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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: ABC1876 on Tuesday 01 September 20 18:45 BST (UK)
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I am one of the granddaughters of EMILY RONSON who was born in 1876 in Dalston. Having obtained her Birth Certificate, I know that her Mother was HENRIETTA RONSON but her Father's name is absent.
From the 1861 census, I know that Henrietta's Mother and Father were WILLIAM (Market Gardener) and MARY RONSON (born 1812 and 1820 respectively) and she had a sister HANNAH (born 1849) and a brother JOHN (born 1838). I have been unable to find any records for HENRIETTA.
Having hit a brick wall, I am looking for any ideas on how I can proceed.
All suggestions warmly received. Thanks.
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Welcome to Rootschat
Have you any idea when William and Mary were married
Louisa Maud
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1861, this family are in Dalston Cumberland, this family have been listed as ROWSON but corrected to Ronson
William 50
Mary 43
Hannah 12
Henrietta 6
Louisa Maud
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1851 Cumberland again listed as Rowson but corrected to Ronson
William Rowson 40
Mary Pickerby Rowson 33
Hannah Pickerby Rowson 2
John 11 Rowson
Sarah Ann 10 Rowson
Mary Elisa 4 Rowson
Louisa Maud
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1851 Cumberland again n listed as Rowson but corrected to Ronson
William Rowson 40
Mary Pickerby Rowson 33
Hannah Pickerby Rowson 2
John 11 Rowson
Sarah Ann 10 Rowson
Mary Elisa 4 Rowson
Louisa Maud
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Hi hope I can help, in 1841 HO107/164 / 20 /9 / 12 town of Cumdivock, family have Sarah ROANSON aged 0 on census transcript, her birth registration is Sarah Ann Ronson March qtr 1841 Carlisle v 25 page 64 mmn MOORE
Keyboard86
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Sarah Ann Ronson MMN Moore, agree with Keyboard
Mary Elizabeth Ronson MMN Moor
Having difficulty with the remaining siblings traces
Henrietta I can only find so far on 1861 aged 6
Hannah aged 2 on 1851 and 12 on 1861 appears to have died 1864
Louisa Maud
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Is this Henrietta on 1871c?
Anthony Ronson 1832 occ gardener
Jane Ronson Sister 1830
John Ronson Nephew 1852
Daniel Ronson Cousin 1847
Henrietta Ronson Niece 1857
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V5BL-LYD
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Possible for Henrietta in 1871? She is not living with her parents who only have John age 32 with them.
RG10 Piece 5225 Folio 50 Page 5
Barrus? House Dalston
Anthony Ronson 39 head unmarried Gardener and Seed?? and farmer of 42 acres
Jane Ronson 41 Sister unmarried Buckabant? Cumberland
John Ronson 19 nephew unmarried South Wales Tracoon
Daniel Ronson 24 Cousin Servant unmarried Newbiggin Cumberland
Henrietta Ronson 17 neice unmarried Servant Cardewlees Cumberland
Same find as you Ladyhawk ;)
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Thank you for the quick replies. I have only recently decided to try and do all this searching, and I am surprised at how addictive it has become !
I've not found a definite marriage date for William and Mary. I dont know Mary's maiden name either. I've been mainly trying to find out about HENRIETTA, my Great Grandmother. I just haven't been able to find any birth or death records.
My Grandma, Emily, died when I was 2, and my Mum used to say Emily was brought up by an Aunt - I suppose this could have been Henrietta's sister, Hannah, but I don't know. I know a lot about her after she married my Grandad in 1894 though. Goodness me, my head's buzzing !! Thanks again.
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Could this be a son of your Henrietta?
William Robert Ronson
Baptism Date - 14 Mar 1883
Baptism Place - Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Mother - Henrietta Ronson
FHL Film Number - 1472062
Reference ID: item 1 p 77
and this could be his death
Robert Ronson
Estimated birth year: about 1883
Registration March 1/4 1883
Age at death - 0
Registration district - Carlisle Cumberland
Vol 10b Page 305
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Just confirming is this Henrietta’s daughter Emily with her grandparents 1881
Cardewlees, Dalston, Carlisle, Cumberland
William Ronson Head 1812 Market Gardener Cumberland
Mary Ronson Wife 1822 Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Francis Thos Moor Ronson Nephew 1865 General Labourer Cumberland
Emily Ronson Grand Daughter 1876 Cumberland
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I'm really grateful for all these replies, I wasn't expecting it. Because I'm a novice at this, I'm still trying to get my head around all these Ronsons - and their various spellings, which makes it more complicated to research! I'm not sure where a Sarah comes into it. My best course of action for tonight is to escape from under these piles of papers and properly digest all this new information. Oh my goodness, I'll never be short of something to do now !!
