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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Wexford => Topic started by: atmartinas on Tuesday 18 February 20 19:33 GMT (UK)
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I have a Johanna Leary born in Ballynamonabeg, The Ballagh in 1857, sister of my Great Grandfather. Parents Laurence Leary and Johanna Murphy.
I found a marriage record for a Johanna Leary father Laurence Ballynamonabeg age 27 in Civil Register to Patrick Lambert father Edmond also Ballynamonabeg. I am inclined to believe this is my Johanna as Townland is fairly small and fathers name and age are correct for her.
I have a mystery as to what happens to her. In 1901 I found 3 lamberts living in Coolakip, Edermine in the household of Patrick Kinsella and Margaret Kinsella as Visitors James 14, Edmond 13 and John Joseph 7, they are Visitors.
In 1901 I find the 2 older boys still with Kinsellas but as Servants now.
I found births in the Civil register for all 3 boys matching ages with parents Patrick Lambert and Johanna Leary in Coolamain. Patrick is a Farmer for James birth and Shopkeeper for younger two boys.
I can't find Patrick or Johanna in the Census or a death for them.
What I would really like to find is a death for at least Johanna.
Thanks for reading any suggestions greatly received.
M
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I didn't find any match for her on freebmd.co.uk from 1890 to 1901. I thought they might have left and died elsewhere.
And I guess she is not the Johanna Lambert, age 44, married, a nurse, who died in Ferns, 17 May 1901. That lady, on the 1901 census, said she was born in Ferns, Co. Wexford. At the time she was lodging with Ellen O'Neil, shop keeper. Although, did she provide her own birthplace information on the census?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1901/05725/4615599.pdf
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Wexford/Ferns/Ferns_Town/1789030/
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I didn't find any match for her on freebmd.co.uk from 1890 to 1901. I thought they might have left and died elsewhere.
And I guess she is not the Johanna Lambert, age 44, married, a nurse, who died in Ferns, 17 May 1901. That lady, on the 1901 census, said she was born in Ferns, Co. Wexford. At the time she was lodging with Ellen O'Neil, shop keeper. Although, did she provide her own birthplace information on the census?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1901/05725/4615599.pdf
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Wexford/Ferns/Ferns_Town/1789030/
Yes, I saw her too, I can't really find anything positive to say its her and where is her husband Patrick?
I have looked for them on and off for a few years, I did wonder if they may have left the Country and intended to send for the children but died on the way or shortly after arrival. One of her brothers died in Australia 1890 he is mentioned on family Headstone. It a couple of years ago that I searched but I couldn't find any sign of them there either.
Thanks for your effort oldohiome.
M
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Did you look for children marrying? See of they say Father deceased.....
e.g James.
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No I didn't, thanks for the suggestion hallmark. I will do that now.
M
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::) ::)
;D
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You might get 15 or 20
you can Right Click on 4 or 5 names.. and Open in New Tab. much quicker!
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Not too many, no luck with Edmund or James. I had a private message suggesting a John Lambert marriage in Camolin, couple called 1st daughter Johanna in 1916. Father of groom given as Patrick but it does not say 'dead' in my experience when it does not say anything it can mean alive or dead.
I have some relations around Camolin might get them to do a little inquiring about living Lamberts in area.
Might never solve this one.
M
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This John?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Wexford/Kilpatrick/Ballydickin_Upper/1803416/
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This John?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Wexford/Kilpatrick/Ballydickin_Upper/1803416/
Thanks. Could be but this one is closer in age to the John I found born to Patrick and Johanna 1893
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Wexford/Kilcomb/Camolin_Town/683344/
M
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No problem.
With stuff being sent via PM's I'll leave it at that...
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No problem.
With stuff being sent via PM's I'll leave it at that...
Thanks for trying for me Hallmark, I do appreciate it. I think Johanna and Patrick disappeared into thin air. I don't think that I am going to find anything I can confirm in the online records. I will try as I said to check via living Lamberts to see if I can find anything but that may be a wild goose chase. I will post if I find anything to solve my mystery.
I have plenty of other mysteries to keep me out of mischief.
M
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Several thoughts come to mind.
- Have you checked the family graveyards, i.e. where the family members (both sides) were historically buried?
- Was not unusual for entire families to be wiped out by TB or other diseases. That the children were not with their parents in 1901 would suggest they were dead.
- Many, many deaths went unregistered.
- When were they last known to be alive, i.e. DOB of last child you know of? How many children did they have?
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Several thoughts come to mind.
- Have you checked the family graveyards, i.e. where the family members (both sides) were historically buried?
- Was not unusual for entire families to be wiped out by TB or other diseases. That the children were not with their parents in 1901 would suggest they were dead.
- Many, many deaths went unregistered.
- When were they last known to be alive, i.e. DOB of last child you know of? How many children did they have?
I have checked Johanna's family grave she is not there. I have no idea where Patrick Lambert family grave might be, didn't find any possibilities in the graveyard near address he gave when they married or the address where their children were born.
I think like you say very likely dead by 1901. Last child I know of born 1893.
I have not been able confirm with certainty that these are indeed the people that I believe them to be. I was hoping that the deaths would be registered by a family member that would strengthen my case.
M
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I have not been able confirm with certainty that these are indeed the people that I believe them to be. I was hoping that the deaths would be registered by a family member that would strengthen my case.
M
Irish death certs are the worst of the BMD records.... often frustrating.
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Irish death certs are the worst of the BMD records.... often frustrating.
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I second that! Just to ease the frustration I think back to when they were not available at all online ;D
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Did you look for children marrying? See of they say Father deceased.....
e.g James.
Well I have solved my mystery, in part at least. Following up marriages of potential children has led me to living descendants. I have only had a brief conversation with a man, he is 80 this year, who knew that his father and my Grandfather were 1st cousins. Exactly the expected relationship.
He said his Grandparents died young no other details at present, but I will go see him in a few weeks and hopefully find out where and when and where Graves are. This man has an older sister in her 90's who is also alive and well, can't wait to meet them.
M
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I didn't find any match for her on freebmd.co.uk from 1890 to 1901. I thought they might have left and died elsewhere.
And I guess she is not the Johanna Lambert, age 44, married, a nurse, who died in Ferns, 17 May 1901. That lady, on the 1901 census, said she was born in Ferns, Co. Wexford. At the time she was lodging with Ellen O'Neil, shop keeper. Although, did she provide her own birthplace information on the census?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1901/05725/4615599.pdf
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Wexford/Ferns/Ferns_Town/1789030/
Turns out that this is indeed my Johanna Lambert. She was a nurse, an unrelated person was able to provide her nursing certificate to her Grandson. I have yet to see it due to current restrictions. I did however have a lovely conversation with the man who provided it. His connection is via his Mother who knew the family. Her sister was to marry one of the Sons but he had a breakdown and ended up in St Sennans, she had items in her 'bottom drawer' including her nearly Mother in Laws cert.
His mother also said that Pat Lambert, who was a rate collector, ran off to USA with the rate money in 1892 and was never heard of again. His youngest son was born April 1893 so must have been in the latter half of 1892! No wonder I had trouble finding him here.
I guess I will have a search in USA but may be like looking for a needle in a haystack!
Thanks again for the help.
M