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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => London and Middlesex => Topic started by: HarryBob on Tuesday 08 September 20 08:07 BST (UK)
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Where might I find information regarding folk who lived in Castle-street, Holborn, London during the 1820s?
My interest is William ELGAR.
From Ancestry (London, England, City Directories, 1736-1943), the only entry I find has Elgar William, Coal-merch't. at 1825 living at 17 Castle-street, Holborn.
At his death 12 July 1827, in Thames-street London, Elgar was recorded as living in Castle-street.
Also, can I determine if his wife and 4 children were living with him during his time in Castle-street?
Thank you for your time.
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From the 1830 Land Tax Records on Ancestry there is a widow Elgar in Castle St, Holborn.
Ian C
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The 1830 directory has Wm Elgar coal merchant at that address
What are the names of his wife and children, so we can see if we can trace them in the area?
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"On the 12th Inst. suddenly, of an apoplectic fit, Mr. W. Elgar, of Castle-street, Holborn, formerly of Maidstone." (The Sun, 18 July 1827, The Atlas, 22 July 1827)
Various bankruptcy notices in The Gazette, 1813-1826
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/
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Children all appear to have been baptised at Maidstone, in the Non Conformist registers. According to some trees on Ancestry William was buried at Maidstone.
Ian C
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The 1830 directory has Wm Elgar coal merchant at that address
What are the names of his wife and children, so we can see if we can trace them in the area?
I saw the 1830 entry. Knowing Wm. had died in 1827, I let it slip.
Wife: Harriet Elgar (nee Smith)
Children:
Hannah Elgar (Baptized: 1815)
Henry Elgar (1816)
Harriet Smith Elgar(1817)
Margaret Frances Elgar(1818)
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Children all appear to have been baptised at Maidstone, in the Non Conformist registers. According to some trees on Ancestry William was buried at Maidstone.
Ian C
Yes, all the children were baptized as you state.
The initial challenge was finding William among the many in that area of Kent.
The burial location we have for Wm. from Ancestry is: Kingsdown (Near Eynesford), Kent, England
From a copy of the burial certificate found in records at the Public Records Office Victoria
Burials in the Parish of Kingsdown in the County of Kent in the year 1827
Name: William Elgar no 149
Abode: St Andrew Holborn London
When buried July 16
Age 54 years
I've not yet confirmed either of these pieces of information with records at the Kent Archives.
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From the 1830 Land Tax Records on Ancestry there is a widow Elgar in Castle St, Holborn.
Ian C
I don't find this transaction when I search starting with Harriet Elgar. Clearly I need a better understanding of the data available. More work is needed.
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"On the 12th Inst. suddenly, of an apoplectic fit, Mr. W. Elgar, of Castle-street, Holborn, formerly of Maidstone." (The Sun, 18 July 1827, The Atlas, 22 July 1827)
Various bankruptcy notices in The Gazette, 1813-1826
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/
We have the information regarding William's death. One stated he was walking with his wife and 2 children to catch the Margate Packet. A Maidstone newspaper when reporting William's death in 1827, stated he had been gone from the area for a few years - maybe c1825?
My initial reaction was that Harriet was returning home (?) after visiting her husband in the city. It now seems likely she (all?) were to travel down the river to Kent. Maybe to visit family?
We found 3 bankruptcy events for William. I followed up the events with the NA. The cost of obtaining information was prohibitive. I didn't take up their "offer".
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From the 1830 Land Tax Records on Ancestry there is a widow Elgar in Castle St, Holborn.
Ian C
I don't find this transaction when I search starting with Harriet Elgar. Clearly I need a better understanding of the data available. More work is needed.
Her name was not mentioned, just Widow Elgar. There were other widows on the same page. I found it by searching for William, it was on the second page I think.
Ian C
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From the 1830 Land Tax Records on Ancestry there is a widow Elgar in Castle St, Holborn.
Ian C
I don't find this transaction when I search starting with Harriet Elgar. Clearly I need a better understanding of the data available. More work is needed.
Her name was not mentioned, just Widow Elgar. There were other widows on the same page. I found it by searching for William, it was on the second page I think.
Ian C
I found what you mentioned regarding the Widow Elgar, and more to boot.
First: William appears to have been in Castle-street from 1821. There are entries for him for each year from 1821 to 1827. Farringdon Without, is used for most of the entries.
Second: Widow Elgar is there in 1828, 1829 & 1830. The first two are marked Farringdon Without, the last St Andrew Holborn.
The 1830 entry for Widow Elgar has the added comment 'Empty 4/4'. [Guess: That was when Harriet Elgar and her children left that address.]
(Now to speculate.)
The line above Harriet's 1830 entry, is for a Elizth Smith. It also notes that the flat(?) was 'Empty 4/4'.
According to the data, Elizabeth Smith had been living next door to the Elgar family from 1823.
Harriet Elgar's father John Smith, Surgeon, died in Aylesford in 1820. His wife's name was Elizabeth (from his Will). Could the lady who lived next door to the Elgar family in Castle-street, for 6 years, be Harriet's mother? I've not yet nailed down Elizabeth Smith's death. A challenging name to chase.
(Where to next?)
I've found Harriet and her 3 daughters on the 1841 Census living at Portsea Town, Hampshire, with her sister Jane and her husband John Wheeler. I need to see if I can determine when Harriet, her daughters (and her mother ?), moved to Portsea.
And there is still the matter of the children's education. Their stories in the years that follow, are driving my questions.
Bob