There's more messages coming in ...so thanks for now. I'll no doubt be back !!!
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Could she have married?
1901 census https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XSVJ-RC5
John Hodgson Head 44 Pradford, Northamptonshire
Henrietta Hodgson Wife 44 Cardewlees, Cumberland
Elizh Hodgson Daughter 20 Carlisle, Cumberland
Sarah Hodgson Daughter 14 Carlisle, Cumberland
John T Hodgson Son 12 Carlisle, Cumberland
Possible birth entry for Sarah and John
HODGSON, SARAH mmn RONSON
1887 M Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 486
HODGSON, JOHN THOMAS mmn RONSON
1889 M Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 463
10 Sep 1890 Ch John Thomas parents John & Henrietta
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NBB3-TD3
1881c https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2WM-F6SM
John Hodgson Head 26 Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Henrietta Hodgson Wife 27 Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Elizabeth Hodgson Daughter 4 Carlisle, Cumberland, England
Robert Hodgson Son 1 Carlisle, Cumberland
Possibly Elizabeth’s birth entry
HODGSON, MARY ELIZABETH mmn RONSON
1877 J Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 551
Added and Robert’s
HODGSON, WILLIAM ROBERT mmn RONSON
1879 S Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 484
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1891 census Henrietta’s name appears as Hannah
Milton Street, Caldewgate, Carlisle, Cumberland
John Hodgson Head 1854 General Labourer Dalston, Cumberland
Hannah Hodgson Wife 1855 - Dalston, Cumberland
Mary Hodgson Daughter 1877 Winder Dalston, Cumberland
William R Hodgson Son 1879 Scholar Carlisle, Cumberland
Elizabeth Hodgson Daughter 1882 Scholar Carlisle, Cumberland
Sarah Hodgson Daughter 1887 - Carlisle, Cumberland
John Hodgson Son 1889 - Carlisle, Cumberland
RG12 Piece 4290 Folio 50 Page 8
Haven’t located a marriage entry yet
Edit to add
HODGSON, ELIZABETH mmn RONSON
1882 J Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 488
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The plot certainly thickens - so many more leads now. I was intending to log off 2 hours ago but I haven't stopped scribbling dates down and trying to work out where some of these people fit it. Very confused on the most recent post ie. Henrietta marries Hodgson and then another census shows Hannah not Henrietta ! Confusing because Henrietta's sister is Hannah ! Gee whizz. I have to log off - this is only my first evening of ancestor searching and I'm worn out !! Thanks everyone.
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Hi again, one more birth registration located:-
Hannah Rickerby ROUSON June qtr 1848 Carlisle mmn Moore
Keyboard86
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No luck locating a Hodgson/Ronson marriage ?
This looks to be the death entry for Henrietta Hodgson
Mar 1910
HODGSON Henrietta age 54 Carlisle 10b 342
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This is the problem with all the miss spellings, well done Keyboard
LM
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WOW so have I got this right...Henrietta marries a Hodgson, has a lot more children (as listed by an earlier poster this evening) and dies in 1910. Her daughter, (my grandma, Emily) born in 1876 doesn't seem to be mentioned.
I couldnt find anything at all connecting Henrietta with a marriage. Also, I've been looking for the death under Ronson, not knowing anything about a Hodgson. Now I can get her death certificate so that's definitely a result for my first day. Thank you very much. I can't believe how helpful you've all been. I really must log off, my eyes are closing!
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Same as everyone else not finding a birth entry for Henrietta - there is this baptism but it’s only a transcription
Henrietta Baptism 27 Feb 1859 Place Dalston Cumberland
parents William Ronson and Mary
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WOW so have I got this right...Henrietta marries a Hodgson, has a lot more children (as listed by an earlier poster this evening) and dies in 1910. Her daughter, (my grandma, Emily) born in 1876 doesn't seem to be mentioned.
