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General => The Stay Safe Board => Topic started by: Rishile on Tuesday 24 March 20 19:37 GMT (UK)
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Once all of this is over, I am hoping this will be a better world. I am hoping we will realise how fragile life is and how precious our family are and how vulnerable our parents can be in a crisis. I am actually very pleased my parents and in-laws are not around now because they all lived a long way from us and it would be a huge problem trying to help them through this.
But there are a lot of smaller things I hope will continue. I hope the obsession with mobile phones may lessen and people will actually talk to each other face to face. I hope people can slow down and enjoy the smaller details of life. For example - sit down and enjoy a cup of coffee rather than gulp it down on the run. I hope people that started courses continue them or those that took up a new hobby continue to get pleasure from it. I hope the people that have helped others in their community still feel it is important to do that even when they don't think they have the time.
I'm hoping but I'm not that optimistic at the moment, but it's early days.
Rishile
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You think there will be coffee, all the coffee producing countries are no better protected than we are.
Unless we take steps to protect vital industries at all costs, (food production and distribution, gas, electricity for heat in winter, drinking water and sewage disposal life might be very basic indeed.
Mike
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Cheers Mike :(. I just came back to Rootschat for a bit of light relief, saw Rishile’s heading and thought that folk may have posted their hopes for our future after this is over. First reply...doom and gloom :'(
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In all my years of researching Family History, I never dreamt that a time that I actually lived in would become such an important part of our (maybe) great great grandchildrens History-- Oh to be able to come back and live it through their eyes...
and no there wont be internet ... or any of the services .. if we carry on at this rate...
The 'Survivors' come to mind..
Xin
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It is important to be optimistic; gloom and doom are unhelpful. The internet used judiciously is a marvellous resource but unfortunately social media seems to be a source of some ridiculously wild and exaggerated scare stories about the virus readily believed by those of a more impressionable age (ok, younger!) - it would be nice if common sense made a comeback. I suspect that people will perhaps be less obsessed with mobiles going forward and indulge in a bit more traditional "face time". Many people also seemed to have discovered that you can actually speak to people using a mobile phone!
As a country we hopefully will reintroduce some sort of Civil Defence to provide fast response in emergency situations - clearly not much resilience has been built into the current system.
Sourcing less from overseas and less just in time stocking wlll probably be on the cards and this should be to our benefit - globalism should be a bit less unfettered.
We are heading out of the flu season and coupled with the measures taken by the Government I am optimistic that the figures will be starting to look less scary in three weeks or so.
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I'm in a coffee producing country and I've been locked down for more than a week already.
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We are heading out of the flu season and coupled with the measures taken by the Government I am optimistic that the figures will be starting to look less scary in three weeks or so.
???
It is not flu....
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It was not intended to be gloom and doom, just realistic prompted by the fact that those who must self isolate are running out of food now, like today, and no “official” help is forthcoming.
Mike
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We are heading out of the flu season and coupled with the measures taken by the Government I am optimistic that the figures will be starting to look less scary in three weeks or so.
???
It is not flu....
No covid-19 is not flu but like flu it affects the lungs, flu and similar which affect the lungs have a huge influence on the body's success in recovering from Covid-19, that is why asthma sufferers are at risk.
Cheers
Guy
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Covid 19 and influenza are both viral respiratory infections with many similarities while not being identical. There is a belief that the similarities will include seasonality and if this proves to be the case then when that is coupled with the measures being taken by the Government we have reason to be optimistic that we will start to see a downturn in infections in two or three weeks time.
We should all try to remain optimistic; the old cliche is very true - "hope for the best and prepare for the worst". I hope that other posts on this thread will highlight positives - there are plenty of other places which seem dedicated to doom and gloom.
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OK
Well my first positive is :) I awoke to a beautiful sunny day :) peace and quiet everywhere... UNTIL my bored neighbour --- mowed his lawn for the 2nd time in a week :)
Xin/aka Fin depending on the mood I think I will revert back to Xin as of now.. maybe
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Think positively Finley - at least it is warm enough where you live for the grass to be growing. We haven't quite reached these balmy conditions yet in my part of Scotland.
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You can't keep politics out of this, much as people don't want to hear it at the moment.
I doubt we'd be in such dire straits if our government hadn't run down public spending over the last decade to such a degree that we're having to protect the NHS by not getting ill. I mean, how utterly ridiculous does that sound when you sit and think about it? Local government would be able to help much more with community support and care for the elderly if their budgets hadn't been slashed again and again.
I appreciate Rishile's optimism and would love for it to come to pass, but, realistically, if and when we get through this, don't kid yourselves, it will be back to normal. The rich get richer and don't give a monkeys about the rest.
As for Prince Charles: I'm no royalist but I have a soft spot for Charles as I believe he does care, in his own way. Make no mistake, though, he'll get the best treatment available and there will definitely be a ventilator available for him, don't you worry!
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We should all try to remain optimistic;
That's all I was trying to do. I know things will be very different but I am hoping it will be for the better. I wish I hadn't bothered.
Rishile
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Thanks Rashile
Today I heard someone say they will not listen or read anymore news about the virus, they are worried and it is making them more so, I am inclined to agree, it is a huge worry all round
I haven't panic bought anything at all but I will manage
I have also decided to use 1 spoon less of tea leaves in my teapot for starters, don't like tea bags, plus I have made a packet of sausages last , sandwich, 2 for a meal and I am making the rest into a Yorkshire pudding for this evenings meal, years since I made one
Today I read that people are complaining their brown bin hasn't been emptied this week, well it is frustrating but a crew cannot work under power obviously for safety reasons so we have to bear with it
We all have to have a bit of patience, this has nothing to do with Boris it was totally unforeseen
Take care
Louisa Maud
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Rishile, I am glad you bothered! Positivity and an optimistic outlook are required and can lead to a better outcome. There is far too much negativity about and I am not prepared to succumb to it. It is a shame that some people are not respecting that this thread is looking to provide hope.
Well done Rishlie for starting a positive thread.
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Thank you SonofThom.
Rishile
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A bit of joy today - My first Radio Times arrived by post this morning! I have been meaning order it by post for years but this crisis really made me do to.
Kay
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Well done Kay - have you got the Trackword? And, we saw a couple of yellow butterflies at the bottom of the garden, too far to see what variety. Haven't seen fairies, though.
Coelmar
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Not yet - I fell flat just after lunch, having tripped over a plank of wood So I am lying down, watching the bruises develop and trying to unscramble my brain :-\
On the plus side my OH brought me our favorite berry bar we had been saving for a treat ;D
Kay
PS - I think I did see your fairies !!
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A bit of joy today - My first Radio Times arrived by post this morning! I have been meaning order it by post for years but this crisis really made me do to.
Kay
Thanks, Kay, you've just reminded me to do that as well. They have an article about receiving RT by post in next week's copy which I picked up yesterday. There was only one copy left in the shop - surely people aren't panic buying the RT!!!
Seems like a good idea to get it posted in the present climate - as long as the postmen are stll working, of course.
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Covid 19 and influenza are both viral respiratory infections with many similarities while not being identical. There is a belief that the similarities will include seasonality and if this proves to be the case then when that is coupled with the measures being taken by the Government we have reason to be optimistic that we will start to see a downturn in infections in two or three weeks time.
We should all try to remain optimistic; the old cliche is very true - "hope for the best and prepare for the worst". I hope that other posts on this thread will highlight positives - there are plenty of other places which seem dedicated to doom and gloom.
I couldn't agree with you more, It got to the point where I didn't want to come on here. ::)
At first I was afraid, I was petrified,
There was no loo roll down at Aldi and I nearly cried.
Oh I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrong,
I used to wipe,
And now I'm forced to just drip dry!
No anti-bac!
No bloody soap,
And if you think you're buying pasta,
Well you've got no bloody hope!
I would have bought that box of eggs,
I would have rationed out my bread.
If I'd known for just one second
Everyone would lose their head!
Go on now go, walk out the door!
Sang to I Will Survive!
That made me smile so I just had to share it.
Stay safe and keep smiling ;)
I posted this on the CV thread and it went unnoticed apart from RTL's post about ending it on.
Carol
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"as long as the postmen are still working, of course." I believe postmen are classed as key workers.
I have decided to write my granddaughter a letter, as it is her birthday in a few days! That will be a novel experience for her. I checked with my son in case he was likely to treat it as a health hazard, and suggested that he could iron it, as someone said on here recently about newspapers. :D
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Sellotape the envelope and don't lick the sticky bit
Louisa Maud
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sonofthom
So sorry for any negativity..
Let me tell you a couple of positives that have come my way.
I had 4 mothers day cards (last year NONE on the day and one a bit late then no more) ---- so FOUR is wonderful -- I have 5 offspring.. but one left the fold of her own choice some time back...
AND then on FB I got messages from my grandchildren ... love you Nanny messages... wow.. brilliant.. smashing.. and so I woke up feeling a little warm and happy....
The sun and grass and peace and actual clear skies daytime and nightime are all wonderful.. so yes lots of positives.. and beside that ... no point in counting calories.. so will eat things I havent eaten in years.. and enjoy..
