RootsChat.Com
Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Banffshire => Topic started by: queencorgi1 on Wednesday 16 September 20 16:28 BST (UK)
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Hello there, I have John Kemp living in Mortlach (1841 census) and described as a 'contractor'. Can anyone tell me what this might mean??
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Someone contracted to perform a trade or service? https://sites.google.com/site/bobsgallowayfamilyhistory/r-old-occupations
Kay
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Indeed, that must be so, but I was wondering if in this particular area there would be some particular product or trade -- for instance, recently I did indeed have a 'coal mining contractor' in south Wales! I don't know if the 'contracts' might have anything to do with the local distillieries?
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Sadly I don't think you can tie it to a specific job without more information. Could it relate to his later job which I think is a Lime Burner :-\
Kay
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Thank you Kay, a good point! I shall have to dig around in the organisation of the lime industry ...
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A Contractor is another word for a Builder but I didn't think they used term until much later.
Don
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My guess is that the local brickworks, or property tycoon contracted him to supply them with lime. To supply lime he had to obtain limestone from a quarry, burn it, then put the resulting lime powder into bags, which he would then sell.
I have an old stone built house and the mortar in between the stones is a lime and water mixture..
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It may be worth reading the account of the parish in the Second or "New" Statistical Account of Scotland which was written about that time. You can find it to read on-line.
I happen to have a paper copy of the First or "Old" Statistical Account from the 1790s. It says "And the vast quantities of limestone here would be an exhaustless treasure to the husbandman, if the expense of fuel were not so high, as nearly to prohibit the use of it." The ministers who wrote the Old Statistical Account are always complaining about shortages or expense of fuel. Your ancestor no doubt contracted to supply lime to farmers in the parish or further afield.
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John Kemp's younger brother Peter Kemp was a "Contractor at Lime Works" in 1871 living at Scrathie, Mortlach (where your John Kemp was living in 1841). The Lime Works would be the Richmond Lime Works. In 1851 and 1861 Peter and his family lived at Maltkiln in Mortlach. At other times, he was a labourer, although interestingly in 1891 he is recorded as a labourer working on his own account (rather than an employee). Peter Kemp was married to Ann Watson, "one of mine".
John Kemp's elder sister Margaret Kemp married James Geddes, also "one of mine". He was a crofter but ended up living at Craibston, Deskford where there was well known Lime Works too.
I see that in 1851 and in 1861 John Kemp was a Lime Burner living at Richmond Lime Works.
ScotlandsPlaces has Richmond Lime Works : named by William Cantlie Keithmore Lessee : descrobed as An extensive lime works held in lease by the Contractor William Cantlie Keithmore and is the property of the Duke of Richmond. This is dated 11 Dec 1869. Perhaps John Kemp was the previous Lessee; perhaps, even, Peter Kemp was the next Lessee after William Cantlie.
That doesn't answer your question as such but I hope it gives an idea.
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In the American language a Contractor translates into English - a Builder.
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In 1841 he was living at Srachie beside Richmond Lime Works https://maps.nls.uk/view/74426509#zoom=7&lat=5307&lon=5103&layers=BT
Kay
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Thank you all for your very helpful comments, especially Fordyce who clearly is practically a John Kemp cousin! I am investigating the Kemps for a friend, not for myself, but I think she will be fascinated by your comments. The Scotlands Places sounds a very useful resource and new to me (not a Scot as you will probably have guessed). My friend is related to the Kemps through her father, whose grandmother was Jane Kemp, daughter of Alexander Kemp, who left Mortlach to become a policeman in Sunderland. At the moment I've been pushing the line back for her and have just started (as in my original enquiry on this thread) exploring their lives, occupations and locations.
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I think at that time (and not in American English) contractor usually means someone who worked on the roads.
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OK a new question but arising out of the same family -- possibly one which Fordyce can answer?
Alexander Kemp was born 1787 but his baptism did not take place until 1799. In 1811 when his son John was born, he was baptised in the Catholic church at Buckie.
How unusual was it to be Catholic at this date in Scotland? Do you think that the delay in Alexander's baptism was in some way due to the family being Catholic?
