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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Spidermonkey on Monday 06 April 20 14:22 BST (UK)
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Now, I know how much everyone enjoys searching for mock Tudor houses...........
Here are two views of a house under construction. My first instinct would be to say some where commuter-belt(ish) so maybe Surrey or Kent???
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That's a jolly nice pile. :) That'll do me, hubby and woofer quite nicely. ;D
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Is that the sea in the background of the second picture?
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I don't think so - I think it is fields.
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I don't think so - I think it is fields.
It looks like fields in the top picture, and then from another angle for the bottom picture it seems more level and therefore like the sea? But who knows ;)
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Very impressive - lovely house.
I can't spot any identifiable features in the landscape unfortunately.
It has an odd feel about it - all alone in what looks like the middle of nowhere.
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Don't laugh, but I was wondering whether it might be a golf club house or similar (think Lytham St Annes golf course https://www.visitlancashire.com/things-to-do/royal-lytham-and-st-annes-golf-club-p8149 )
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maybe Surrey or Kent???
I think we can take out Surrey so perhaps Kent or Essex?
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What about Cornwall or Devon, perhaps it is now a hotel or maybe even then.
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Don't forget to keep an eye open for WAI 19 when looking for this one ;D
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=719240.msg5630128#msg5630128
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Don't laugh, but I was wondering whether it might be a golf club house or similar (think Lytham St Annes golf course https://www.visitlancashire.com/things-to-do/royal-lytham-and-st-annes-golf-club-p8149 )
I was wondering about a golf club house too, or a hotel. (But I haven't had any ideas yet, bright or otherwise.)
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We can do mock tudor in NI too! This is Sandown Park in Belfast, c1910. It was divided into 4 villas. (My great grandfather lived in one, and his mother-in-law lived in another.)
In the foreground is a railway stop. All completely surrounded by houses now of course. The railway line is a greenway.
Spidermonkey’s one might be divided up too. Or do we think it’s all one house?
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My feeling was that it's all one house/hotel/clubhouse etc. If someone was building a house on that scale in the middle of a field (apparently), I think it's very unlikely that it would be either semi-detached or so close to its neighbour that you can't see the gap between them.
But that's when it was built - for all we know it might now be surrounded by a modern estate of little boxes and divided into flats.
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My first thought was it was a golf club house so I’m now going round all the Southport area Golf Clubs looking at op photos of their gold clubs. I’ve ruled out Hesketh Golf Club I think.
No success so far.
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It does look like some kind of Country Club but a search hasn't thrown up anything yet.
Carol
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Saw pictures and thought - large mock-Tudor pub. Then did a google image search and lots of similar buildings, which could be anywhere in the country.
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And whilst you are looking at golf clubhouses, keep WAI #12 in mind too............
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=717629.0
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... and a mock-Tudor pavilion in a park:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=764229.0
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One of the things I considered - due to the isolation of it - that it may be an Asylum etc
Looking at some hospitals I see Ellerbeck Fever Hospital Workington has an adjunct building in Tudor style. I dont think it is as I can only source one long shot picture .
So instead of golf club maybe hospital/asylum?
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So instead of golf club maybe hospital/asylum?
I notice that in the first of the two photos the windows on the lower floor seem quite high up
However, the very dramatic bay window in the lower photo is to a lower area - grand entrance hall? - as it seems to me to be adjacent to a main entrance with a sloping canopy type roof over it, supported by pillars. The fact that the roadway seems to lead to this would suggest it is the main entrance.
On the other hand, the first photo also shows another major entrance with crenellated top.
Whatever it is, it's a very dramatic building with considerable pretensions to grandeur!
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The dry stone wall might be a clue to which part of the country it's in.
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Another thing to consider, which has been mentioned in previous threads like this, the building may have been renovated in more recent times and possibly had it's timbers removed.
It could look quite different now, if it still stands :-\
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It does have the look of an institution of some sort rather than a private house or hotel. There appears to be a chapel window behind the crenellated doorway. School, religious institution or college perhaps?
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Would I be right in saying the dorner window on the far left of the first photo is the same dormer window just about visible at the far left of the second photo?
If so, that flat landscape in the background is very extensive ... so my guess would be sea rather than fields.
Also, does anyone know what the pole is near the left side of the house on the first photo. It seems to have bend at the top and two dangly bits...? :-[
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I think you are right Gilby, it does appear to be the same dormer window on the far left of both photographs. I’ve also been wondering what the bent pole with the two dangly bits is.
The whole building seems a very strange mix of styles. Not sure about the gothic style bay window along with the Mock Tudor gables, and the columns under the cat slide porch roof! Is it a ‘new build’ or a ‘makeover’ with a huge extension at the back, hence the strange architectural style?