ONE thing I must add... I have been a Rootschatter since forever.. now and it has helped me through a lifetime of ups and downs SARAH AND TRYSTAN --- thank you for starting this site and helping so many people gain wonderful knowledge regarding so many things not only .. 'Where is my 6th GG buried' - I have loved the restoration pages in my day - and made so many lovely virtual friends... sadly some now no longer with us.. xxxxxx whoops
slipping off the positive
going now xxxxxx Love you all xxxxxxx with or without an 'ee' ha ha
Xin ;D ;D
ps wheres mjb and hippy and all from my day :) sorry brain tired these days so many more names not at front ...
gone 8) 8) 8) 8) ::) ::) ???
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Rishile, I am glad you bothered! Positivity and an optimistic outlook are required and can lead to a better outcome. There is far too much negativity about and I am not prepared to succumb to it. It is a shame that some people are not respecting that this thread is looking to provide hope.
Well done Rishlie for starting a positive thread.
Well said ! The clue is in title of the thread, if people cannot find something positive to say then JOG ON, plenty of other threads to comment on. There are many of us struggling right now, we need to think and hear that there might at least be a chink of light at the end of this tunnel
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Rishile, I am glad you bothered too! Please everyone don't stop coming here!
There must always be hope.
How often do we look at some grim record of the history of our forebears, a tragic death of an infant, an early widowhood, wars, disease or poverty and wonder how on earth did they overcome that? Well they did. They hoped and they carried on. We are all the living proof of that.
We repay that hope and their trust in a better tomorrow by researching, recording and remembering them all today.
Take care all, Tony. x
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I do not know how accurate this advice is but it seems common sense and cannot do any harm to follow
Advice from China after autopsies of dead the virus obstructs repository pathways with thick mucus
that solidifies and blocks airways and lungs.
1) Drink lots of hot liquids coffee soup teas warm water in addition Sip warm water every 20 minutes this keeps mouth moist & washes virus into stomach where gastric juices neutralise it, before it can reach the lungs and damage them
2) gargle with an antiseptic in warm water like vinegar lemon or salt
3) Virus attaches to hair and clothes take a bath or shower after being out in street avoid sitting down before taking bath/shower
4) wash cloths daily, wash metallic surfaces daily don't touch handrails or door handles
5) Don't smoke
6) wash hands for 20 seconds every 20 mins using any soap that foams
7) eat fruit and vegetables daily try to elevate zinc levels
8 ) Animals do not spread the virus
9) avoid common flu as it weakens immune system
10 if you feel discomfort in your throat attack it with the above methods immediately
In other words be sensible and follow normal rules of hygiene
Cheers
Guy
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As I said on another thread, I am a very positive person.
I don't hold with negative thinking! ;D
Not in isolation yet, but taking care.
I am classed as "vulnerable" due to diabetes, and a flu-jab every year.
Have been going for walks in the countryside.
Went for a walk on the Marine Drive in Douglas, Isle of Man.
Saw ravens, (lots of) seagulls, but sadly didn't spot a chough.
Neither did I spot a dolphin :-(
But the gorse is coming into flower - such a gorgeous deep golden-yellow.
One of the first major changes I noticed when I moved here 26 years ago.
Meanwhile I have one daughter who is an NHS worker - pharmaceutical stores.
And my other daughter is a key worker, being Kitchen Manager in a Primary School, providing dinners for children of other key workers.
Stay positive ;D ;D
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https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
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I do not know how accurate this advice is but it seems common sense and cannot do any harm to follow
Advice from China after autopsies of dead the virus obstructs repository pathways with thick mucus
that solidifies and blocks airways and lungs.
1) Drink lots of hot liquids coffee soup teas warm water in addition Sip warm water every 20 minutes this keeps mouth moist & washes virus into stomach where gastric juices neutralise it, before it can reach the lungs and damage them
2) gargle with an antiseptic in warm water like vinegar lemon or salt
3) Virus attaches to hair and clothes take a bath or shower after being out in street avoid sitting down before taking bath/shower
4) wash cloths daily, wash metallic surfaces daily don't touch handrails or door handles
5) Don't smoke
6) wash hands for 20 seconds every 20 mins using any soap that foams
7) eat fruit and vegetables daily try to elevate zinc levels
8 ) Animals do not spread the virus
9) avoid common flu as it weakens immune system
10 if you feel discomfort in your throat attack it with the above methods immediately
In other words be sensible and follow normal rules of hygiene
Cheers
Guy
To be fair, doing any of the above won’t harm you, and there is science to prove the placebo effect.
It’s just very sad that someone has felt the need to produce this list and give false hope.
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https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
They didn't mention the cleric in Iran who said it can be cured by rubbing Pansy oil on your anus at night. ::)
Debra :)
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It's been doing the rounds, in various forms for a while now.
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Hi Dundee, from where can I get some Pansy oil, my next door neighbour but one is one
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https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
They didn't mention the cleric in Iran who said it can be cured by rubbing Pansy oil on your anus at night. ::)
Debra :)
Mmmm, he may have ulterior motives.
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Can you get 'Ulterior Motives' from the Chemists ?
maybe 'Posterior Motions'
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Latest scientific evidence proves * that happiness and optimism is a lot stronger than the Corona Virus. It can live much longer on doom and gloom but happiness and optimism will banish it almost immediately.
* This is actually a lie but does it matter? Isn't it worth a try? It certainly can't hurt.
Happiness spreads faster than any virus. Stay Happy, Stay Safe, Stay Indoors.
Rishile
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Whilst on the subject of lies;
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/rolltodisbelieve/2020/03/10/christian-scammers-have-discovered-coronavirus-thanks-i-hate-it/
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Suey, don't discount the above list out of had it actually has sound scientific evidence behind it and is certainly logical.
1 Drink lots of hot liquids coffee soup teas warm water in addition Sip warm water every 20 minutes this keeps mouth moist & washes virus into stomach where gastric juices neutralise it, before it can reach the lungs and damage them. Whilst this is likely not to affect the Covid-19 virus itself it could help by a secondary method of keeping one's fluid intake up and lessening the effects of flu and colds on the lungs.
2 gargle with an antiseptic in warm water like vinegar lemon or salt, again this will probably not stave off the Covid-19 virus but it will help to reduce sore throats etc. and make you feel better. You are more likely to stay healthy if you feel fit and healthy than if you feel down and miserable.
3) Virus attaches to hair and clothes take a bath or shower after being out in street avoid sitting down before taking bath/shower There is good scientific evidence to support this which is exactly why people are told to wash their hands, this is just taking it one step further if you have been out and possibly carried the virus back home on your hair or clothes.
4) wash cloths daily, wash metallic surfaces daily don't touch handrails or door handle again science has proven that the virus survives for long periods of times on non absorbent surfaces, washing such surfaces may remove the virus from them and not touching surfaces others a likely to touch will certainly help protect you.
5) Don't smoke , smoking and vaping has been shown to compromise the lungs not smoking or vaping gives them a chance if attacked by the virus.
6) wash hands for 20 seconds every 20 mins using any soap that foams current advice from medical experts.
7) eat fruit and vegetables daily try to elevate zinc levels fruit and vegetables add roughage to the diet and help to evacuate the bowels, it has been scientifically shown that stools can contain the virus to clearing them from the body as soon as possible must be a good thing
8 ) Animals do not spread the virus, this is based on sound scientific evidence.
9) avoid common flu as it weakens immune system, this is really a repeat of 1 above, flu affects the lungs anything that compromises ones health should be avoided at this time (common sense)
10 if you feel discomfort in your throat attack it with the above methods immediately again common sense defeating Covid-19 requires a healthy body anything one can do to reduce any other infection gives one a fighting chance
As I wrote at the head of the posting I do not know how accurate this advice is but it seems common sense and cannot do any harm to follow.
In other words be sensible and follow normal rules of hygiene, it is like hand sanitiser most hand sanitisers do not contain enough alcohol to provide any defence even straight Vodka is too weak, but washing hands does work and using hand sanitiser when this is not available reinforces the practice.
Cheers
Guy
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On the subject of good news, the link below takes you to an official UK Government web page and so can be regarded as authoritative. However the downgrading of the seriousness of Covid 19 doesn't seem to have been noticed by our journalists. Also interesting, and depending on how it proceeds perhaps a harbinger of good news, is the Swedish approach to not go into full lockdown; if their infection numbers don't skyrocket this would point to a possible lessening of restrictions here sooner rather than later.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/high-consequence-infectious-diseases-hcid?fbclid=IwAR0qpn_FP0xIdLUOjFLZS5hXFpfnWYyeoX6dykdgc0PaR5E4d1fOk2BTFGw#status-of-covid-19
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Media reports seem to indicate the true number of people who have had and recovered from Covid 19 is far, far greater than the official number - thanks to lack of test kits. If this is correct, then surely that must mean that the total fatalities constitute a much smaller percentage of the whole.
Still awful for those affected, of course.
Currently trying to persuade myself that I don't really feel as though I'm going down with a cold. :'(
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Guy, Not once, but twice have you written the same extraordinary 'Advice from China'.
Some of it will do harm, and most of it certainly won't help.
1) Drinking water every 20 minutes is highly likely to lead to hyponatremia, depending upon how much water you drink, especially with all the other increased fluids suggested.
