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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: Seaton Smithy on Monday 20 May 19 13:23 BST (UK)

Title: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Monday 20 May 19 13:23 BST (UK)
Hi everyone.

Barbara Flora McDonald Kidd was born 5 December 1908 in Eckville, Alberta, parents George Kidd and Barbara Doig.

On 28 August 1934 she married John Douglas Storrings in Smithers, British Columbia.

Barbara died on 18 December 1996 in Victoria, British Columbia.

I am hoping to find an obituary for Barbara.  Any assistance greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: *Sandra* on Monday 20 May 19 14:40 BST (UK)


Must have used the name Flora Storrings

Times Colonist  - Victoria, British Columbia, Canada - 20 Dec 1996, Fri  -   Page 35

https://tinyurl.com/y4evh8dz

Sandra
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: *Sandra* on Monday 20 May 19 14:46 BST (UK)

Death Certificate John Douglas Storrings

http://search-collections.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca/Image/Genealogy/62a4a250-cd33-47d0-b4a5-886103bd4b9a

Sandra
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: *Sandra* on Monday 20 May 19 15:15 BST (UK)


FIND A GRAVE

John Douglas Storrings - 1900 - 1948

http://geneofun.on.ca/names/photo/2521161

Sandra
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Monday 20 May 19 20:04 BST (UK)
Thank you for that - that is much appreciated.

Damn, no children.  And her brother died unmarried.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: *Sandra* on Monday 20 May 19 20:14 BST (UK)


Unfortunately no children to be found.  :'(

Sandra
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Tuesday 21 May 19 01:42 BST (UK)
You probably have the marriage already, but just in case:
http://search-collections.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca/Image/Genealogy/72595a0f-76e8-40fd-bf9c-1dab48a7be36

Flora's brother's death registration indicates that Flora was living in Campbell River in 1973.
(Really far from Smither's).
http://search-collections.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca/Image/Genealogy/dfc9401a-f0df-48a6-8645-939b77eb8980
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Tuesday 21 May 19 02:49 BST (UK)
Thanks, bbart - I did have those.

It seems the images for Flo's parents aren't available (mother Barbara is mistranscribed as "Ridd"), but I was able to confirm their details at familysearch.org.

It's a pity.  I am sure that Flo's father George is the man I've been looking for the past 6 years, but if he has no legitimate descendants it looks like my search is over.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Tuesday 21 May 19 04:03 BST (UK)
Quote
It seems the images for Flo's parents aren't available (mother Barbara is mistranscribed as "Ridd"), but I was able to confirm their details at familysearch.org.

A library relatively close to me has most of the microfilms (although the viewers are getting very dim now!)  I should be able to get there in the next week or two if you want them, unless you are very sure it's the wrong family.

Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Tuesday 21 May 19 06:21 BST (UK)
Thanks for the offer, bbart.

I am reasonably convinced it is the right family - my hope was that DNA might support this but with no descendants that is unfortunately not an option.

If you are going to the library anyway and it is no extra trouble it would be greatly appreciated, particularly the record for George Kidd - the record for Barbara Watson (Doig) Kidd is less important.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Tuesday 21 May 19 06:37 BST (UK)
No trouble at all, and hopefully he is not on one of the very few films they are missing.

Looking at the 1921 census, I only see the two kids you know about, aged 12 and 15, so it doesn't look promising that there were any more.

Sometime in the next week or so, I will get there, and will nudge this post when I have found the registrations.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Tuesday 21 May 19 06:50 BST (UK)
It's a shame his marriage certificate doesn't say whether he was a bachelor or not.  I thought given the age difference he may have remarried and had kids from another wife.
Have you seen it? It gives his parents names, and location of birth etc.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Tuesday 21 May 19 07:33 BST (UK)
I don't have it with me, but I thought the marriage record did say "Not previously married".

I believe that the father's name and the mother's surname are correct, but that the mother's given name and birth location are incorrect  - the birth location is closer to that of his mother.

His mother's name on his death record as shown on familysearch.org is given as Flora McDonald - this matches his daughter's middle names, so may have been an assumption on her part.  His birth location on the death records of his children is Aberdeen or Aberdeenshire.

His mother's name on his marriage record is given as Elizabeth McDonald and his birth location as Laurence, Kincardinshire.

I believe he is the George Kidd born in 1856 in Skene, Aberdeenshire, parents Andrew Kidd and Harriet McDonald.  Harriet's census and death records state she was born in Durris, Kincardineshire, although a birth or baptism for her has not been confirmed.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Tuesday 21 May 19 08:02 BST (UK)
Quote
I thought the marriage record did say "Not previously married".

You are correct!  I missed reading that part.

Thanks for the info as well.... I would have never read "Laurence" out of the scrawl for the birthplace.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Thursday 23 May 19 04:21 BST (UK)
Okay, got the documents, and of course my scanner packed it in!  So for now, I'll just type out what I see, and worry about how to get copies to you later.