I think the photographs were taken around 1920’s to 1930’s but I may be completely wrong.
My first impression is that it’s close to the sea. There are numerous rooms in the eaves, possibly for staff or students?
I am thinking along similar lines to Janan that it could be a religious institution of some sort due to the chapel style windows and for some reason the gothic bay window (but when I look again I also think it could be an hotel ). ???
PS I have just looked at the first photograph again and have come to the conclusion it’s a ‘Toby Carvery’ ;D
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I do agree with Gilby that the end of the house with the 'herringbone' black and white decorated top is shown in both photos - so that the photographer for the second shot is standing to the far right of the first shot, just beyond the fence posts. They are at the far right of the first shot and in the foreground of the second.
If that makes any sense, I've had to draw a diagram of it to make it clear to myself!
I also think that the horizon in the second shot is the sea - it looks more level than fields would be.
And in the first shot, looking to the left of the mansion, towards the horizon, is that a road or a river?
In terms of the 'thing' with the curly top in the first picture is that a tall lamp post?
There are some deep shadows in both pictures - could someone deduce which direction the house is facing?
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I realised that the part of the building in the far right in picture 1 was the same gable end closest to the photographer in picture 2 - the shape of the 'attachments' under the window and the poles apparently propping it up appear in both.
I also believe it is the sea in the background. I am inclined to think that on the right in picture 2 there are the tops of roofs of other houses which are in effect below the skyline and down the slope.
And is that the outline of another porch/portico that can be seen on the far right in picture 2? Would it in effect be opposite the one shown in picture 1?
I don't think it is big enough for an asylum or a hotel. It does look to be out in what appears to be the middle of no-where. Hotels in that sort of position might well need to be larger to attract the paying guest, especially if not on a main road or near a railway station.
The sun is casting some good shadows so I think the photographer is facing in a generally northerly direction. And I think this is an almost finished new building.
Only other observation is that there are no trees or shrubbery visible.
Having said all that, when it is found, less than 1% could be correct ;) ;D
Nell
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For what they are worth some observations and gut feelings.
Late Victorian/Arts and Crafts, but cannot see clearly if bargeboards are decorated
Decorated chimney stacks
Seaside (clifftop) villa for local VIP?
Possibly Cornwall?
Otherwise I haven't a clue! :-\
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The sun is casting some good shadows so I think the photographer is facing in a generally northerly direction.
I broadly agree with this, although the angle of the sun is quite low - see the shadow of the porch in the middle of the first picture (LMP 0032a.jpg).
So it could be early morning looking generally westwards, or late in the day eastwards, or if it's winter then as you say, northwards. One thing that we can be fairly sure of, I think, is that we're not facing southwards. (Assuming we're in the northern hemisphere, that is.....)
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The sun is casting some good shadows so I think the photographer is facing in a generally northerly direction.
I broadly agree with this, although the angle of the sun is quite low - see the shadow of the porch in the middle of the first picture (LMP 0032a.jpg).
So it could be early morning looking generally westwards, or late in the day eastwards, or if it's winter then as you say, northwards. One thing that we can be fairly sure of, I think, is that we're not facing southwards. (Assuming we're in the northern hemisphere, that is.....)
Oh Arthur.... :(
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Hello everybody - Ive been a member for many years now and have posted occasionally - but I suddenly find myself with a lot of time on my hands - how did that happen....
Anyway I have worked in architecture and building and have been really intrigued by these pictures.
My thoughts won't help to locate but may give others some clues to pursue.
I think we are looking at a major extension to an originally fairly large building - probably Victorian in origin. There are so many differences in style as shown in the attached pics that lead me to believe that the original building was a C shape with a large verandah entrance between two wings.
The original building had no timbering at first floor while the presumed "extension" has extensive timbering (Mock Tudor) which might place it as Edwardian. Also the roof lines are totally wrong if this was a one off build.
I think they were changing the frontage to be the large porticoed entrance shown in the top pic which meant creating a more sweeping drive into that facade of he building.
This original building fronted on to a "road" which at that time was unmade but you can see evidence of a road edge running across the original "frontage".
I don't think it was in "the middle of nowhere" as you can see evidence of a large shadow to the left, which I think can only be another building, and evidence of roof lines to the right.
In the bottom pic you can also see evidence of a pole and cables which are running parallel to the road which would indicate that this is not a remote location.
I've also shown the approximate angle of sun on both pics.
I am in the process of drawing a sketch plan of what we can see and will update in due course.
Meanwhile feel free to disagree or debate ......
