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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Tipperary => Topic started by: JessicaSarah14 on Monday 18 May 20 23:31 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I have signed up to findmypast.co.uk but have come to a dead end when getting to my nan's father. He was called Patrick Hickey, born in Tipperary in 1890's (multiple Patrick Hickeys so this is where I'm struggling). He married Gertrude Smith - I think born in Widnes. I was interested in knowing history regarding him such as war records, accurate records of his children as there is some confusion with my mum regarding names that are coming up on the family tree and also his mum and dad as on Ancestry it began to show trips to America which confused me all together and I got worried incase I was beginning to confuse my family tree.
I know for definite one of their children was Joan Hickey as that's my nan born in Widnes, also James Patrick Hickey who died in WW2 who also had a 'half' brother called Arthur Mark Smith he also died in WW2 however unsure if he had a different dad or whether it was out of wedlock??
I'm also struggling to find information on Gertrude Smith such as her mother and father, brothers and sisters, children other than the ones mentioned. My mum says her Gertrude's mothers' name is Anne Smith (unsure on maiden name) but also struggling to find any information on an Anne Smith potentially being Gertrude's mother??
Any help would be appreciated, thank you!
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Hello and welcome :)
http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/
Shows that Patrick and Gertrude married in 1919 either at the Registry office or the marriage was attended by the Registrar. Did they marry in a Catholic Church? The marriage certificate would help you because it would show their fathers’ names which would then help to trace births.
Heywood
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Have you found Patrick in the 1939 register on FindMyPast? That would give you his birthdate to help your search. (Sometimes, that is not always accurate though).
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From the information I have, it seems like he was born in 1890 Tipperary and died in 1965 in Widnes but I've no idea if its definitely the correct Patrick Hickey - I'm just presuming based on the link with Gertrude and also the location he died.
My mum said they were both catholic too. Don't think the 1939 census record has come up, based on what I have its just a marriage record, death record and also a potential army record (unsure if definitely his as there is multiple)
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With regard to children you can search https://www.freebmd.org.uk/ using mother’s surname for your timespan
There are these children Hickey/Smith in Prescot district
June Quarter 1919 James
June Quarter 1920 Mary
June quarter 1922 Norah
September quarter 1923 Eileen
March quarter 1927 Annie
September quarter 1929 Joan
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From the information I have, it seems like he was born in 1890 Tipperary and died in 1965 in Widnes but I've no idea if its definitely the correct Patrick Hickey - I'm just presuming based on the link with Gertrude and also the location he died.
My mum said they were both catholic too. Don't think the 1939 census record has come up, based on what I have its just a marriage record, death record and also a potential army record (unsure if definitely his as there is multiple)
There is a published tree - is it yours? There is quite a bit of information about Patrick but I wonder how much if that information - birth/census is verified.
Do you have Patrick’s father’s name from his marriage certificate?
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Amazing! My mum recognises James, Mary (findmypast recognises her as Mary Veronica Hickey??) would love to know when Mary passed away, she married Wilfred Webster. They had 2 daughters Brenda and Jean but can not find anything about those 2 whatsoever.
My mum also recognises Norah, Eileen, Joan (my nan). Unsure about Annie though so will take a look into this.
However, not sure why Arthur Mark Smith is not showing, would he not show as their child as it may have been out of wedlock or does he have a completely different father?
Could be my family tree but I was messing around with a few when I was younger so could be an older one. I got really confused when it got to Patrick and Gertrude so from there things could be wrong. Unfortunately I don't have the marriage certificate, just a transcription.
According to ancestry.co.uk, Patrick's dad was called John Hickey who married Johana Mccarthey but I was completely confused at that point so no idea if thats accurate. I found findmypast easier as it shown me a relevance score with documents.
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https://tree.findmypast.co.uk/#/trees/cac5b27d-d9b1-4b2e-887a-7c016bdbd370/1451907938/family
This is the link to my most recent family tree - hopefully it will load up for you
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Free BMD
Arthur M Smith born 1915 with mother’s name Smith so he was illegitimate. If Patrick was around then and in the military, he might be Patrick’s child otherwise not.
I do not have FindMyPast so cannot see the tree. However when you say Ancestry has those parents, it might be just someone’s guess.
This is a useful site for Irish records. https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/
Do you know Patrick was definitely born in Tipperary? Or is that from someone’s tree?
There is a Patrick in 1939 - could that be him?
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My mum said she was told Patrick was definitely born in Tipperary. What is the information you have on Patrick in 1939?
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Just asked my mum again, 17th March he was born. I've looked at the link you provided and it states there was a Patrick Hickey born in Tipperary 17th March 1899. Mother's maiden name was Downey. Maybe getting somewhere now if this is accurate
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Have you checked 1939 though for the birth date? It might be right or wrong though :-\
Does your transcription of the marriage give all details or is it just the index? You really need his father’s name.
Re Gertrude - do the names Samson and Ellen (Davies) for her parents seem familiar to your mum?
This site helps with mother’s name for births before 1919 https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp
It is free but you have to sign in.
There is a Gladys in 1911 with those parents, you can check that.
I am going to bed now but good luck - see what you can find but don’t just guess. :)
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Definitely not 1939 as the birth date due to my nan being born 1929.
The only Patrick Hickey showing in Widnes died in 1965 which sounds about right, but was born 1890. So that must definitely be him. Still no closer to finding out the father and mother though which is really disappointing.
I feel I recognise Samson and Ellen Davies from looking at records related to Gertrude, however my mum is 100% sure Gertrude's mother was called Anne so I'm not sure if there is confusion somewhere because soon as I put Anne that's when things just don't add up. Will look more into this.
Thank you so much for your help - I have also pm'd you regarding a relative with the name Heywood incase you recognise any of the names. :)
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I know I keep going on about 1939 - we aren’t allowed to post much information from that for copyright reasons.
However, I can say that there is a Gertrude and a Patrick Hickey and the 1939 gives birthdates.
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Hi,
Going by the dates....for Patrick Hickey, this is his birth, Bansha, County Tipperary.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1899/02039/1781241.pdf
Maggsie
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In the Census
1901.................
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Tipperary/Ballycarron/Lagganstown_Lower/1716227/
1911
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Tipperary/Ballycarron/Lagganstown_Lower/829210/
Maggsie