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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Armagh => Topic started by: LAW1221 on Friday 24 July 20 18:20 BST (UK)

Title: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Friday 24 July 20 18:20 BST (UK)
Hi
I'm looking for any information on my gggrandfather, William Verner Gilpin dob abt 1834...Armagh/Portadown (all his children were born in Loughgall District.  I believe he died September 4, 1907.  His wife, my gggrandmother was, Eiiza Jane Gilpin (dob abt 1838, dod Jan 25, 1912).  I was hoping to see if anyone had either in their tree and had any information on their parents and/or siblings.

Thanks!
laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Friday 24 July 20 18:32 BST (UK)
William's death record

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1907/05524/4548325.pdf
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Friday 24 July 20 18:39 BST (UK)
William & Eliza's marriage 1856

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1856/09514/5448521.pdf
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Friday 24 July 20 18:47 BST (UK)
Possible death of his brother, Richard (after his father) 1907, Loughgall

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1907/05533/4550778.pdf

Marriage of Richard, (father's name Richard) 1859 to Emily Lake

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1859/09561/5466502.pdf
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Friday 24 July 20 18:55 BST (UK)
Will image of William Verner Gilpin on
https://apps.proni.gov.uk/WillsCalendar_IE/WillsSearch.aspx

Probate of the Will of William Verner Gilpin late of Copney Tullyroan Moy County Amagh Farmer who died 4 September 1907 granted at Armagh to James Gilpin Shop Assistant.

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Friday 24 July 20 19:06 BST (UK)
Possible marriage of William's brother, James Andrew Gilpin, (father Richard) 1888 to Sarah Verner

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1888/10783/5932302.pdf

Added
James Andrew death in 1898

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1898/05842/4654808.pdf

Correction....

1901 census for the family

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Armagh/Killymann/Copney/1015582/
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Friday 24 July 20 19:16 BST (UK)

..........late of Copney Tullyroan Moy County Amagh


Townlands of Copney north-east and Tullyroan east of the village of Moy.
https://www.townlands.ie/armagh/oneilland-west/clonfeacle-tyrone-portion/copney/
https://www.townlands.ie/armagh/oneilland-west/clonfeacle-tyrone-portion/tullyroan/

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Friday 24 July 20 19:21 BST (UK)
William's son, James, birth, 1876

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1876/03060/2121496.pdf
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Friday 24 July 20 19:22 BST (UK)
Eliza Jane Gilpin with her son James and extended family in 1911 Irish census.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Armagh/Killyman/Copney/323936/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai001621095/

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Friday 24 July 20 19:28 BST (UK)
Party 1 Name   JAMES GILPIN
Party 2 Name   LOUISA STUART
Date of Event   30 October 1901
SR District/Reg Area   Dungannon

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1901/10325/5758684.pdf

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Friday 24 July 20 20:26 BST (UK)
Daughter Jane born 8th October 1865 at Copney.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03555/2308896.pdf

She was married? to George Dever (in Pittsburgh, an electric car conductor). Her son George (Verner Gilpin?) was born in 1892 at Copney. The informant was his grandfather William Verner Gilpin (the occupier) at Copney.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1892/02361/1881762.pdf

Verner Gilpin is on both the 1901 and 1911 census at Copney.

Eliza Jane Gilpin passed away on the 25th January 1912 at Copney. The informant was Verner G Dever (her grandson).
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1912/05376/4499503.pdf

Verner G Dever married Rebecca Weir in 1913. He gave his father as George Dever, a gas inspector.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1913/09886/5591481.pdf

KG


Edited to add:
Daughter Doreen Winifred Dever born 1917
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1917/01315/1543645.pdf

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: KatC on Friday 24 July 20 22:11 BST (UK)
This was a tree that may have come from a Canadian Gilpin researcher.  I haven't checked to see if the above comments agree with the tree.  Some, not all,  of the records are at Seagoe and his family was at Balteagh.
Descendants of Dynes Gilpin
         