Stay safe
DB
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Excellent observations DB :)
After reading your comments I took a closer look and noticed the chimney stacks are a different design on the "original" building to the "extension".
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With their interest in the medieval, could the Victorians not have built a dwelling intentionally encompassing various styles of architecture? I do understand what you are saying though.
I think one reason this looks like a new build is because there appear to be no gardens whatsoever and you might expect an exisiting house to have something.
I agree that it is a bit of a mishmash and I originally did consider it might be being renovated, but I really am not sure.
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Thanks Jool - there are so many differences it just feels, intuitively, that these are two different parts of the buildings history.
Hi Ruskie, I just feel that the differences are so stark that it is two different developments. I understand what you say but if they were melding different styles it would be a bit more subtle than what we can see.
Also I agree with your point about garden/landscaping, that is something I can't understand because there is no evidence of any kind of landscaping in either picture.
DB
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Great post, DB10.
It is a most strange house, and I've had a bit of a struggle trying to work out its plan.
I agree about the 'original' house and the huge extensions.
Looking at picture 1, what do you think about the long, high roofline with the dormer windows (as indicated on my shot), as well as the 'tower' structure which looks almost like a church tower, together with the vertical window adjacent to it - which also have a church window type appearance. Or are windows on a staircase?
You can just see the top of the long high roofline in picture 1, and also, just beyond the bay window of the new section, do you think there is another 'tower' like structure over the entrance canopy?
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Though this isn't it, the whole set up reminds me of this Cornwall mansion
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Thank you DB10 - well made points
As I completely missed those houses in the background - can we glean any information on what seems to be the dominant white colours of those dwellings?
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DB10 - thank you for all the points you make, but for me they raise a few questions:
I think we are looking at a major extension to an originally fairly large building - probably Victorian in origin. There are so many differences in style as shown in the attached pics that lead me to believe that the original building was a C shape with a large verandah entrance between two wings.
The original building had no timbering at first floor while the presumed "extension" has extensive timbering (Mock Tudor) which might place it as Edwardian. Also the roof lines are totally wrong if this was a one off build.
I think they were changing the frontage to be the large porticoed entrance shown in the top pic which meant creating a more sweeping drive into that facade of he building.
This original building fronted on to a "road" which at that time was unmade but you can see evidence of a road edge running across the original "frontage".
I see what you mean about changing the frontage, but if the original entrance (under the verandah) was facing the road, is it likely that when creating an even grander house they would move the main entrance round the side, where it couldn't be seen from the road?
I also take your point about the mixture of styles, but wasn't there sometimes a tendency (Arts and Crafts movement???) to build things to look as though they'd grown organically over time, even though this wasn't the case?
I don't think it was in "the middle of nowhere" as you can see evidence of a large shadow to the left, which I think can only be another building, and evidence of roof lines to the right.
In the bottom pic you can also see evidence of a pole and cables which are running parallel to the road which would indicate that this is not a remote location.
I'm not sure about the shadow, as I would then expect to see some evidence of the other building in the first picture, which is taken from a bit further away. It would also, I think, mean that the new portico entrance would be facing this other building rather than the road - a bit unlikely?
Thank you for pointing out the other buildings in the distance on the right. The picture I'm now getting is of (possibly) a house on rising ground, perhaps overlooking an estuary or flood plain, with other houses lower down and a rough road leading up to it.
But that still doesn't explain to me why they might move the main entrance to face away from the road - unless perhaps the opposite side of the road was about to be developed and there was still a good outlook to the side.
Further thoughts on this (and your site plan!) would be most welcome.
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Adding to what has said and combining with my own theory of this being a school or college:
This might be a private Victorian villa being extended to form a school/college
The front half might remain as the principals dwelling house
The new crenellated portico would be the entrance to the school/college
The church tower and window is the new school/college
The absence of any previous garden can be explained by the extensive building works
There may be some terraced gardens on the sloping side of the building (right of the original frontage) that we can't see
None of these thoughts are terribly helpful in locating the building ;D
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I can see what some of you mean about houses off to the right in the second picture, but I'm not convinced. I still think it's building material. Possibly a long pile of bricks or timbers, with packs/chunks of something pale/white (insulation) stacked on top in a number of places.
The perspective feels wrong for it to be houses down the side of a hill.
But that's just my 2 penn'th... :P
It is weird that there is absolutely nothing in the way of plants, shrubs or trees. The grassy area is, however, cropped, which makes me think it is either an animal field or the location is so exposed to the (coastal) weather that nothing really grows. (I'm thinking exposed clifftop location.)
Hmmm... ???