The son, William George Kidd, was informant for both parents.  However, if he is correct about his father's age, it botches up the theory of the George Kidd born to Andrew and Harriet.

Starting with Barbara:

Place of Death:
If in Municipality: ---
If in City or Town:  Smithers   Street: ----   House No.:  Farm
If in hospital or institution:  ----
Name of Deceased:  Barbara Watson-Kidd
Residence: Smithers
Racial Origin: British
Married
Birthplace: Dundee, Scotland
Date of birth: April 09, 1871
Age: 58 yrs, 0 mo, 5 days
Occupation: farming
Length of residence: At place of death: 9yrs  In province: BC  In Canada: 22 years
Name of father: William Doig
Birthplace of father: Dundee, Scotland
Maiden name of mother: Annie
Birthplace of mother: Dundee, Scotland
Informant: William G. Kidd, Smithers
Date of death: April 14, 1929
Cause of death: diabetes melitis, ascites, exhaustion
Autopsy?: no
Place of burial: Smithers Cemetery
Date of burial: April 16, 1927
Undertaker: David Jones, Smithers

George

Place of Death:
If in Municipality: Farm near Smithers, BC
If in City or Town:  Street:   House No.:
If in hospital or institution:  ----
Name of Deceased:  George Kidd
Residence: Smithers, BC
Racial Origin: Scotch
Married
Birthplace: Aberdeen, Scotland
Date of birth:
Age: 75 yrs, 0 mo, 22 days
Occupation: farmer
Length of residence: At place of death: 13yrs 6 mos  In province:   In Canada: 26 years
Name of father: Andrew Kidd
Birthplace of father: Aberdeen, Scotland
Maiden name of mother: Flora MacDonald
Birthplace of mother: Glencoe, Scotland
Informant: William G. Kidd, Smithers
Date of death: Dec 28. 1933
Cause of death: carcinoma of stomach; stated he had stomach problems for years
Contributory cause: hemorrhage from stomach, intermittent one month
Surgery?: no
Autopsy?: no
Place of burial: Smithers Cemetery
Date of burial: Jan 1, 1934
Undertaker: David Jones, Smithers

Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Wendy2305 on Thursday 23 May 19 07:26 BST (UK)
There is a family tree on Rootsweb with this family it's also part of a website called Doig net they have different parents for both Barbara and George although still not the ones you were hoping for if you contact the owner I have found him very helpful in the past he maybe able to help
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Thursday 23 May 19 08:01 BST (UK)
I can't find them on there, Wendy!  What names did they have for parents of George?

Familysearch has a baptism index for Barbara which matches the death reg:
Name    Barbara Watson Doig
Gender    Female
Birth Date    09 Apr 1871
Birthplace    DUNDEE,ANGUS,SCOTLAND
Father's Name    William Doig
Mother's Name    Ann Fraser

Unfortunately, George is being more elusive if the death reg. has the right birthdate.  Always the case.... the one you really want to know about is never easy!
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Wendy2305 on Thursday 23 May 19 08:12 BST (UK)
They have an Andrew Kidd and Harriet McDonald a son George was born to this family in 1856 Skene Aberdeenshire the website also states George emigrated 1880
If you google Doig net this should give you the website this family tree came from and they have the same parents for Barbara as you have just posted
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Thursday 23 May 19 08:22 BST (UK)
Ok, thanks for that!  :)

Seaton Smithy may have already seen it, but just so it doesn't hide on me again, found the link:

https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=andx1647&id=I2288
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Wendy2305 on Thursday 23 May 19 08:34 BST (UK)
Sorry just reread and this is indeed the George Smythy is looking for according to the family tree as I suggested if you contact the owner of the website he maybe able to confirm how they have these parents for George
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Thursday 23 May 19 10:18 BST (UK)
They have an Andrew Kidd and Harriet McDonald a son George was born to this family in 1856 Skene Aberdeenshire the website also states George emigrated 1880

These are the details that I believe to be correct - but I cannot see those details on the Doig site or the RootsWeb site. I will try contacting the site owner.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Wendy2305 on Thursday 23 May 19 13:01 BST (UK)
Here is a link to Barbara's family tree

http://www.doig.net/ANDX1647.html

And bBart posted a link to the family on Rootsweb in reply 18
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Thursday 23 May 19 13:44 BST (UK)
And bBart posted a link to the family on Rootsweb in reply 18

Yes, and that has different details than in your reply 17.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Wendy2305 on Thursday 23 May 19 16:47 BST (UK)
Sorry so it does must stop skim reading
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Thursday 23 May 19 19:55 BST (UK)
Regarding my post #14, I have been able to get a large resolution picture of each document on my camera, so if you pm me an email address, I can send them.

