RootsChat.Com
General => The Stay Safe Board => Topic started by: LizzieL on Friday 08 January 21 12:44 GMT (UK)
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third one approved now
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55586410
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Coronavirus: 'Major incident' declared in London
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-55588163
Sandra
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Article on the use of ionisers to fight Covid 19, these things are not that expensive, from £15 upwards but apparently not good for asthmatics, worth checking,
https://www.thenational.scot/news/18351414.coronavirus-ionisers-may-key-fight--defeat-covid-19/
https://www.which.co.uk/news/2020/03/coronavirus-can-an-air-purifier-protect-you/
Skoosh.
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On the news last nght was an item about the innoculations. apparently people have been standing at the end of queues because news has circulated that there's often some vaccines left.
Also on the news was the American Hospital that had received its first vaccines and the first to be innoculated were the hospital managers !
I've just had a phone call to to ask if I would like to be innoculated (Yes please).
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Mom had the pfizer vaccine today. Her gp surgery contacted her 2 days ago. The living well centre was used, just down the road from gp practice.This is bloxwich walsall and there are supposed to be 4 hubs opening. I think she had the pfizer vaccine because the Manor hospital less than 10 mins away is a storage hub for it
Rena , a birmingham labour councillor was the one who stood in the queue and there was an article i think msn that i read. They said if people just turn up without an appointment then they will sent away but other centres offer to people from odd comments i see, Also it was a birmingham group of hospitals where some executives were given left over vaccines rather than the front line staff and obviously staff were n't happy. I also seen an article about american congress people getting the vaccine in one of the offices. Yes important not to waste but the MP was daft to adverise it and jeremy vines lot obviously had n't researched enough. Think the MP had previously had a renal transplant if my memory serves me correct.
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Todays Figures
62,322 new cases
more than 1,000 deaths.
Sandra
Figure was 1041
Todays figures
52618 new cases (that's down on yesterday - good)
1162 deaths ( not good) :'(
Sandra
Todays fgigures are up on cases and deaths
68,053 New cases
1325 deaths :'(
R number 1.0 - 1.4
Sandra
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There was a scammer turned up on someones doorstep in surbiton and said they were nhs and had come to vaccinate her against covid . It cost £160 but was told it could be claimed back from he nhs. She felt a jab in arm. The person went back in a few days for £100.
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There was a scammer turned up on someones doorstep in surbiton and said they were nhs and had come to vaccinate her against covid . It cost £160 but was told it could be claimed back from he nhs. She felt a jab in arm. The person went back in a few days for £100.
I posted that earlier on this thread
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=842467.0
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I was insensed tonight when I listened to the manager if a football club saying that all professional footballers should be vaccinated rather than having tests because so any are testing positive and games are having to be cancelled... 😤😤😳😳😱😱... I hope someone’s going to put him right and that they should be at the bottom of the list! Who do they think they are....
What the heck are they playing for anyway ... if they behaved themselves... didn’t flout the rules, jump all over one another and hug every-time they score a goal it wouldn’t happen...
Sorry.. rant over now!
Caroline
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Poor things, my heart bleeds for them (NOT!!) Don't they think that the care workers and their grandparents are more deserving?!! >:( (No need to answer that.... )
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Several different groups are now arguing that they deserve priority in the vaccination queues, for example teachers and policemen. Each group can put forward a good reason why they should be prioritised, but how is the government to decide? I suppose it depends on which angle they are coming from - put the most vulnerable first or put essential workers first? I'm glad I don't have to make that decision.
Very happy to receive a phone call yesterday from my GP's surgery inviting me to go for the jab next Saturday. This is because I'm one of the older age group, by the way.
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Several different groups are now arguing that they deserve priority in the vaccination queues, for example teachers and policemen. Each group can put forward a good reason why they should be prioritised, but how is the government to decide? I suppose it depends on which angle they are coming from - put the most vulnerable first or put essential workers first? I'm glad I don't have to make that decision.
Very happy to receive a phone call yesterday from my GP's surgery inviting me to go for the jab next Saturday. This is because I'm one of the older age group, by the way.
It is very difficult to decide who should go first in the list....
whilst I appreciate that those in the older groups need protecting... if we want the children to get on with their education, after all they will be the people earning and supporting the country with taxes in the future ,
I do feel that we have an obligation to vaccinate all teachers so they’re able to get on with their jobs and allow parents to get back to work...after all if they’d wanted to be teachers they’d have trained in the first place.
There are going to be thousands of children whose education will suffer enormously because perhaps the home situation will not be able to assist whereas more affluent children will continue to prosper...
But I’m still of the opinion that professional footballers are not near the top of the list!
I wouldn’t want their job either!
I’m pleased to hear you will be getting your vacation next Saturday...
Caroline
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With regard to who should be vaccinated first:
The vaccination program is primarily designed to prevent the overwhelming of the NHS. Something like 85% of all deaths from Covid are from people over the age of 70 and those deemed to be CEV. Therefore if you can reduce the risk to those people then you remove the pressure on the NHS and all the subsequent knock on impacts. People under 70, and thus much of the working population, can still get poorly but up to now seem to have not required as much medical attention.
Whether that continues with this new strain is up for debate.
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Children, according to many reports, aren't very effective spreaders of Covid, in contrast to other respiratory viruses. As yet efficacy and safety testing on children has not been done in detail (it's unethical to carry out clinical trials on people who can't give informed consent). Although teachers have causght Covid, and there have been deaths, international studies have shown, rather surprisingly, that they are not at significantly higher risk than the general population.
But new data is published practically daily and when the facts change one can expect policy to change in reponse.
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2 new cases identified yesterday on IoM - one of them a primary-school pupil.
They attended School on Tuesday and Wednesday, and showed no symptoms of the virus, which was then identified in pre-admission screening ahead of a medical procedure.
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Children, according to many reports, aren't very effective spreaders of Covid, in contrast to other respiratory viruses.
At what point, in terms of physiology, do children become adults? Is it c. 13 when puberty is established - i.e. if you can reproduce you are an "adult"?
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Is it not 16 age of consent? Not sure.... in days gone by it was 12 wasn’t it?
I wasn’t advocating children be vaccinated by the way in my previous post.... I just felt teachers should be higher up on the scale...
I do understand too that there are more younger people now in hospital having listened to a variety of medical staff being interviewed.... so it’s not just the elderly who are being affected....
Caroline
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Is it not 16 age of consent? Not sure.... in days gone by it was 12 wasn’t it?
Caroline
Not connected with age of consent. The ethical issue which will determine whether an investigation is permitted is full understanding of the possible outcomes. Ethics committee will not allow research on people who do not have ability to give informed consent. In different circumstances the Gillick case is relevant, as is the ongoing controversy over the Tavistock Clinic.
The unfortunate consequence is that many medicines are not licensed for children.
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I do think that teachers and other staff who work in schools should be amongst the first vaccinated. My great nephew who is in year 10, so studying for GCSEs, was off school for two separate periods of 10 days each time before Christmas. Not because any of his bubble had been in contact with the virus, but simply because there weren't enough teachers as they were isolating. If the Government wants to keep schools open, they need to make sure that staff are protected.