2) Antiseptic does not kill coronavirus, so gargling with it is highly unlikely to be of any benefit. Vinegar and salt are not antiseptics that I am aware of, lemon juice has weak antiseptic properties
6) Washing hands for 20 seconds every 20 minutes is highly likely to leave your hands very, very sore, with broken skin.
9) I think we all try to avoid catching the common flu, but if it is circulating and we are circulating, people will catch it.
Please do not spread fake advice, likely to do as much harm as good.
https://www.kcrg.com/content/news/FACT-CHECK-Dont-trust-social-media-tips-on-Coronavirus-569108951.html
This is also spreading on Facebook.
Regards Margaret
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Hope for the future?. I just hope that we do not lose hope, because without it what do we have?. Precisely nothing. Hope keeps us going.
Even without the current situation people live with hope for all sorts of things.
I see that some people say things will change after this episode but they never really say how they expect things will change. It will be interesting to see what, if anything, does change and will it necessarily be for the better?.
I certainly hope so.
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Did you not read my link?
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The science is flawed in the garbage posted.
You cannot wash out your lungs by drinking water.
Stomach fluids do not kill it.
See here, again;
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
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I'm sure Guy was trying to bring some 'hope for the future' as this thread seems to demand. I have no idea whether the advice is hokum or helpful but that doesn't give anyone the right to gang up on the poor man.
I posted some reality as I see it on this thread yesterday about government underfunding being partly responsible for the current NHS crisis and was told in no uncertain terms to go away if I couldn't be 'hopeful'.
Hope comes in many guises - mine is that a lesson has been learnt and the NHS will receive decent funding (and lots of reorganisation) in years to come. Some of you might care to start your future Utopia by being nicer to your fellow Rootschatters!
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I'm sure Guy was trying to bring some 'hope for the future' as this thread seems to demand. I have no idea whether the advice is hokum or helpful but that doesn't give anyone the right to gang up on the poor man.
I posted some reality as I see it on this thread yesterday about government underfunding being partly responsible for the current NHS crisis and was told in no uncertain terms to go away if I couldn't be 'hopeful'.
Hope comes in many guises - mine is that a lesson has been learnt and the NHS will receive decent funding (and lots of reorganisation) in years to come. Some of you might care to start your future Utopia by being nicer to your fellow Rootschatters!
I agree entirely, especially as one link posted has many dubious adverts and little in the way of facts.
Fact. The minimum recommended fluid intake for a man is 3 litres, that’s a lot of cups of tea. The
Fact. The lead medical oncologist I see recommends gargling with salt and water, I trust him
Lets stay friendly and enjoy each day as it comes, even the experts cannot agree so give commonsense a fair try
Mike
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Remember that "Chinese proverb / Curse" :
"May you live in interesting times"
Well, in retrospect, most of us might feel that one way or another over approximately the past decade, we have been - and are doing just that.
BUT - I can't say I like it. I'd prefer uninteresting, calm and unruffled times, please.
TY
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Shouldn't the majority of the posts on this thread be moved elsewhere? Either to the Covid19 thread or a new one - perhaps titled Covid19, myths and facts? Then this thread could be left for Rishile's original intention. :)
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The science is flawed in the garbage posted.
You cannot wash out your lungs by drinking water.
Stomach fluids do not kill it.
See here, again;
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
My computer is refusing to display the page on the above link.
Is this a fake site, because our official BBC site was definitely a co.uk site?
There was a claimed UK appeal by an organisation for money (posted by a Forum poster) which our British Army already have in hand.
So I searched for the organisation (by name) and ended up with different main web addresses.
Be very careful, fraudsters are operating!
Mark
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Not sure where you went to. It is this that it is from; https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20151016-welcome-to-a-home-for-the-insatiably-curious/
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The science is flawed in the garbage posted.
You cannot wash out your lungs by drinking water.
Stomach fluids do not kill it.
See here, again;
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
My computer is refusing to display the page on the above link.
Is this a fake site, because our official BBC site was definitely a co.uk site?
There was a claimed UK appeal by an organisation for money (posted by a Forum poster) which our British Army already have in hand.
So I searched for the organisation (by name) and ended up with different main web addresses.
Be very careful, fraudsters are operating!
Mark
The link is working fine for me?
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The science is flawed in the garbage posted.
You cannot wash out your lungs by drinking water.
Stomach fluids do not kill it.
See here, again;
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200319-covid-19-will-drinking-water-keep-you-safe-from-coronavirus
My computer is refusing to display the page on the above link.
Is this a fake site, because our official BBC site was definitely a co.uk site?
There was a claimed UK appeal by an organisation for money (posted by a Forum poster) which our British Army already have in hand.
So I searched for the organisation (by name) and ended up with different main web addresses.
Be very careful, fraudsters are operating!
Mark
The BBC official site https://www.bbc.co.uk/ searching ... Coronavirus drinking water
Says
"Sorry, there are no results for Coronavirus drinking water"
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I'm afraid you are looking at a different site
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Maybe if your not happy with my previous links try this one, it is the BBC;
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/51952535/coronavirus-health-myths-you-should-ignore
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I'm afraid you are looking at a different site
The article with others is on https://www.bbc.com/future/
"This website is produced by BBC Global News, a commercial company owned by the BBC (and just the BBC). No money from the licence fee was used to create this website."
Stan
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Maybe if your not happy with my previous links try this one, it is the BBC;
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/51952535/coronavirus-health-myths-you-should-ignore
Hi
I'm not a GP.
However, some infections in the mouth (off fingers onto food / from infected surfaces etc / air) may try and sit in the Mouth / Back of the Mouth FIRST, before spreading. Another reason for HAND WASHING.
SOCIAL DISTANCING is to try and stop us breathing the virus in through nose and/or mouth into the upper respiratory tract and spreading to the lungs.
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I'm gargling with Salt water & spitting out, if any soreness in my Mouth / Back of my Mouth when swallowing.
Mark
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?
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?
Quite.
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Mark, I do hope you are thoroughly cleaning and disinfecting the basin after you've spit out your gargle
:-X
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Mark, I do hope you are thoroughly cleaning and disinfecting the basin after you've spit out your gargle
:-X
20 seconds of of soapy water should do the trick. ;D ;D
I see the gov. are to clamp down on misinformation on line, and are saying again that the gov.uk site is the only one to use.
You can read the actual legislation in full there, it makes interesting reading.
Mike
Thought I’d add this, It is based on commonsense and makes me think they are on the right lines and the plan will work
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There is no evidence that drinking water will stop you getting Covid however ensuring that you're adequately hydrated is good general health advice. Interestingly anaesthetists are finding that for those who devlop ARDS complication of Covid are responding better if they remain slightly 'dry' (not full acute kidney injury) although that applies more to IV fluids.
Sadly there is no evidence for us to be able to tell if there is going to be seasonal variation in the risk of COVID, so I wouldn't want people to be lulled into a false sense of security by the better weather coming in. Obviously I hope it does ease off.
As for the positives giving hope for the future:
1. Pollution is falling in may areas which could give nature the breathing space it needs
2. Due to the excercise rule (no driving somewhere to excercise) people are discovering/rediscovering the beauty in their local areas.
3. Despite social distancing people are actually getting to know their neighbours as they help each other out
4. Through necessity the NHS are finding new ways of working and although many are least worst option others could be valuable lessons for moving forward after this is over.
5. People are learning new skills as they adapt to being at home, or are redeployed within the
6. People are discovering who is important to them and reconnecting with friends and family with whom they may have lost contact due to busy lives.
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What a positive way to regard this awful virus's effects and outcome. Well done, PharmaT
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The LAW in the UK regarding Covid-19 as opposed to unenforceable guidance!
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2020/7
Cheers
Guy
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Gargling with Laphroaig then swallowing it works for me! ;D
Auld NHS Advice, https://www.kintyreforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=19854
Skoosh.
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If you would like to help the scientists understand covid-19
https://covid.joinzoe.com/?fbclid=IwAR2L2IOMPxnx8uasYVFnuzlGa7YnqZyg2LujSpr9DwRXZyAuM4UoccT1FrA
It’s an app for everyone to record daily. Hopefully they will be able see patterns emerging and help get a greater understanding what can be done to fight the virus.
This has come from a bonafida source who is treated at Kings.
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The title of this post 'Hope for the future' should make us all think about what hope there is for humanity after this dreadful virus has been contained( we hope).
My personal hopes are that people are kinder to one another and put more thought in to how we can all help those that need it most.
Families with children who are all at home together with mum and dad trying to continue their careers will come to realise several things...
1. The importance of spending quality time with their children rather than rushing around taking them here there and everywhere at weekends to make up for the fact they don't see much of them during the working week.
2. Just how hard a life teachers have with a whole class room of children not just the 1,2,3 or even 4 children in a family
3. How much they rely on grandparents to do some of the 'parenting' for them.... although as a grandmother I'm always happy to help out.
4. Thinking about their parents who maybe a long way away and how time can quickly run out and therefore stronger relationships are being made as there's more time for actual communications.
I hope that as a country we can become more self reliant in producing the food that we need, manufacturing items we require thus boosting our economy and give employment to the people of our country.
