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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Mercia118 on Tuesday 09 July 19 12:05 BST (UK)
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Pretty much as the subject says, can anyone enlighten me as to what a tea basin is?
I'm studying up on an 1877 case where they repeatedly speak how they were drinking sherry out of a tea basin. For context:
Mr. CARTWRIGHT: What did you drink out of ?
Witness : A tea basin.
Mr. CARTWRIGHT: Is that the smallest article you had got there?
Witness : Yes, it was.
Mr. CARTWRIGHT: No glasses or tumblers, or anything of that sort?
Witness: No, sir, we never use them.
I'm guessing that it's a fairly sizeable object, as there's mention that one man was "helped" to drink from it, and there appears to have been quite alot of chugging taking place ::)
The men in question were boatmen, so I can't imagine they had anything fancy
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Without looking at google this is just a guess ...
I believe that coffee (and possibly tea as well after it was introduced into Britain) was drunk from something similar to what we know today as a cup and saucer, however I think that the cup may not have had a handle and the saucer was very deep. The liquid was poured from the cup into the saucer and then drunk from the saucer.
I might be on the wrong track completely, and I am not sure if it would have been called a "basin" because that does imply something much larger, but this is the first thing that came to mind when I read your post. Unsure how that ties in date wise with your research and fashions in crockery.
Maybe the chap who needed help to drink from it was a bit the worse for wear after drinking too much sherry. :)
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It may also have been a slop basin. (dregs emptied into it, before brewing fresh in pot)
3" deep and 5+1/2" wide.
http://collections.vam.ac.uk/item/O77482/slop-basin-unknown/
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Having had many holidays on a canal boat I can say that most glasses and crockery don’t last very long.
I imagine that in the 1870s and given the huge lack of space in a narrow boat cabin, it was an all purpose small basin or bowl.
Mike
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I would say that a slop basin seems more apt in this context.
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I recall us having a tea basin when I was young. It was used to rest the tea strainer on.
However, if they drank from it, it is most likely to be what Ruskie has described - a tea cup without handles - like the Japenese tea bowls.
Gadget
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The case in question.
Page 67 of 136
Case 208 May 5 1877. THE SUSPECTED MURDER OF A CANAL BOATMAN NEAR CHESTER – THE PRISONERS
BEFORE THE MAGISTRATES, John Probert and Jane Probert.
Malky
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Thanks everyone,
Mallky is right, this is the case I'm studying.
Living on an old working boat, I've taken to seeing what occurrences happened at our various tie-ups and this one is unusually detailed.
They describe how they've got the alcohol into a "brown can" that's on the roof, what we'd recognise as a buckby can, but I've not been able to figure out this basin business!
One of the statements say how "he had no more than teacup worth" and, in the context of everyone taking a good spell of it, it suggests to me that the basin is fairly large..
I've seen sets on ebay of matching victorian pottery with a teapot, cups, sugar bowl and, what I always assumed was, a water jug and basin.. but if they were using a "wash basin" then that's alot of sherry :o
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Reading the title of this, I assumed a slop basin - part of the tea service into which dregs would be poured, to be disposed of, allowing second ( and subsequent?) bowls, dishes or cups of tea to be poured and drunk.
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The key things about basins, according to the dictionary, is that they are circular and their width is greater than their depth. It doesn't specifically mention them as drinking vessels, but does give "A basin of tea" (1834) as an example of use. That usage certainly implies a drinking vessel rather than a slop basin. I have looked at the nine Georgian tea bowls in the house and they are all wider than they are deep. In comparison, all the cups with handles seem to have a width similar to their depth.
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"Tea Equipage in 18th Century America. ... Often a medium-sized bowl, usually hemispherical in shape, is to be seen on the tea table, and it is most likely a slop bowl or basin. According to advertisements these bowls and basins were available in silver, pewter, and ceramic. Before a teacup was replenished, the remaining tea and dregs were emptied into the slop bowl. Then the cup might be rinsed with hot water and the rinsing water discarded in the bowl."
https://colonialquills.blogspot.com/2015/10/tea-equipage-in-18th-century-america.html
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... and I'm pretty sure exactly the same in Britain, Erato!
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"and I'm pretty sure exactly the same in Britain, Erato!"
I'm sure that's true. The custom of drinking tea and the necessary equipment were mostly imported. Indeed, in the years leading up to the Revolutionary War, tea drinking was a mark of loyalist, Tory sympathies. The Boston Tea Party wasn't just a protest against the tax on tea but also against the aristocratic, tea-drinking English culture that was imposed on the people of the colonies.