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The Queen and Prince Phillip vaccinated today :)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55602007
Sandra
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"Are Covid patients getting younger?" BBC report today.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55586994
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I do think that teachers and other staff who work in schools should be amongst the first vaccinated.
Some will be in categories on the priority list, due to age or health condition.
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They need to sort out the definition of a key worker.
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Rather strange map of vaccination centres on the BBC tonight.
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I seem to have moved to Wigton ::) ::) ::)
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I seem to have moved to Wigton ::) ::) ::)
And Bristol has leap-frogged Cardiff. Manchester is even wetter than usual.
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Source - NHS England
Add - this seems better
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/976/cpsprodpb/12410/production/_116386747_uk_hospital_hubs_640_map_5jan-nc.png
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It will be interesting in Australia to see which of the three vaccines go where in the country.
The government has all three on the books to be supplied when the authorities have done their checking.
The two American vaccines require storage at -70o C, whilst the UK one can be stored at normal refrigeration temperature.
There will not be many places outside the major cities which will be able to handle the -70o vaccines, as they do not have the basic facilities for that sort of temperature.
AC
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Rather strange map of vaccination centres on the BBC tonight.
Birmingham has joined Bristol in Wales. Population of Wales doubles at a stroke!
Manchester is a port but it's not Manchester-on-Sea, unless coastal erosion took a giant leap overnight.
There's been talk about English devolution but cities so desperate to escape central rule that they move a hundred miles is drastic.
There was a map once which removed Wales completely.
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Let's hope the people administrating the vaccine are more accurate than that map, or goodness knows where the needle will be stuck! ;D ;D
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To be fair, I think the map is only supposed to denote the approximate area, the yellow dot on the left is a light not a marker.
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Let's hope the people administrating the vaccine are more accurate than that map, or goodness knows where the needle will be stuck! ;D ;D
:o ??? ::) :P :-X :-X :-X :'( :'(
Could be painful
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I seem to have moved to Wigton ::) ::) ::)
If you're in Wigton then I'm in the middle of the Irish Sea :-X
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If it's where they say it is, it's in one of the daftest places in the city - There's hardly any parking up there and public transport means at least one bus change.
There are lots more suitable places with parking facilities and better public transport.
It's probably easier to get to Wigton !
Add - mayhem. They sent letters out to say when it would open and to make an appointment. Consequently, a large number just went along without an appointment and many 80-90 yr olds had to stand in a line for about an hour in the cold.
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Really interesting piece in Nature. The fact that we already have vaccines of known high efficacy makes testing new vaccines very difficult as it's no longer ethical to hold randomised placebo-controlled double-blind trials. https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00015-0 - this link I think will work. You cansign up for daily briefing emails from the home page.
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2 new cases identified yesterday on IoM - one of them a primary-school pupil.
They attended School on Tuesday and Wednesday, and showed no symptoms of the virus, which was then identified in pre-admission screening ahead of a medical procedure.
Has anyone speculated as to how these cases occurred KG , as you said how strict your entry quarantine was for entrants or rentrants to the isle and you'd been doing so well keeping it out ?
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2 new cases identified yesterday on IoM - one of them a primary-school pupil.
They attended School on Tuesday and Wednesday, and showed no symptoms of the virus, which was then identified in pre-admission screening ahead of a medical procedure.
Has anyone speculated as to how these cases occurred KG , as you said how strict your entry quarantine was for entrants or rentrants to the isle and you'd been doing so well keeping it out ?
Residents have been allowed to travel to the UK for some time.
They have to self-isolate on return.
Currently Covid tests are taken on day 1, day 7 and day 13 of the 14 day isolation.
Of the 30 positive active cases, 9 were detected during those tests.
So, it looks like the virus is now in the community.
Suspicion on social media, and street chat, is that some of the returnees didn't follow self-isolation rules properly?
It's a worry :o
I am currently staying home, except for shopping twice per week.
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This is the problem with self isolation - you rely on people doing it properly.
My friend is South African, but she and her husband have lived and worked in Qatar for over 10 years. They had been home to South Africa for Christmas, but had to cut their holiday short after the new strain was discovered, as they were worried they wouldn't be allowed back into Qatar. They were met at Doha airport by officials and escorted out to a designated hotel. They had to stay in the room there for 10 days, with meals being delivered to the door. All this was at their own expense. They were tested on arrival and again before they were allowed to leave quarantine. My friend said it will be a very long time before they book a holiday in a hotel again! ;D
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This is the problem with self isolation - you rely on people doing it properly.
My friend is South African, but she and her husband have lived and worked in Qatar for over 10 years. They had been home to South Africa for Christmas, but had to cut their holiday short after the new strain was discovered, as they were worried they wouldn't be allowed back into Qatar. They were met at Doha airport by officials and escorted out to a designated hotel. They had to stay in the room there for 10 days, with meals being delivered to the door. All this was at their own expense. They were tested on arrival and again before they were allowed to leave quarantine. My friend said it will be a very long time before they book a holiday in a hotel again! ;D
Very similar to what is in force in Australia for international arrivals.
Even between states, some of the restrictions apply.
One couple arrived in Victoria, by plane, from the "hot spot" of NSW, and headed for the aircraft to Adelaide. The Vcs were not happy, and caught up with them, and fined them $9000 each. They will probably pay the same way as the international arrivals do, not at all. :-X
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A love-sick Scot crossed to the IOM on a water-scooter thing! Sadly the guy ended up in court. No respect! ;D
Skoosh.
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A love-sick Scot crossed to the IOM on a water-scooter thing! Sadly the guy ended up in court. No respect! ;D
Skoosh.
Yep! 4 hour journey on a jet-ski :o
Followed by a 15 mile walk to Douglas.
Unfortunately, he didn't have permission to cross the borders, so received a 4 week prison sentence (commuted to 2 weeks).
He has subsequently applied for permission, but was refused.
UPDATE:
The jet-ski is for sale on eBay! ;D
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Several different groups are now arguing that they deserve priority in the vaccination queues, for example teachers and policemen. Each group can put forward a good reason why they should be prioritised, but how is the government to decide? I suppose it depends on which angle they are coming from - put the most vulnerable first or put essential workers first? I'm glad I don't have to make that decision.
The Education Secretary now saying that school staff should be prioritised.
The government is aiming to offer vaccinations to around 15 million people in the UK - the over-70s, older care home residents and staff, front-line healthcare workers and the clinically extremely vulnerable - by mid-February in the first wave of immunisations.
But Mr Williamson told MPs he believed school staff were the "top priority" for the next phase of the vaccine rollout.
He told the Education Select Committee: "There's a school workforce of a million and it is absolutely vital that we do not forget support staff in this because it is often the support staff that are the most exposed.
"I think there is a special need in the area of special schools as well where there is often a crossover between not just an education setting but also as a care and health setting as well.
"It is quite understandably right that the government has chosen to prioritise those that are most at risk of being hospitalised (for vaccination).
"But... in that next wave where we have to prioritise others, I will make no apology for the fact that I see the top priority as all those who work in schools.