   1     Dynes Gilpin   
..      +Jane?   
........   2     Dynes Gilpin   1766 -
........   2     Thomas Gilpin   1767 -
........   2     William Gilpin   1767 -
........   2     Henry Gilpin   1768 -
........   2     George Gilpin   1768 -
........   2     Jane Gilpin   1771 -
........   2     Richard Gilpin   1773 -
............      +Elizabeth   
...................   3     William Verner Gilpin   
.......................      +Eliza Jane Gilpin   
.............................   4     Jane Gilpin   1865 -
.............................   4     Rachel Gilpin   1868 -
.............................   4     Richard Gilpin   1871 -
.............................   4     Elizabeth Gilpin   1873 -
.............................   4     James Gilpin   1876 -
...................   3     Isabel Gilpin   1809 -
...................   3     Margaret Gilpin   1815 -
...................   3     Judith Gilpin   1818 -
...................   3     Richard Gilpin   1822 -
.......................      +Deborah Robinson   
.............................   4     Richard Gilpin   1850 -
.................................      +Mary Elizabeth McConnell   
.............................   4     Eliza Jane Gilpin   1851 -
.............................   4     Mathew Gilpin   1853 -
.............................   4     Elizabeth Gilpin   1855 -
.................................      +Thomas Emerson   
.............................      *2nd Husband of Elizabeth Gilpin:   
.................................      +Youngson Somerville   1834 - 1907
........................................   5     Elizabeth Somerville   1867 -
.............................   4     John Gilpin   1859 -
.............................   4     Isabella Gilpin   1861 -
.............................   4     Mary Gilpin   1862 -
.............................   4     Richard Gilpin   1864 -
.............................   4     Samuel James Gilpin   1864 -
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: eileenwilson on Saturday 25 July 20 00:52 BST (UK)
Missing a daughter ... Margaret born 1880 is the grandmother to my husband's cousin in Annaghmore.  She married William David Murdock in 1907. Their daughter Ruby is his mother.  If you've done your DNA, you should be a relatively close match.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: eileenwilson on Saturday 25 July 20 00:54 BST (UK)
I have William Verner Gilpin's parents as Richard Gilpin & Dinah Thompson.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 01:05 BST (UK)
Thank you!  You guys are the best!  Lots of info here to digest.

Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Saturday 25 July 20 09:50 BST (UK)

Elizabeth Gilpin born in 1873
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1873/03176/2164683.pdf

She married Henry Murray on the 27th March 1908 in Armagh Methodist church. One of the witnesses was her sister, Maggie Murdock.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1908/10040/5652020.pdf

Children:
John Murray 1909
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1909/01616/1647687.pdf

Thomas William Murray 1912
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1912/01504/1610849.pdf

Henry Murray 1914
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1914/01405/1577619.pdf

In the 1911 census
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Armagh/Tullyroan/Derrymagowan/327851/

KG


Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Saturday 25 July 20 10:02 BST (UK)
Missing a daughter ... Margaret born 1880 is the grandmother to my husband's cousin in Annaghmore.  She married William David Murdock in 1907. Their daughter Ruby is his mother.  If you've done your DNA, you should be a relatively close match.

There were actually two Margarets born in 1880 and 1882 respectively. I can't find the death of the first one  :-\
Margaret Gilpin 1880
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1880/02876/2053715.pdf
Margaret Gilpin 1882
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1882/02763/2014540.pdf

When Margaret marries William Murdock in 1907, her age is 24 so born 82/83.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1907/10086/5668923.pdf

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 14:11 BST (UK)
Hi

There is also a son of William's,  David who married Lilly Miller.

The above family outline has Isabella (my gggrand) as the daughter of Richard.  I've been working her as the eldest of William for the following reasons:

1.  Her death certificate lists her father as Wm V. Gilpin;
2.  Her obit (1915) lists surviving siblings as David from Patterson, NJ and James from Ireland;
3.  She was institutionalized in 1905, her intake papers suggest her parents are still alive at that time which Wm and Eliza are and that she has 3 brothers and 4 sisters.

I have not been able to find a marriage license from her marriage to Thomas Wilson to get some collaboration.

However, another concern I have is that  Mary Gilpin McClelland, m to Richard McCelland and living in Patterson, NJ raised Isabella's youngest daughter once she was institutionalized.  I've always assumed Mary was her sister.
 Above she is listed as a daughter of Richard.  However, my Mary has a birth date of Feb 14, 1860 per her passport.  I am trying to find her marriage cert to hopefully get some confirmation.

Again, thank you all so much!  All of this are new leads to investigate!!

Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Saturday 25 July 20 14:54 BST (UK)
Just adding David's marriage record. He married on 11th July 1894 at St James parish church, Moy. Father indeed William Verner Gilpin.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1894/10568/5850076.pdf

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 15:33 BST (UK)
Interesting info on Jane Gilpin Dever.  I found her marriage to George Dever in PA in 1890.  He was born in Ireland per the marriage cert.  She is listed as Jennie but I've tied that name back to her on other documents so I'm confident it is her.

She has her baby in Ireland in January, 1892.  I found her and the baby returning to PA in August, 1892. 

