RootsChat.Com

Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Ray T on Saturday 25 July 20 15:26 BST (UK)

Title: Unknown Boats ?
Post by: Ray T on Saturday 25 July 20 15:26 BST (UK)
A bit of a challenge for a wet Saturday afternoon - where and when?

I know nothing about this other than it's of some boats and that the water is likely to drain away if it stays tilted for much longer! Good place for water skiing perhaps?
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: arthurk on Saturday 25 July 20 16:39 BST (UK)
Judging by the number of funnels and masts, it looks like a group of three, with one or possibly two more astern.

Were there ever that many steamers at once on Windermere, for example, or might it be somewhere like the Clyde? Does anyone recognise the line of hills?
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Saturday 25 July 20 17:09 BST (UK)
hi
   yes it could be the clyde the hill line looks good
and the pier could be craigendoran the steamers
would lay up they re over night the funnels  could
be black and red of caledonian macbrayne though
i ve allways seen the rampant lion on the funnels
but it could be before my time,
the hills would be on the  greenock side of the river
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: arthurk on Saturday 25 July 20 17:30 BST (UK)
You could be right - see this picture:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Craigendoran_Pier_from_the_west,_Helensburgh,_Scotland.jpg

Not quite the same view, but some similarities.

Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: bbart on Saturday 25 July 20 18:47 BST (UK)
Rather difficult to compare given different camera angles and distances, but this looks somewhat comparable in regards to the hills?
https://www.caingram.info/Scotland/Clyde_steamers/waverley.jpg
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Ray T on Saturday 25 July 20 19:09 BST (UK)
Hmmm... I too canít get the hills to match. I thought it might be Balloch Pier on on Loch Lomond but the hills on my photo look further away.

The other problem is that most of the Clyde/Lomond ships seemto be paddle steamers which the ones in my photo clearly arenít. I would agree that if you were to monochrome a Cal-Mac funnel, it would look like those.

Off to look at Oban!

Edit - no, not oban - doesnít look like it ever had a pier like that, itís always been much the same as it is now.
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Saturday 25 July 20 23:06 BST (UK)
hi
  possible  non steamers on the clyde
TS Queen Mary build and design is similar
Duchess of Hamilton
Duchess of Montrose
though i m not convinced those are any of the ships in photo
all 3 did berth at craigendoran

i so wish my old dad was still here he sailed on all 3 and more
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Saturday 25 July 20 23:08 BST (UK)
sorry non paddle steamers that should read
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Karen McDonald on Saturday 25 July 20 23:14 BST (UK)
Could it be Barrow-in-Furness?

Added: I can't help thinking that the ships in the photo might be too big for it to be e.g. Windemere or Loch Lomond. At least one of them has lifeboats fitted.
Which is why I originally wondered about somewhere like Barrow...

Here are a couple of links, for comparison.

https://www.windermere-lakecruises.co.uk/about-us/company-history

http://www.valeofleven.org.uk/lochlomondsteamers.html


Best regards,
Karen
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Ray T on Sunday 26 July 20 12:51 BST (UK)
Whilst I wouldnít rule out Barrow, the boats, to me look more like tourist boats than ocean going liners. There are also at least five of them so it has to be somewhere ďtouristyĒ with a considerable number of people. Barrow is a bit ďon the road to nowhereĒ; more of an industrial town and I canít imagine where people would sail too or round from there.

It still seems more likely that itís either a large lake or a tourist hot-spot; e.g. the Clyde.
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Ian Nelson on Sunday 26 July 20 13:20 BST (UK)
Could I suggest Gourock / Greenock.  Princes Pier Rail Station at the West end of Greenock near to Gourock.  If all these boats were Day cruising then Gourock and Greenock would be suitable for Arran, Belfast, Dublin and Isle of Man.  My home port of Ardrossan certainly had plenty of Ships sailing for Larne, Brodick, Belfast, Isle of Man and Dublin in the 1950s, but from stone built harbours, not timber.