"Not just teachers, but all those that work in schools because every single one of them is absolutely vital for delivering education."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-55643842
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I agree with him, if we want to get children back to school we need to get teachers and support staff vaccinated. I have young relatives who have been off school several times, not because anyone in their bubble has caught Covid, but because staff have it, or have to self isolate, so there aren't enough staff in school. Also if schools or year groups in schools have to close, that means parents have to take time off work.
Most older people are being careful and staying in, so we can wait a few more weeks if necessary.
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Apparently Indonesia are vaccinating frontline workers first, followed by 18 - 59 year olds.
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Apparently Indonesia are vaccinating frontline workers first, followed by 18 - 59 year olds.
Makes sense - they are the ones who are having to go out to work to keep the rest of us going. I've said before on here that I think they should have been done first, the younger generation (ie anyone younger than me - 72) have really stepped up right from the start to look after us older people & keep the country going.
I heard from a care worker acquaintance this morning that 'we've got a case of Covid in the Home'. This must have been brought in by a member of staff surely. That's why I think they should have been jabbed by now.
But I do appreciate the programme is taking a while to roll out...... Same old story
Pat
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Apparently Indonesia are vaccinating frontline workers first, followed by 18 - 59 year olds.
That looks to be partly due to the vaccine they're using hasn't yet been approved for those aged 60+.
News.com.au
Indonesia’s very different vaccine plan
13 Jan 2021
https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/global/indonesia-takes-very-different-approach-to-mass-vaccination-program/news-story/9bc6208167f30aece656c4fa8185ebd3
Younger people will be first in line to receive the jab in the initial phase of the rollout that began on Wednesday, a strategy that stands in stark contrast to most other nations that are starting with older and more vulnerable populations.
Health officials the archipelago of nearly 270 million people say the distribution of the jab developed by China’s Sinovac will start with the working age population because regulators have not yet approved it as safe for the over-60s.
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I agree with him, if we want to get children back to school we need to get teachers and support staff vaccinated. I have young relatives who have been off school several times, not because anyone in their bubble has caught Covid, but because staff have it, or have to self isolate, so there aren't enough staff in school. Also if schools or year groups in schools have to close, that means parents have to take time off work.
Most older people are being careful and staying in, so we can wait a few more weeks if necessary.
I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
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For those of you who haven't seen it, the UK's JCVI's document detailing their advice for priority groups and phases is worth a read as it shows how they reached their conclusions. It has a long list of references, of data and reports, that they took into consideration, including occupational risks.
Personally, I can't see the government and health service deviating from the JCVI's advice, at least for Phase 1.
GOV.UK
Updated 6 January 2021
Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation: advice on priority groups for COVID-19 vaccination, 30 December 2020
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/priority-groups-for-coronavirus-covid-19-vaccination-advice-from-the-jcvi-30-december-2020/joint-committee-on-vaccination-and-immunisation-advice-on-priority-groups-for-covid-19-vaccination-30-december-2020
Vaccine priority groups: advice on 30 December 2020
Phase 1 – direct prevention of mortality and supporting the NHS and social care system
JCVI advises that the first priorities for the COVID-19 vaccination programme should be the prevention of mortality and the maintenance of the health and social care systems. As the risk of mortality from COVID-19 increases with age, prioritisation is primarily based on age. The order of priority for each group in the population corresponds with data on the number of individuals who would need to be vaccinated to prevent one death, estimated from UK data obtained from March to June 2020:
1. residents in a care home for older adults and their carers
2. all those 80 years of age and over and frontline health and social care workers
3. all those 75 years of age and over
4. all those 70 years of age and over and clinically extremely vulnerable individuals
5. all those 65 years of age and over
6. all individuals aged 16 years to 64 years with underlying health conditions which put them at higher risk of serious disease and mortality
7. all those 60 years of age and over
8. all those 55 years of age and over
9. all those 50 years of age and over
It is estimated that taken together, these groups represent around 99% of preventable mortality from COVID-19.
The next phase – further reduction in hospitalisation and targeted vaccination of those at high risk of exposure and/or those delivering key public services
As the first phase of the programme is rolled out in the UK, additional data will become available on the safety and effectiveness of COVID-19 vaccines. This data will provide the basis for consideration of vaccination in groups that are at lower risk of mortality from COVID-19.
The committee is currently of the view that the key focus for the second phase of vaccination could be on further preventing hospitalisation.
Vaccination of those at increased risk of exposure to SARS-CoV-2 due to their occupation could also be a priority in the next phase. This could include first responders, the military, those involved in the justice system, teachers, transport workers, and public servants essential to the pandemic response. Priority occupations for vaccination are considered an issue of policy, rather than for JCVI to advise on. JCVI asks that the Department of Health and Social Care consider occupational vaccination in collaboration with other government departments.
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I agree with him, if we want to get children back to school we need to get teachers and support staff vaccinated. I have young relatives who have been off school several times, not because anyone in their bubble has caught Covid, but because staff have it, or have to self isolate, so there aren't enough staff in school. Also if schools or year groups in schools have to close, that means parents have to take time off work.
Most older people are being careful and staying in, so we can wait a few more weeks if necessary.
I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
I think that's uncalled for, ReadyDale.
I won't be engaging further, but I just wanted to mention that to you.
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I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
Have taught for over 30 year before retiring, I totally disagree with that and in fact find it offensive. From speaking to colleagues who are still teaching, it is far harder at the moment than it is normally. Most teachers are having to prepare two lessons - one for those children at home and one for those in school. They are also presenting these lessons to those at home in the form of Google Classroom or similar. In a lot of schools the staff take it in turns to go in to cover the increasing number of children who are attending school, they certainly aren't sitting at home on holiday! Teachers want to get back to what they are trained to do and that is teach children in school.
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UPDATE:
The jet-ski is for sale on eBay! ;D
In good working order, low mileage, one careful owner - used once only.
:)
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No doubt it is possible to make a compelling case for several professions to be a priority case for receiving the vaccine but the order, which seems to have been adopted by all four UK nations, has been decided by the JVCI, an independent body.
Here, in Wales, the "roll out" of the vaccine has been slow and it seems we have the lowest rate of administering it in the UK. Our First Minister, Mark Drakeford, made a statement saying that the vaccination programme was "not a sprint". Mmmmm ..... I have no argument with that because it is a marathon, but one which must be run at the rate of a sprint throughout its entirety.
Yesterday in Cardiff and Vale Health Board nineteen people failed to attend for their vaccinations. Whilst I appreciate some may have a valid reason for this, I am sure some certainly will not. I don't know how much this is being replicated across the UK but I hope it is not widespread.
:)
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I echo Groom's comment and reaction completely. Teachers I still know in the job are really frustrated, and worried, and trying very hard to do several impossible tasks at the same time, with many people sniping at them, usually from a not-very-well-informed position.
So no change there, then?
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I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
That's totally out of order! >:( >:(
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I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
That's totally out of order! >:( >:(
Please note, I said "Teachers' Unions", NOT the teachers themselves, who are doing a brilliant job under extreme circumstances
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I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
That's totally out of order! >:( >:(
Please note, I said "Teachers' Unions", NOT the teachers themselves, who are doing a brilliant job under extreme circumstances
Teaching Unions, including those who make the decisions, are made up of teachers or ex teachers, they have the safety of staff and pupils in mind, they don't tell them to refuse to go into school just for the sake of it.
