RootsChat.Com

Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 07:00 BST (UK)

Title: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 07:00 BST (UK)
Hi again, folks.

Attached is a screenshot of the first paragraph of the letter Matilda Mead wrote to William Menere in September 1842. This page has a tear in it, which means two or three words will be guesswork. I have done some work on it and have come up with the following (each gap is a missing word):

Some will say I ought to apologise for sending

letters of poetry to you. I would _______ so both

think it(?) probable(?) I may fall into a(?) ________.

________ (inserted word) if _______ _______ (scrap torn) risk your

disapprobation is too ___(scrap torn).

Please feel free to correct any words I've mis-read.

Once this paragraph is sorted out I will post the final paragraph.

All ideas gratefully received! You contributors are amazing!

Thanks again,
                    Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: sparrett on Saturday 22 August 20 09:15 BST (UK)
A try from me

I would now in truth think it probable I would fall into a similar......if you now...
Sue
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 09:46 BST (UK)
Thanks Sue. That looks good. It will make it easier to work out the words in the missing torn part once I know the other words. Once the whole letter is "decoded" I will post it in the general section.

Thanks again,
                    Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Bookbox on Saturday 22 August 20 10:59 BST (UK)
Compare the letter-forms with those already identified earlier?
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=836204.0
(Iím not sure why youíve started another thread)

=====
You will say I ought to apologise for sending
letters of poetry to you. I would do so but
think it probable I may fall into a similar
error another ^time^ if you do [not expre]ss your
disapprobation in too [...]

(perhaps 'in too [something] a way'?)
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 11:27 BST (UK)
Thanks Bookbox.

That makes sense. Once I have the whole text worked out I will re-read it a few times I will start to think about what the missing words might be. She wrote in a very interesting, rather florid way, so it will be a bit of a challenge (perhaps a future topic for this site?).

I created a new post for this paragraph because I wasn't sure whether it would be lost or overlooked in the earlier post. I'll continue using this post for the last paragraph, which I'll post shortly. Thank you for both your help and the suggestion.

Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 11:32 BST (UK)
The final paragraph!

Here is what I've worked out so far:

 I have received a(?) _______ ________ - they(?)

containing _______ _________ ________ ________ hopes that

nothing(?) will(?) leave(?) _______ _______ as both in the

_________.

      I have obliged(?) to _________ (scrap before torn piece)

for their _______ opinion _______ _______ (end of word missing)

then it is reciprocated ________ _______ ________ ________

then goes back to them.      (gap).    __________ _________

than(?) being(?) lonely(?).

         __________ yours affectionately

               Matilda Mead

Thanks again to everyone who is helping.

Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Bookbox on Saturday 22 August 20 11:52 BST (UK)
I have received a letter from Mary
containing a thousand kind hopes that
nothing will prevent her seeing us both in the
Spring. I am obliged to your P[arents?]
for their good opinion and a[...]
them it is reciprocated  Give my kind [love?]
when you write to them and accept
the same yourself
from yours affectionatly
Matilda F. Mead
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 12:01 BST (UK)
Bookbox! WOW! You are absolutely amazing! That's just brilliant! Thank you SO much!

When I've typed it out I will post it for others to view and for Mead and Menere researchers to enjoy.

Thank you again!

Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Bookbox on Saturday 22 August 20 12:03 BST (UK)
It's just a suggestion. You may want to wait for any other opinions before typing it out.
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Saturday 22 August 20 12:10 BST (UK)
Agreed. I will hold off until I'm satisfied it's been thoroughly checked by everyone who has commented.

Thanks,
            Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Sunday 30 August 20 11:35 BST (UK)
Hi folks.

Attached is a dedication to Marion Menere from a book of hand-written (copied) poetry. The writing at the bottom reads, "Written on the day of her departure from London to Melbourne. May 13th 1879.

Above this is "_____________ to Marion" The first letter matches the M in Marion's name but I just can't work out the rest. All I am sure of is that it's not another name. All help gratefully received.

Many thanks,
                   Peter
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Bookbox on Sunday 30 August 20 12:15 BST (UK)
No attachment, Peter.
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Sunday 30 August 20 12:20 BST (UK)
Sorry! Brainfade on my part!
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Bookbox on Sunday 30 August 20 13:30 BST (UK)
Attached is a dedication to Marion Menere from a book of hand-written (copied) poetry. The writing at the bottom reads, "Written on the day of her departure from London to Melbourne. May 13th 1879.

Above this is "_____________ to Marion" The first letter matches the M in Marion's name but I just can't work out the rest. All I am sure of is that it's not another name. All help gratefully received.

I think this is the last verse of the poem as shown. I realise you already have this, but it may help the rest of us to identify the letter-forms in what follows:

     When Suns have waned & worlds sublime
     Their final Revolutions told,
     This Soul will triumph over time,
     As though such Orbs had never ^rolled.^


So I think it may be Ma[...]t to Marion, but I canít identify any more.

Below that, I canít read it as 'London to Melbourne'. Perhaps ...

     Written on the Eve[?] of her Departure from
     Lowood[?] to Kea...ts[?]
     May 13th 1879


Was she in Australia in 1879?
Title: Re: Matilda Mead 1842 letter - start of last page.
Post by: Peter L. Mitchell on Sunday 30 August 20 14:22 BST (UK)
Hi Bookbox.

Yes, I see what you mean about it probably not being London to Melbourne. That also casts some doubt on my idea that Marion was in England in 1879. Some background:

This dedication comes from a book of poems started by Marion's aunt, Elisabeth Mead, in 1842 when she was 12 years old. An inscription in the front of the book has Elisabeth's name and that year on one page, and on the opposite page is Marion's name and the date 13 May 1879. It appears that Elisabeth probably gave the book to Marion for her to continue writing poems in it, though exactly why she chose that time I don't know.

Marion was born in Keilor (outer Melbourne suburb) in 1857 or 1858 (birth certificate is not in Victorian records), and she would have been 21 in 1879. I've assumed that because they were a wealthy family Marion might have done a "grand tour" to the Mother country but I'm probably wrong.

There is some evidence that Elisabeth (who came out with Marion's family) was in England in 1871 (Ancestry information, which I'm not 100% sure is accurate), although it would (to me) seem odd that she would return to Australia some years later as she evidently died in New South Wales in 1911.

Given your clearly correct observation that it's not "from London to Melbourne", I'm going to have to re-think Marion's movements and precisely where and when the book was given to her.

Many thanks for your response.

Peter