Our skies are quieter are roads are empty the countryside is breathing as it should and having time to regenerate.
There are many more things I could say about my hopes for the future but these are just a few.
Take care, stay safe and well and connected.
Caroline
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The LAW in the UK regarding Covid-19 as opposed to unenforceable guidance!
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2020/7
Cheers
Guy
Oh the joys of reading legislation ………. zzzzzzzzzzz ::)
:)
Have a look at this - especially if you have a touch of "hiraeth".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/cymrufyw/52043654
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The LAW in the UK regarding Covid-19 as opposed to unenforceable guidance!
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2020/7
Cheers
Guy
Oh the joys of reading legislation ………. zzzzzzzzzzz ::)
:)
Have a look at this - especially if you have a touch of "hiraeth".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/cymrufyw/52043654
Yes reading the law can be boring but if you bothered to read it you would see the fines that many police forces are handing out are unlawful and should be appealed.
This is not only my view but the view of many barristers.
We do not live in a police state but many are trying to impose one under the excuse of safety.
Don't get me wrong I support the measures in the guidance but it is just that guidance not law.
Cheers
Guy
-
The LAW in the UK regarding Covid-19 as opposed to unenforceable guidance!
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2020/7
Cheers
Guy
Oh the joys of reading legislation ………. zzzzzzzzzzz ::)
:)
Have a look at this - especially if you have a touch of "hiraeth".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/cymrufyw/52043654
Yes reading the law can be boring but if you bothered to read it you would see the fines that many police forces are handing out are unlawful and should be appealed.
This is not only my view but the view of many barristers.
We do not live in a police state but many are trying to impose one under the excuse of safety.
Don't get me wrong I support the measures in the guidance but it is just that guidance not law.
Cheers
Guy
How do you know I didn't read through it?. I spent the greater part of my wage earning/working life looking at and understanding and using legislation, so I have no problem distinguishing between law and advice.
:)
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Sorry guys but this topic is headed Hope for the Future incase you've forgotten.... there are other sites for topics such as the ones you've raised.
We all need some positive thoughts for the future as we've all been bogged down with the guidelines etc and I'm sure all us RC's are abiding by them all....
Caroline
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I think it is that question mark that is causing the problem ::)
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You may well be right.....
I'm trying to look at the positive in this topic as we do all need that in these worrying times.
Caroline
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I agree Caroline. :)
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I agree that the subject matter of this topic is veering off Rishile's original title of 'Hope for the Future'.
A Rootschatter friend has suggested I post the poem below - not compiled by me, but received. I think it is SO apt;
I heard a little rumour
I don’t know if it’s true
That the world is going to be at peace
for a month or maybe two
The shooters can’t go out to shoot
And the dealers cannot deal
The bombers cannot throw grenades
So mother earth can heal
I hear that folk must stay at home
And spend time with their kin
Slow down relax, take a breath
And find some peace within
I heard that food and water
is being shared around
So everyone has got enough
World kindness has been found
The Queens and Kings and governments
Have settled for enough
Instead of always wanting more
Whilst millions sleep rough
The factories have all closed their doors
And so have schools and bars
The atmosphere is cleaner now
A healthier world is ours
And though we may be worried
about money, jobs and bills
We will notice beauty everywhere
Blue skies, fresh lakes, green hills
The social isolation
Is really not a curse
A blessing in disguise I’d say
to stop things getting worse
And when the month or two is over
and we can go back to our lives
People will show gratitude
that their loved ones all survived
Drugs and bombs and bullets
Will be put away for good
There will be no hate or bitterness
All children will have food
I am not sure if it’s a rumour
Perhaps it’s just a dream
But we are all in this together
We can make it as a team
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That's so lovely Pennines, brought a few tears to my eyes. :'(
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https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-johnson-johnson-vows-to-make-not-for-profit-vaccine-11966292
This article seems to suggest vaccine hope is on the horizon - hope for the future indeed!
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Thank you Roobarb - I appreciate your comment. It is lovely isn't it.
Let's hope it comes true.
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Thank you Pennines, that is so positive and uplifting. We are all suffering from information overload and I am now only listening to one daily news update and don't look at the CV posts now on here.
I remember something my Father said in response to my question about an earthquake which I think was in China, I was very young at the time and mentioned that, if there was a God, why were so many people dying. His answer was, that there needed to be natural disasters to thin out the population or there would be famine, as there wouldn't be enough food to go round.
I do think the world could start to heal itself and start to breath again.
My hope for the future is that we learn to appreciate everything more and not take things for granted and that we can care for and respect others. The old saying that you don't appreciate things until they are no longer there has more meaning now than ever before. If you miss your Family, tell them and let them know how much you ❤️ them.
Stay home and stay safe.
Carol
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Indeed, and the many fewer cars on the roads are having a positive effect
on air quality, it is reported.
What good does it do to be negative? It solves nothing, and negativity does have , well - a negative effect on our physical and mental wellbeing.
Thanks to all who have posted encouraging posts, poems, opinions and
advice.
You are never alone with RootsChat.
And sincere thanks for that .
Viktoria.xxxxx
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Just been sent this!! :) Just don't embrace each other - yet . . . . ;)
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Sensible Wiggy! ;D
Skoosh.
Temporary suspension of jury trials expected to clear the Scottish Parliament today with maybe a couple of amendments. The alternative is a horrendous backlog of cases in six months time.
This has been pulled from the bill due to objections and will be re-submitted after investigation of alternatives!
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Thanks for the poem Pennines. That says it all really.
Thank you to all the positive postings on here too. I intended this thread to be full of optimism and hope for the future but it did veer off into negativity which is why I haven't posted on here for a while.
I am seeing so much changing in the past week or so. I have met new RC friends (you know who you are), I have re-connected with old school friends on FB that haven't had time to really re-connect in the past. People in the street, although keeping their distance, have been friendlier and are smiling much more.
I know people are dying and there are people worrying about their businesses and jobs but there is hope. There MUST ALWAYS be hope. I am a great believer in 'when one door closes, another opens'. All the bad things that have happened to me so far in my life (not that many, luckily) have always lead to a new beginning and better times ahead. So I am looking at this in the same way. We will move forward but in a better way.
Here's hoping
Rishile
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Rishile - thank you for starting this topic and what you say is so true, we must always have hope and our trust in others.
For all those wonderful medics who are putting their lives on the line to help look after and treat those poor souls who are/ and going to suffer from this our hope for them must be strong and we have to all keep the faith.
Neighbourliness is something that should really always be there but in this rushing around world that lots of people live in I think it's got missed and perhaps now we will all think more about our vulnerable neighbours and friends just a little more... it's a shame that it's a pandemic that has brought this about. There is always a silver lining to every cloud.
Pennines I thought your poem was very thought provoking and I shall be passing it on. Thank you for posting it.
I remain positive that things will improve and we can all move forward to a better world.
Caroline
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My very elderly neighbour ,when I phoned this morning ,my routine daily check on her, asked if I had a visitor a little earlier.
“Well no, no one ought to be visiting , who was it and what did they want?”
“ Well, he talked about something on the front of the house,that needed doing and then walked through to the kitchen and said the rear fencing was
in a poor way and all the neighbours were having theirs done,”
She had not exactly invited him in but somehow he had got in.
I phoned The Police.
Then her neighbour on her other side informed me she had been targetted by itinerant workers for work done to her front garden,which was twice the quoted price!
It is completely flagged over with two lonely plant pots .
Nothing needed to be done as this other neighbour hoses down the flags .
What upsets me is her daughter told other nearby neighbours of this but I had no idea.
Considering I normally visit her twice a day when her daughter is holidaying etc and I am old too, sort out her smoke alarm when yet again she forgets her meal is heating in the oven etc ,have a key for emergencies and have had to use it a good few times I think I too ought to have known.
Well, the lady herself is lovely but the first thing she said when I said the Police must be informed, as she keeps her key in a very visible place and I could not get her to check if it was still there,was “ Don’t tell ———-( her daughter).
Ah well , I like her and we got on from before I moved in as we had a laugh over her fence.
So nothing will change , but how thoughtless, on her daughter’s part.
Viktoria.
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Words fail me Viktoria, what nasty people, as my dear dad would say "they will get their comeuppance"
Louisa Maud
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I just thought I would share this lovely poem with you -so apt for this topic 'Hope for the future'.
IN THE TIME OF QUIET
(Author Unknown)
No-one’s told the daffodils about the pause to Spring
And we haven’t told the birds to roost and asked them not to sing
No-one’s asked the lazy bee, to cease his bumbling round
Nor have we stopped the bright green shoots emerging through the ground.
No-one’s told the sap to rest, deep within the wood,
Nor stopped the sleepy trees from waking, wreathed about in bud.
No-one’s told the sky to douse its brightest shades of blue,
And we haven’t stopped the scudding clouds from puffing headlong into view.
The lambs have not been asked to still the springs beneath their feet,
To stop their rapid rush, nor quell every joyful bleat.
The stream has not been told to halt its gurgle, or its flow
Nor have we warned the playful breezes, not to gust or blow.
We haven’t asked the raindrops not to fall upon the earth
And fail to quench the soil in this season of rebirth.
