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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: PatsyAnnKelly on Monday 03 June 19 21:49 BST (UK)
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Would be very grateful for any info or advice relating to a Bernard ( Bernie) Sydney Rowe born 1917 in either Auckland or Wellington I believe, although there could be a link to Nelson area. Parents were Olive St Hill Jordan and Sydney Rowe.
Many thanks
PatsyAnn
A newbie :)
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Hello PatsyAnn,
Welcome to Rootschat! :)
Divorce:
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=22517847
Added: Death of his mother:
1937/24452 Rowe Olive St Hill 43Y
Death notice:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH19370524.2.2.3?query=olive%20rowe&start_date=01-01-1937&end_date=31-12-1937&snippet=true&title=KWE,NZ,NZH,PWT,ROTWKG,TO,ACNZC,AKTIM,NZHAG,FRTIM,ALG,AS,DSC
Minniehaha.
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Cemetery Record for Olive St Hill Rowe
Date of birth
Unknown
Date of death
23 May 1937
Age at death
43 years
Gender
Female
Region
West
Cemetery name
Waikumete Cemetery
Plot location
Waikumete Cemetery, Roman Catholic Division C, Row 22, Plot 92
Remains type
Body
Date of burial
24 May 1937
Funeral director
W H Tongue
Minniehaha.
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Olive St. Hill Jordan, 19/07/1893
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Death notice for Sydney [Bernard & siblings named]:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/NZH19450416.2.6?query=sydney%20rowe&page=3&start_date=01-01-1945&end_date=31-12-1945&snippet=true&title=KWE,NZ,NZH,PWT,ROTWKG,TO,ACNZC,AKTIM,NZHAG,FRTIM,ALG,AS,DSC
Cemetery Record for Sydney Rowe
Date of birth
Unknown
Occupation
Storeman
Date of death
14 April 1945
Age at death
50 years
Gender
Male
Region
West
Cemetery name
Waikumete Cemetery
Plot location
Waikumete Cemetery, Service Persons Area G, Row 7, Plot 31
Remains type
Body
Date of burial
17 April 1945
Funeral director
Tilton Opie And Pattinson Limited
Minniehaha.
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Bernard's date of birth was 31.10.1917.
You might have to obtain a printout for the registration details you require. These are cheaper than a certificate and may contain more information. Can be e-mailed.
Minniehaha.
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Death of divorced wife [also mother of his children?]....
2011/23706 Rowe Hazel Elizabeth 10 September 1915
I have her newspaper death notice which names the children. This I can send to you by personal message but you will need to put up a couple more posts before I can do this. Just a :) in each will do the trick. :)
[I also have the year of their marriage.]
Minniehaha.
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Is this what you thought was a possible Nelson connection?
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=20808304&digital=yes
However, the regimental number does not tie in with that stated in Sydney's death notice @ Reply #4.
[1897*/6170 Rowe Sydney Mary George
*1895 according to above war file.]
Added later-
Here is the correct war WW1 file:
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=24063074&digital=yes
His birth:
1890/1693 Rowe Sidney Harriett Martha William John
Actual date of birth [2.3.1890] ties in with that recorded on his WW1 file.
WW2 file is included. Stated to have been born @ Thames.
Wife, Violet Rowe. ? See page 53
Minniehaha.
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I believe these to be the details concerning the siblings of Bernard Sydney....
Death:
1993/34652 Rogers Joyce Gladys 17 July 1920
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=12134824
Divorce file:
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=22747393
Death:
1993/28883 Jupp Lois Olive 4 August 1921
Divorce file:
https://www.archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=22358216
[Marriage details available by PM]
BUT I still can't find Bernard Sydney!
Minniehaha.
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Thank you so much Minniehaha. I am very grateful. I am doing this because Kiwi my son-in-law is related to the late Bernard Sydney Rowe and has had difficulty in obtaining any info about him from here in the UK and you have discovered a treasure trove, in particular about his parents Sydney and Olive St Hill.
However there are a couple of queries arising from the fount of data you have uncovered and I wonder if you can help further. I am really grateful for all you've done already.
1 In Sydney's attestation papers dated September 1914( the correct ones not the one in Nelson who is certainly not the correct man) he says his wife is Violet whereas the parents of Bernard Sydney Rowe are Sydney and Olive St Hill Rowe. This is borne out in the various death and burial notices you found for me. Sydney and Olive married in 1917 did he divorce Violet between 1914 and 1917, or perhaps she died?
2 I looked through both sets of military documents and see the Sydney in Nelson is/was 5ft 9 with brown eyes, mentions being invalided with malaria and gives address as Nelson, whereas the Auckland Sydney ( my one) was very short 5ft 3 blues eyes and was discharged because of wounds in Dardanelles. Looks to me as if Doc 14 in papers for my Sydney 12/1066 has been misfiled? Don't know what, if anything can be done?
3. I know there is a rather distinguished family the St Hills. I cannot tie Olive St Hill Jordan in with them so far but is there any reason you can think of for taking that name if unrelated to them. Wondered about illegitimacy?
I would love to hear more by private email but do not know what I should do?
Thank you very very much again
PatsyAnn
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One more reply PatsyAnn will enable you to use the personal messaging system. Just put up a smiley :) and we can go from there..........
There is no mention of service in WW2 in Sydney's death notice. But at least we know which is the correct WW1 file. :)
[At the foot of reply #7 I have queried the name of Violet.]
Still a bit of sorting out to do.
Minniehaha.