I couldnt find anything at all connecting Henrietta with a marriage.
Also, I've been looking for the death under Ronson, not knowing anything about a Hodgson. Now I can get her death certificate so that's definitely a result for my first day. Thank you very much. I can't believe how helpful you've all been. I really must log off, my eyes are closing!
To be absolutely certain Henrietta Hodgson is the same Henrietta Ronson you are looking for
finding the marriage and obtaining that certificate would be helpful to confirm her father’s name was William.
The naming of John & Henrietta Hodgson’s children possibly after her parents and siblings!
??? I still haven’t found a marriage entry - perhaps the didn’t marry and lived together as man & wife :-\
Henrietta Ronson was living with her Uncle Anthony Ronson in 1871 I wonder if this is her father’s baptism
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:N5CP-7PT
William Ronson 29 Jul 1810 Wetheral, Cumberland
parents Anthony Ronson & Mary Little
There are lots more baptism parent Anthony & Mary on family search it’s free to use you just need to
register
https://www.familysearch.org/search/record/results?q.surname=Ronson&q.fatherGivenName=Anthony&q.motherGivenName=Mary&count=20&offset=0&m.defaultFacets=on&m.queryRequireDefault=on&m.facetNestCollectionInCategory=on
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Just confirming is this Henrietta’s daughter Emily with her grandparents 1881
Cardewlees, Dalston, Carlisle, Cumberland
William Ronson Head 1812 Market Gardener Cumberland
Mary Ronson Wife 1822 Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Francis Thos Moor Ronson Nephew 1865 General Labourer Cumberland
Emily Ronson Grand Daughter 1876 Cumberland
WOW so have I got this right...Henrietta marries a Hodgson, has a lot more children (as listed by an earlier poster this evening) and dies in 1910.
Her daughter, (my grandma, Emily) born in 1876 doesn't seem to be mentioned.
Emily is with her grandparents 1881 and she is lodging with the Thompson family in 1891
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QRFT-B2M
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Emily is with her grandparents 1881 and she is lodging with the Thompson family in 1891
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QRFT-B2M
Thankyou yes, I saw that she was their lodger (in Preston) aged 16. I'm intrigued why she moved from Dalston and travelled to Preston. The Thompson family were from Cumberland area so maybe she was friendly with their daughter Ruth who was only 4 years older, and they took her with them when they moved. Aaaagh isn't it frustrating?
Emily married my Grandad James Henry Wildmun in 1894 and from my Mum's Memoirs I know a lot about our family from then - thankfully.
Anyway, I will get the 1910 death certificate for her Mother Henrietta now that I have the information from your goodself.
I'm still not sure who the nephew Francis Thomas Moor Ronson is on the 1881 census.
Cheerio and thank you.
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Could only find a single Francis Ronson born circa 1865
Lancaster 1866 Dec qtr MMN Raby
Louisa Maud
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I may have got him!!
Francis Thomas Moore June qtr 1865 Whitehaven MMN Dewars
Louisa Maud
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Thankyou, goodness, yet another name comes into the saga. I can see why you've got all those stars in your profile, you've obviously a lot of experience at this. I'm only into day two and I've hardly moved from the sofa !!!
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Think on later census he might be married, looks as if he died in 1934, it is a nuisance all these names that pop in and out
1871 might help but I have to go to feed the other half, will hope to be back later
LM
PS, never taken much notice of the stars to be honest
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Hi their is a Moore family at Scotch St Court, Whitehaven, headed by an Ann Moore 50
Amongst the other chilfren, is an Edwin b June qtr 1861 Whitehaven mmn DUER
And a Sarah Jane b c 1853 Carlisle mmn DEWAR
Anne Maria Moore 1850 Carlisle mmn DUERS
Census ref RG10/5255/41/28
Keyboard86
PS only here to help, never look at how many stars I have!