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I remember the phrase”a dish of tea”, from a play,something like “ The School for Scandal” or “ The Rivals”.
One of the characters asks another” Will you take a dish of tea?”
Mrs. Malaprop ?
Not absolutely sure though.
Viktoria
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Tea basin.
https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/65567932_blue-and-white-colored-tea-basin (https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/65567932_blue-and-white-colored-tea-basin)
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Thanks, Mike. I'd envisaged a simple bowl. Perhaps the men drank from the spout.
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Thanks, Mike. I'd envisaged a simple bowl. Perhaps the men drank from the spout.
It does seem rather fancy for what is, in effect, a slop bucket.
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I remember the phrase”a dish of tea”, from a play,something like “ The School for Scandal” or “ The Rivals”.
One of the characters asks another” Will you take a dish of tea?”
Mrs. Malaprop ?
Not absolutely sure though.
Viktoria
It is a line from "Double Dealer" by William Congreve, 1694.
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They spoke of a 'dish' of tea in America, as well.
"I believe I forgot to tell you one Anecdote: When I first came to this House it was late in the Afternoon, and I had ridden 35 miles at least. “Madam” said I to Mrs. Huston, “is it lawfull for a weary Traveller to refresh himself with a Dish of Tea provided it has been honestly smuggled, or paid no Duties?” "No sir, said she, we have renounced all Tea in this Place. I cant make Tea, but I'le make you Coffee.” Accordingly I have drank Coffee every Afternoon since, and have borne it very well. Tea must be universally renounced. I must be weaned, and the sooner, the better." John Adams to Abigail Adams, 1774
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Georgian tea caddies often had two compartments for teas & a round hole for a bowl (often missing!), the unconvincing explanation usually given for this is that it held a mixing-bowl to blend black & green tea. Why on earth would anybody need a mixing-bowl for tea which gets mixed in the teapot anyhow? Possibly this was for this slop-bowl & as that was cleared away to the kitchen by the skivvy for washing explains the missing bowls? ;D
Skoosh.
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Without looking at google this is just a guess ...
I believe that coffee (and possibly tea as well after it was introduced into Britain) was drunk from something similar to what we know today as a cup and saucer, however I think that the cup may not have had a handle and the saucer was very deep. The liquid was poured from the cup into the saucer and then drunk from the saucer.
My grandmother and her sisters (all born 1880 to 1900) drank tea and coffee in this manner (out of the saucer) as late as the late 1960s. It used to fascinate me. Especially as we children were not allowed to copy them, and yet they seemed so polite!
Added. They also made coffee with hot milk instead of hot water. Ugh!
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Georgian tea caddies often had two compartments for teas & a round hole for a bowl (often missing!), the unconvincing explanation usually given for this is that it held a mixing-bowl to blend black & green tea. Why on earth would anybody need a mixing-bowl for tea which gets mixed in the teapot anyhow? Possibly this was for this slop-bowl & as that was cleared away to the kitchen by the skivvy for washing explains the missing bowls? ;D
Skoosh.
I have a tea caddy, with the original mixing bowl, it is made of cut glass. Tea was blended to suit by the user, not by the seller. The chimps came later.
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Thanks Mike. Couldn’t place it other than a Restoration play.
The receptacle you sent a photo of reminded me somewhat of those used by Gauchos in South America,except they need a sort of straw ,not attached.
Not ordinary tea.
If I have a second cup I like to empty and rinse my cup after the first.
Viktoria.
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My grandmother and her sisters (all born 1880 to 1900) drank tea and coffee in this manner (out of the saucer) as late as the late 1960s. It used to fascinate me. Especially as we children were not allowed to copy them, and yet they seemed so polite!
My grandfather was born in 1900 and he did the same, but only when my grandmother wasn't looking. If she caught him he'd be soundly rebuked for being 'common' :o
Carol
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Slightly off topic (sorry), but this has reminded me of my father's habit of creating a 'nice, hot' second cup of tea by boiling up the metal teapot on the gas.
The resulting liquid looked as if it could act as brown dye.
Concentrated essence of tannin is what it tasted like (and was)!
Not refined at all, and much worse than drinking out of the saucer, which my grandmother I think also used to do, before the family told her it wasn't acceptable any more.....
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Also a bit off topic,there was a street not far from our home in Manchester where very poor people lived .
I have related this story but it was why we went to the house.
One of our little friends from that street had drowned in the canal and was awaiting burial.
He was in his coffin in the living room of a two up two down terrace house.
We his playmates ,used to go to see him,and the family would be having a meal and them using jam jars as cups.
