RootsChat.Com
Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Glamorganshire => Wales => Glamorganshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Mazilby on Sunday 05 July 20 13:47 BST (UK)
-
Can anyone help please. I am looking for the birth of Edward Davies who married Elizabeth Ann Evans (widow) in 1906. On the marriage cert in Pontypridd his father is William Davies but no mother's name.
Elizabeth Ann Evans and Samuel Evans had William 1895, John and then Ethel in 1899. 1901 census shows Elizabeth Ann as widow.
Can you find the death cert of Samuel Evans? The marriage cert of him and Elizabeth Ann for her maiden name.
Information about William Davies and his wife and children including Edward born about 1895. I am stuck on this group because of the common names Evans and Davies. Just my luck!! Ha Ha.
Welcome anyone who will respond. thank you.
-
Do you have him on the 1911 census, if so could you please post the details
-
I will try and find him as I haven't had any luck so far.
Have only found four in 1911 census that lived in Glamorganshire born 1865
coal mine hewer, Anglican priest, Stationary engine man, colliery rider.
No access to certificates to see who wife was!! How do I find that out without buying certificate?
-
Name Ethel Evans Found the family by his step-daughter. Now need Edwards father and mother?
Gender Female
Birth Circa 1899
Tonypandy, Glamorganshire
Residence Apr 2 1911
95. Tonna Road, Caerau, Glamorganshire, Wales
Age 12
Occupation School
Father Edward Davies
Mother Elizabeth Ann Davies
Siblings William Evans
John Evans
Ada Davies
Rachel Davies
Census
Parish Higher Llangynwyd Series RG14
Township Caerau Piece 32529
Registration district Bridgend, Maesteg Enum. District 4
County Glamorganshire Family 372
Country Wales Line 5
Date Apr 2 1911
View census image
-
working from possible birth registrations for the children
Ada Davies dec qtr 1906 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 624
Ethel Evans june qtr 1898 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 574
mother's maiden name on both is Evans
Possible marriage
Samuel Evans sept qtr 1892 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 754 with Elizabeth Ann Evans on the same page
Possible death reg
Samuel Evans 35 march qtr 1900 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 388
-
Yes thank you, they would appear to tie in nicely.
I can't find the birth record of Edward though to get his parents names accurately. I know his father is William from the marriage certificate.
I am not very good at searching that is why there are two threads I keep losing it and having to go back to the email inbox to link in again. I also cant find how to get births again.
Sorry its my age!!
-
You can use FreeBmd for all civil events
https://www.freebmd.org.uk/
and then the GRO index for births to find the maiden name, free to use but you need to register
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp
You need to go one step at a time especially with names like Davies. Your best bet would be to get a copy of the 1906 marriage cert to get William's occupation and the names of witnesses and Edward's address at the time. Marriage certs in England & Wales do not give names of mothers as a rule and no date of death for previous spouse. Copies can be purchased from the GRO from the same link as above. The try to track him back through census entries before trying to work out which of the many Edward Davies entries he might be.
I'm not sure how you have the name of William, but not his occupation without access to the marriage cert.
Also, on the other thread you say William born 1875/6 living in Pontypridd area. The 1911 census has him as 38 so born 1872/3 and place of birth Aberdare.
If you need to update info on a thread, just reply to it and add new info. If you start another thread and duplicate info, you stand less chance of getting a reply.
:)
-
Here’s a link to the other Evans Davies thread looking for Edward’s birth
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=833913.msg6987775#msg6987775
-
thanks, I had seen it and I've now replied about inconsistencies as well.
::)
-
This might help track him back, as it has a bit of biographical info on Edward Davies and his previous military career
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3886433/3886438/60/
-
I can't find the birth record of Edward though to get his parents names accurately.
I know his father is William from the marriage certificate.
Can you give us all the details from his 1906 marriage certificate?
What occupation for his father William?