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No doubt it is possible to make a compelling case for several professions to be a priority case for receiving the vaccine but the order, which seems to have been adopted by all four UK nations, has been decided by the JVCI, an independent body.
Here, in Wales, the "roll out" of the vaccine has been slow and it seems we have the lowest rate of administering it in the UK. Our First Minister, Mark Drakeford, made a statement saying that the vaccination programme was "not a sprint". Mmmmm ..... I have no argument with that because it is a marathon, but one which must be run at the rate of a sprint throughout its entirety.
Yesterday in Cardiff and Vale Health Board nineteen people failed to attend for their vaccinations. Whilst I appreciate some may have a valid reason for this, I am sure some certainly will not. I don't know how much this is being replicated across the UK but I hope it is not widespread.
:)
As I read the BBC report, the Education secretary was advocating teachers should be given priority after the first wave, i.e groups 1 - 4 and get ahead of the 65 - 69 year olds and the clinically vulnerable through certain medical conditions.
"The government is aiming to offer vaccinations to around 15 million people in the UK - the over-70s, older care home residents and staff, front-line healthcare workers and the clinically extremely vulnerable - by mid-February in the first wave of immunisations.
But Mr Williamson told MPs he believed school staff were the "top priority" for the next phase of the vaccine rollout."
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I'm sure the teachers' unions will still find reason to oppose returning ::)
That's totally out of order! >:( >:(
Please note, I said "Teachers' Unions", NOT the teachers themselves, who are doing a brilliant job under extreme circumstances
Teaching Unions, including those who make the decisions, are made up of teachers or ex teachers, they have the safety of staff and pupils in mind, they don't tell them to refuse to go into school just for the sake of it.
Maybe so, but in my dealings with them through work and how they portray themselves in the media, they seem to have a "Can't Do" attitude.
Similarly, many of the teachers my work brings me in to contact with do not have the best of opinions of their union's bosses.
But I appreciate different people have different opinions.
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If the Government's plan for vaccination is ambitious at 13 million doses, (2 million per week) by mid Feb, in order to vaccinate all over 70s, then it surely needs to be even more ambitious after February. In order to get everyone vaccinated by autumn or even the additional 20 million, in the plan, over 50 and under 70 by spring, will it not have to increase its vaccination programme to 4 million per week? They have decided that 12 weeks can be left between first and second doses in order to maximise the number of first doses given, but that can only ever "buy" the initial twelve week gap, then in order to keep everything on track and achieve "herd" immunity (80% vaccinated) by autumn, there will surely need be the 2 million vaccines per week for the first timers, in addition to those receiving the follow up dose!
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Quote from ReadyDale regarding teachers:
"....Maybe so, but in my dealings with them through work and how they portray themselves in the media, they seem to have a "Can't Do" attitude."
I think this is outrageous and I am shocked that anyone would post something like this, which is both rude and dismissive of the huge debt of gratitude we owe teachers, who have struggled to keep schools open for the past year, many of whom have died or become seriously ill with covid.
To use the phrase "how they portray themselves in the media" shows the most blatant ignorance of how the media works. The teachers are not responsible for how the media portrays them. Generally speaking, we are all at the mercy of how the media wants to portray us. We saw a similar situation at the start of the pandemic, when the media ran lurid stories about nurses partying on empty wards, implying that covid wasn't really as bad as it was made out to be. But as soon as people - including medical staff - started dying in their hundreds, then thousands, we were urged to rush out and applaud their courage.
Please can we stop this divisive nonsense. It is unnecessary. To get through this dreadful time, we all need to be respectful of each other, and not be led by the nose by powerful groups with their own agendas.
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Maybe so, but in my dealings with them through work and how they portray themselves in the media, they seem to have a "Can't Do" attitude.
Remember the first rule of holes - when you find yourself in one - stop digging!
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OK. Once again I must stress I was talking about the union leaders NOT, repeat NOT, the rank and file teachers who have performed incredibly (above and beyond doesn't even begin to cover it).
To Answer Greensleeves comment about the media, I would 100% agree and I am basing my opinions on what the union leaders THEMSELVES say, not on what words the media put in their mouths, and as previously said, in conjunction with my dealings with teaching unions via my work.
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Please can we stop this divisive nonsense. It is unnecessary. To get through this dreadful time, we all need to be respectful of each other, and not be led by the nose by powerful groups with their own agendas.
I just wanted to highlight this.
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If the Government's plan for vaccination is ambitious at 13 million doses, (2 million per week) by mid Feb, in order to vaccinate all over 70s, then it surely needs to be even more ambitious after February. In order to get everyone vaccinated by autumn or even the additional 20 million, in the plan,
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will it not have to increase its vaccination programme to 4 million per week?
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then in order to keep everything on track and achieve "herd" immunity (80% vaccinated) by autumn, there will surely need be the 2 million vaccines per week for the first timers, in addition to those receiving the follow up dose!
A Pfizer spokesman was questioned by a Parliamentary committee today. He said 1 million doses ordered by UK Gov. should be delivered by end of 2021.
Moderna vaccine should have joined Pfizer and Oxford Zenecca by autumn.
"How to Vaccinate the World", a series presented by Tim Hartford on Radio 4 on Mondays has reached episode 9. Hartford's long-running programme "More or Less" which digs into the facts underneath statistics, began a new run today.
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"How to Vaccinate the World", a series presented by Tim Hartford on Radio 4 on Mondays has reached episode 9. Hartford's long-running programme "More or Less" which digs into the facts underneath statistics, began a new run today.
Both of those are superb series.
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I see Boris Johnson has said today that as soon as there is enough vaccine, centres will be working 24 hours a day. Hope my appointment isn't 3 am. ;D
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For those of you who haven't seen it, the UK's JCVI's document detailing their advice for priority groups and phases is worth a read as it shows how they reached their conclusions. It has a long list of references, of data and reports, that they took into consideration, including occupational risks.
GOV.UK
Updated 6 January 2021
Joint Committee on Vaccination and Immunisation: advice on priority groups for COVID-19 vaccination, 30 December 2020
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/priority-groups-for-coronavirus-covid-19-vaccination-advice-from-the-jcvi-30-december-2020/joint-committee-on-vaccination-and-immunisation-advice-on-priority-groups-for-covid-19-vaccination-30-december-2020
Vaccine priority groups: advice on 30 December 2020
Phase 1 – direct prevention of mortality and supporting the NHS and social care system[/b
The next phase – further reduction in hospitalisation and targeted vaccination of those at high risk of exposure and/or those delivering key public services
As the first phase of the programme is rolled out in the UK, additional data will become available on the safety and effectiveness of COVID-19 vaccines. This data will provide the basis for consideration of vaccination in groups that are at lower risk of mortality from COVID-19.
The committee is currently of the view that the key focus for the second phase of vaccination could be on further preventing hospitalisation.
Vaccination of those at increased risk of exposure to SARS-CoV-2 due to their occupation could also be a priority in the next phase. This could include first responders, the military, those involved in the justice system, teachers, transport workers, and public servants essential to the pandemic response. Priority occupations for vaccination are considered an issue of policy, rather than for JCVI to advise on. JCVI asks that the Department of Health and Social Care consider occupational vaccination in collaboration with other government departments.