Eastery greetings,
Karen
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Hi all, sorry have been in the garden all afternoon - isolating of course ....
Loving the debate that has been going on.
First let me say I'm having trouble with my drawing programmes as I don't have access to my usual software so cant produce a legible plan at the moment but I am working on it - watch this space.
Authurk - I was intrigued by your comments about changing the frontage and took a more careful look at the side elevation. As you rightly point out why would you change the main frontage away from the road - if we agree that is what it is. So having looked in more detail at the side elevation I am now moving towards this being two separate buildings.
I think you can see separation between the front (original) building, which has extensions built on, and the "new" build to the rear of that.
The "chapel" which appears to be between the two is really interesting as I think you can see separation between that and the "new" build.
So maybe we have an original building being extended and a new build to the back not directly connected to the original.
In between the two there appears to be "the chapel" as suggested by IgorStrav which now seems to me to be the most important issue to resolve. Why would you have a chapel in a private home.
Janan suggests a school/college but might I might muddy the water a bit more and throw into the ring - Monastery/Nunnery??
Any way as I say loving the debate - even if we never find the location - and I will work with the software I have and (eventually) produce some graphics for further discussion.
Stay safe
DB10
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I think DB has made excellent suggestions concerning the building, and I agree that there is probably another building in the distance, possibly a large one like the main subject. I would think that the setting has the sea on one side and a river/estuary on the other (directly behind the photographer in bith photos), so we are looking at a seaside development of large properties for the wealthy. Perhaps the ground is so bare because it was previously grazing land (sheep/cattle) but I'm always amazed by some older pictures which show how free of trees and shrub many areas were, compare with today.
I don't get the feel of an institution at all - I feel it could be a speculative development, which perhaps a customer who didn't like this particular property as it was, asked for changes and extensions in a mock Tudor style, whereas the original was plainer. No idea on area at all.
Steve
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The house is gaining an extra lower floor - look at the far left in picture 1. There is another set of windows below the level of those on the right. So the main house is on an area of ground that appears to be higher than its surroundings.
The 'stuff' on the right hand side which might or might not be buildings or building supplies. I'm not sure that when this house was being built/extended that they thought to put insulation in and if they did, did it come packed as we might be used to seeing today? ???
I can understand the line of thinking about it being an extension - strange roof-lines and the square tower perhaps indicating old plus new. But looking at other Arts & Craft movement houses, square towers and differing styles of windows and roof-lines do happen even in houses built in one go. Take a look at Standen House (granted all the chimneys there appear to be same design) or the Red House. Both have towers, lots of different styles of windows.
Spidermonkey - any clues about the age of the photo?
Nell
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Actually Spidermonkey Little Nell makes a great point about the original photos - any chance of higher res images - that would make it much easier to differentiate the fine detail which we are all talking about.......
Agreed Little Nell the Victorian/Edwardian builders did not understand the need for insulation - anywhere.
DB10
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The 'stuff' on the right hand side which might or might not be buildings or building supplies. I'm not sure that when this house was being built/extended that they thought to put insulation in and if they did, did it come packed as we might be used to seeing today? ???
Nell
I didn't mean blocks of Ytong or packs of polystyrene boards. ;)
(Unless, of course, Spidermonkey has deliverately "aged" a new photo and we are looking at piles of modern building materials. ;D ;))
In the 2nd picture, there are definitely big, angular stacks/blocks/packs of something very pale in colour, piled up in front of the entrance. What might that be? ???
I keep looking at the dark, angular area there, too. What could possibly appear to be a roof/roofs further away and downhill is, I think, something in front of the entrance. I was wondering whether it was simply a long, neat pile of bricks.
Also (maybe DB10 can answer this one), why are there supports propping up the ground-floor window in the 2nd photo? OK, I'm not a builder, but I've seen enough windows being replaced in my time and I was wondering why the window would need support from outside. ???
I would also love to know what the white areas are under that window. Signs? The builder's details?
The tower/chapel continues to interest me, too. Can anyone see (better than I can) whether the arch-topped window to the right of the tower in Pic. 1 actually has a stepped form, or is there a crenelated wall in front of it? It the window does have that form, it would be rather unusual.
Following on from DB's extremely interesting comments, I found this property on the Internet:
http://www.wightagents.co.uk/property/print.aspx?pics=true&id=48996
I wondered whether our mystery building started off more along those lines..?
Ponder, ponder...
Karen
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Arthurk - I was intrigued by your comments about changing the frontage and took a more careful look at the side elevation. As you rightly point out why would you change the main frontage away from the road - if we agree that is what it is. So having looked in more detail at the side elevation I am now moving towards this being two separate buildings.