No-one’s locked the sun down, nor dimmed the shimmer of the moon
And even in the dark of night, the stars are still immune.
Remember what you value, remember who is dear.
Close the doors to danger and keep your family near.
In the quiet all around us, take the time to stand and stare
And wonder at the glory unfurling everywhere.
Look towards the future, after the ordeal,
And keep faith in Mother Nature and her power and will to heal.
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That is super. Thanks.
It is so true, it is all happening around us and we could appreciate it more if we just calmed down, and if we did appreciate it more we would calm down ,so nothing to lose .
Like Pharma’s cat.
She talks sense!.
Viktoria.
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I fear that governments at home and abroad will get to like the idea of restrictions and police states will become the norm
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Actually -- it wouldn't be a bad idea to have far more law and order in today's society. I think I will accept your message as a 'Hope for the future' Redroger.
And Viktoria -- many thanks for your kind acknowledgement of the poem - I thought those verses were so calming at this time.
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Actually -- it wouldn't be a bad idea to have far more law and order in today's society. I think I will accept your message as a 'Hope for the future' Redroger.
Careful what you wish for!!
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This is an opportunity to put the profiteers and Hedge Fund owners in front of a jury .
They are fortunate capital punishment is a thing of the past.
But, I fear for the rule of law across the world.
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Redroger and jillruss --- this is a 'Hope for the Future' topic. I, for one am feeling very down at the moment -- and there will be many, many more people in a far worse position than I am.
Don't you agree that your comments may be more appropriate on a 'We are all Doomed' topic?
Please let us have a little light and brightness at this dreadful time.
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Actually -- it wouldn't be a bad idea to have far more law and order in today's society. I think I will accept your message as a 'Hope for the future' Redroger.
I totally agree Pennines. It would be a lot better country/world if there was more law and order. Too many people have so little disregard for the law because they don't think it applies to them. I think the police should be a bit tougher and be SEEN to be tougher. The stupid things shown in the media of police being so petty doesn't help at all but I loved the policeman putting out the barbecue with his helmetful of water.
Rishile
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Until they half kill a relative for being in the wrong place at the wrong time!Policing by consent yes, but they lost my trust over that and other things.
Actually I agree with you on people in high places flaunting the law, two instances at least of senior ministers and health officials taking long car journeys and sadly, not confined to government either, though of the same social class.
I think your suggestion is a good idea. Let's start a "We're all doomed " thread.
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No, we do not want a " we are doomed" thread, we need to be more positive
Louisa Naud
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This is an opportunity to put the profiteers and Hedge Fund owners in front of a jury .
They are fortunate capital punishment is a thing of the past.
But, I fear for the rule of law across the world.
Come the revolution, eh.
:)
I fear that governments at home and abroad will get to like the idea of restrictions and police states will become the norm
Really?.
:)
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Do you know - I have realised during the last 2 or 3 weeks, just how much we normally take for granted.
Going out when we want, seeing family, Doctors, Nurses, Dentists, Repair men, and the more shallow things like taking the car through a car wash, hairdressers, wandering around the shops (particularly the women!)
Money coming in each week in wages, or business takings etc.
Our ancestors didn't have a lot of these facilities really - yet we have been lucky enough to accept it as the norm.
Maybe in the future we will appreciate things SO much more.
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Do you know - I have realised during the last 2 or 3 weeks, just how much we normally take for granted.
Going out when we want, seeing family, Doctors, Nurses, Dentists, Repair men, and the more shallow things like taking the car through a car wash, hairdressers, wandering around the shops (particularly the women!)
Money coming in each week in wages, or business takings etc.
Our ancestors didn't have a lot of these facilities really - yet we have been lucky enough to accept it as the norm.
Maybe in the future we will appreciate things SO much more.
Someone was saying today that it is luck that this happened now and not 30 years ago so at least we have thechnology to help us stay in contact with each other.
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This is an opportunity to put the profiteers and Hedge Fund owners in front of a jury .
They are fortunate capital punishment is a thing of the past.
But, I fear for the rule of law across the world.
Come the revolution, eh.
:)
I fear that governments at home and abroad will get to like the idea of restrictions and police states will become the norm
Really?.
:)
Nice idea Llwd, but a regression not a progression. Look at Eastern Europe USA and Brazil. Abominable governance in all of these. China got it right and was half ignored.
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Not sure how you can use 'China' and 'got it right' in the same sentence, considering our current situation.
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They published the genome of the virus within a few days to the world.
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Not sure how you can use 'China' and 'got it right' in the same sentence, considering our current situation.
I was reading an article today in which it was stated that it's likely we will never ever know the true source of C-19. Indeed, there are a number of reports of people in the UK contracting a very similar illness before Christmas, many of whom subsequently were hospitalised with pneumonia. It is pointless trying to apportion blame; these things happen, and it's not as though it was because of some deliberate act on behalf of 'foreigners'.
China dealt with its problem fairly efficiently; South Korea really got to grips with the issue by aggressive testing and contact-tracing. The UK, however, decided to try out a 'herd immunity' experiment, before realising that the model they were given was based on viral pneumonia rather than C-19.
An interesting thought is that we are not in a dissimilar situation to Europe in the 14th century, the results of which were far-reaching, not only in the amount of deaths, but also in the way that society changed as a result. The black death decimated the population of the UK, and signalled the end of the feudal system. People who had been bound to their lords found that they could escape what was in effect slavery, and offer their labour elsewhere. Properties were abandoned when entire families died, which meant that Ag Labs suddenly found themselves in charge of entire farms.
Whilst dreadful, this 21st century plague is likely to change our social and political landscapes, and we need to make sure it will be for the better. An important lesson has been learned: it's not the billionaire tax-dodger with money in off-shore accounts to avoid tax who keep countries from falling apart. No, it's the people on basic wages, it's the people at the checkouts, the refuse collectors, the cleaners, the wonderful (in the UK) NHS staff and all the emergency services; the carers and those who work in care homes... I could go on. But these are the people who hold our countries together and it would be a good idea if we recognised who are important in our lives, and who are not.
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Totally agree. I have been saying for a long time that all the people who actually matter to others are the mainly low-paid employees of the NHS, local government, and various contracted out and privatised services, such as postmen, bus drivers, railwaymen, binmen, prison officers library assistants.... Let's hope for better things for them!
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Don't bet on it; https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/09/hedge-funds-raking-in-billions-during-coronavirus-crisis
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It's also worth remembering that a lot of those "mainly low-paid employees of the NHS, local government, and various contracted out and privatised services, such as postmen, bus drivers, railwaymen, binmen, prison officers library assistants.." are from other countries. Perhaps this may make a lot of people realise how we can't do without them.
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An important lesson has been learned: it's not the billionaire tax-dodger with money in off-shore accounts to avoid tax who keep countries from falling apart. No, it's the people on basic wages, it's the people at the checkouts, the refuse collectors, the cleaners, the wonderful (in the UK) NHS staff and all the emergency services; the carers and those who work in care homes... I could go on. But these are the people who hold our countries together and it would be a good idea if we recognised who are important in our lives, and who are not.
Thank you.
I work in healthcare. I am not a doctor. My last pay rise was 13 years ago.
In the meantime the cost of registration, insurance and continuing education has pretty much doubled. I spent 5-10% of my annual gross earnings simply on meeting the requirements to practice and jumping through hoops.
A course was rolled out a couple of years ago that my boss wanted to me to do, so then I'd been able to offer a service that the boss could charge for. It was going to cost at least a couple of hundred pounds. He wanted us to do the course but wasn't going to pay for it.
Pffffttt....fat chance buddy.
This is the same boss that we didn't hear from for a week in mid-March when we were absolutely flat out and the Alert Levels were changing rapidly. His excuse is that he was busy too. His leadership has been woefully inadequate. Fortunately my manager has been amazing, but she has to deal with his pathetic stinginess over simple things like providing enough hand sanitiser, or getting us a decent mop to clean the floor (I've been taking my own mop and bleach, just so I can be sure it's been done properly)
Suddenly, thanks to COVID19, our Ministry of Health has decided that it would be good if more people across various sectors of health have this training, and will provide it for free. I'm going to enrol and get started on the online component before they change their mind. I fee sorry for my manager who footed the bill herself last year.
But if I wasn't working in this role and had been in a service that would be currently shut and which hadn't put me at risk of being exposed to COVID19, I'd have hit the road before the lockdown and would be staying with my 80 years+ parent down country who lives alone.
But actually I doubt that much will change and that I will be appreciated or remunerated any more than I am now.
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I will try to keep this as brief as possible. There are parallels between this and the Black Death. However there are important differences. It is not conclusive that the BD was entirely plague,some of the pictures from the time are more like the effects of smallpox.This is at least one mutant of CV possibly more. It has a death rate of between 1 &10%. BD was 50%+.
At the end of the BD there was an acute shortage of Labour so wages went up and the feudal system began to fail.
This time there will probably be a Labour surplus and a shortage of capital leading to inflation and a world slump. Is this why "herd immunity" looked attractive earlier? There will be a surplus of people. Worrying situation.
However, in some ways there are bright spots. We have a strong scientific sector, though to an extent it is held back by superstition and bigotry. The planet is recovering, pollution is at a level not seen since the 1950s,fish seen in Venetian canals. Can we grasp and develop these positives? I sincerely hope and believe so if the idiot fringe obey the shutdown.