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Oh gosh, more to confuse us with spellings
LM
Never taken notice of the stars until it was mentioned, will we get the jackpot when we reach the grand total! Just a thought
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In 1861, the Moore famly, are headed by John Moore b c 1821 Dalston
12, George Street, Whitehaven
Census ref RG09/3948/39/27
Keyboard86
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1851
John Moore 30
Ann 30
Anne Maria 6mths
Martha 10, possible maiden name DIVINE
Mary 8
George 6 poss MMN DEWARS
Joseph 4, not sure if this is Joseph Thompson in which case no MMN
Louisa Maud
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Looks as if by 1871 Ann was a widow
Ann 50
Anne Maria 20
Sarah Jane 18
Joseph 13
Mary Scott, widow poss dau Mary born 1843
Edwin 9
Francis 6
So far can't find a marriage with John to Ann but with her maiden name changing at will it makes it difficult
LM
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Hi again think Ann Maria Moore marries a Cron/Crone, in 1881 Edwin Moore is with the Cron family?
Keyboard86
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LM we’ve still got a long way to go to catch up with KB’s stars :D
I’m still trying to find a marriage for a John Hodgson to Henrietta Ronson
to check if she’s the correct person but I’ve drawn a blank ???
I have found widowed John on 1911 census with his four children, if John & Henrietta married it should be around 1871 :-\ number of children 8 (2 died)
1911 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X72M-RT2
John Hodgson Father 58 Dalston Carlisle, Cumberland farm labourer
Robert Hodgson Son 29 Newton Carlisle
Elizabeth Hodgson Daughter 26 Newton Carlisle
Sarah Hodgson Daughter 24 Carlisle, Cumberland
John Thomas Hodgson Son 20 Carlisle, Cumberland
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My goodness - thank you for all your researching. I have been printing off all your messages and doing numerous family tree scribblings and have realised that I'll need a roll of lining paper to review it all !!
My interest began with a quest to find out about Henrietta who I believe must be my Great Grandma, in order to find out more about Emily's early life. I've sent off for Henrietta's death certificate and I will investigate her baptism records, thanks to you all. I'm muckstruck though! Could I just set out what I'm understanding so far - which could so easily be way off the mark.
I'll refer to RONSON every time rather than the other variations of the spelling.
WILLIAM RONSON (b1812) marries MARY PICKERBY RONSON (nee Moor?) (b1820)
1851 census there's :
HANNAH PICKERBY RONSON (2)
MARY ELISA (4)
SARAH ANN (10) which confirms Keyboard 86 findings in the 1841 Census where she was 0.
JOHN (11)
Henrietta hasn't been born yet, she comes along in 1855.
1861 Census.
Henrietta is 6.
1871 Census
She's living with her unmarried Uncle ANTHONY RONSON and his sister .. Who is he then?
1881 Census
Henrietta is "with" JOHN HODGSON and has
ELIZABETH (4)
ROBERT (1)
[Meanwhile My Grandma Emily is living with her grandparents]
1891 Census
[Emily aged 16 is now a lodger with the Thompson family]
Henrietta still with HODGSON but listed as HANNAH (just coincidence that her sister was Hannah, but she died in 1864) and she now has the following children:
*ELIZABETH (14)
William ROBERT (12) (this is presumably the ROBERT mentioned in 1881)
*MARY ELIZABETH (is she the same one as above ie.(14)
SARAH (4)
JOHN (2)
[Meanwhile My Grandma EMILY has got married to my Grandad in December quarter 1894]
1901 Census
Henrietta still with John Hodgson and has
ELIZH (20) (can't work out if this age could be right...shouldn't she be 24?)
SARAH (14)
JOHN T (12)
[Hope you are all still awake !!!!)
OK, if that is basically right.....then I'm not sure I am going to follow up on the Moor (Moore) side and this Francis chap. I think I'd get too distracted from my objective if I start to follow "that lot" (for want of a more respectful way of putting it)!
I'd be grateful for any comments as to whether I've understood and linked everything properly and if so, this puts me in a really good position now to move on to my next bit of the family !!! Sorry - that means I'll be back !! :o
Thank you for all your help so far, it's been invaluable. I just wish I knew more about the people and their lives rather than statistics - but hey ho. It's just so good to have my Mum's handwritten memories and photos which add such a lovely dimension to all this.
Signing off....
There's another cold cup of tea waiting !!!
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LM we’ve still got a long way to go to catch up with KB’s stars :D
I’m still trying to find a marriage for a John Hodgson to Henrietta Ronson
to check if she’s the correct person but I’ve drawn a blank ???