Age if given & Address for Edward Davies
Did either witness have surname Davies
working from possible birth registrations for the children
Ada Davies dec qtr 1906 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 624
Ethel Evans june qtr 1898 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 574
mother's maiden name on both is Evans
Possible marriage
Samuel Evans sept qtr 1892 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 754 with Elizabeth Ann Evans on the same page
Possible death reg
Samuel Evans 35 march qtr 1900 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 388
Elizabeth as a widow on 1901 census - perhaps Edward Davies was living close by in Tonypandy area
72, Kinry Street, Tonypandy
Elizabeth Ann Evans Head Widow 1870 Pontypool, Monmouthshire, Wales
Willie Evans Son 1893 Tonypandy, Glamorganshire, Wales
Johnnie Evans Son 1895 Tonypandy, Glamorganshire, Wales
Ethel Evans Daughter. 1899 Tonypandy, Glamorganshire, Wales
John Mead Boarder Single 1855 Timberman Labourer Colliery Surface Gloucestershire
RG13 Piece 5017 Folio 103 Page 14
-
This might help track him back, as it has a bit of biographical info on Edward Davies and his previous military career
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3886433/3886438/60/
Great find Mabel
-
Edward served in South Africa according to the article so probably not on the 1901 census.
-
Thank you so much for the newspaper article, and as you say it may be why he is not in the census.
I will continue to search for his father, William Davies.
-
Tremendous thanks from the granddaughter of Edward as she knew he had been commemorated for bravery but has never been able to find out more. She is now in her 80s. I am now waiting for his Military records to arrive.
I have now found Edwards parents William Davies b1840? (1881 census states his birth as circa 1843?) and helper in melting furnace in 1851. He married Martha (Williams?) 21st April in 1871 at Salem Chapel and they lived at Gladlys Rd. Aberdare, Glamorgan .
He lived at the next address back in 1881 31 Miskin Rd, Ystradyfodwg and was a labourer in coal. This matches so far.
I am now trying to find who his parents were?????
I have found a William born 1840? at Newchurch, Carmarthen in 1841 but am not sure if this is he as only a mother is mentioned Esther (Harries?? )Davies
Is there anyway you can help me or advise me on how to confirm this is he, and find his parents to get more please. You have been so helpful so far. Thank you .
-
so this is 1881
31 Miskin Road RG11/5306 folio 77 pg 13
William Davies head mar 38 labourer at coal works b. Carmarthen
Martha wife 31 b. Pembroke
Esther dau 9 b. Treherbert
Elizabeth dau 7 b. Aberdare
George son 5 b. Ystradyfodwg
Edwards son 3 b. Ystradyfodwg
Richard son 1 b. Ystradyfodwg
+ 2 boarders
birth regs
Esther Davies march qtr 1872 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 349 mmn Williams
George Davies march qtr 1876 Pontypridd vol 11a pg 414 mmn Williams
Do you have the marriage from 1871? What is the name & occupation of William's father from the certificate?
-
I have now found Edwards parents William Davies b1840? (1881 census states his birth as circa 1843?) and helper in melting furnace in 1851.
He married Martha (Williams?) 21st April in 1871 at Salem Chapel and they lived at Gladlys Rd. Aberdare, Glamorgan .
He lived at the next address back in 1881 31 Miskin Rd, Ystradyfodwg and was a labourer in coal.
This matches so far.
This is the 1881 census you have for your Edward Williams with father William & mother Martha
Miskin Rd
William Davies Head 38 Carmarthen, Carmarthenshire, Wales Lab At Coal Works
Martha Davies Wife 31 Pembroke, Pembrokeshire, Wales
Esther Davies Daughter 9 Treherbert, Glamorganshire, Wales
Elizabeth Davies Daughter 7 Aberdare, Glamorganshire, Wales
George Davies Son 5 Ystradfodwg, Glamorganshire, Wales
Edward Davies Son 3 Ystradfodwg, Glamorganshire, Wales
Richard Davies Son 1 Ystradfodwg, Glamorganshire, Wales
William Connolly Boarder 30 Ireland
Patrick Keeffee Boarder 40 Ireland
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2W9-HLG5
EDIt - snap Osprey posting whilst red writing :)
-
I do not have the marriage cert for 1871.