I'm 1900, George is remarried to Teresa and the census indicates they've been married 5 years by 1900.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: KatC on Saturday 25 July 20 15:42 BST (UK)
Here is a transcription of Seagoe records which may help with pre irishgenealogy births.  All transcriptions need to be rechecked with originals as typists misread or mistype entries.  However, it may help those who have no access to these records.  This will be in 2 or 3 parts


15/4/1822   gilpin   maria    john & maria bealteagh         
15/4/1822   gilpin   richard   Richard & elizabeth balteagh         
15/4/1822   gilpin   georege    George & Sarah Balteagh         
8/8/1822   gilpin   john   Jane Lewis         
15/8/1822   gilpin   mary   David Murry - moyntaghs         
14/4/1823   gilpin   maria    William & anne Balteagh         
16/6/1823   gilpin   john   John & jane Moyraverty         
2/11/1823   gilpin   matilda    William & sarah Clonrola         
10/3/1824   gilpin   robert   Robert & margaret Balteagh         
30/4/1828   gilpin   eleanor    William & sarah Clonrola         
5/10/1826   gilpin   charlotte   william thompson         
17/10/1826   gilpin   mary   robert wilson         
18/10/1826   gilpin   elizabeth   edward lavery         
27/11/1827   gilpin   joseph   mary dickson         
9/3/182822/6/1828   gilpin   eliza jane    John & jane Moyraverty         
22/6/1828   gilpin   mary jane   Thomas & sarag tamnafiglasson         
21/12/1828   gilpin   william    William & sarah Clonrola         
26/3/1829   gilpin   margaret   john & maria bealteagh         
9/4/1828   gilpin   robert   jane Russell         
16/8/1829   gilpin   henry   henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
28/2/1830   gilpin   dynes   John & jane Moyraverty         
5/8/1830   gilpin   jane Balteagh aged 49            
17/10/1830   gilpin   margaret   thomas & sally Tamnafiglasson         
6/3/1831   gilpin   mary anne   henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
24/3/1831   gilpin   isabella    william gibson         
16/3/1831   gilpin    eliza Tamifglassion   -17            
17/10/1832   gilpin   letitia   George Armstrong          
21/10/1832   gilpin   thomas    Thomas & jane drumagoon         
14/4/1833   gilpin   james   henry & elizabeth Tamnafiglasson         
9/6/1833   gilpin   anne   George & elizabeth balteagh         
27/5/1834   gilpin   elizabeth   dynes & ann balteagh         
30/11/1834   gilpin   andrew    thomas & sarah Drumagoon         
14/4/1835    gilpin   george    thomas & jane balteagh         
10/9/1835   gilpin   mary ann   john Webb         
4/10/1835   gilpin   oliver    John & jane Moyraverty         
21/1/1836   gilpin   sarah   john macoun         
28/2/1836   gilpin   william   sarah Browne         
19/7/1836   gilpin   john   sarah nichelson         
26/7/1836   gilpin   william henry   William & sarah  Balteagh         
26/7/1836   gilpin   henry   dynes & ann balteagh         
6/8/1836   gilpin   jane   john best          
7/10/1836   gilpin    Robert  Tamifglassion- 46             
6/12/1836   gilpin   rebecca   henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
7/1/1837   gilpin    mary Moyraverty - 14            
26/4/183726/6/1837   gilpin   dynes    mary anne walsh         
26/6/1837   gilpin   mary   Dynes & mary anne tamicarbet          
25/7/1837   gilpin    sarah Tamifglassion 50            
20/8/1837   gilpin    henry Tamifglassion 74            
22/10/1837   gilpin   elizabeth   john & sarah balteagh         
11/11/1837   gilpin   jane   thomas uprichard         
12/11/1837   gilpin   john   dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
15/2/1838   gilpin   margaret   joseph lyness         
9/3/1838    gilpin   matilda Tamifglassion   - 20            
22/4/1838   gilpin   mary    Dynes & mary anne tamicarbet          
5/8/1838   gilpin   henry   mary turkington         
9/12/1838   gilpin   william henry   William & sarah balteagh         
28/4/1839   gilpin   margaret    dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
16/5/1839   gilpin   dynes   dynes & ann balteagh         
22/5/1839   gilpin   william   anne Jane Cooke         
16/6/1839   gilpin   mary anne   Henry & mary Balteagh         
18/8/1839   gilpin   william john    Dynes & mary anne tamicarbet          
15/3/1840   gilpin   sarah anne   thomas & sarah Drumagoon         
30/5/1840   gilpin   margaret   david Webb clanrole         
17/6/1840   gilpin    william Tamifglassion - 40            
1/7/1840   gilpin   thomas    henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
29/7/1840   gilpin   jane   john & sarah balteagh         
21/11/1840   gilpin   sarah   Andrew McStea - shankill          
4/4/1841   gilpin   dynes   dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
23/8/1841   gilpin   henry   George & elizabeth balteagh         
23/8/1841   gilpin   alice   George & elizabeth balteagh         