I have found widowed John on 1911 census with his four children, if John & Henrietta married it should be around 1871 :-\ number of children 8 (2 died)
Thankyou, yes, Henrietta died in 1910 so she'd be about 55. What hard lives they all had. At least my Grandma's life after she married and had her own children, was slightly better. Goodnight and thankyou.
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Possible Anthony on 1841 ,transcribed as Transon
Possible parents
Anthony and Mary
He is also on1851 and 1861 and he has been found on 1871, because he was born before 1837 he won't have been registered as such, but with a Christian name of Anthony he shouldn't be to difficult to find a baptism for
Hope you warmed up your cuppa, we have all been there
Louisa Maud
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If you can access Ancestry family trees there's a comprehensive tree including Anthony and his father Anthony,
makes interesting reading
Louisa Maud
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My interest began with a quest to find out about Henrietta who I believe must be my Great Grandma, in order to find out more about Emily's early life.
I've sent off for Henrietta's death certificate and I will investigate her baptism records
Please come back and let us know if the d/c was helpful
Could I just set out what I'm understanding so far - which could so easily be way off the mark.
I'll refer to RONSON every time rather than the other variations of the spelling.
WILLIAM RONSON (b1812) marries MARY PICKERBY RONSON (nee Moor?) (b1820)
1851 census there's :
HANNAH PICKERBY RONSON (2)
MARY ELISA (4)
SARAH ANN (10) which confirms Keyboard 86 findings in the 1841 Census where she was 0.
JOHN (11)
Henrietta hasn't been born yet, she comes along in 1855.
1861 Census.
Henrietta is 6.
1871 Census
She's living with her unmarried Uncle ANTHONY RONSON and his sister .. Who is he then?
1881 Census
Henrietta is "with" JOHN HODGSON and has
ELIZABETH (4)
ROBERT (1)
[Meanwhile My Grandma Emily is living with her grandparents]
1891 Census
[Emily aged 16 is now a lodger with the Thompson family]
Henrietta still with HODGSON but listed as HANNAH (just coincidence that her sister was Hannah, but she died in 1864) and she now has the following children:
*ELIZABETH (14)
William ROBERT (12) (this is presumably the ROBERT mentioned in 1881)
*MARY ELIZABETH (is she the same one as above ie.(14)
SARAH (4)
JOHN (2)
[Meanwhile My Grandma EMILY has got married to my Grandad in December quarter 1894]
1901 Census
Henrietta still with John Hodgson and has
ELIZH (20) (can't work out if this age could be right...shouldn't she be 24?)
SARAH (14)
JOHN T (12)
OK, if that is basically right.....then I'm not sure I am going to follow up on the Moor (Moore) side and this Francis chap. I think I'd get too distracted from my objective if I start to follow "that lot" (for want of a more respectful way of putting it)!
I'd be grateful for any comments as to whether I've understood and linked everything properly and if so, this puts me in a really good position now to move on to my next bit of the family !!!
I think you’ve summerized very well all the info. given .
I would be happier if we could find a marriage for John Hodgson to Henrietta Ronson to be 100% certain.......we know Henrietta was on 1871 census and noted as single (census night 2nd April).
It might be worth looking for John Hodgson on earlier censuses to see where he was living and with whom.
I had a look to see if I could find a marriage for William Ronson to Mary Rickerby Moore but have not found anything.....1851 census gives Mary’s pob as Liverpool this appears to be her baptism
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Search/indexp.html
1817 Baptism St Peter Liverpool Mary Rickerby Moore parents John Moore & Mary
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ABC, I like your enthusiasm and the way you have gone about it, please let us know what info you glean on the cert(s) you have ordered , unfortunately so many names are spelt differently which really makes it more difficult
Happy Hunting
Louisa Maud
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Hi again, I was dreaming about all this last night - I never knew I had this investigative streak. It's quite funny because I'm hogging the laptop for a change and instead of nattering about miscellaneous stuff during the evening I'm finding myself suddenly saying " You see, listen to this, this is interesting.... well fancy that..... etc etc"..
I considered joining Ancestry, I believe its about £70 but it seems that certificates cost more than GRO ones. I've paid £11 but they seem to be £25. It would be beneficial I guess to have information available in one place, but I'm getting on OK with BMD and the sites you have all kindly mentioned. FreeUKGenealogy gives me access to the Census forms too.