I think you can see separation between the front (original) building, which has extensions built on, and the "new" build to the rear of that.
The "chapel" which appears to be between the two is really interesting as I think you can see separation between that and the "new" build.
So maybe we have an original building being extended and a new build to the back not directly connected to the original.
On giving it a bit more thought, since it seems to be an area still under development, might it be that the house was originally up a rough road, facing one way, then it was decided to lay out new roads on a different alignment, so they wanted to turn the house round, as it were, so as to front the new road?
As for a new build, as I think I suggested before, if you owned a house/plot on that scale and wanted to split it and build another one, would you have it built so close that you can barely see the join? Wouldn't you be more likely to want a decent gap between them?
This makes me wonder if they are joined in some way - and presumably it would be easier to build an almost separate wing with a small joining corridor than to take down all of the rear wall of the original and build the extension on to the whole width.
As for the reason? Maybe a small private school that was adding a boarding house? A monastery or similar, as DB10 suggested, that was adding a retreat house for visitors? A nursing home that was expanding - or a private house being converted to a nursing home? There are quite a lot of possibilities.
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The tower/chapel continues to interest me, too. Can anyone see (better than I can) whether the arch-topped window to the right of the tower in Pic. 1 actually has a stepped form, or is there a crenelated wall in front of it? It the window does have that form, it would be rather unusual.
Karen, to answer one of your questions, the window to the right of the tower is arched at the top and stepped at the bottom. I think it may be windows on a stairway.
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Hi Karen
"Also (maybe DB10 can answer this one), why are there supports propping up the ground-floor window in the 2nd photo? OK, I'm not a builder, but I've seen enough windows being replaced in my time and I was wondering why the window would need support from outside. ???"
Well I think they were using precast/premade elements which had become very common by Victorian times (just take a look at some Victorian terraces near you and see how common the details are) but they were very heavy so needed props to keep them stable whilst the mortar set.
You can also see props being used to support the arched lintel over the new entrance to the "new" build.
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So I haven't been able to access any proper drawing software so I've gone old school and actually sketched some plans - takes me back!!
Please accept these as my interpretation and totally open to debate.
DB10
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And another
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Lovely plans - thank you!
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Having another close look, I've changed my mind about there being other buildings on the right hand side of photo 2. I now think it is the start of landscaping a garden in front of the entrance/doors from a drawing room (?). The long darker structure is a wall with crenellated (?) steps leading down to a lower part of the garden - they show as being very light as in the sun, whilst the wall is in shadow.
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Thanks Arthurk takes me back to my "apprentice" days - lost some of the old skills but technology doesn't always cut it!
So anybody any further thoughts on the old/new theories?
I would really like to see some higher res images - although the ones posted are 300 dpi they are very small which means that when you zoom in they are really pixelated. I think a more detailed image would give up so much more information.
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Great sketches and all-round contribution DB10! I was very taken with one of your first mark-ups showing the C-shaped part of the building and I agree it looks like the original core which has been added to. I take others' point though that it could be a deliberate mish-mash design of different styles.
I'm not convinced about the roof in the bottom right of the 2nd photo - I think if it wasn't for the triangular shape there we wouldn't be seeing houses at all.
I'm also not convinced that there is a gap between the building(s). I may be seeing this wrong, but I thought the entrance porch in the first picture was angled across the right angle between the two wings in such a way as to join them both?
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Fabulous drawings DB10. They have more character than anything produced using software. :)
I am still not sure what is going on in the photo, so am hoping for some higher res images.
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after using photo converting on my heritage
what i see in the 2nd photo is a house in a coastal area
above possibly a fishing port, buildings lower on the right,
and the house itself possibly under renovation,
on the far right corner of the house there looks to
be what could be scaffolding.
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That is an improvement Raonull4. :)
Presumably using that programme with a better scan will bring out even more detail?
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That's interesting - those "buildings" off to the right now look to me more like a retaining wall for the front garden. And I think I can see steps leading up towards the front door.
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can you also see a ladder left of front entrance,
telegraph pole, and a bent over street lamp,
also to the left of photo the pole with triangular base
that looks familar to me why i don t yet know,
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That's interesting - those "buildings" off to the right now look to me more like a retaining wall for the front garden. And I think I can see steps leading up towards the front door.
As I posted yesterday
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That's interesting - those "buildings" off to the right now look to me more like a retaining wall for the front garden. And I think I can see steps leading up towards the front door.
As I posted yesterday
So you did - sorry for not acknowledging that.
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At the very very extreme left edge of the original photo 2, and the recolourised version, on the horizon on what may be the sea, can anyone else see a white shape? Is that cliffs in the distance?