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How unusual was it to be Catholic at this date in Scotland?
Absolutely usual. Catholicism in Scotland was centred around the Dukes of Gordon based near Fochabers. And switching between religions was also normal, as was intermarriage between the two. One example of laissez-faire was my gtgdmother, always a member of the established church, who had a row with the Kirk Session so simply flounced around to the Catholic Church and got her child baptised there. Next child: back to Church of Scotland.
In 1811 when his son John was born, he was baptised in the Catholic church at Buckie.
Alexander Kemp's children were born at Smerrick, Enzie and baptised at Preshome St Gregory RC Chapel. John was actually baptised 8 Aug 1810, born Smirack, Rathven [sic] to Alexander Kemp & Jean Murdoch.
Use http://libindx.moray.gov.uk/mainmenu.asp to check out the details and/or ScotlandsPeople to see the actual images. For example. "Preshome - 11 July 1818 - This eleventh day of July eighteen hundred and eighteen. I baptised Peter lawful son of Alexr KEMP & Jane MURDOCH in Smerack. The sponsors were Peter WEIR & Elspet GEDDES"
Many baptism events are repeated in the Buckie St Peter records, and not always exactly. ScotlandsPeople will show you that. And you'll have to decide from the images themselves whether the baptism took place at Preshome itself or in Buckie. John Kemp is there recorded twice.
Alexander Kemp was born 1787 but his baptism did not take place until 1799.
I don't recognise those birth and baptism dates for Alexander Kemp (and ScotlandsPeople doesn't have them). My notes have: "Alexander Kemp died 20-2-1872 in Enzie at age 91 - the register states his parents as being Peter Kemp & Elizabeth McIntosh (D-1872-Enzie-10). Alexander Kemp & Jean Murdoch were married 29-8-1802 at Rathven by Church of Scotland [so a 1787 birth isn't possible]: no CoS christenings have been found, all known children being baptised in the Catholic Church at Preshome." I transcribed the death details some years ago when pencils not cameras were the norm, so you'd have to check the actual image to see whether his parents were married or not - or even wrong, for I have his birth [sic] as 14 Sep 1781 Rathven and ScotlandsPeople has "KEMP ALEXANDER parents JOHN KEMP/KATHERINE SUTHERLAND FR311 (FR311) Bapt [sic] 14/09/1781 Rathven".
My interest in these Kemps was only in relation to my family tree, viz Margaret Kemp and Peter Kemp, so I only got their parents' information that happened to come my way, enough to establish they were siblings, and I wouldn't like to claim it's hard-and-fast verified.
Hope that helps! Untangling my folks in and around Enzie/Rathven has been and is a nightmare! Best of luck!
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Hi there Fordyce, what an amazing contribution! Many thanks. I attach the entry for Alexander which I quoted, which came from ScotlandsPeople. You will see that the preceding entries are for the 1790s and this one appears to refer to 1787. I think you must be right and this isn't 'my' Alexander as he would have been only 15 when 'an' Alexander Kemp married Jean Murdoch in 1802 which seems a bit on the early side! It doesn't really matter for my current purposes as I think my friend will just be delighted to have her Scottish ancestors traced back to the start of the 19th century and, as previously discussed, doing stuff with lime kilns. I will come back to what you've sent me just now tomorrow and go through it carefully but I think I can now put something together for her. Her real interest is Alexander's grandson of the same name who was the policeman in Sunderland. Thank you again -- once more I am astonished by the knowledge and generosity of RootsChat members!
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OK a new question but arising out of the same family -- possibly one which Fordyce can answer?
Alexander Kemp was born 1787 but his baptism did not take place until 1799. In 1811 when his son John was born, he was baptised in the Catholic church at Buckie.
How unusual was it to be Catholic at this date in Scotland? Do you think that the delay in Alexander's baptism was in some way due to the family being Catholic?
I am back to mid 1700s in Aberdeen for my Other Half's Catholic lines. I haven't looked at it for several years, but had to stop due to different spellings and records not released online at that time.