21/12/1841   gilpin   william   Robert & jane balteagh          
26/12/1841   gilpin   jane    dynes & mary anne balteagh         
13/1/1842   gilpin   elizabeth balteagh 62            
19/1/1842   gilpin    james Tamifglassion   -20            
28/4/1842   gilpin   robert   willaim & sarah ballymacrandel         
27/9/1842   gilpin   ruth   richard McLernon         
12/3/1843   gilpin   george    dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
23/4/1843   gilpin    James Tamifglassion   – 43             
3/5/1843   gilpin   elizabeth   George & elizabeth balteagh         
21/6/1843   gilpin   robert   William & sarah balteagh         
23/7/1843   gilpin   alice   Dynes & sarah balteagh         
26/9/1843   gilpin    john Tamifglassion   – 84             
14/10/1843   gilpin   jane   charles Twinem         
15/10/1843   gilpin   james frederick   Dynes & mary anne tamicarbet          
24/3/1844   gilpin   elizabeth    henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
28/7/1844   gilpin   margaret   john & sarah balteagh         
4/8/1844   gilpin   sarah   George & elizabeth balteagh         
29/10/1844   gilpin   john   dynes balteagh         
13/12/1844   gilpin   mary annw   robert twinem         
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: KatC on Saturday 25 July 20 15:44 BST (UK)
8/6/1845   gilpin   elizaveth   dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
6/10/1845   gilpin   william john    henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
21/11/1845   gilpin     john  portadown 27            
28/7/1846   gilpin   James gilpin 30 b farmer tamifiglasson joseph gilpin farmer    mary gilpin 24 s seamsestress tamnifiglasson john gilpin farmer         
28/7/1846   gilpin   mary gilpin 24 s seamsestress tamnifiglasson john gilpin farmer   James gilpin 30 b farmer tamifiglasson joseph gilpin farmer          
15/9/1846   gilpin   rachel 28 s tamifiglasson joseph gilpin farmer    william Lyness 38 b farmer lisnavague william lyness farmer          
30/10/1846   gilpin   john 27 b farmer tamnifiglasson john gilpin farmer             
6/11/1846   gilpin   dynes balteagh  - 81            
11/11/1846   gilpin   thomas 21 b farmer balteagh robert gilpin farmer    jane tuft 18 s kilvergan george tuft  farmer          
25/12/1846   gilpin    goerge balteagh - 80            
28/12/1846   gilpin    mary Tamifglassion  -70            
25/5/1847   gilpin    margaret drumagoon – 17            
16/7/1847   gilpin   richard 24 b farmer balteagh richard gilpin farmer   deborah Robinson 18 s tamnifiglasson matthew robinson farmer          
18/7/1847   gilpin   letitia    dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
31/7/1847   gilpin   dynes  Tamifglassion  – 74             
15/10/1847   gilpin   martha jane    james & mary balteagh         
15/10/1847   gilpin   margaret anne   John & bess Tamnifiglasson         
7/6/1848   gilpin    joseph -72            
23/7/1848   gilpin    elizabeth - 32            
24/9/1848   gilpin   leonard   dynes & judith tamnafiglasson         
3/12/1848   gilpin   jane   dynes & ann balteagh         
15/6/1849   gilpin   Joseph   henry & elizabeth Balteagh         
16/9/1849   gilpin   richard   john & sarah balteagh         
16/9/1849   gilpin   sarah - 3 years old    john & sarah balteagh         
7/10/1849   gilpin   sarah   john & elizabeth balteagh         
10/10/1849   gilpin   mary elizabeth   james & mary balteagh         
27/1/1850   gilpin   richard   dynes & Elizabeth balteagh         
14/9/1850    gilpin   dynes balteagh – 50             
18/10/1850   gilpin   ellen 23 s weaver ballymacrandel william gilpin weaver    william Maxwell 22 w crosmacaughly thomas maxwell pentioner         
1/12/1850   gilpin   mary jane   james & judith balteagh         
20/7/1851   gilpin   william   james & mary balteagh         
10/8/1851   gilpin   elizabeth jane   richard & deborah balteagh         
21/9/1851   gilpin   Alice   robert doherty & maria Gilpin         
28/12/1851   gilpin   margaret Anne   John & bess Tamnifiglasson         
12/7/1852   gilpin   eliza Jane 24 s farmer moyraverty john gilpin farmer    alexander Jones 25 b farmer moyraverty james jones farmer         
4/10/1852   gilpin   elizabeth Balteagh 36            
16/10/1852   gilpin    mary carn – 66            
21/12/1852   gilpin   letitia gilpin 24 s farmer balteagh dynes gilpin farmer   james Gilpin 34 b farmer balteagh william gilpin farmer         
21/12/1852   gilpin   james Gilpin 34 b farmer balteagh william gilpin farmer   letitia gilpin 24 s farmer balteagh dynes gilpin farmer         
20/3/1853   gilpin   sarah   dynes & judith tamnafiglasson         
3/7/1853   gilpin   John   james & mary balteagh         
31/7/1853   gilpin   matthew   richard & deborah balteagh         
7/8/1853   gilpin   mary   john & sarah balteagh         
23/10/1853   gilpin   margaret    William & mary Upper Seagoe         
