wish to extend the family tree a little further, here are some new names relating to the family of Eliza, wife of John Samuel Hammond [apart from the memorial notice]........
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/206950762?searchTerm=%22eliza%20hammond%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=eliza+hammond|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom|||dateTo|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
[Boylan death]
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/205200274?searchTerm=%22eliza%20hammond%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=eliza+hammond|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1930-01-01|||dateTo|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
[Terry death]
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/205902891?searchTerm=%22eliza%20hammond%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=eliza+hammond|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1930-01-01|||dateTo|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
Obituary re Felix Boylan....
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/172026963?searchTerm=%22felix%20boylan%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=felix+boylan|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom|||dateTo|||sortby
Obituary of the father of Eliza nee Boylan….
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/151757766?searchTerm=%22edward%20boylan%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=edward+boylan|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom|||dateTo=1938-12-31|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/171239301?searchTerm=%22edward%20boylan%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=edward+boylan|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1915-01-01|||dateTo=1938-12-31|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/4697571?searchTerm=%22edward%20boylan%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=edward+boylan|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1915-01-01|||dateTo=1938-12-31|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
Another Boylan death notice….
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/4697571?searchTerm=%22edward%20boylan%22&searchLimits=exactPhrase=edward+boylan|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1915-01-01|||dateTo=1938-12-31|||l-advstate=Victoria|||sortby
Minniehaha.
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You have been a busy bee, minniehaha, and I thought you only dealt with NZ! Do the Trove papers mean that the event occurred the day before or do they publish on the same day? Seems divorce was easier there than here, up until the 1970's here you had to prove adultery or desertion for up to 7 years after the event!
Cr
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Hi Cr,
I would say the date that appears after "death notice" would be the actual death date. The next date being the day of publication.
This being an example of what you are referring to?
"FIELD Ernest Vincent Death notice 15AUG1966 Death 55 late of Doncaster The Age (Melbourne) 16AUG1966"
Hope you have some details to keep you busy while we turn in for the night down under....... :)
Minniehaha.
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Certainly got a lot to sort through minniehaha, I was thinking more about the divorce as the death date is stated.
Cr
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Hi Cr,
If you go to the top of the divorce report which appeared in the newspaper dated 12.2.1935, it reads,
"Mr. Justice Duffy continued the hearing yesterday........."
[However the divorce was not made final on 11.2.1935, just the grant of a decree nisi.]
The decree absolute would probably be granted approximately about 6 months later.
Minniehaha.
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Hi minniehaha, thought that was the case and I understand the nisi and absolute terms too.
Cr
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This may be of interest Cr,
The sad report concerning the death of Margaret Boylan, wife of Edward and mother of Eliza Hammond......
1872
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/219157956?searchTerm=margaret%20boylan&searchLimits=exactPhrase|||anyWords|||notWords|||requestHandler|||dateFrom=1872-01-01|||dateTo=1872-12-31|||sortby
Death registration [*name of spouse not entered but the year ties in with the obituary of Edward Boylan which has been provided in reply #35.] [Also the names from reply #6].
BOYLAN
Margaret
Death
<Unknown Family Name>, Eliza
*UNKNOWN
<Unknown Family Name>, Mcmullen John
IREL
<Unknown Family Name>
0
1872
7721/1872
Minniehaha.
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Three In Memoriam notices [1914, 1915 & 1916] for John Samuel, inserted by his mother and dear friend together with one from "W.M."
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/DOM19140326.2.14.3?query=%20john%20samuel%20hammond&phrase=2&start_date=01-01-1913&end_date=31-12-1917&snippet=true
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/EP19150325.2.3?query=%20john%20samuel%20hammond&phrase=2&start_date=01-01-1913&end_date=31-12-1917&snippet=true
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/EP19160325.2.5?query=%20john%20samuel%20hammond&phrase=2&start_date=01-01-1913&end_date=31-12-1917&snippet=true
Minniehaha.
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Thank you minniehaha; a very tragic end indeed for the lady. Also John's 'friend' not the wife so I guess this is the friend who he left money, etc to.
Cr