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In addition, I've been looking again at the lamp posts - the best image seems to be in original photo 1.
It has a characteristic semi-circle top, with what appear to be two lights, but these come from a single source (rather than the double-headed lights I've seen on google which generally seem to have two semi-circular supports).
And there are two cross pieces on the vertical?
I've been looking at Edwardian/Victorian street light images, but can't see anything similar so far.
In the recolourised version, you can see another lamp post but not the lights at the top of it?
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At the very very extreme left edge of the original photo 2, and the recolourised version, on the horizon on what may be the sea, can anyone else see a white shape? Is that cliffs in the distance?
Yes Igor, I can see it now that you have pointed it out. It could be cliffs partly shadowed if it is sea, or a white building if it's land :-\
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a closer look
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actually i have now changed my opion
completely,
i think this is test of our sanity
devised by spidermonkey
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can you also see a ladder left of front entrance,
telegraph pole, and a bent over street lamp,
also to the left of photo the pole with triangular base
that looks familar to me why i don t yet know,
This reminds me of the poles and supports for wiring for temporary electricity when houses are being constructed - these days the supports are plastic. I don't know if that would have been the case when this house was being built or renovated.
In raonull4's reply at #64 - if you look just to the left of the red box drawn to show the roof line - you can see a red (in the colourised version) rectangular shape - might that be a stack of bricks? It is possible that I think it looks like bricks because the colour is similar to the bricks of the house. :)
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In addition, I've been looking again at the lamp posts - the best image seems to be in original photo 1.
It has a characteristic semi-circle top, with what appear to be two lights, but these come from a single source (rather than the double-headed lights I've seen on google which generally seem to have two semi-circular supports).
And there are two cross pieces on the vertical?
I've been looking at Edwardian/Victorian street light images, but can't see anything similar so far.
In the recolourised version, you can see another lamp post but not the lights at the top of it?
Hi Igorstrav
I think the post you refer to in the recolorised version is a telegraph pole - if you look very closely you can just about see what appears to be a cable running from left to right, and parallel with the road, terminating at the top of the pole. It also appears to be forming a catenary curve which is what you would expect a suspended cable to do. So if it is might help in dating.
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Here's some examples
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hi DB10
and yes i hae seen many of those poles,
the one i refer to as a telegraph pole
not the grey oblong on it if i m correct
that that would contain a number for
the pole as does the old wooden pole in our back garden
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the area next to my square you mention
if you look closer at the bottom
it appears on blocks or something
keeping it of the ground,
and behind that is what looks
like other stacks of materials,
this is what leads me to believe
its a property under renovation
ladders left of entrance
scaffolding at right back corner,
there is one more thing but this is
a pure guess close to the front
supported window is dark mound
could that be stacked turf.
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That's interesting - those "buildings" off to the right now look to me more like a retaining wall for the front garden. And I think I can see steps leading up towards the front door.
As I posted yesterday
So you did - sorry for not acknowledging that.
Sorry if I sounded abrupt Arthur, I was in a hurry. I really think that there is a 'patio' being constructed above a future main garden down below. Unfortunately the colourised photo hides the fact of the retaining wall being all on the same level - and level with the brickwork line on the house. The lighter piles are surely stone for the decorative features around the doors and windows - you can clearly see bricks elsewhere. If this is an older building being added to, or renovated it's add that it shows no sign of ageing at all. It looks as new and fresh as the other side. None of which helps our dilemma.
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It's not the house we are looking for but the entrance on photo no. 1 looks very much like Compton Wynyates
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01pbf/
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It's not the house we are looking for but the entrance on photo no. 1 looks very much like Compton Wynyates
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01pbf/
Well, it certainly seems very much inspired by it ;)
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Spidermonkey's gone a bit quiet... ???
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I know this isn't quite right but this building has quite a bit in common - although smaller.
This was a pub, built in the 1930s.
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I found this rather lovely website the other day:
https://www.downtothecoast.co.uk/downloads/dttc-fine-mansions-fair-villas-east-wight.pdf
I have only been to the IOW once, and that was many moons ago. Looking at the linked website, I was fascinated to see how many beautiful old buildings there are /were on the island. Also interesting is that Queen Victoria owned lots of properties there.
The website mentions that many lodges/villas were considerably extended years after being built.
There are lots of buildings on the IOW which are very similar to "our" building(s) here (see e.g. Berwick Lodge on Page 8 - with an extension, it would look very similar to "our" place). I'm not saying that it must be on the IOW, but it is a possibility - especially if it is indeed a clifftop location (See e.g. Page 7 on the website).