17/2/1854   gilpin   james 24 b weaver drumgor robert gilpin weaver   elizabeth hagan 21 s weaver balteagh james hagan weaver         
19/3/1854   gilpin   sarah Jane   William & sarah tamniglasson         
10/9/1854   gilpin   william 21 b weaver balteagh william farmer    margaret Lyness 21 s weaver tamniglasson Feliz mcilreavy?         
15/10/1854   gilpin   mary ann   James & elizabetg bealteagh          
4/3/1855   gilpin   nathaneil   John & elizabeth tamifiglasson         
11/3/1855   gilpin   dynes   dynes & judith tamnafiglasson         
9/9/1855   gilpin   amelia rebecca   william  & sarah tamnafiglasson         
8/12/1855   gilpin   dynes 19 b weaver drumgor robert gilpin weaver   margaret Lyness 20 s weaver drumgor joseph lyness weaver         
30/12/1855   gilpin   elizabeth   richard & deborah balteagh         
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: KatC on Saturday 25 July 20 15:45 BST (UK)
10/2/1856   gilpin   maria    William & Maria tamniglasson         
26/5/1856   gilpin   Susanna   George & elizabeth balteagh         
15/6/1856   gilpin   william robert    George & elizabeth balteagh         
15/6/1856   gilpin   isabella   George & elizabeth balteagh         
2/10/1856   gilpin   William Verner Gilpin 22 b farmer copney richard gilpin farmer   Eliza Jane Gilpin Ballinor james gilpin Farmer         
2/10/1856   gilpin   Eliza Jane Gilpin Ballinor james gilpin Farmer   William Verner Gilpin 22 b farmer copney richard gilpin farmer         
27/10/1856   gilpin   robert   Dynes & margaret Drumgor         
8/11/1856   gilpin   mary ann 24 weaver dalteagh henry gilpin weaver   robert brown 21 b weaver balteagh robert brown weaver         
26/12/1856   gilpin   mary 19 s weaver drumagoon dines gilpin weaver   william hewitt 21 b weaver tanificarbet john hewitt weaver          
5/1/1857   gilpin    george Tamifglassion   - 61            
31/1/1857   gilpin   alice    james & eliza drumgor         
3/5/1857   gilpin   harriet   james & mary balteagh         
24/5/1857   gilpin   thomas geoge    George & elizabeth balteagh         
21/9/1857   gilpin   mary   William & sarah tamniglasson         
20/10/1857   gilpin   jane 18 s weaver clanrola william gilpin weaver   charles fylnn 23 b weaver clanrola edward flynn weaver          
4/4/1858   gilpin   sarah   dynes & judith tamnafiglasson         
3/1/1859   gilpin   robert    William & mary Upper Seagoe         
3/1/1859   gilpin   henry john    William & Maria tamniglasson         
11/2/1859   gilpin   ann jane 25 s weaver balteagh george gilpin weaver   john best 26 b weaver balteagh henry best farmer         
27/2/1859   gilpin   john   richard & deborah balteagh         
14/3/1859   gilpin    sarah balteagh – 78             
26/3/1859   gilpin   mary jane    william & Margaret tamnafiglasson         
5/12/1859   gilpin    rachel balteagh 74             
24/1/1860   gilpin    william clonrola – 69             
28/5/1860   gilpin   22 s weaver balteagh william gilpin farmer    john dawson 28 b weaver tullyherron george dasson weaver         
3/1/1861   gilpin   goerge 25 b weaver tarosn henry gilpin weaver   rose ann coulter 28 s weaver tarson richard coulter farmer         
31/3/1861   gilpin   martha Jane    William & mary Upper Seagoe         
14/4/1861   gilpin   isabella   richard & deborah balteagh         
25/4/1861   gilpin   joseph   George & Rose tarson         
25/4/1861   gilpin   thomas henry   George & Rose tarson         
9/6/1861   gilpin   charles   Dines & judith Tamnifiglasson         
27/2/1862   gilpin   jane f s farmer balteagh george gilpin    George Armstrong f W farmer Drumgor William Armstrong farmer         
8/5/1862   gilpin   james Hamilton   John & elizabeth tamifiglasson         
26/5/1862   gilpin   jane    james & elizabeth bealteagh born 18/12/1860         
6/6/1862   gilpin   andrew  f b weaver seagoe thomas gilpin farmer    Ellen McCaughly f s weaver seoagoe isreal McCaughley farmer         
25/6/1862   gilpin   Joseph   dynes & margaret balteagh born 8/2/1862         
31/7/1862   gilpin   ellen margaret   andrew & ellen lower seagoe weaver born 20/4/1862         
27/8/1862   gilpin   mary   richard & deborah balteagh born 23/2/1862         
11/12/1862   gilpin   jane   james chambers f w royal artillery knocknamuckly  adam charmbers labourer          
26/6/1863   gilpin   sarah   james & elizabeth bealteagh born 29/5/1863         
5/6/1864   gilpin   richard   richard & deborah balteagh born 12/4/1864         
14/8/1864   gilpin    william balteagh – 64             
16/3/1865   gilpin   james    dynes & margaret balteagh born 12 /1864         
13/10/865    gilpin   dynes drumagoon – 77             
12/11/1865   gilpin   elizabeth anne   john humpjeries and eliza gilpin balteagh weaver bor 21/8/1865         
12/11/1865   gilpin   elizabeth anne   john humpjeries and eliza gilpin balteagh weaver bor          
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Saturday 25 July 20 15:48 BST (UK)