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Indeed, there are a number of reports of people in the UK contracting a very similar illness before Christmas, many of whom subsequently were hospitalised with pneumonia. It is pointless trying to apportion blame; these things happen, and it's not as though it was because of some deliberate act on behalf of 'foreigners'.
Yes, we have a thousand houses now in our former village area and I mentioned it to the Chemist and a number of us felt we had, had it and been confined to bed, or something very similar in November 2019 and January 2020.
During January / February 2020, it was like when I had Bronchitis as a child and you felt you were taking your last breath due to complete exhaustion, when my Mother use to sit up by my bedside with me until I was so exhausted that I fell asleep. I had a burner candle in my bedroom (as a child) which gave off a kind of smoke vapour and was plastered with Vicks Vaporub.
If I had not had Bronchitis as a child, I would have been very frightened this January / February, when I ignored the VapoRub safety instructions and covered my lower face and neck with Vapor Rub and had extra pillows to be able to sleep in a reclined (semi-upright) position, to reduce the cough at night.
The continous dry cough lasted a month and is a non-productive cough. But the vibration from the continual cough after several weeks eventually hurt my brain.
Since I've had a rash, aching and stiff leg muscles, ear pain when swallowing and now left with a pain in my head that side and rear.
I have since seen the Doctor about the rash (a mystery) and reported my January / February illness and he said there was no antibody test and felt I'd had Influenza.
Last week, our Doctors Surgery was handed over to the NHS Trust and became a BY APPOINTMENT Covid-19 Assessment Centre.
Mark
Added
We are following the UK Government Rules to the letter!
I can see, that if a sufferer develops Pneumonia in an already weak exhausted state, how anyone could be in extremely serious trouble!
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Your experience sounds very similar to people in this area Mark; but of course we will never know if it was an early version of C-19 and I suspect no-one would want to find out since they are happy to accept China as the source.
The problem with this country is that without testing most of us have no idea of whether or not we've been infected. I think this sums up our situation currently:
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Indeed, there are a number of reports of people in the UK contracting a very similar illness before Christmas, many of whom subsequently were hospitalised with pneumonia. It is pointless trying to apportion blame; these things happen, and it's not as though it was because of some deliberate act on behalf of 'foreigners'.
Yes, we have a thousand houses now in our former village area and I mentioned it to the Chemist and a number of us felt we had, had it and been confined to bed, or something very similar in November 2019 and January 2020.
During January / February 2020, it was like when I had Bronchitis as a child and you felt you were taking your last breath due to complete exhaustion, when my Mother use to sit up by my bedside with me until I was so exhausted that I fell asleep. I had a burner candle in my bedroom (as a child) which gave off a kind of smoke vapour and was plastered with Vicks Vaporub.
If I had not had Bronchitis as a child, I would have been very frightened this January / February, when I ignored the VapoRub safety instructions and covered my lower face and neck with Vapor Rub and had extra pillows to be able to sleep in a reclined (semi-upright) position, to reduce the cough at night.
The continous dry cough lasted a month and is a non-productive cough. But the vibration from the continual cough after several weeks eventually hurt my brain.
Since I've had a rash, aching and stiff leg muscles, ear pain when swallowing and now left with a pain in my head that side and rear.
I have since seen the Doctor about the rash (a mystery) and reported my January / February illness and he said there was no antibody test and felt I'd had Influenza.
Last week, our Doctors Surgery was handed over to the NHS Trust and became a BY APPOINTMENT Covid-19 Assessment Centre.
Mark
Added
We are following the UK Government Rules to the letter!
I can see, that if a sufferer develops Pneumonia in an already weak exhausted state, how anyone could be in extremely serious trouble!
I was the same in November with a chest infection and I'm not especially prone to chest infections. I find myself wondering if it was but I don't know how much of that is wishful thinking trying to make me feel a little less scared at work though.
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I think it was Professor Chris Witty I saw who referred to Covid-19 as one of the Corona Viruses, suggesting there is more than one?
UK Scientists can't tell us if we've had Coronavirus or a version because:-
a) there is no 99% reliable antibody test yet.
b) even if our UK did have an antibody test, it might not do any good yet, because REUTERS News Agency have gone public ... saying South Korean recovered Coronavirus patients are now testing positive again.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-southkorea/south-korea-reports-recovered-coronavirus-patients-testing-positive-again-idUSKCN21S15X
So the other UK Political parties saying look at Testing and South Korea, it seems, will have to eat humble pie!
Take great care, STAY HOME and continue to observe RULES and HAND-WASHING etc., Mark
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I think it was Professor Chris Witty I saw who referred to Covid-19 as one of the Corona Viruses, suggesting there is more than one?
UK Scientists can't tell us if we've had Coronavirus or a version because:-
a) there is no 99% reliable antibody test yet.
b) even if our UK did have an antibody test, it might not do any good yet, because REUTERS News Agency have gone public ... saying South Korean recovered Coronavirus patients are now testing positive again.
So the other UK Political parties saying look at Testing and South Korea, it seems, will have to eat humble pie!
Take great care, STAY HOME and continue to observe RULES and HAND-WASHING etc., Mark
Yes there is more than one corona virus. Corona viruses are a class of viruses, you get seasonal ones cause the common cold, SARS and MERS were both corona viruses. There is absolutely no suggestion that infection with one corona virus confers any immunity to any of the others. The existence of corona viruses is specifically why it's called novel corona virus as in a new corona virus.
There are several cases (51 I think) in South Korea of people testing positive for Covid after previously testing negative. It has not been established exactly why this has happened and is under investigation. Some of the possible explanations are:
1. Reinfection because being infected cannot confer immunity (the most worrying)
2. Reinfection because a percentage of the population do not gain immunity (this phenomenon happens with rubella which granted is not a corona virus)
3. The virus levels fell to too low a level to be detectable by the test then levels went up again (this can happen with HIV ie viral load to low to be detected by basic test. This suggests it takes longer to clear the symptom than thought, a concern but not as worrying as 1.
4. False negative due to poor technique or faulty test leading to original negative result
5. Viral fragments without infective capability are giving the positive test
Each has their own concerns but WHO seem to be on to it and are investigating so that we can know.
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Redroger and jillruss --- this is a 'Hope for the Future' topic. I, for one am feeling very down at the moment -- and there will be many, many more people in a far worse position than I am.
Don't you agree that your comments may be more appropriate on a 'We are all Doomed' topic?
Please let us have a little light and brightness at this dreadful time.
Some would call that sticking your fingers in your ears and singing very loudly, Pennines. I don't see how you can have a grown up 'conversation' about the current pandemic without analysing both sides (good and bad). I do not like the way the police have suddenly popped up all over the place when previously they were hardly to be seen, in order to move old ladies off park benches or tell people what they can or cannot buy in a supermarket. This has even come from Chief Constable level - later retracted, but, nevertheless, that's where their minds were to begin with.
Nations don't usually turn into police states over night - its progressive.
However, I take your point that you want everything on this thread to be sugar and spice so I've now blocked replies and will take no further part. Congrats! You've just started a police state thread!! ::)
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People seem to be badmouthing herd immunity (this is the proportion of the population immune to a virus due to having protection derived from antibodies produced after an infection or vaccination, meaning that there is little chance of an unprotected person coming into contact with an infectious person and being infected by them.) but that is the only way such viruses are contained in the long term.
One very good example of this is measles, due to vaccination of children measles was practically wiped out in the UK and the World Health Organization declared the nation measles-free, the vaccinations gave the population herd immunity.
Now partly because of a doctor called Andrew Wakefield wrongly linking MMR with autism and partly because the government withdrew the individual vaccination herd immunity has dropped and measles is again on the increase.
Many virus experts believe the same will happen with covid-19, but it was never a policy to allow people to get infected to gain herd immunity but rather a forecast that due to the fact that covid-19 is a new virus and there is no immunity to it and no vaccine available there would be a rapid spread through populations and the surviving population would benefit from herd immunity.
However due to the success of social distancing and the efforts of the NHS it is likely that the UK infection rate will never reach the levels required to give herd immunity therefore the policy is to contain and suppress the virus as much as possible until a vaccine can be developed.
Cheers
Guy
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There is some very interesting and potentially very good news on the BBC Scotland website claiming that in Scotland the true number of Covid 19 cases is likely to be over 500,000, compared to the official figure of 5,275; no source is given. However if true this would imply a very low mortality rate and similarly a very low serious cases rate; it would also suggest a significant level of community (ie "herd") immunity is being built up leading to much slower transmission of the illness. I cannot see that there is any reason to suppose that the position in the rest of the UK would be significantly different so this perhaps points to an easing of the lockdown relatively soon.
Guy, I cannot agree with your assertion ( I hope that you are wrong) that " the policy is to contain and suppress the virus as much as possible until a vaccine can be developed". A vaccine by most accounts is at least a year or more away and maintaining the current practices for that long would lead to complete societal breakdown due to the total collapse of our economy. The consequences of this would be dire, including the inability to pay for the NHS. On the other hand we are seeing other countries relaxing their lockdown a bit; for example I see that in Germany Saxony has announced that schools will reopen after the Easter holidays.