I'm really not sure whether to join it or not - because the website is rather vague about just what you get for your money - the emphasis is on doing the free 14 day trial.
I'm intrigued to find out what the interesting reading is on the Ancestry tree for Anthony and his father. I don't feel any connection as such though because I don't really understand who he is, but maybe I'll turn my attention his way when I've written out everything else you've helped with.
I've got my lining paper ready and, having printed all the replies I've had from this helpful and friendly site, I'll be starting tomorrow to get at least my Mum's side of the family documented.
I'm a bit further on with my Dad's but I have the inevitable question marks on his Tree too - so you'll see ABC again for sure !
I really appreciate your comments. I feel sure that this is the right Henrietta, but I understand how easy it must be to latch on to the wrong one, so I'll carry on looking for any evidence that they were married.
Having never joined a site before, I must say that I'm so impressed with the responses I've had, from people prepared to give advice and help to novices like me and, unusually these days, for no personal gain - except the satisfaction of sharing enthusiam for this fascination with family history. Thank you.
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As soon as I get Henrietta's death certificate I'll let you know.
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Same as everyone else not finding a birth entry for Henrietta - there is this baptism but it’s only a transcription
Henrietta Baptism 27 Feb 1859 Place Dalston Cumberland
parents William Ronson and Mary
ABC - there’s also a baptism on family search for a Martha Ronson same date, place and parents names as Henrietta https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J3XW-NRG
Does anyone know if Cumberland Baptisms are available to view online?
GRO indexes has this birth entry
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/indexes_search.asp
RONSON, MARTHA mmn MOOR
1858 D Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 373
Possible death entry from GRO indexes
RONSON, MARTHA age 1
1859 D Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 281
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Thankyou once more. I'm still waiting for Henrietta's death certificate but it's due this week. I'm tempted to open a new topic for my Grandad's family but that might be too adventurous yet!
Does anyone have any recommendations for Family Tree Templates please, there's so many online, but I've fancied including bits of interesting information and/or pictures next to some of the people - and most templates I've seen are limited to just a name and birth, marriage or death dates. I think in the future, when I've popped my clogs, it'd be nice to have bits of notes "my grandma had beautiful long auburn hair so long that she could sit on it" - with photo evidence etc.
Speaking of clogs - one of my relatives was a clogger and had a shop on Penny Meadow, in Ashton-Under-Lyne. Crikey I need to rein myself in, because that's yet another road to travel. I can see I'll be making myself a packed lunch and a flask before long !!
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You are very keen
Louisa Maud
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Hi again, since my last postings I've been trying to get all this information into some written form and not yet found out the best format - I plan to do a search on this site and see if there are any templates.
I have now got the Death Certificate for HENRIETTA HODGSON (formerly RONSON) who died in 1910 (aged 54) at 2 Burns Court, Burns Street, Carlisle. The informant was JOHN HODGSON "Widow of the deceased" so it seems they were married.
So I've now, with your help, been able to establish that :
William Ronson b.1812 and Mary Pickerby Moore b.1820.were Great Great Grandad and Grandma.
Henrietta Ronson b.1855 was my Great Grandma, (Great Grandad unknown)
Emily Ronson b.1875 my Grandma (married James Henry Wildmun my Grandad in 1894) (After that date I know a lot about my mum's side of the family fortunately).
Phew !! Result
I'm a good way through the WIldmun side - back as far as JOHN WILDMUN b1852 married to JANE ? but I'm planning on starting another thread now I'm hooked on this malarkey!! I've never sat down as much without moving - and its much more interesting than TV !
Cheerio for now and thankyou.
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Sounds like a good result
Louisa Maud
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My Grandma, Emily, died when I was 2, and my Mum used to say Emily was brought up by an Aunt - I suppose this could have been Henrietta's sister, Hannah, but I don't know. I know a lot about her after she married my Grandad in 1894 though. Goodness me, my head's buzzing !! Thanks again.
I think this Hannah may have died in 1864 aged 15. There is another Rootschatter researching the Ronson Family from Dalston and I did some records checks for him. Hannah who died in 1864 was from Cardewlees and was buried in Dalston Church Cemetery.
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I have now got the Death Certificate for HENRIETTA HODGSON (formerly RONSON) who died in 1910 (aged 54) at 2 Burns Court, Burns Street, Carlisle. The informant was JOHN HODGSON "Widow of the deceased" so it seems they were married.