Interesting info on Jane Gilpin Dever.  I found her marriage to George Dever in PA in 1890.  He was born in Ireland per the marriage cert.  She is listed as Jennie but I've tied that name back to her on other documents so I'm confident it is her.


In Ireland Jennie was often a nickname for Jane.
See: https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Traditional_Nicknames_in_Old_Documents_-_A_Wiki_List#J

KG

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Saturday 25 July 20 16:05 BST (UK)
An Isabella Gilpin (father Richard) married a Thomas Lee, 1856, Dungannon. Her residence is Copney.

Possibly where the confusion is.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1856/09510/5446853.pdf

There is also a 1864 birth of an Isabella Gilpin, from Copney, father, Thomas.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1864/03629/2339798.pdf
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Saturday 25 July 20 16:26 BST (UK)
Is this Isabella & Thomas's daughters marriage?

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:K8NS-ZRG

1900 census

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M9Q5-JBY

Military service for Amanda 1917

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QP8J-GNHJ
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 17:04 BST (UK)
Yes, these are my g-grandparents.  Their children were: Ethel (my grandmother), Amanda (married and divorced Martin Davis), Maude (unnamed child in census...She was shipped as an infant to NJ and raised by Richard and Mary (Gilpin) McClelland.)
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Saturday 25 July 20 18:48 BST (UK)
Isabella & Thomas's grave on findagrave

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/74382497/isabella-g-wilson

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 19:26 BST (UK)
Hi

Thanks, I've was fortunate to have visited the grave in person.  I'm not convinced about the year of birth.  I have many conflicting dates on various documents.  I need their marriage certificate...I looked in the same place (Manchester, Ct) that I found my grandmother's birth cert but no luck...per census, they were married 1891 or 1892.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Saturday 25 July 20 19:52 BST (UK)
I certainly cannot find an Irish birth record for either of them in that range. Possible the names were spelt differently.
From the 1900 Conn Census, it certainly looks as though the marriage was around 1892 & that Isabella may have been with child at that time.

Could they have been married at sea?
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Saturday 25 July 20 20:02 BST (UK)
Have you looked at this marriage in Canada?

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FMVV-L8V
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 20:17 BST (UK)
Marriage at sea is something I hadn't considered...if that was the case, would the passenger list have her with her maiden or married name, I wonder?I'm

Thank you,

Law
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: eileenwilson on Saturday 25 July 20 20:26 BST (UK)
Name:   Isabella Gilpin
Gender:   Female
Marriage Date:   6 Oct 1891
Marriage Place:   Astoria, New York, USA
Spouse:   Thomas Wilson
Certificate Number:   17410

Only the index is online at Ancestry.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Saturday 25 July 20 21:13 BST (UK)
That could be them...there is family connection in NY...

Thank you!!
Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kloumann on Sunday 26 July 20 09:50 BST (UK)
Mary Gilpin, daughter of Thomas Gilpin of Copney, born 1866, Armagh

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1866/03532/2299810.pdf

Added.