However...what is also mentioned in the website is that many of the grand buildings on the clifftops no longer exist, as they have fallen prey to landslip... :( It could be that "our" building disappeared seawards a long time ago...
Best regards,
Karen
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Spidermonkey's gone a bit quiet... ???
Sorry - I am here, but spent most of the Easter weekend digging a veg bed and planting potatoes. Am now broken, but back here.
Will catch up with what I have missed.......
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OK - so people want better scans. I'll see what I can do -do you want both pictures done again?
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Hi Spidermonkey
Both would be great please. :) :) 8)
Also do you have any idea of general location ie. are they british or from some other part of the world?
Cheers
DB10
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I'm afraid I have no idea - most of my photos come from 'job lots' at our local auction house, so tend to be a shoe box full of random things!!
I have rescanned one of the photos, so that it is now scanned at 1200 dpi. However, I've had to reduce the size of it considerably so that it fits within the 500kb limit.
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And the other picture.
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Thanks Spidermonkey can begin to see more detail now - particularly on first view definitely houses in the distance :)
Still working on it!!
DB10
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i m beginning to form the opinion
both house's are in a locality close to
each other both coastal and ground elevation
similar
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Just in case there are any further clues in the surrounding landscape, would you be able to provide some more high-res scans, please? What I'm thinking is selective scans (crops) of the areas to the sides of the house, in both photos.
If you take the 1200dpi ones you've already done, but instead of reducing the whole of the image to the size needed here, just crop to those areas, we'd hopefully get a larger and even clearer picture of the surroundings. Each of those should be within the size limits.
Thanks.
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Will do.
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Next crops
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And more
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Thanks, Spidermonkey!
I'm still examining the scans, but what I already find interesting is that in the last of the new scans, it looks as though the wall is being clad.
Does anyone know when dampcoursing started to be used?
Thanks,
Karen
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close up 3a pallets stacked
so how long a go suggests the use of fork lifts
or perhaps unloaded using a crane or excavator
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Those closeups show a lot more detail thanks Spidermonkey. :)
It doesn't help in any way but there is an absence of human life in the photos apart from the photographer of course.
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I don't know how accurate this is:
http://en.lcn-pal.com/wooden-pallets/Articles/The-history-and-the-evolution-of-wood-pallets.aspx
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And the other side of the building in close up
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Two more
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Trying to get the houses (?) in the distance to be a bit clearer.
I also wonder if there is a builder's sign to the front of the main house.....
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I don't know how accurate this is:
http://en.lcn-pal.com/wooden-pallets/Articles/The-history-and-the-evolution-of-wood-pallets.aspx
This is one of the things that I love about these threads - suddenly finding out bits of 'useful' information about subjects that you never thought you would need to know about!!!
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This is one of the things that I love about these threads - suddenly finding out bits of 'useful' information about subjects that you never thought you would need to know about!!!
;D ;D ;D
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At the very very extreme left edge of the original photo 2, and the recolourised version, on the horizon on what may be the sea, can anyone else see a white shape? Is that cliffs in the distance?
Yes Igor, I can see it now that you have pointed it out. It could be cliffs partly shadowed if it is sea, or a white building if it's land :-\
Just to clarify - with the new scans it looks as if this object has now vanished.
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Trying to get the houses (?) in the distance to be a bit clearer.
I also wonder if there is a builder's sign to the front of the main house.....
good point have you bought a job lot of photos that belonged to a builder
any clues in other photos
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At the very very extreme left edge of the original photo 2, and the recolourised version, on the horizon on what may be the sea, can anyone else see a white shape? Is that cliffs in the distance?
Yes Igor, I can see it now that you have pointed it out. It could be cliffs partly shadowed if it is sea, or a white building if it's land :-\
Just to clarify - with the new scans it looks as if this object has now vanished.
Igor, I can just about see it in Spidermonkey's post #92 but I have to move back a bit from my screen to spot it. I still can't make out what it is ???
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Thanks for the extra photos, Spidermonkey.
They help a lot, though I'm still unsure whether what's off to the right is more houses or a retaining wall and piles of building materials. And actually, apart from that, the surrounding area seems rather featureless - though if nothing else, I suppose that might possibly suggest a coastal/estuary setting.
(I'm not really seeing cliffs, assuming I'm looking in the right place. What I think might have been taken for cliffs, I would put down to fading or discolouration of the print.)
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As mentioned by Gilby earlier, that entrance porch is at an angle from the adjoining wall. This detail will show up on Ordnance Survey 25-inch plans. The Isle of Wight has been suggested as a possible location, so maybe the search should start there. With that elaborate street lamp-post, I'd guess the location must be near a town.