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Spain is also starting to relax its lockdown and from Monday, workers in sectors such as construction and manufacturing will be allowed to return to work.
Deaths in the UK are slightly down today - 917 new coronavirus deaths, which sadly includes an 11-year-old. The result of our lockdown should start to show next week, so we will know how successful it has been.
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However, I take your point that you want everything on this thread to be sugar and spice so I've now blocked replies and will take no further part. Congrats! You've just started a police state thread!! ::)
You could have phrased your reply in a more friendly way. We are all feeling stressed at the moment and a reply like that will simply make someone feel even more upset.
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People seem to be badmouthing herd immunity (this is the proportion of the population immune to a virus due to having protection derived from antibodies produced after an infection or vaccination, meaning that there is little chance of an unprotected person coming into contact with an infectious person and being infected by them.) but that is the only way such viruses are contained in the long term.
One very good example of this is measles, due to vaccination of children measles was practically wiped out in the UK and the World Health Organization declared the nation measles-free, the vaccinations gave the population herd immunity.
It is accepted that the British government tried a 'herd immunity' experiment initially, thus wasting a precious two months, before it was realised that the model they were relying on was based on viral pneumonia and not C-19. Additionally, the government allowed the races at Cheltenham to go ahead,where tens of thousands of people were in close proximity. I was reading a doctor's report this morning which suggested that the current surge in UK deaths is in large part due to people from all over the country being at Cheltenham races three weeks ago.
I agree that the only way to achieve herd immunity would be through vaccination; however, that's a long way off currently. And the fact that (as stated above) there are now indications of people who have recovered from C-19 subsequently testing positive for the virus is another reason why any plans for herd immunity are going to be somewhat challenging.
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There is some very interesting and potentially very good news on the BBC Scotland website claiming that in Scotland the true number of Covid 19 cases is likely to be over 500,000, compared to the official figure of 5,275; no source is given. However if true this would imply a very low mortality rate and similarly a very low serious cases rate; it would also suggest a significant level of community (ie "herd") immunity is being built up leading to much slower transmission of the illness. I cannot see that there is any reason to suppose that the position in the rest of the UK would be significantly different so this perhaps points to an easing of the lockdown relatively soon.
Guy, I cannot agree with your assertion ( I hope that you are wrong) that " the policy is to contain and suppress the virus as much as possible until a vaccine can be developed". A vaccine by most accounts is at least a year or more away and maintaining the current practices for that long would lead to complete societal breakdown due to the total collapse of our economy. The consequences of this would be dire, including the inability to pay for the NHS. On the other hand we are seeing other countries relaxing their lockdown a bit; for example I see that in Germany Saxony has announced that schools will reopen after the Easter holidays.
If the above figure turn out to be correct that would be good news however the official figures are
A total of 29,903 people in Scotland have been tested. Of these:
24,313 tests were confirmed negative
5,590 tests were positive
542 patients who tested positive have died
The BBC figures are simply guesses.
I did not suggest that the lockdown would be in force until a vaccine was developed, but the policy is to contain and suppress the virus as much as possible until a vaccine can be developed, this means as the social distancing works and the infection rate falls the lockdown can be relaxed in various ways or even removed then next year when the virus regains its hold an adapted procedure would be put in place again to contain and suppress the virus as much as possible and as many times as necessary until a vaccine can be developed.
Each week that passes more and more is learnt about the virus, stats form countries all round the world provide useful information regarding how it copes with heat or cold environments, which whether any race is more or less susceptible to it, does age make a difference, does social position make a difference all sorts of things are being learnt and will help to protect populations both now and in the future.
Cheers
Guy
PS as for Herd Immunity some advisers were hoping that herd immunity would build however as this is a new virus that could not be relied on as it was not known whether a person would produce antibodies to the virus and if they did how long the immunity would last would it be a couple of months a year or a lifetime. It is not even known now if a vaccination would need to be an annual thing like the flu vaccine or a lifetime thing like the pneumonia vaccine.
It is true some restrictions were delayed but that was not to promote herd immunity but because the government realised they cannot enforce a lockdown over a long period so they had to delay as long as possible before persuing that option
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People seem to be badmouthing herd immunity (this is the proportion of the population immune to a virus due to having protection derived from antibodies produced after an infection or vaccination, meaning that there is little chance of an unprotected person coming into contact with an infectious person and being infected by them.) but that is the only way such viruses are contained in the long term.
One very good example of this is measles, due to vaccination of children measles was practically wiped out in the UK and the World Health Organization declared the nation measles-free, the vaccinations gave the population herd immunity.
It is accepted that the British government tried a 'herd immunity' experiment initially, thus wasting a precious two months, before it was realised that the model they were relying on was based on viral pneumonia and not C-19. Additionally, the government allowed the races at Cheltenham to go ahead,where tens of thousands of people were in close proximity. I was reading a doctor's report this morning which suggested that the current surge in UK deaths is in large part due to people from all over the country being at Cheltenham races three weeks ago.
I agree that the only way to achieve herd immunity would be through vaccination; however, that's a long way off currently. And the fact that (as stated above) there are now indications of people who have recovered from C-19 subsequently testing positive for the virus is another reason why any plans for herd immunity are going to be somewhat challenging.
People are badmouthing the herd immunity plant that involves gaining herd immunity via infection rather than vaccination. Personally I would prefer a very strict testing and contact tracing system to reduce the pool of infection in the way countries like New Zealand have done. Then when there is a vaccine, and only then go for herd immunity.
The more specific reasons the herd immunity by infection route causes me concern are:
1) The level of infection required will cause a large number of deaths directly from COVID.
2) Allowing a large spike of cases fills the hospital beds completely (in any health system, look at New York) meaning not all the patients would be able to get the highest level of care increasing suffering and increasing the number of deaths as noted in point one.
3) A high infection rate will me a significant proportion of the workforce will be incapacitated at any one time making it harder for the health systems, supply logistics etc to cope and maintain supplies this will cause more suffering and could contribute to increase in deaths
4) overwhelming the hospitals impacts on the treatments of other illnesses meaning people will die at a higher rate from other illnesses due to lack of treatment
5) Last but not least. It has not been determined one way or another whether infection with Covid19 infers lasting immunity. This makes it a very risky strategy especially is it is common for older Corona viruses not to infer lasting immunity. A risky strategy a lot of pain for no gain.
In anticipation of replies, I am fully aware that many of the things above are happening but a lot of that is due to a herd immunity light strategy being followed. I strongly suspect that had we gone into lockdown earlier, tested more and done more contact tracing then things wouldn't be so bad.
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Question from a young friend: "Do you think it was something like this that did for the dinosaurs, and that's why they all died out?"
Me: "Quite possibly - but how will we ever know?"
Young friend: "Don't you think we ought to leave messages, just in case?"
Me: (after a pause) For who would we leave them?
Y.F: Martians?
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Question from a young friend: "Do you think it was something like this that did for the dinosaurs, and that's why they all died out?"
Me: "Quite possibly - but how will we ever know?"
Young friend: "Don't you think we ought to leave messages, just in case?"
Me: (after a pause) For who would we leave them?
Y.F: Martians?
Yes, that's it. By George, YF's got it, it's not the Chinese at all; it's the bloody Martians.
:)
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Well there's one thing obvious. There is little if any immunity to this virus, but had it been of extraterrestrial origin there would have been nothing, and literally none left to tell the story. So I suppose that's good news.
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.... and perhaps YF was right about what finished off the dinosaurs....?
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Redroger and jillruss --- this is a 'Hope for the Future' topic. I, for one am feeling very down at the moment -- and there will be many, many more people in a far worse position than I am.
Don't you agree that your comments may be more appropriate on a 'We are all Doomed' topic?
Please let us have a little light and brightness at this dreadful time.
Some would call that sticking your fingers in your ears and singing very loudly, Pennines. I don't see how you can have a grown up 'conversation' about the current pandemic without analysing both sides (good and bad).
I don't see this as a helpful comment especially when Pennines has openly said she is feeling very down at the moment. Some people want 'sugar and spice' and others want 'doom and gloom'. This thread was originally intended as a 'sugar and spice' for people that want and need it at this current time.
Rishile
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Question from a young friend: "Do you think it was something like this that did for the dinosaurs, and that's why they all died out?"
Me: "Quite possibly - but how will we ever know?"
Young friend: "Don't you think we ought to leave messages, just in case?"
Me: (after a pause) For who would we leave them?
Y.F: Martians?
Would the Martians be interested in genealogy? I'll leave my user names and various passwords on the notes for them.
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Difficult. What would be the equivalent to the Rosetta stone? Perhaps pictures would be the way to communicate.But, and here I show my optimistic side. Luckily this is not in itself an extinction level event, though to hear some comments from a head of state the consequences of his remarks might make it one.
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Hi Pennines,
I am sorry to read you have been feeling low. I hope you are feeling better or will do soon.
Thank you for the lovely poems you have posted :). I have been passing these on to friends and family who have are self isolating along with other uplifting cheering things I have come across on RootsChat. Yesterday, I got a reply from a lady at my Church who has never been out once since lockdown .. she wrote the the poem 'In the time of quiet' had literally brought tears to her eyes she had been so moved by it.