From the 1900 census, it looks like they were married around 1896. They emigrated 1887 & 1889

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M9JT-S3Z

Richard's passport application, 1925

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-99D3-P9QF-9?i=675&cc=2185145&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AQV5Y-CQ4G

Gives there marriage date as 25th Dec 1895

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L9D3-P362?i=676&cc=2185145

Includes photo of them both
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Sunday 26 July 20 10:13 BST (UK)
Thomas Gilpin of Copney in 1901 Irish census.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Armagh/Killymann/Copney/1015586/

Daughters Isabella and Mary have the wrong ages........Isabella born 1864 & Mary 1866.

KG
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: Kiltaglassan on Sunday 26 July 20 10:22 BST (UK)
Death of Thomas Gilpin of Copney in 1902.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1902/05689/4603348.pdf

His daughter Mary was the informant.

KG
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Sunday 26 July 20 14:09 BST (UK)
Thanks everyone.   I struggle bc my Isabella's death certificate lists her father as Wm. V. ...but I cannot tie her to him.  Per her obit, I know she had a brother David and James alive in 1915 also...that all fits with Wm. V except Isabella!!  I'm going to check out these other families also so thank you for the leads.

Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: eileenwilson on Sunday 26 July 20 19:12 BST (UK)
Have you done your DNA?  You should be a close match to hubby's cousin who is noted as noelwilson22.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: eileenwilson on Sunday 26 July 20 19:16 BST (UK)
That online tree must be missing older children since the couple were married in 1856 and the first child shown is born 1865.
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Monday 27 July 20 15:30 BST (UK)
eileenwilson, I agree.  The online tree also didn't have David Gilpin, Wm. and Eliza's son.  So I'm holding out hope that perhaps Isabella is Wm. V's daughter born abt 1858 which would make more sense with the marriage date.  Need to do more research to prove that out...but as I've mentioned, my Isabella's death certificate names Wm. V as her father plus information in her obit and other documentation I have puts her in that family.

I have not done the DNA.

Thanks to all of you for your help with all of this!
Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Friday 06 November 20 17:31 GMT (UK)
Hi All,
With Covid etc...I finally just heard back from the City of New York Department of Records & Information Services for my request for the marriage certificate referenced in Ancestry (per eileenwilson's note above - Isabella Gilpin to Thomas Wilson 10/8/1891 Astoria, NY Number 17410).  They came back and said that they could not find a record.  Well it must exist if Ancestry has it indexed, right?...I need help with NY.  They searched Manhattan, Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx and Richmond.  Did I go to the wrong place?  I assumed Astoria was Queens.  Should I go to the NY State Dept of Health Vital Records?  Anyway, any thoughts would be appreciated.  Thanks!
Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: eileenwilson on Friday 06 November 20 17:39 GMT (UK)
The database reference at Ancestry indicates that the record comes from the the NY Department of Health:

https://www.health.ny.gov/vital_records/
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Friday 06 November 20 17:52 GMT (UK)
Thanks!  I'm going to try again!
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Wednesday 05 May 21 13:47 BST (UK)
Quick Update...NY Health Department (as cited in the Ancestry marriage index for NY) is "unable" to process records that occurred in NYC and sent me back to the NYC city clerk who sent me to the NY Health Department previously!  So a circular dead end on this marriage record until things open again and I can perhaps make a visit to look myself.  Although Isabella and Thomas' index indicates the location as Astoria in Queens in 1891...in researching it seems the records on file for Queens do not go that far back (although there is an index entry?).

I'm still leaning toward my Isabella Gilpin being a child of William Verner (mostly due to the death cert listing father as Wm V. Gilpin).  I found a notation (not proven out yet) that the Isabella who is the daughter of William's brother Richard died in 1864, so if true, no chance she is my Isabella bringing me back to mine being Wm V's daughter.

Just wanted to update you all since you gave me so much help which I truly appreciate.  I'll keep at it.  Thank you so much again.

Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: aghadowey on Wednesday 05 May 21 17:58 BST (UK)
Quote
I'm still leaning toward my Isabella Gilpin being a child of William Verner (mostly due to the death cert listing father as Wm V. Gilpin).  I found a notation (not proven out yet) that the Isabella who is the daughter of William's brother Richard died in 1864, so if true, no chance she is my Isabella bringing me back to mine being Wm V's daughter.
You can view the death certificate via GRONI (pay per view) but this extract indicates that father Richard was the informant (parents' names are not included on death registrations but informant's relationship usually given)-
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QG2T-X2P6
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Wednesday 05 May 21 20:07 BST (UK)
Hi
Thank you, that then confirms that Richard's Isabella is NOT my Isabella as mine lived to move to the US and died in CT in 1915.  Which brings me back to thinking that my Isabella Gilpin is the daughter of William Verner her dob being sometime around 1858 prior to civil records which is why I can't find her and absolutely prove once and for all she is William's daughter.