Aerial photos, which cover the entire country from WW2 onwards, will also show it, but, unlike the OS plans, I don't think they are accessible on line.
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Just to try and help with location finding I was thinking about the orientation of the buildings.
Looking at the length and angle of the shadows the sun is obviously at a relatively low point - either setting or rising.
Also if the part of the building with the tower is a "chapel/church" then it would be orientated east - west, which would tie in with the angle of sun.
So depending on which end the tower is would give an accurate compass point however at this stage all I would suggest is that we should be looking for a building which has it original frontage (facing the road) pointing north or south.
Not sure that helps an awful lot but it should eliminate any buildings not orientated that way!!
Feel free to disagree ...... 8) 8)
DB10
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Just to try and help with location finding I was thinking about the orientation of the buildings.
Looking at the length and angle of the shadows the sun is obviously at a relatively low point - either setting or rising.
Also if the part of the building with the tower is a "chapel/church" then it would be orientated east - west, which would tie in with the angle of sun.
So depending on which end the tower is would give an accurate compass point however at this stage all I would suggest is that we should be looking for a building which has it original frontage (facing the road) pointing north or south.
Not sure that helps an awful lot but it should eliminate any buildings not orientated that way!!
Feel free to disagree ...... 8) 8)
DB10
So the coastline would be pointing roughly north - south, pretty much ruling out most of the south coast of England, north or south coast of Wales and of the Isle of Wight. Should be easy to locate now ;D
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HaHa - but it could be on an estuary so really doesn't exclude much of the UK coastline!! If indeed it is in the UK ;D ;D
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i m running out of airmiles searching for them HELP
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This ISN'T it https://www.christinsley.co.uk/properties/12499268/sales but I wonder if this is the sort of setting that people are thinking of.
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Yes Spidermonkey that is the sort of setting I'm thinking of, although with the house on a hill.
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Spidermonkey, your hunch about this photograph being a golf club house was correct. The location is a bit of a surprise though :o. Mar Del Plata Golf Club, Argentina!
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01qsk/
There are quite a few articles on the internet if anyone is interested.
Trish
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Wow! Well done Trish! How on earth did you end up finding that one?????
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It was just a fluke really. Unfortunately (for me), I have a photographic memory as far as images are concerned and when I saw the golf club on the website I knew I had seen the same image in black and white.
I didn’t imagine in a million years it would be in Argentina as it looks so British but that may be explained by the fact that the British railway executives played golf in that location.
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Wow Trish!!! I can't believe you found it, and you weren't even looking for it ;D. Well done.
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Hi Jool, just need to erase that image from my memory bank now….no doubt another one will replace it before too long ::)
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Keep going Trish, there are still plenty of mystery buildings on Rootschat to find. You really are good at this :)
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I have attached a link with some interesting photographs taken around 1924 when the building of the golf club house was taking place. You will need to scroll through the first 22 photographs to arrive at the relevant ones. Hopefully I have managed to master Google translate to show the narratives in English rather than Spanish
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01qsl/
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You are amazing Trish!!!!!! ;D
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Wow!! Woke up early to watch the Olympics but this find was more impressive!! ;D
Kay
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Trish, you have amazing powers. ;D
Thank you so much. I have often returned to this one and mused over it. Who would have thought it could be Argentina?!
I love this website. :-*
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Blimey!!!
What a terrific find, Trish - thank you so much for posting.
When I saw the title of the thread on my notification I immediately remembered the image, and our joint frustration, but I wouldn't have associated the Argentine website photo with it.
How amazing to have that Tudor style of building in South America, but as you say there are considerable links with Europe.
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What a great find.
I was quite convinced it was in North Norfolk :-X
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Trish, that's amazing - very well done! :) :) :) 8) 8) 8)
Bonus point for all those who thought it looked coastal - and looking back through all the posts, I see one of my slightly despairing comments contained a grain of truth:
The sun is casting some good shadows so I think the photographer is facing in a generally northerly direction.
I broadly agree with this, although the angle of the sun is quite low - see the shadow of the porch in the middle of the first picture (LMP 0032a.jpg).
So it could be early morning looking generally westwards, or late in the day eastwards, or if it's winter then as you say, northwards. One thing that we can be fairly sure of, I think, is that we're not facing southwards. (Assuming we're in the northern hemisphere, that is.....)
Oh Arthur.... :(
;D ;D ;D ::) ::) ::)
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Well done, Trish.
I don't suppose you could use your super powers to find No 12? ;D
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Oh Jan, if only :( it seems my powers are only mediocre even though the image of No.12 is burnt on my brain. That particular mystery has driven many of us to distraction ;)