Occupations which get little publicity are those in the justice system. There's a massive backlog of court cases. Justice delayed is justice denied. Several prison officers have died. Prisoners are spending 23 hours a day in their cells, leading to deterioration in mental health.
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I see Boris Johnson has said today that as soon as there is enough vaccine, centres will be working 24 hours a day. Hope my appointment isn't 3 am. ;D
My daughter works at the Bristol Vaccination Centre.
Bet she won't thank Boris for 24/7 working?! ;D ;D
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I see Boris Johnson has said today that as soon as there is enough vaccine, centres will be working 24 hours a day. Hope my appointment isn't 3 am. ;D
My daughter works at the Bristol Vaccination Centre.
Bet she won't thank Boris for 24/7 working?! ;D ;D
Night shifts?. Oh how I have fond memories of them, especially twelve hours long. ::) 3am appointment?. No problem.
:)
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A Pfizer spokesman was questioned by a Parliamentary committee today. He said 1 million doses ordered by UK Gov. should be delivered by end of 2021.
Have you got a typo in that or a missing word/number?
Just 1 million doses from Pfizer by the end of 2021 doesn't seem right.
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A Pfizer spokesman was questioned by a Parliamentary committee today. He said 1 million doses ordered by UK Gov. should be delivered by end of 2021.
Have you got a typo in that or a missing word/number?
Just 1 million doses from Pfizer by the end of 2021 doesn't seem right.
Answering my own question here.
I think MS' quote was a reference to the following Select Committee meeting which included executives from AstraZeneca in which they stated they're committed to providing 100 million doses to the UK by end of 2021. When asked about delivery in the near future they stated they're on track to 'release' 2M per week, and that if they average 2M per week it'll meet the commitment of 100M by the end of the year.
Parliamentlive.tv
Science and Technology Committee
Wednesday 13 January 2021 Meeting started at 9.30am, ended 12.21pm
https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/68d1c853-13b2-4022-85ff-dc439f1476b1
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Actually, most of the officials of the various Teaching Unions still are ..... wait for it.... Former Teachers. And most of the ones at grass roots level, locally are actually serving or recently retired teachers.
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I had my first Pfizer vaccination at lunchtime today. Well organised local health centre which started vaccinations early in December. They were just finishing the over 80s and had got to WXYZ surnames when I just snuck in as my birthday was 5 January. I got a text on 7 Jan asking me to make an appt and the appt was today. 2nd vaccination 8 April, unless the experts change their minds about now waiting 12 weeks between appts. A notice in the health centre states that the Pfizer vaccine is 95% effective after 1 dose. I'd read (when the 2nd dose was after 4 weeks) that the first dose was 95% effective and the 2nd dose only added another 3% effectiveness. There are 3500 over 80s in my town (population just under 26,000) so most of those have been vaccinated as well as 20 care homes - for elderly as well as mentally and physically handicapped - all the care home staff, the staff at the health centre and various others. The last 80 or over at the health centre at lunchtime was vaccinated around midday, I was next to the last. Behind us in the queue were fairly young people who I assume must be medical staff/care workers/etc. as they certainly all looked fit and well.
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Actually, most of the officials of the various Teaching Unions still are ..... wait for it.... Former Teachers. And most of the ones at grass roots level, locally are actually serving or recently retired teachers.
Yes, that's correct. :D
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Maybe so, but in my dealings with them through work and how they portray themselves in the media, they seem to have a "Can't Do" attitude.
Similarly, many of the teachers my work brings me in to contact with do not have the best of opinions of their union's bosses.
But I appreciate different people have different opinions.
A friend of my husband is a teacher, in fact she's now Head of Chemistry in a large comprehensive. She never socialises with the other teachers and said (Pre Covid) that they spent most of their free time such as coffee breaks, lunchtimes etc. in the staff room just moaning about how much work they had to do at home, for example marking homework and preparing lessons. Meanwhile, she took herself off to a spare room and marked homework, or prepared lessons etc. during her lunchtimes (when not on playground duties). She arrived at school around 7.30am and usually left around 4.15pm. She never took work home with her. Her comment was that other teachers could do the same as her but they choose not to, that they prefer to moan about how much work they've got rather than spend their time usefully. Her way must have worked for her to have been promoted over other candidates.
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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/14/outrage-as-people-in-coventry-asked-to-travel-100-miles-for-covid-jab
???
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Gadget - I've not read the report in your link but heard similar stories on our local tv. The truth seems to be that these people have been offered vaccinations at the large centres, if they want to travel (most are only 15-20 miles distant), otherwise they can just wait for vaccinations in their local area. Of course, the media never let the truth get in the way of a good - or should that be a bad!! - story.
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It's quite detailed and the Guardian is a reputable newspaper unlike some that I can mention.
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It’s also perfectly true, no vaccine has yet reached our gp hub, nor in other practices around the country where my relatives live.
It’s a postcode lottery and totally shambolic if you live outside a big city.
Mike
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OH got his NHS letter yesterday - appointments now booked at Millenium Point in Birmingham for Sunday and 5 April. Today received a letter from our GP practice in Tamworth, saying that appointments would be offered, so he rang the practice, to be told that vaccine had not yet arrived, and they thought it best if he continue with the Birmingham appointments.
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It’s also perfectly true, no vaccine has yet reached our gp hub, nor in other practices around the country where my relatives live.
It’s a postcode lottery and totally shambolic if you live outside a big city.
Mike
I live in a town of just under 26,000 residents (that includes children), yet our local health centre is now finishing vaccinating all the over 80s (there are about 3,500 of them) plus 20 local care homes - for elderly as well as physically and mentally handicapped plus the care home staff.
I had my vaccine today and the health centre staff said they'd all been vaccinated. Behind us in the queue today, where much younger people who I assume must be care workers or key workers as they all looked fit and healthy. When all the over 80s have been vaccinated, probably by the end of this week or next, they will start on the over 70s. (I don't mean a long queue as we'd all been given timed appointments. The maximum number of people waiting was about 6. The room I went into had 2 nurses giving vaccinations and on the other side of the health centre, through a different entrance there were 2 other nurses giving vaccinations).
So it's not true it's only large cities doing vaccines. Unfortunately, the good news never reaches the media.
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It’s also perfectly true, no vaccine has yet reached our gp hub, nor in other practices around the country where my relatives live.
It’s a postcode lottery and totally shambolic if you live outside a big city.
Mike
I live in a town of just under 26,000 residents (that includes children), yet our local health centre is now finishing vaccinating all the over 80s (there are about 3,500 of them) plus 20 local care homes - for elderly as well as physically and mentally handicapped. So it's not true it's only large cities doing vaccines. Unfortunately, the good news never reaches the media.
I live in a remote rural area, and all of our 80+ residents have had their first jab now, and some have had their second. So yes, it may be a postcode lottery but I don't see that it's just the big cities getting the benefit.
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Yes, in my area all the over 80s who had their vaccine in December (975 according to the health centre newsletter) had their 2nd vaccine too because it was too late to cancel the 975 appointments and re-book a new lot of people.
