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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: YB2019 on Saturday 07 November 20 15:34 GMT (UK)
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Hello,
I have just received the death certificate of my 3X Great Grandmother and her cause of death is listed as 'Syncope'. After a quick internet search I have found that syncope isn't usually a cause of death and normally refers to something else such as a heart attack etc.
Has anyone else had this written on a death certificate?!
Thanks in advance :)
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Yes, Syncope is listed under cause of death on several certificates I have.
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I have it on one of mine as well. She was a 17yr old girl
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Apparently the use of syncope on certificates is now frowned upon as it describes a mode of death whereas the certificate should indicate a cause of death.
Stan
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Oh thanks everyone.
I suppose it could contribute to a cause of death but not be the main cause. My 3X Great Grandmother was only 33 when she died so quite young. I guess it will remain a mystery haha.
Thanks again :)
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Syncope is a clinical syndrome defined as a relatively brief and self-limited transient loss of consciousness. However, in some instances, syncope may be due to more worrisome conditions (particularly those associated with cardiac structural disease or channelopathies), and, in such circumstances, syncope may be an indicator of increased morbidity and mortality risk, including sudden cardiac death (SCD).
Syncope and the risk of sudden cardiac death: Evaluation, management, and prevention
September 2017Journal of Arrhythmia http://www.rootschat.com/links/01q0j/
Stan
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I have found many older death certificates list mode of death rather than cause. We do have better understanding now and I don't think they were as strict historically as they are now. I have one where it says "Heart stopped"
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Well..... "Heart stopped" was pretty accurate, at least.
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Well..... "Heart stopped" was pretty accurate, at least.
Well the way I see it (and my colleagues agreed) was that that was not the cause of death that was the process of death. Something caused the heart to stop and THAT was the cause of death.
BTW my colleagues certify cause of death
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Syncope can be brought on with a bout of sneezing, particularly dangerous when driving a car.
Skoosh.
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I am glad you have posted asking these question as I have recently got a death cert for a paternal Grt Grandmother. Cause of death was
1) Syncope (with the second cause as bowel cancer).
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As Stan points out, Syncope was often used historically but is now one of the things listed as "modes of dying" which are no longer acceptable as a cause of death, because they describe how someone died rather than why. They can still appear but must be supported by an acceptable cause.
Other modes of dying that are listed in the manuals as not acceptable would include things like "cardiac arrest" "coma" "asphyxia" and many others.
If the doctor does give a cause of the death that is unacceptable (and they quite often do), then the registrar may have to negotiate with the doctor for amended paperwork to be issued before the registration could be done or refer it to the coroner for them to sort out.
My favourite response when I spoke to a GP and asked for a clearer cause of death was "well I've absolutely no idea really, could have been half a dozen things, what shall I put down ?"
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A friend of mine recently died in a canal
At the inquest
vaso vago syncope was discussed as a possible contributing factor .
I was diagnosed with this recently and it was explained to me as a tendency to faint have to keep salt levels and hydration.levels up
Fainting during or before fall in canal meant drowning could not be ruled as Cause of death for him
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Really interesting. (One does learn a great deal on here)
TY
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Really interesting. (One does learn a great deal on here)
TY
Couldn't agree more! Very interesting and enlightening as always. Thanks everyone :)
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From https://geekymedics.com/certification-death-uk-osce-guide/
Completing the death certificate.
A few things that you CAN NOT write as a disease or condition that led directly to death:
“Failures” as a sole 1a (e.g. heart/kidney/liver/respiratory failure). However, it is ok to use congestive cardiac failure.
Asphyxia
Asthenia
Cachexia
Cardiac arrest
Coma
Exhaustion
Old age/frailty as a sole cause of death: this can only be used in patients who are over 80 years old.
(While there is no statutory age limit or restriction on referring to ‘old age’, a death certified as due to old age or senility alone will usually be referred to the coroner, unless the deceased was 80 or older)
Stan
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The guidance on Old Age (alone) as a single cause of death does have other suggested conditions attached (in addition to being over 80) and does say it should only be used in "very limited" circumstances.
In practice it is used quite often....
Interestingly the rules on causes of death don't apply to coroners - they do tend to follow them, but don't have to and can put just about anything they decide.