It used to be really easy to discover if your area of interest had a Catholic church because Genuki used to list the churches and the denominations plus it gave the dates of records available = (for example 1584 to 1805)
You'll know that the country was Catholic until the reformation in the 1500s and many Catholics sailed from Britain to Ireland for safety and only returned one or two generations later. However, there were still several Scottish churches practicing the Catholic faith of which Aberdeen and surrounding area was one place. There were other secret places to worship too, such as in London where an historic table in a pub could be swivelled over to reveal a Catholic alter (sorry can't recall name of pub).
You might find this interesting:-
https://www.stpeters-pa.org.uk/pa/st-gregorys-preshome/history-of-st-gregorys/
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Some Rathven Kemps:
1844 - Jane Kemp with child by William Reach
1832 - Elizabeth Kemp with child by William Copland
1832 - Alexander Kemp (same one as in 1828) in fornication with Margaret Ingram
1830 - Isabel Kemp on the poor list
1829 - Margaret Kemp with child by James Mitchell
1828 - Alexander Kemp father of a child by Helen Garden
1827 (and 1822) - Alexander Kemp tenant of Smearich (rent £1 per annum)
1827 (and 1822) - James Kemp tenant in Nether Clochan (rent 5/- per annum)
1827 (and 1822) - William Kemp tenant of Smearich (rent 2/6d per annum)
1827 (and 1810) - Peter Kemp tenant of Smearich (rent in 1822 and 1827 £2 2/- per annum)
1815 (and 1810) - Isobel Kemp tenant in Cottertown
1803 - Katherine Kemp with child by Alexander Fraser
1800 - Janet Kemp in Baremuir on the poor list
1797 - Alexander Kemp in Damhead paid tax on one farm horse
1797 -John Kemp in Damhead paid tax on one farm horse
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Rena, thank you so much for putting the Catholic element in context -- I found all that extremely interesting and I'm sure my friend will too.
GR2, thank you for the tabulation of Rathven Kemps! I had of course realised that the place was simply full of the creatures, but this table is a practical and helpful way of checking them out.
As I remarked above, the level of kindness and expertise on this site always amazes me!
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Expanding a little on the theme of Catholicism, there are in Banffshire two areas where the population remained staunchly Catholic right through the 18th century when Catholicism was officially persecuted. One of these is the Enzie and the other is Glenlivet.
In 1755 the laird built what he called a 'sheep-cote', and gifted it to the RC congregation for use as a place of worship. It is still is use. See https://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/3588. This is the first post-Reformation Catholic church in Scotland.
Towards the end of the 18th century it became possible to practise Catholicism openly, and a new Catholic Church, St Gregory's, was built nearby at Preshome. See https://www.geograph.org.uk/search.php?i=121672566.
In Glenlivet, a clandestine seminary at Scalan trained Catholic priests in secret throughout the 18th century. See https://www.scalan.co.uk/ and https://www.geograph.org.uk/gridref/NJ2419.
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Hi Fofarian, thank you for that and especially for the 'sheep cote' -- brilliant! Could you possibly give an ignorant southerner some idea of how near the Catholic strongholds you mention are to Rathven?
Also if anyone knows of any nice online pictures of Rathven/Buckie/Damhead and indeed Mortlach I'd be very grateful as it would be lovely to give my friend some idea of the area where her ancestors lived. She's very excited about the prospect (Covid permitting) of making the trip north!
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The Enzie basically contains the western part of the parish of Rathven and part of the parish of Bellie. Its history is rather complicated, so I won't go into it here. You can read about Rathven in the Statistical Accounts at https://stataccscot.edina.ac.uk/static/statacc/dist/parish/Banff/Rathven.
Glenlivet is at the other end of the county of Banff, about 40 miles or an hour or so by car from Buckie, which is the largest town in the parish of Rathven. Most of it is in the parish of Inveraven or Inveravon. See https://stataccscot.edina.ac.uk/static/statacc/dist/parish/Banff/Inveraven.
You can find photographs of all these areas at www.geograph.org.uk.
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Thank you Forfarian! I found those links very helpful.
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You're very welcome.