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Cuffie replies 70 & 71. Mea culpa. I missed out some zeros and got the wrong company! I should be ashamed of myself, and me a loyal listener to "More or Less". I heard an excerpt from the Select Committee hearing again on the late night Parliament programme. The Astra Zeneca director said production had been delayed because of a Covid outbreak among staff and suggested that they be vaccinated as priority workers. I'd vote for that if I was in government.
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Vaccination also progressing rapidly in my mainly rural GP practice.
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"How to Vaccinate the World", a series presented by Tim Hartford on Radio 4 on Mondays has reached episode 9. Hartford's long-running programme "More or Less" which digs into the facts underneath statistics, began a new run today.
Both of those are superb series.
I must listen to "More or Less" repeat tomorrow afternoon and pay attention to the list of important numbers at the start. It includes a comparison between hospital bed occupancy due to covid this winter and flu in previous winters. More evidence to counter the "it's only flu" brigade, except they'll claim it's more lies and propaganda.
Those programmes fulfil the inform and educate requirements of the BBC Charter. I think "More or Less" programmes are made in collaboration with the Open University. "Inside Science", "Inside Medicine", "All in the Mind" and "The Life Scientific" are on my listening list.
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There was an analysis in my paper today from a medical virologist saying that there have been very few cases of flu this winter, possibly because people have had flu vaccines, are wearing masks and generally being careful, staying at home etc. but that when lockdown measures are lifted then flu will come back again. They said that in Australia there has been an unseasonal rise of something called Respiratory Syncytial Virus, which causes bronchiolitis or croup in children but more severe pneumonia in transplant patients. So now they're worrying that the paediatric wards will come under strain. Also our natural immunity to illnesses might wain. In addition, fewer infections one season can fuel a bigger outbreak the next by providing a larger susceptible population. So loosening social distancing measures is likely to allow other viruses to re-establish themselves.
The good new is this is likely to be a blip and infection rates should return to pre-pandemic levels over the next couple of years. ::)
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Despite whatever is happening occasionally here and there, the UK is amongst the best countries in the world with its vaccination programme so let's not decry the efforts being made, despite the odd hiccup. The roll out in Wales is poor but we are where we are. It will all work out in the end.
:)
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I live in an area of 80K people. My pals had their innoculation in December and I have an appointment for tomorrow morning.
I was offered a flu jab at the local chemist last year but thanked them and declined their offer.
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Looks as if when you get your vaccine depends where you live. The London area seems to be behind, yet a friend who lives in Sunderland who was 70 last June, very fit and no health issues, is getting his next week.
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As I've mentioned before, the demographic of the area must have a bearing on the speed of the vaccination programme - if there are only a handful of over 80s they'll soon be onto the next group. Also the number of medical and volunteer staff to carry them out and do things like ushering people in the right direction. And of course the availability of supplies. None of it an exact science but one thing that is obvious is that many people are working flat out to get people vaccinated and I applaud them.
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It seems that here in the North East we have the second highest number of people vaccinated, the highest being the South West. All of the figures are given here:
https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/19011017.many-covid-vaccines-issued-north-east-north-yorkshire/
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I was just wondering if there was a cut off date for doing second doses (or for cancelling them) only my friend's father had his second one on the 7th Jan but my father's second one due on the 13th Jan was cancelled.
They live in the same town.
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The Government changed their strategy to doing the 2nd dose after 12 weeks.
Thus departing from the Pfizer recommendation of 3 weeks!
Not sure when the change happened but sometime during the 2nd week of January I think?
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Although I was only 80 on 5 January, I had my first vaccination on 14 January (yesterday). The nurse said I'd just snuck into the over 80s as they were doing the vaccines alphabetically and were up to the ones with surnames starting W X Y or Z. However, there was a letter in our local paper today from a 96 year old well known local lady whose surname begins with I, saying that she hadn't been called for the vaccine. She wasn't complaining as she thinks key workers and younger people should have the vaccine first. The only thing is she was in hospital with Covid-19 in October and was quite unwell but recovered and wrote an article in the local paper about it. I wonder if whilst vaccinating the over 80s that, for now, they are disregarding the ones known to have already had Covid?
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However, there was a letter in our local paper today from a 96 year old well known local lady whose surname begins with I, saying that she hadn't been called for the vaccine. She wasn't complaining as she thinks key workers and younger people should have the vaccine first. The only thing is she was in hospital with Covid-19 in October and was quite unwell but recovered and wrote an article in the local paper about it. I wonder if whilst vaccinating the over 80s that, for now, they are disregarding the ones known to have already had Covid?
Interim results of follow-up research by Public Health England on people who have had Covid has shown average immunity period is 5 months. However they may still be able to carry and transmit the virus. A few people have been re-infected during that time. Results were published this week. The study group are health workers. The study is continuing.
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I have heard of several people in their 90s who haven't yet had the vaccine. It does worry me that perhaps they were informed by letter, which due to the post at the moment, has got lost. Does anyone know whether people are chased up if they don't make an appointment?
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The lady I was talking about uses computers and has a mobile 'phone so I'm sure she would have been contacted by text like I was. She is secretary to many local societies so knows her way around computers etc. despite her age. I agree, however, that many might have been informed by post which is a bit erratic in some areas. Post in our area is getting through OK.
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Where I live in the southern part of the town the GP surgeries only got vaccine last Friday so started vaccinations at the weekend. The northern part of the town got vaccines in the first lot of deliveries so started a month before the southern part. That area will get through the bands before my area which is a month behind. Perhaps something similar is happening in Groom’s area?
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Our GP surgery is supposed to be starting today. Hopefully my next door neighbour will be soon. she's 91
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I have heard of several people in their 90s who haven't yet had the vaccine. It does worry me that perhaps they were informed by letter, which due to the post at the moment, has got lost. Does anyone know whether people are chased up if they don't make an appointment?
That might be something to ask a local councillor about. Councillors should know progress in their wards.
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It seems that here in the North East we have the second highest number of people vaccinated, the highest being the South West. All of the figures are given here:
https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/19011017.many-covid-vaccines-issued-north-east-north-yorkshire/
Thanks for this Roobarb.
It should be NOTED that these numbers may actually represent letters of invitation sent rather than injections administered.
Also, they are per capita.
So the number in the South West is actually lower than the North East, but as the population is lower, per capita, South West appears higher.
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We keep looking at out Drs surgery website and up to now they’re still saying they’ll be getting their supplies in a FEW WEEKS time!
It has been said that The East has had a much smaller number of people vaccinated in comparison to other parts of the country so this seems to be correct...
I hope it doesn’t take that long as my OH is in 4th sector and I’m in the 5th... just so it could take a while before we get even the first one! 😢
Caroline
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My 70th birthday is mid summer. I am taking bets I shall have had my birthday long before I am offered the vaccine. :'(
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My 70th birthday is mid summer. I am taking bets I shall have had my birthday long before I am offered the vaccine. :'(
sadly I think you maybe right! My 70th is in September and I had hoped by then to have had it enabling us to have a family knees up... BiL is 70 in couple of weeks and OH’s was last year so big celebration would be nice.... niece supposed to be getting married on 1st May too...so many things we’ve taken for granted in the past... let’s hope that will return..