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Thank you so much River Tyne Lass. That was a very kind message.
I didn't compose the poems - I wish I could have done!! I agree the one 'In the time of quiet' is very moving - it sort of reminds me of the William Wordsworth one;
'What is this life if full of care
We have no time to stand and stare'.
There is certainly time now - and to watch the birds flying between the trees.
I'm not too keen on all the gnats in my back garden though!!
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Gnats and other little beasties are FEASTING off me, every time I venture into the garden! "All creatures great and small" it feels like, have fancied a nibble of my ankle, back of knee or side of head!
But it's so much nicer out there than inside... gulp....wonder if wine imbibed might seep through the pores and deter them? (Probably not!)
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Gnats and other little beasties are FEASTING off me, every time I venture into the garden! "All creatures great and small" it feels like, have fancied a nibble of my ankle, back of knee or side of head!
But it's so much nicer out there than inside... gulp....wonder if wine imbibed might seep through the pores and deter them? (Probably not!)
I feel for you, they seem drawn to me too, eat more garlic, that will keep them away ;)
Carol
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They bother me too. Skin so Soft helps to keep them away and Eurax helps to relieve the itch.
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Midgies (actual size) are a feature of this RBS polymer £5 note, if you can spot them you're a good yin! ;D
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-36111759
Skoosh.
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They've spotted me enough times
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Best treatment for insect bites [especially chiggers] - a drop of hot wax from a paraffin candle straight onto the bite. Be sure to use cheap, low melting point paraffin, like birthday cake candles.
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I use a suncream that contains insect repellent.
The time I had a holiday in Africa, I took vitamin B12 for at lest 2 weeks beforehand.
Both of these seem to work for me! ;)
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The hot wax sounds worse than the bite! Could end up dropping it in the wrong place ... often get bites at the back of my knee! Something like a pen with a pad at the end called "Afterbite" helps a little if you slap it straight on.
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Try it. The pain is very brief but the itching is controlled for hours.
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I have a really bad reaction to mosquito bites, they come up like a volcano with tiny blisters and the surrounding inflammation can be the size of the circumference of a teacup. The pharmacist told me that sun cream and insect bite cream which I always had with me, react badly to sunlight! I would take Birthday candles with me next time and give it a go as nothing can be worse than the night time itch caused by a mosquito bite when your body temperature rises :( A long time ago, a Cypriot lady told me use my own urine on a tissue...and yes it did work, but not for long.
Carol
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Might Aloe Vera Gel work? It's wonderful for burns and rashes. Just a thought.
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Might Aloe Vera Gel work? It's wonderful for burns and rashes. Just a thought.
Yes I've tried it, it's good for small insect bites and very cooling but it doesn't work as well on mosquito bites for me.
Carol
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Eurax cream definitely works to stop the severe itching. I'm like you, Carol, I get big swelings and blisters. Midges and horseflies (clegs) were wicked in the Highlands.
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One of the worst I ever got was from a wee pesky Scottish Midge, near my eye! It swelled up until I could barely see from that eye. Really put me off Scotland, sadly.
TY
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Insects make a meal of me and as a result I've tried all sorts of remedies. The one that I've found the best is Boots Dermacare Hydrocortisone 1% cream. You have to use it very sparingly because of the hydrocortisone content and can't use it near the eyes etc but I've found that it takes the heat and swelling out of bites in a very short time.
How did we get to this on a Hope for the Future thread? ???
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Roobarb -- I had wondered that also - but because I had banged on about the 'Hope for the Future' topic before - and got myself into trouble - I held back this time.
I think 'things' just morph into something else by a chance remark occasionally.
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Yes I'm sure you're right Pennines. I could find out but I'm too lazy to look back through.
Hoping for no insect bites in the future! ;)
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Just a quick reply -- I have been out clapping - but ringing 2 little bells. A neighbour told me they liked my bells!
It's the first time anyone has ever said that to me -- so that's hope for the future (especially at my age!
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Perhaps my hope for the future might be that all the little beasties decide they don't like my taste? Just got bitten by something else clearing some long grass....drat!
-But I do have a far tidier garden!
Perhaps I should hope to keep it that way in future? Instead of future eating out, and going away, going out and ...s-o-c-i-a-l-i-s-i-n-g??
TY
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Gnats and other little beasties are FEASTING off me, every time I venture into the garden! "All creatures great and small" it feels like, have fancied a nibble of my ankle, back of knee or side of head!
But it's so much nicer out there than inside... gulp....wonder if wine imbibed might seep through the pores and deter them? (Probably not!)
At least you have not got this ...
Coronavirus ... other rashes puzzle Doctors
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52493574
Two weeks! The Doc seem mystified by the rash 16th March, still terribly awfully itchy. Doc prescribed 2 tubes of cream to use, but only extremely sparingly on each spot due to the side effects.
It is like having my childhood illnesses all over again! Exhausting Chronic Bronchitis, followed by a continuous bout of Chicken Pox!
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Oh Bushinn - so sorry to hear about the problems you have been experiencing.
I do hope they are fully resolved soon.
Best wishes to you.
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Thanks Pennines
I'm going to plead to get another Doctor's appointment when they open, it really needs investigating / diagnosing properly, Mark
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Mark -- I am so pleased to hear that. Let's hope it gets sorted - first step - definitely get that appointment! ( I am being assertive!)
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Roobarb, how are you this am?
I have been drinking plenty, seems it is important to keep the body's fluid intake up.
Oh Pennines, I'll try again, but I was left with the impression that there is not an awful lot that can be done. I've already done my duty to report my earlier suspected illness and current rash to my G.P., back in mid-March. The G.P. passed it off as probable Influenza.
I have managed to find the official Spanish Report online that some with hospitalised Coronavirus have a rash, or are left with rash.
29 Apr 2020 · Summary Background Cutaneous manifestations of COVID‐19 disease are poorly characterized. Covid Piel Study (about 18Mb, photos at the end)
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/bjd.19163
Mine looks like Chicken Pox spots, with larger blotches and raised red swellings with multiple spots and not all are itchy at once now.
An American suggestion feels the rash was the body's immune system overreacting to fight the virus as it trys to attack organs.
When out for a daily walk it is obvious, we and everyone we come across are all distancing.
Take care and keep safe everyone, Mark
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I’ve only just seen this, as my immune system is being manipulated at the moment I know it can cause itchy skin and a rash, but stress alone can cause similar problems.
I have found that taking an anti allergy medication last thing at night can help a lot, if it works it’s unlikely you have the virus.
If you read up about dermatitis you see it comes in many varied forms, only to discover at the end that there is very little the experts can do about it ;D ;D
Mike
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Mike, I can assure you whatever it was, it was like Chronic Bronchitis last November, returning mid January and into February 2020.
I know what Chronic Bronchitis is like, as I had it as a child, the continuous coughing hurts the throat, hurts the brain and left me exhausted. The Family Doctor use to come twice daily (the good old days eh) to listen to my chest. In addition to Vapor rub (which helped a little), at night a burner giving off a vapor was lit, I hear now they are outlawed and my Mother would sit up with me until exhaustion from coughing set in and I fell asleep.
So I know what Chronic Bronchitis was like.
The varying itchy rash began about the third week in January 2020 as I have the Epaderm receipt, long before I really knew much about Coronavirus and two months before the UK lockdown.
Always a possibility I've had Chronic Bronchitis, as the Family Doctor said it would come back when I got older.
But the first time I recall with rashes, swellings, spots and attacking my leg muscles at the same time, so I got up and made myself walk in the house a bit and drank plenty of water. Also had a pain in the rear left of my brain, that and the aching leg muscles disappeared after two weeks.
Currently, I'm left with an odd varying rash and swellings, the pointed and small spotted rash must have clear fluid in it. Occasionally the fluid is released and the tip or spot scabs over. Other replacements sometimes appear in the same area.
Mark
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Mark, I'm better than I was yesterday thank you, I slept through last night without any problems coughing. Every year when I have my asthma review the nurse suggests that I try cutting down the number of puffs I take of my preventative inhaler. I did this successfully for about eight months, although if I'm having any problems I increase it again and depending on the severity I might increase it more. I told her I would reduce the morning dose as I didn't want to die during the night! I often have problems at this time of the year, although I don't suffer in the same debilitating way from hay fever as I did in my childhood and younger adulthood, I'm pretty sure it's the tree pollens that still get me in spring. I've upped my dosage again, will continue that for a while. My cough hasn't been like the hard cough associated with Covid, I also haven't been anywhere near anyone at all since St Patrick's day so am pretty sure it's my asthma.
The problem with my stomach is improving, just a bit tender today.
I sympathise about the bronchitis, I used to get it every year when I was a child, my mother used to know when I had it, she said she could smell it. I could taste it.
Your ongoing illness sounds dreadful, I hope you manage to get rid of the rash soon, you have my sympathy.
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Hello Roobarb and All
I'm sorry the pollen is affecting you and others. I'm lucky and don't have Asthma.
Hope your stomach quickly gets better.
All of my worse symptons have gone, hopefully! :)
Mark :)
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Thank you Mark, here's to good health in the future for all. :)