After trawling around every site, I agree that this George was (probably) the one born 1856 to Andrew/Harriet.

When George married, whether his birth was Nov (per baptism) or Dec. (per death reg), he hadn't had his birthday yet that year, so he would have been born 1856.  He also says he was born in Kincardine, and it is highly possible that his mother had him at a sister/relatives home, but they actually lived in Aberdeen.  That could be a detail his children were not aware of when they filled out forms regarding him.
 
As for the Harriet/Elizabeth problem:  If you search Scotland's people for every McDonald in Duriss, (Duriss being the only consistent thing about her on the censuses; her age is not too consistent!), there is no Harriet, but there is an Elizabeth, born 1818.  1818 is pretty much in the middle of all the ages the censuses say.  She could have been baptised as Elizabeth, but went her whole life as Harriet. Perhaps her parents "renamed" her after baptism, which is not unheard of. 

MCDONALD
ELIZABETH
WILLIAM MCDONALD/ELSPET MCGREGOR
23/11/1818
256/10 188
Durris

George had older brothers;  maybe track them down for descendants for DNA, if that is what you are after?  Some of them appear to have vanished, but brother Alexander is not too hard to track.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Thursday 23 May 19 23:04 BST (UK)
Regarding my post #14, I have been able to get a large resolution picture of each document on my camera, so if you pm me an email address, I can send them.

Thank you!  Message sent.

Quote
MCDONALD
ELIZABETH
WILLIAM MCDONALD/ELSPET MCGREGOR
23/11/1818
256/10 188
Durris

This is an interesting lead.  I'll look to see if there is any other evidence for this person.

Quote
George had older brothers;  maybe track them down for descendants for DNA, if that is what you are after?  Some of them appear to have vanished, but brother Alexander is not too hard to track.

Great suggestion - I do have two DNA matches to people I think are descendants of George from Skene's brothers James and Alexander.  There are issues with both of their trees, but I believe my variations to their information are defensible. I am building out the trees for all of George's siblings (sisters are equally as valid as brothers with autosomal DNA).

I think there are very good reasons to conclude that the George Kidd who marries in Montana in 1901 is the George Kidd born in Skene in 1856.

I am looking for a man likely to be in his early 20s purported to be named George Kidd, occupation Shepherd, who conceived a child in or near Cluny, Aberdeenshire in around July 1879.  None of the men named George Kidd on the 1881 Scotland census appear to be obvious candidates.

George from Skene is with his parents in Dyce in 1861 where his father dies in 1867.  In 1871 his mother is in Kinnellar but George is in Kintore living in a farm bothy with several other young men.  Kintore is not all that far from Cluny.  George appears to be entirely absent from Scotland by 1881.

The consistencies for George from Skene and George in Montana & British Columbia are father's  full name, mother's maiden surname and his age on his marriage record.

The inconsistencies are mother's given name (inconsistent twice), month of birth (November v December) and the places of his birth on his marriage record and of his mother's birth on his death record.

I am trying to find when George from Skene was baptised - if he wasn't baptised until December he may have mistakenly believed that is when he was born.

EDIT: I think a plausible explanation for the inconsistency of George's birth place on his marriage record is the order the questions were asked: Father's name? Mother's name? Place of birth? [Respondent walks away wondering why they wanted  to know where his mother was born.]

Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Friday 24 May 19 05:11 BST (UK)
I meant to add - Harriet McDonald's 1874 death record says she was illegitimate and that her mother was also Harriet McDonald.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: bbart on Friday 24 May 19 05:23 BST (UK)
I meant to add - Harriet McDonald's 1874 death record says she was illegitimate and that her mother was also Harriet McDonald.

Okay, we can kick that Elizabeth theory of mine to the curb then!

Quote
The consistencies for George from Skene and George in Montana & British Columbia are father's  full name, mother's maiden surname and his age on his marriage record.

You can add the USA 1900 census to that list: dob is Dec 1856. (immigration year 1882)

The only real snag is that index of his baptism.  We don't even know if it is the index from the original parish record.  Mistakes were frequent when they copied them to send up the ladder.  Somewhere in rootschat I have an old post about exactly this problem, and someone managed to find an image of the originating church record, which showed the real date of birth, as opposed to the image I had from higher up the hierarchy of the church.
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Wendy2305 on Friday 24 May 19 07:29 BST (UK)
Have you looked at the original of George birth as it is after 1855 it will show you where he was born what you see on the index is only the parish it was registered
Title: Re: STORRINGS (nee KIDD), Barbara Flora McDonald - died 1996
Post by: Seaton Smithy on Friday 24 May 19 23:41 BST (UK)
I have the a copy of the original birth registration where Andrew is the informant which shows George was born at 4pm on 18 November 1856 in the Parish of Skene.  The house name is hard to read but I think it is Auchinclech which was a farm steading in Skene.