Is there any chance of MORE Pixels to try and identify the boats?
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Sunday 26 July 20 13:54 BST (UK)
hi
   being a gourock man myself, Ian is on the right track
though the pier is not one on our side of the river
Gourock and Greenock certainly had the capacity
to fill all those boats in the photo as
i remember the days in summers past
when you could nt find standing room on the Gourock pier,
most clyde cruises left from gourock and went to many different
places, but at night not all boats berthed there
some berthed at Kilmun some Gourock and others Craigendoran,
the first boat out was from craigendoran it was known as the mail run,
in the 50s and 60s not all steamers on the clyde where paddle steamers
other than the 3 previously mentioned there was the maids that where  smaller
than those in the photo,
unfortunately i m not old enough to remember them all,
if it is the clyde its deffinitely from the Helensburgh side of the river
and looks good for the Craigendoran pier which would certainly have had that number of boats berthed at night,
the number of steamers  that ran from Gourock back in its heyday would have been
around 12 different boats everyday
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Ian Nelson on Sunday 26 July 20 14:23 BST (UK)
with more pixels to magnify we could identify the white building high above the sea level just above the 'man in a row-boat'.  If Greenock or Gourock, this could be the Old Asylum & Poor-house or the original Ravenscraig Hospital or the Paper Mill.  just guessing though!
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Sunday 26 July 20 14:59 BST (UK)
hi Ian i think its more likely a sugar refinery asylum is red sandstone ropeworks red brick
there is few buildings it could be
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Ian Nelson on Sunday 26 July 20 15:25 BST (UK)
You could be right there.  I'd been checking older maps before the Refinery was built but I now remember it well.  As I was driving East along Drumfrochar Road I was assaulted by the most horrendous smell coming into the car, so strong it was painful enough to make your eyes water.  My companion that day was a local Insurance Agent who suggested it was because we were approaching Strone ( a local joke I found out the following week when accompanying another agent around the scheme) but we were passing the Sugar Factory at the time and we put it down to some process which produced noxious fumes.  Only later did we discover the Scotch Glue factory just around the corner which boiled up animal bones and I think used acid as well.  It now reminds me of the Academy's Technical Room where the Joiner in charge always had a tin pot of glue over a camping gaz ring for our woodwork efforts.  Hot Scotch Glue, that puts hairs on your chest, and you'll never get them off again.  My last trip along there the Sugar Factory had gone.
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: jcmac on Sunday 26 July 20 15:59 BST (UK)
I thought it could be Craigendoran but I can't quite line it up with hills.
I now think it can't be Craigendoranifthe view is from Middleton Drive - on the shore. The natural background of hills wouldn't fit. Don't know if that helps to rule it in or out?
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Sunday 26 July 20 16:35 BST (UK)
hi
  i m totally convinced myself but i m trying to i m thinking photo was taken from down on the shore
but thats guess work as to whether that would alter the hill line and the angle of the shot is more towards Langbank if this is the case could the white building be Gleddoch house or the old langbank hotel,
and Ian i ve been asking some older menbers of my familly and mentioned your smell
most reacted with Blimey quite a few of them where  brought up around there
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: KGarrad on Sunday 26 July 20 16:59 BST (UK)
I reckon it's Douglas, Isle of Man! ;D

The white building in the distance is the former Falcon Cliff hotel, I think.
See: http://www.island-images.co.uk/2017/1711/171124122356.html (more modern picture)
and: http://manxscenes.com/Nov%2004/falcon.htm
and: https://www.culturevannin.im/exploremore/places/historic-douglas-promenade-401664/

Also IoMSPCo ships had red funnels with black tops.

Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Sunday 26 July 20 17:12 BST (UK)
could right there SS Victoria is of the same build and size of those in photo
but i can t help with landscape as i m not familar with the Isle of Man
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: JenB on Sunday 26 July 20 17:13 BST (UK)
http://www.hows.org.uk/personal/rail/iom.htm

Scroll down to 'Douglas Head Cliff Railway' and look at the r-g sepia photograph. The hotel KG has identified can be clearly seen on the extreme right,
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: KGarrad on Sunday 26 July 20 17:18 BST (UK)
could right there SS Victoria is of the same build and size of those in photo
but i can t help with landscape as i m not familar with the Isle of Man

But I am!! ;D ;D ;D ;D

I've seen pictures of the ferries at the pier, back in the hey-day of tourism here.
Buggered if I can find a photo now!! ;D

Falcon Cliff Hotel is still there, but it's offices these days.
It's still painted white; it's an iconic landmark.
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: JenB on Sunday 26 July 20 17:21 BST (UK)
I've seen pictures of the ferries at the pier, back in the hey-day of tourism here.
Buggered if I can find a photo now!! ;D

Watch your language  ;D  have you looked at the photo I mentioned? Lots of ferries + the hotel.
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: KGarrad on Sunday 26 July 20 17:25 BST (UK)
I've seen pictures of the ferries at the pier, back in the hey-day of tourism here.
Buggered if I can find a photo now!! ;D

Watch your language  ;D  have you looked at the photo I mentioned? Lots of ferries + the hotel.

Apologies! :-[ Frustration creeping in.

The view on the photos, just like the original photo, is very familiar.
Must have seen something similar at The Manx Museum.
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: raonull4 on Sunday 26 July 20 17:28 BST (UK)
spot on well done
and don t worry about not finding
the photo i get that way often,
ships of the Allan line
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Ray T on Sunday 26 July 20 17:54 BST (UK)
Well done everybody, itís definitely a view across Douglas Harbour - the hotel is the clincher for me.

The Isle of Mann makes sense - my mother and father went there on honeymoon - and people from this part of the world would be more likely to visit the Isle of Mann than Scotland. The photograph was in a box of other, similarly unidentified, photographs which are certainly un-related to them.

Thanks for the help.

R
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: KGarrad on Sunday 26 July 20 18:17 BST (UK)
As for dates - pre WW1, I reckon.

Not all the ships were twin-funnels.
Postcards on this site:
http://www.simplonpc.co.uk/IOMSP.html
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Karen McDonald on Monday 27 July 20 11:05 BST (UK)
Good work, everybody!  ;D
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: arthurk on Monday 27 July 20 13:44 BST (UK)
Excellent find - worth a celebratory cider or two  8)
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ????
Post by: Karen McDonald on Monday 27 July 20 16:00 BST (UK)
Good idea! I love a glass of cider.  :P
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ?
Post by: KGarrad on Monday 27 July 20 16:21 BST (UK)
Reckon that might have been aimed at me?!
I run the Cider & Perry Bar at the IOM Beer & Cider Festival ;D ;D
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ?
Post by: barryd on Monday 27 July 20 18:20 BST (UK)
Isle of Man.

https://www.pinterest.co.uk/karenlees/vintage-isle-of-man/

My claim to fame is that I have been to the Isle of Wight and Guernsey

Title: Re: Unknown Boats ?
Post by: Karen McDonald on Monday 27 July 20 19:37 BST (UK)
Reckon that might have been aimed at me?!
I run the Cider & Perry Bar at the IOM Beer & Cider Festival ;D ;D

Now that sounds like an event worth visiting! I've just googled the Festival. To be honest, I didn't even know that CAMRA still existed.  ::) I've been away from Blighty for too long...
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ?
Post by: KGarrad on Monday 27 July 20 20:26 BST (UK)
Reckon that might have been aimed at me?!
I run the Cider & Perry Bar at the IOM Beer & Cider Festival ;D ;D

Now that sounds like an event worth visiting! I've just googled the Festival. To be honest, I didn't even know that CAMRA still existed.  ::) I've been away from Blighty for too long...

We are always looking for volunteers for the Festival ;D
Strangely, I don't need any help tasting checking the ciders and perries ;)
Title: Re: Unknown Boats ?
Post by: Karen McDonald on Tuesday 28 July 20 10:54 BST (UK)
 ;D ;D ;D

I'll make a note...  :)