So I've now, with your help, been able to establish that :
William Ronson b.1812 and Mary Pickerby Moore b.1820.were Great Great Grandad and Grandma.
Henrietta Ronson b.1855 was my Great Grandma, (Great Grandad unknown)
Emily Ronson b.1875 my Grandma (married James Henry Wildmun my Grandad in 1894) (After that date I know a lot about my mum's side of the family fortunately).
Thanks for the update :) a shame we couldn't find John & Henrietta's marriage ???
I think this Hannah may have died in 1863 aged 15. There is another Rootschatter researching the Ronson Family from Dalston and I did some records checks for him.
Hannah who died in 1863 was from Cardewlees and was buried in Dalston Church Cemetery.
I think ABC did mention on the thread that Hannah Ronson had died 1864 - not sure if her death entry was posted
Hannah RONSON age 15
1864 M Quarter in CARLISLE Volume 10B Page 331
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Yes thankyou everyone, Hannah did die at 15 like you say. I'm happy that at the end of the day, with your help, I've established that Henrietta was Emily's Mum.
I have a feeling that the other Rootschat person interested in the RONSON family may have been trying to find out about JOHN RONSON but hopefully if he or she has wider interests then maybe these postings will be of help.
The sun has been shining and the garden has been inviting - and very unusually I've been sat inside getting to grips with a 14 day free trial on Ancestry !! AAAgh the bug appears to have bitten !!
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Keep you eye on the 14 days
Louisa Maud
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Yes, thank you, I will. To be honest I've found it a bit frustrating, probably because I'm experiencing for the first time how easy it is to look at a record and think how "nearly" it seems to fit, dates etc....only to find about an hour down the line that it doesn't stack up and the man could not reasonably have sired his first of ten children when he was ...er....13 !!! Aaaagh.
My mental arithmetic is superb now though !! :)
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Hi everybody,
I am the other Ronson researcher and Ancestry tree owner mentioned in this thread. I got some great help here a year or two ago. Finding this thread, working on it and getting in touch with ABC1876 has helped me even more so a big thank you again. The last paragraph below relates to an inexplicable frustration in this case. I suspect I have interpreted wrongly or missed something so obvious that I will be embarrassed at displaying my incompetence but I would welcome some like minded friends to quality assure this conundrum.
So in summary, Henrietta Ronson (1855 baptism but no birth - 1910) had a daughter Emily Ronson (18/2/1875 - 1952). There is no father on the birth certificate. Sometime before late 1880 Henrietta gets together with a John Hodgson (1856 - 1932) No marriage can be found but she has 5 Children with him: Robert Hodgson 1880 and then Elizabeth 1881, Sarah 1887, John Thomas 1889 and John S 1899. This all takes place in and around Carlisle.
It is not unreasonable to presume that prior to hooking up with Hodgson that Henrietta and Emily lived with William Ronson and Mary Rickerby Ronson (nee Moore), Emily's grandparents. Emily is still there on the 1881. When Henrietta then moves out - speculation I know - to live with Hodgson it could well have been that it was Hodgson who insisted on Emily not joining them but staying with her grandparents. If Henrietta was pregnant with Robert she may not have had much choice. Plus young Emily may well have had a great relationship with her grandparents. Unfortunately in 1882 Emily's Grandma Mary Rickerby dies and it seems that Grandad William now heads for Preston to be with his daughter Mary Elizabeth and her husband John Thompson sometime between 1882 and 1885. He dies there in Preston himself in 1885. One suspects that he must have taken Emily with him and, after he dies, she may well then be stranded in Preston, perhaps with people she does not want to be with and who do not want her. We believe that Emily was not treated particularly well by her Aunt. Times were hard in those days and she possibly traded being exploited as a worker in exchange for board and lodgings. We will never know for sure but I think my theories are at least plausible. Fortunately Emily's difficulty does not last too long as she marries late in 1894.