Thanks again,
Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Thursday 06 May 21 14:36 BST (UK)
eileenwilson, do you have anything that indicates Richard Gilpin (Doctor, I believe) and Dinah Thompson are William Verner's Parents?  Any siblings to William?

Thanks,
Laura
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: aghadowey on Thursday 06 May 21 14:47 BST (UK)
Belfast Newsletter, 8 Mar.1842: I HEREBY caution the Public not to ... my wife, DINAH GILPIN, otherwise ... anything on my account, as I will not pay any Debts she may contract in my name after this date. RICHARD GILPIN. LOUGHGALL, March 7, 1842.

Northern Whig, 12 July 1880: GILPIN—At the residence of her brother, William John Thompson, Carnban, Lisburn, Dinah, relict of the late Dr. Gilpin. Her remains will be removed for Interment in Lisburn Cathedral Burying-ground, on to-morrow (Tuesday), 13th instant. Friends ...
Unfortunately her brother William was the informant-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1880/06470/4861144.pdf

I did find this death- Richard Gilpin, farmer, Copney, informant- son William Verner Gilpin (signed by his mark which makes me doubt his father was the above Dr. Richard Gilpin)-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1873/020682/7256771.pdf
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: LAW1221 on Thursday 06 May 21 14:52 BST (UK)
Hi

Thank you...yes, I don't think Dr. Richard Gilpin and Dinah are William Verner's parents.  KatC about a year ago put up the Seagoe records earlier on this post and I completely missed the following...now thinking William's father is a different Richard:

2/10/1856   gilpin   William Verner Gilpin 22 b farmer copney richard gilpin farmer   Eliza Jane Gilpin Ballinor james gilpin Farmer         
2/10/1856   gilpin   Eliza Jane Gilpin Ballinor james gilpin Farmer   William Verner Gilpin 22 b farmer copney richard gilpin farmer
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: aghadowey on Thursday 06 May 21 14:54 BST (UK)
Not sure if this has been posted-
Newry Telegraph, 22 Mar.1849: On the _th inst., Copney, near Loughgall, at the advanced age of _ years, Sarah, relict of the late Mr. John Gilpin, of said place, and mother of Richard Gilpin, M.D.

Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: juli2022 on Thursday 04 August 22 18:30 BST (UK)
Moy PARISH RECORDS (ST JAMES )    Partial Gilpin extract done in 1996
It shows that Dr. Richard Gilpin who was married to Dinah was not William Verner Gilpin's father
as he is listed separately
 (a list of parishioners by townland, giving head of house and members of household, compiled in 1852 and revised to 1860)
John, Copney, 50 years, Wife Sarah 50, Richard Thompson 20, George 19,
     William James 15, Sally Regan 13, Charlotte Elisa 10.
      (All then deleted, possibly 1860 since this family moved to Canada)          M. R. P31        No. 8
Richard,Copney,  a country doctor.                                                              M. R. P31 No. 10
Richard, Copney, 47 years, Wife Rachel 47. Sarah 24, Margaret 22, David 20,
          William Verner 15, Isabella 13, Rachel 9.
Thomas, Copney, 45 years, Wife Alice Jane 35.  Richard 7, Thomas Love 9, John 5, Francis 4, Ann
             2.                (Sinclair born 1852)    (Rachel born 1862)
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: juli2022 on Tuesday 11 October 22 15:14 BST (UK)
-there were at least 2 Richard Gilpins in Copney in the early 1800's
-please review https://irishdeedsindex.net/index.php
 -specifically  memorial 5644525   Dec 28 1828  Gilpin to Matchett vol 842 pg 25
-it mentions a transaction between Richard Gilpin Surgeon and John Gilpin farmer both of Copney in the county of Armagh  and John Matchet of Derryanville in said county of Armagh farmer
-witnesses were Richard Gilpin of Copney in the County of Armagh weaver and John Courtney Gilpin of the same place weaver
-the two Richards are different people - one was a surgeon and one was a weaver/farmer
Title: Re: William Verner Gilpin Armagh Loughgall
Post by: juli2022 on Tuesday 11 October 22 15:18 BST (UK)
William Verner Gilpin was probably named after Sir William Verner 2nd Baronet (4 April 1822 – 10 January 1873  - who owned estates both in the county of Armagh and the county of Tyrone