I know he was a coal haulier in 1861 and 1871
his wife was Martha Davies (Williams???) and his mother was Esther Davies (Harries??) but I do not have his fathers actual name, I believe he was born about 1808 information eludes me here.
-
how can you know this information without the marriage certificate? With a common name like William Davies trying to go back without certificates is guesswork, not research!
-
Because I have old paperwork from grandmas research and documents have been lost. It's all written in a note book. I am trying to work from her notes without getting the certs as I have spent a large amount so far. I thought it was research and I certainly aren't guessing as I am asking for help to discover how to look back.
-
I have now found Edwards parents William Davies b1840? (1881 census states his birth as circa 1843?) and helper in melting furnace in 1851.
I have found a William born 1840? at Newchurch, Carmarthen in 1841
but am not sure if this is he as only a mother is mentioned Esther (Harries?? )Davies
Is there anyway you can help me or advise me on how to confirm this is he, and find his parents to get more please.
You have been so helpful so far. Thank you .
Is this the 1851 cenuses you refer to?
David Richards Head 43 Abergwilly, Carmarthenshire
Hesther Richards Wife 48 Conwil, Carmarthenshire
Sarah Davies Step Daughter 17 Abernant, Carmarthenshire
John Davies Step Son 14 Newchurch, Carmarthenshire
George Davies Step Son 12 Newchurch, Carmarthenshire
William Davies Step Son 10 Newchurch, Carmarthenshire Helper In A Melting Furnace
Thomas Richards Son 8 Newchurch, Carmarthenshire
David Richards Son 4 Abergwilly, Carmarthenshire
1851c https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SG8N-ZDW
EDIT to add and is this the 1841 census?
Ester Davies 30 Carmarthenshire
Sarah Davies 7 Carmarthenshire
John Davies 4 Carmarthenshire
Gorge Davies 3 Carmarthenshire
William Davies 1 Carmarthenshire
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7QR-Q66
-
Yes I had some of this information but not all... thank you for that.
His mother must have married again? That I did not know! Makes it even more difficult.
Do I look up marriages now for Hesther {unknown) Davies to David Richards?
Was there a census in 1841?
It goes way before census now I think but I do have the DVD for Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints if that might help?
-
from parish marriages 31 Dec 1842 Newchurch
David Richards full bach farmer Greengrove father Thomas Richards farmer
Esther Davies full widow farmer Foes lun ucha father Griffith Harries farmer
witnesses Henry Williams & Henry Harries, all sign except Esther
-
From the 1851 census
George Davies born 1839
William Davies born 1841
Thomas Richards born 1843
David Richards born 1847
you could use GRO indexes to confirm their mother's maiden name
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/indexes_search.asp - it's free to use but you have to register
-
Gosh that looks like it. Wow so William aged 1's father must have died before 1841. The Ester (doesn't help when they keep spelling it different does it) must have married this David Richards
Ill have a look for a death about 1840 at the address in Newchurch in Carmarthen
Thank you. for the marriage of Esther.
-
baptisms in Newchurch to George, farmer, & Esther Davies of Blaencynnon
John Davies 26 March 1837
George 15 Nov 1838
Possible burial in Newchurch 29 June 1842 George Davies 47 of Cwmglowddy - matches the address for the 1841 census.
Esther's maiden name was Harries from the marriage to David Richards.
The William in this family was 10 in 1851 which is older than the William married to Martha - born 1842/3.
-
Oh Dear have I lost track of the right William then, or could the age be an error ????
-
sorry, to sound like a broken record, but that's why you need that 1871 marriage record to be sure.
1881 age = 38
1891 age = 50
You said you were asking for help to discover how to go back, document each stage and get marriage certificates.