Nothing is simple in family history and I have some very perplexing information that does not fit neatly with the above or with the story of Henrietta, Emily and John Hodgson. The problems in question are the baptisms of Lizzie, William Robert and Mary Ronson all in 1883 and of Thomas Ronson in 1885 ( see records below). All at Carlisle and all were the children of........ wait for it: Henrietta Ronson. At face value we would just say that it is all explained by there being another Henrietta Ronson in Carlisle in the same era. The problem with that is that it is an uncommon name AND I cannot for the life of me find another Henrietta Ronson. I suspect I have made another howler and am not seeing something so obvious that I will be embarrassed if it is pointed out. I cannot find Births for any of these four new Ronson's born to Henrietta Ronson (ours or another). I still think it most likely that this was another Henrietta Ronson but I cannot stand that up. It could be, just, I suppose, that these are very late baptisms of children that our Henrietta had in-between having Emily 1875 and meeting Hodgson in the period 1875 - 1880 but, if so, why no births and no 1881 census entry for them. Why are they not with Emily at Grandparents in 1881 and what happens to them?
If anyone can point out any howler I have made, record I have missed or just give an opinion of what this all means I would be very grateful.
Thank you,
Neil.
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Lizzie Ronson Gender Female Baptism Date14/03/1883 (14 Mar 1883) Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson FHL Film Number1472062 Reference IDitem 1 p 77
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name William Robert Ronson Gender Male Baptism Date14/03/1883 (14 Mar 1883) Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson FHL Film Number1472062Reference IDitem 1 p 77
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Mary Ronson Gender Female Baptism Date14/03/1883 (14 Mar 1883) Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson FHL Film Number1472062
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Thomas Ronson Gender Male Baptism Date13/06/1885 (13 Jun 1885) Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta RonsonFHL Film Number1472062Reference IDitem 1 p 133
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England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Lizzie Ronson Gender Female Baptism Date14/03/1883 (14 Mar 1883)
Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson
FHL Film Number1472062 Reference IDitem 1 p 77
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name William Robert Ronson Gender Male Baptism Date14/03/1883 (14 Mar 1883)
Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson
FHL Film Number1472062Reference IDitem 1 p 77
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Mary Ronson Gender Female Baptism Date14/03/1883 (14 Mar 1883)
Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson
FHL Film Number1472062
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name Thomas Ronson Gender Male Baptism Date13/06/1885 (13 Jun 1885)
Baptism Place Holy Trinity, Carlisle, Cumberland, England Mother Henrietta Ronson
FHL Film Number1472062Reference IDitem 1 p 133
May help to look at the original baptism records for Holy Trinity Church, Cumberland to see if a date of birth is noted, giving an address and occupation for Henrietta
I think they maybe available to view on Microfilm according to the link I’ve found on family search
https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/413168?availability=Family%20History%20LibraryNotes
Microfilm of original manuscripts in the Cumbria Record Office, Kendal
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Carlisle_Holy_Trinity,_Cumberland_Genealogy#Church_records
Two of John & Henrietta Hodgson’s children were also baptised at Holy Trinity Church on same day in 1890 (reply 13 for some info. on J&H, plus birth entries for their children)
It is strange the RONSON birth records cannot be found ???
The Registration of Births and Deaths Act 1874 came into effect on 1st Jan 1875 and registration became the responsibility of the parents, or the householder where the birth took place, on penalty of a £2 fine.
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Nothing is simple in family history and I have some very perplexing information that does not fit neatly with the above or with the story of Henrietta, Emily and John Hodgson.
The problems in question are the baptisms of Lizzie, William Robert and Mary Ronson all in 1883 and of Thomas Ronson in 1885 ( see records below). All at Carlisle and all were the children of........ wait for it: Henrietta Ronson.
At face value we would just say that it is all explained by there being another Henrietta Ronson in Carlisle in the same era. The problem with that is that it is an uncommon name AND I cannot for the life of me find another Henrietta Ronson.
I cannot find another Henrietta RONSON
only the HR parents William & Mary Ronson and Niece of Anthony Ronson in 1871
these details were posted previously
1859 bpt. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JMRD-P72
1871 census https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:V5BL-LYN
see reply 2 posted by LM 1861c
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Ladyhawk,
Thank you ever so much. I think we may have solved the puzzle. ABC1876 has suggested to me that the RONSON baptisms and Hodgson children may be one and the same. Post 14 where you found the 1891 census certainly gives considerable weight to that solution especially with the listing of a William R HODGSON . Now I need to get to work checking and developing that probable solution with more evidence.