Caroline
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My 70th birthday is mid summer. I am taking bets I shall have had my birthday long before I am offered the vaccine. :'(
sadly I think you maybe right! My 70th is in September and I had hoped by then to have had it enabling us to have a family knees up... BiL is 70 in couple of weeks and OH’s was last year so big celebration would be nice.... niece supposed to be getting married on 1st May too...so many things we’ve taken for granted in the past... let’s hope that will return..
Caroline
Yes. 2 weddings and a month down under rolled over to this year, but l will believe it when it happens!!
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I had heard and read of people being sent texts for the vaccine appointments & got really worried because my OH has his mobile switched off most of the time & we don't get a mobile signal in the house. Texts often arrive days later when I go out.
I rang our excellent GP surgery to check & the receptionist said they have been told they must use a land-line number if one is provided and keep ringing until they speak to us. Not allowed to leave a voicemail.
She said they have 2 days next week at the local GP hub. So that implies each GP surgery is allocated certain days. She clarified that OH and I, although we both have health issues, won't be priorities but as both 70+ our turn was coming soon. I'm not expecting it just yet as I know several 90+ who haven't been called, and several 80s who have.
And Caw1 I'm in 'the East' too - when they said the low figure carried out here in a month, I worked it out as 6000 a day. Assuming 'the East' means Essex, Suffolk & Norfolk, that's 2000 a day per county. Not many is it?
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I rang our excellent GP surgery to check & the receptionist said they have been told they must use a land-line number if one is provided and keep ringing until they speak to us. Not allowed to leave a voicemail.
She said they have 2 days next week at the local GP hub. So that implies each GP surgery is allocated certain days. She clarified that OH and I, although we both have health issues, won't be priorities but as both 70+ our turn was coming soon. I'm not expecting it just yet as I know several 90+ who haven't been called, and several 80s who have.
I live in North West Lancashire and am 81 yrs old. Last week I had a phone call on my landline and was asked if I'd like to attend the local Hub for a Covid innoculation "next week".
I arranged for one of my sons to come and drive me to the appointment. We kept the appointment yesterday (Friday), then on the way I had a bit of a panic that we were driving to the correct place. I needn't have worried, there were very large signs on lampposts which had large red red writing pointing the way.
there were about 20 people in front of me. I was surprised that even with the queuing (at 2metre distances) , then the 15 minute wait after the vaccination that I was only out of my house for one hour.
I got a surprise when I read the little card I was given after the injection. I thought I'd be having the Oxford vaccine but saw I'd been given the Pfizer vaccine.
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At the end of the day we are so lucky to live in the UK where we have the opportunity to be vaccinated.
I've heard of people doubting the vaccine and persuading their elderly mother from having it.
Friends flew from Mexico to Alaska to have the vaccine. It's a crazy world out there. End of story.
Judy
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I took OH for his first vaccination this morning - Millenium Point in Birmingham. His appointment was 11.45. We arrived a little early but he decided to go in. He was greeted at the door, sanitised etc., had his vaccination and was back at the car by 11.45, no queuing anywhere, car park ticket validated, no hassle at all. He had been asked whether he was driving, and because he wasn't then he was allowed to leave very shortly after the "jab". I'm hoping that the second one is just as efficient.
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Good news it is working well somewhere BumbleB.
How far from home?
How easy to get there?
You were able to drive, but if he had to go alone, public transport l guess?
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I went for my 1st jab this morning at GP surgery in Birmingham at 10.25. It went like clockwork with everyone obeying the rules, no queue and appointment for 2nd one on 28 March.
Thanks to everyone.
Judy
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MH - distance about 18 + miles. Driving on a Sunday not bad at all, not sure about his second one which is a Monday!! If he had to go alone then preference would be for driving, although the venue is within a few minutes walk of at least one Birmingham station. I'm also hoping that the adjacent car park will be available next time, with ticket validation so no charge.
Assuming that our GP receives the vaccine, then I have an appointment next Saturday at a venue in Tamworth. OH only went to Birmingham because he received the letter from NHS and he responded immediately. "Sod's Law" that our Practice Nurse rang me a couple of days later offering local appointments - I did ask the question about OH cancelling and re-booking with her, but she advised that he go ahead with his plans.
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Thanks BumbleB.
I have no axe to grind as heaven alone knows when I might be eligible for the vaccine, but I just DO NOT understand why the MOST vulnerable, elderly, frail are expected to travel to city centers regardless of where they live!
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Mom had her first one just over a week ago, Her appointment was 9.45 and was back not long after. She had pfizer. She had it at the active living centre down the road from gp surgery after being rung by practice nurse. This is one of 4 walsall centres/hubs and i think they used pfizer as walsall manor is a storage facilty and only is about 10 mins away. Shrewsbury hospital is using pfizer beacause my cousins wife is helping with the vaccinations and had her first one that day. From what the nespaper said millenium point was using oxford and apparently that asda being turned into accination centre was approved for pfizer.
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Yes, OH did receive the AZ vaccine. AND, unfortunately for us at times, we do have a Birmingham postcode here in Tamworth!
BUT, as long as we get the vaccination, and we all stay safe ;D
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Bumblebee, the same thing happened to me but because our GP had spoken to OH some weeks ago we knew they were preparing to get "set up to vaccinate" so I ignored the NHS letter and, sure enough, within a couple of days we both had a phone call from GP practice.
Judy
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Do they give you a set appointment time or do you get to choose one that's convenient? I think someone on this thread said something about booking online.
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Roobarb,
I got a phone call on Thursday from my own doctor’s surgery inviting me for vaccine and would Thursday be ok. I asked if there was another option and I could choose Friday or Saturday too. The vaccine will be given at a hub which is another practice in the area.
I just hope it doesn’t get cancelled.
Heywood
Forgot to mention, I asked about the 2nd one and was told it would be 3-12 weeks.
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Thanks heywood, hope it's all straightforward for you.
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Thanks, Roobarb.
I was surprised to hear so soon but the receptionist said they were getting through them quite quickly.
It’s just there are so many differences and stories around.
A friend text me to say she had been offered one at Manchester City Stadium but wouldn’t be able to get there so said she would wait. She is older than me and although in the same town, is at a different practice.
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Thanks BumbleB.
I have no axe to grind as heaven alone knows when I might be eligible for the vaccine, but I just DO NOT understand why the MOST vulnerable, elderly, frail are expected to travel to city centers regardless of where they live!
As I understand it, they were invited but didn't have to accept the invitation. More vaccination places are being added. 6 "pilot" pharmacies began last week.
A mass vaccination for health workers has been going on at the Nightingale hospital (exhibition centre) in Glasgow this weekend. All GP practices in Scotland should have vaccine supply by end of month. All inhabitants of the island of Arran aged 70+ are being done in a batch to minimise wastage of vaccine.
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Spoke to daughter #2 tonight.
She spent most of the week working at the Bristol Vaccination Centre - at Ashton Gate Stadium.
Apparently the vials are often overfilled, and while supposed to have 10 doses, can have 11 or 12 doses.
Consequently she got her first dose! They try to use all the vaccine in the time allowed.
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Scotland has had a better grip on the entire crisis than England, where it is clear we are still floundering and rudderless!!.