:)
-
Thank you, I will have to do just that to be certain. You have been a great help and also taught me how to search so thanks for that too, I will get back to you if I have more information.
-
Hey folks, you have been great, but now I have another quandry!!!
Edward Davies born according to 1881 census in 1878 Pontiprydd, Wales – he was 3 George was 5 so that’s not helpful!
On his marriage cert Edward said he was 3 years older born in 1875. I thought it was because his wife Elizabeth Ann Evans was older and a widow with children. He married her in 1906 at Pontiprydd, we have that cert.
Now on his death cert which we have just received it states age of 58 in 1933 which does tie in with the marriage certificate . Making his birth year 1875.
There are 2 births in 1875 and 3 births in 1878, the only thing I think I can do is apply for them one at a time until I find the right one but thats getting very expensive if you can check it out for me on line? I only have a few days left on FindMyPast and I can't find the birth!!
Can you see the birth certificate for parents?
His parents were William and Martha Davies of 31 Miskin Road, Ystradyfodwg, Glamorganshire:
Tonypandy is in the district of Pontypridd in 1906 but on the death certificate in 1900 it is the sub district of Ystradyfodwy , district Pontypridd, and Caerau is in the district of Bridgend, sub district of Maesteg – confusing or what?
Please help if you can as your methods far exceed mine on finding the answers.
Much obliged if you are reading this again. Maz ???
-
Does the marriage certificate confirm that William is his father? Do the occupations match the census entries? Do the names of the witnesses help?
Whose death was recorded in 1900 in Ystradyfodwg? checked back, Elizabeth's first husband
Pontypridd registration district had several subdistricts and there were changes over time.
https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/pontypridd.html
and Bridgend had these subdistricts
https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/bridgend.html
births registered at Pontypridd for Edward Davies
june qtr 1874 vol 11a pg 244 mmn Evans
march qtr 1875 vol 11a pg 423 mmn Morgan
sept qtr 1875 vol 11a pg 355 mmn Edmunds
sept qtr 1875 vol 11a pg 357 mmn Morgan
march qtr 1878 vol 11a pg 344 mmn Hatton
june qtr 1878 vol 11a pg 410 mmn Williams - same mmn as that for George & Esther
sept qtr 1878 vol 11a pg 420 mmn Edwards
You can check mmn on the gro index, you need to register, but free to use.
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/login.asp
-
Oh thank you so much that is a big help, and yes the fathers name on marriage cert is William.
The other siblings are definitely Esther and George, then Edward and Richard followed, so I guess that is the cert we should send for.
You made it look so easy!!!! After weeks of trolling the pages! Thank you.
Would you believe he was a war hero and yet none of his records show his age!
Why on earth did they forget their ages?? All our research is confused by their illiteracy, so sad.
-
not illiteracy, age just wasn't so important. No need to use date of birth to identify yourself. Adult birthdays weren't celebrated as they are now.
-
IS THERE ANY WAY TO VIEW THE BIRTH CERT WITHOUT ORDERING IT?
-
no.
you may be able to check some details by asking the local registrars but they would probably expect you to buy it if the details matched.
Cheapest way to buy is getting a pdf from the GRO.
-
Okay, thanks very much.
Costly business this family history!!
-
Edward Davies won the D.S.O. in the first world war in the mining battalion, and was my step grandfather (Ethel born 1897 was my grandmother). He was in the Somerset Light Infantry before the war and rejoined on the outbreak of war.
Ethels brother John Evans was in the Welch regiment and killed in the first world war in Egypt and is buried in Port Said war cemetery please refer to CWGC for details.
Samuel Evans was a merchant seaman and sailed around the world for several years before marrying Elizabeth Ann,his mother may have been named Ruth.
-
Apologies Edward Davies won the D.C.M. not the D.S.O.
He also had a son named Edward who was called Teddie.
Ethel married my grandfather James Robert Evans.