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Purewa Cemetery details for Bernard's sisters. [Hopefully I am up the correct family tree]
Surname ROGERS
First Names Joyce Gladys
Age 72 Years
Gender Female
Date of Death 16 Apr 1993
Religion Roman Catholic
Serial No 63067
Date of Service and/or Interment 21 Apr 1993
Type Of Service
Funeral Director Davis Funeral Services, P O Box 56013, Mt Eden, AUCKLAND
Ashes Disposal Returned
Book Of Remembrance No
Surname JUPP
First Names Lois Olive
Age 71 Years
Gender Female
Date of Death 13 Feb 1993
Religion Roman Catholic
Serial No 62869
Date of Service and/or Interment 16 Feb 1993
Type Of Service
Funeral Director Davis Funeral Services, P O Box 56013, Mt Eden, AUCKLAND
Ashes Disposal Returned
Book Of Remembrance No
Minniehaha.
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Yes they look like the sisters. Thanks again
PatsyAnn :)
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I can now send the death notice......
Minniehaha.
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Sent...... :)
Minniehaha.
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Hi PatsyAnn,
I am endeavouring to obtain the death notices for Lois & Joyce. You never know, mention may be made of their brother.
Minniehaha.
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Death notice for a daughter of Joyce Gladys Rogers sent by PM........
Minniehaha.
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Details I have provided for Lois & Joyce prove to be for the correct family.
I now have the death notices for these two ladies, the sisters of the elusive Bernard Sydney.
Can you please send your e-mail address by personal message and I will send them on to you.
For those of you following this topic, we now only know that Bernard Sydney had died by February 1993.
Minniehaha.
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There is a Rootsweb tree, shows different date of birth but the correct wife. Might be worth contacting the author.
https://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=:2689078&id=I551067669
Annie
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Interesting about the birth date in that link; the day and month are correct, but not the year.
1917/5848 Rowe Bernard Sydney Olive Sydney
Although the original question concerning Bernard Sydney has not been answered, a great deal of background information has been found about the Rowe families and provided to PatsyAnn by PM.
Minniehaha.
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Thanks very much to all who have helped so brilliantly in particular Minniehaha who has provided so much information. We have now been able to contact a family member and although the final story of Bernard Sydney is still a mystery we now have the possibility of learning more in due course.
We are very grateful
PatsyAnn
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We have now been able to contact a family member [...] we now have the possibility of learning more in due course.
Hello Patsy Ann...
Welcome to Rootschat :-)
Does the above mean the family member is unaware of what happened to your Bernard. Or is it that he/she is contacting other family members who do know and will (hopefully) report back.
... and Hi Minnie :-)
Do you have any record of Bernard post-1946 and pre-1993. ER's? Children's d.o.b?
Regards
Beg
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Hello Beg
We have his D/B, marriage and divorce records and births of children, sisters, nieces and nephews. He falls off the radar sometime in the 1970s. No NZ deaths but he used aliases during his earlier life so could have died under another name. He seems to have moved often for work during his early life so that may have continued all the way through. Definitely a rolling stone. The family we are in contact with also seemed to lose contact with him then too but they are making further enquiries. If that does not bear fruit we may have to leave it there as the reason for the post is for my Kiwi son in law to find his formerly unknown paternal family, which has now happened, thanks in great part to Minnie who has been a star, and to Annie who has given info too.
Thank you all very much
Patsy
:)
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Hello Beg,
No ER records consulted for this mystery man.......
Minniehaha.
P. S. While editing this post, the whole lot vanished. ???
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Hello, thank you to all that have helped my mother in law PatsyAnnKelly trace the family of Bernard Sydney Rowe. I am also trying to trace the son of Bernard Rowe. Hi name is (*)Rowe and he was a Policeman possibly in the Wellington area. I think he might have been born sometime around 1940's and was married. There is a good chance he may still be alive and he is my deceased fathers half brother. Bernard Sydney Rowe was my dads father. We have been in touch with Bernard Juniors first cousin although the family lost touch many years ago and she does not know where he is. We think its still in New Zealand somewhere. Thank you. Clint
(*) Moderator Comment:
Edited in accordance with RootsChat policy of not publishing details of living people here, or details of people who may still be living. This is to protect all concerned from spam, identity abuse, internet abuse, etc, etc.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
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Hello Clint and welcome to RootsChat
Unfortunately the rules do not allow us to discuss living people in this forum,it would pay you to search the electoral rolls to start with.
Cheers Janette
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Hello Clint,
Welcome to Rootschat! ;D
I have the address of the couple you are seeking. However I cannot send it to you until you post two more messages. A smiley :) in each will do the trick.
Or I can send it to PatsyAnn if you wish.
Best wishes....
Minniehaha,
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Address sent by personal message....
Minniehaha.
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I have locked and this edited topic because it against our rules to research and post information on living folk.
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Moderator Sarah, Apologies for asking about living people. I am new to this site and did not understand this was against the rules. I have also tried to reply to a personal message although in my account it says that I am not allowed to send personal messages. Is this a consequence of my mistake? If so, seems abit harsh. Regards Clint
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Hello Clint,
No you are not being punished for that oversight. ;D
Somehow your messages with a :) have vanished. Just put up another one to bring your total to three, then you are able to send messages by the personal messaging system.
Minniehaha.
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Clint You need 2 or 3 posts before you can use the P M system. You should be able to use it now. Welcome to Rootschat. You will find people willing to help you. Do not post about living people and don't post you email address as this is not allowed. Looks like I am too slow as rootschaters are already helping. Good luck with your research
Carol80
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Hello again Clint,
All looks to be sorted now. I look forward to hearing from you by personal message. I have sent what is now probably most of the Jordan family tree to PatsyAnn at her request. Hope you enjoy going over it together.... ;D
Minniehaha.
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Yes all sorted. Thanks again for everything. Clint