My mother was aghast,I got into trouble for being such a little ghoul and very impolite into the bargain.
Imagine hot tea in a glass receptacle,not heatproof glass either.
A frequent saying near the pub was” are you coming in for a jar?”
Viktoria.
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Viktoria -
my son (who is old enough to know better) was complaining that when he made himself a cup of coffee to take on his train journey to work, it was too hot to hold. It emerged that he was making it in an (ex-marmalade) glass jar.
I bought him a specially designed hot drink thermos flask.
In olden times? No, last year.
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Many workmen had enamel tea mugs,now they get very hot .
They chip easily but that was no matter.
A hole in the road provided us with interest for a few weeks,burning brazier,
nice little shelter for the night watchman,big black ( very black) kettle always singing softly.
Enamel or tin mugs lined up .
Tin of condensed milk helping the flies to survive.
Can you imagine that nowadays?
He would be mugged!
Tea does stay hot in enamel mugs though and a dish of tea being relatively shallow cools quickly and tepid tea! Ugh.
Viktoria.
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Also a bit off topic,there was a street not far from our home in Manchester where very poor people lived .
I have related this story but it was why we went to the house.
One of our little friends from that street had drowned in the canal and was awaiting burial.
He was in his coffin in the living room of a two up two down terrace house.
We his playmates ,used to go to see him,and the family would be having a meal and them using jam jars as cups.
My mother was aghast,I got into trouble for being such a little ghoul and very impolite into the bargain.
Imagine hot tea in a glass receptacle,not heatproof glass either.
A frequent saying near the pub was” are you coming in for a jar?”
Viktoria.
They were ahead of their time Viktoria:
https://www.waresofknutsford.co.uk/jars/drinking-jars-and-dispensers/
That kind of thing is trendy now, or at least it was a couple of years ago. Possibly not any more. :)
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The Tatler, 10 Jan 1914
Thoughts from "The Ways of Society"
"We never speak of slop basin nowadays, we always call it a tea basin, and we never call a table napkin a serviette"
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Igor, that's exactly how I make tea, your faither was right! certainly not this palaver of an earthenware pot & a tea-cosy, though nowadays it's a teabag in a mug if you're lucky.
Anent the blending business, it's just the kind of nonsense repeated ad-nauseum by the so-called experts on the Antiques Road Show where TV personality Fiona Bruce is consulted on everything from Rembrandt to Ronson Lighters.
Tea becoming much cheaper saw it drank by everybody & in big hooses was consigned to the pantry, not kept under lock & key in the drawing-room away from light-fingered servants! Future generations of toffs knew this ceremony not!
Our own staff were always very honest ;D
Skoosh.
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Ours too Skoosh. >:(
We were also very posh as Mum would not have a mug in the house( if you dis- count me!)
Cups and saucers and each one with a tea spoon.
Visited someone once and they had big mugs and a communal teaspoon and
not even one dedicated to the sugar bowl.
Whew Mum was in hypercritical mode the minute we left their house!
Mum used to buy what were known as ‘ Half Tea Sets.”
In other words six cups ,saucers and tea plates.
Previously twelve of everything was the norm.
All in thin plain white china,so everything matched whenever they were bought .
.Tea in a China cup is nice.
This tea basin reminds me of articles on the old antiques programmes.
People took them in and said they wondered how old the gravy boat they used ,was?
Well it transpired the gravy boat was in fact a sort of potty for ladies wearing great hooped pannier skirts and they could withdraw behind a screen in the dining room during banquets and answer the call of nature! :o
The faces!of those people on the Antiques Roadshow. ;D ;D ;D >
I will leave you on that decidedly low note .
Viktoria.
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@ Viktoria, always a delight! ;D
Skoosh.
PS, the Chinese supermarket sells Oolong tea in boxes, which is superb, big leaves, what used to be called floor-sweepings is now used in tea-bags!
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On one trip to What then was Ceylon,my O H brought back a small ,foil lined crate/box about 10 inches square.
Full of Broken Orange Pekoe tea.
Why Ceylon with a name which sounds Chinese?
Oh it was lovely,such big leaves and delicate flavour.
Can’t get it now.
I like LapsangSouchong,especially with kippers,but we won’t go down that route, >:(
Rose Pouchong,scented.
And Earl Grey.
Tea is a nice addition to some currant loaf recipes Barm brack and Bara Brith.
Pears poached in Earl Grey are lovely.
When you see some really old tea sets the saucers are deep ,as if meant to be sipped from.
I am off to make a cuppa now before the second appointment of the day at the Dentist.
Viktoria.