:'(
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KGarrard reply #123. A doctor who is overseeing vaccinations said the same thing about number of doses per vial on "Broadcasting House", Radio 4 this morning. He said that to avoid wastage there should be a reserve list of people from the priority lists who can turn up at short notice.
mowsehouse reply 124. Advantages Scotland has: Being approximately a month behind S. England so know what's coming up the line and can take avoiding action. A leader who is naturally cautious. Clarity of message but also a willingness to admit uncertainty. Despite this, outcomes are no better.
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This looks promising, from the BBC
“ People in England aged 70 and over, as well as those listed as clinically extremely vulnerable, will begin receiving offers of a coronavirus vaccine this week.‘
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I live in Scotland and the FM has been cautious about schedules, nothing like the incredible claims made in Westminster. We seem to have 9 categories though my concern is that throughout the UK last year the number who were left off the "vulnerable shielding" lists that enabled assistance with essentials. I fell into that group but my GP sent the required paperwork direct to me not the Chief Medical Officer and there is no way to overcome that, Simply forwarding the paperwork personally isn't "official". I can only hope they don't do the same again as I should be in one of the early groups based on health conditions but a very late one based on age alone.
A relative in England lives in Shrops and has an annual check at Guys hospital with a rare condition (not one that is listed as making him vulnerable), he's had three vaccination letters, two from his local NHS board and one from Guys. Guys have even offered to provide him with a taxi there and back, I don't think they realise it's a 300 mile round trip!
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I had a text this morning asking me to contact my G. P 's surgery about my Covid vaccination, it took awhile to get through and I have it booked for Wednesday afternoon at my own surgery which is a hub.
I'm in Birmingham and was expecting to have to wait a little longer as I'm under 75.
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A friend of ours who is over 80 had his today at our gp hub which is three practices that have come together so that all three practices can supply staff we’re told to do the jabbing. He said it was great and it was actually his own doctor that did the jab. His is Oxford jab. We are in the North East of England,
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This looks promising, from the BBC
“ People in England aged 70 and over, as well as those listed as clinically extremely vulnerable, will begin receiving offers of a coronavirus vaccine this week.‘
Only in areas where the majority of 80+ have had their 1st jab.
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Looks like the Pfizer one for us tomorrow at 1 pm.
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I had my vaccination on Saturday on an indoor tennis court 5 miles away from my home (in Devon). I had received a phone call from my GP's surgery a few days before, offering the vaccine. The whole operation was extremely slick, with plenty of stewards and about 12 people doing the actual jabs. Mine, the Pfizer vaccine, was given by a retired doctor, and I didn't feel a thing. Just hope I won't have to wait too long for the second, though I was told it could be up to 12 weeks.
I was given plenty of information and warned to continue to act as if I hadn't had the jab yet, partly because it wouldn't be effective for around 21 days and partly because it was only the first one. There is great concern that people will revert to their normal behaviour too soon, but then we oldies don't on the whole go out and mingle like younger folk.
The day before the jab I received a letter from the NHS giving the opportunity of booking a jab online. It did say, however, that I should ignore the letter if I had already got an appointment.
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Looks like the Pfizer one for us tomorrow at 1 pm.
Good news.
My parents both had their Pfizer ones yesterday.
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I gather they are using various sports venues around Newcastle in addition to the large hub.
:)
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The whole operation was extremely slick, with plenty of stewards and about 12 people doing the actual jabs.
My parents said the same.
Theirs was in the Islamic Cultural Centre, Batley. The whole thing was very well organised and efficient. Rough calculation shows they were doing about a thousand people a day.
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I gather they are using various sports venues around Newcastle in addition to the large hub.
For anyone in England interested where their local sites are, there are lists on the NHS England website. There's also a map showing the 10 mile radius of each, which may be of interest to those living in rural areas and may have further to travel.
NHS
Coronavirus » Vaccination sites
Updated 15th Jan
https://www.england.nhs.uk/coronavirus/publication/vaccination-sites/
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Do you need to take any ID or NHS number with you?
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No mention of needing to take ID or NHS number on the NHS website.
NHS
Coronavirus vaccination
What happens at your appointment
https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/coronavirus-covid-19/coronavirus-vaccination/what-happens-at-your-appointment/
What to bring
You'll need to bring:
1) a face covering, unless you cannot wear one for a health or disability reason
2) your booking reference numbers if your appointment is at a vaccination centre
If you need a carer you can bring them with you on the day.
However, apparently some NHS trusts have asked patients to bring their NHS number (https://fullfact.org/online/nhs-number-coronavirus-vaccine/) though.
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Do you need to take any ID or NHS number with you?
No.
I've just checked with practice - all we need is our names :D
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My 94 year old neighbour had hers this morning. As a 72 year old I'm expecting a loooooong wait if that's the stage they've reached :-\
Very pleased to hear of so many people having it though, it's a big ray of light in all the doom and gloom.
Pat
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Text notification this morning for this coming Saturday 09.35
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A heartening "Good News" story out of Britain this week (Monday, 18 January, 2021) on the front page of "The Globe and Mail" a major newspaper in Canada.
Headline reads: 'It's rewarding and a real privilege': Britain's army of volunteers sets blistering pace in vaccination effort
Snippett from text:
"... and the rate of vaccinations has jumped to nearly 300,000 a day from about 300,000 a week in December. Some regions have been vaccinating people so fast that they've been told to slow down so that London and other cities can catch up."
Keep your spirits up, folk. You are doing better than we in Canada are.
Cheers,
Westoe
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This vaccine IS NOT a silver bullet.
It's all over bar the shouting
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My son and his partner (he is an A&E nurse and she works in a GP surgery) now have COVID - both seemed to have picked it up a day or two after receiving their first jabs.
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Best wishes to both of them, Mike.
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Thank you. They're both young and healthy, so statistically they should be OK, but it's still a worry. They're both pretty knocked out by it, and our grandson is a lively 16 month old boy.
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Snippett from text:
"... and the rate of vaccinations has jumped to nearly 300,000 a day from about 300,000 a week in December. Some regions have been vaccinating people so fast that they've been told to slow down so that London and other cities can catch up."
Keep your spirits up, folk. You are doing better than we in Canada are.
Cheers,
Westoe
Why do London and other cities need to catch up? ???
Hope you soon get yours Westoe :)
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Thank you. They're both young and healthy, so statistically they should be OK, but it's still a worry. They're both pretty knocked out by it, and our grandson is a lively 16 month old boy.
I do hope all goes well with them, Mike. I was thinking about the little boy - is it 16 months already!
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What a worry for you Mike. All good wishes to them both for a quick recovery.
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Thanks both.
I'm sure they'll be OK, I'll let you know though.
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Why do London and other cities need to catch up? ???
To forestall the more-efficient volunteer-run provincial vaccination sites from requisitioning unused doses from the cities????
I'm not holding my breath about getting my jab anytime soon, despite being both a senior with chronic health issues and an essential worker. It will probably be July, August or September, perhaps even later since Canada isn't getting all the doses already bought because of retooling at the manufacturer's plant.
No use complaining. We just have to soldier on.
Cheers,
Westoe
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Hello Mike
Best wishes and get well soon to your Son and his partner,
Mark
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My son and his partner (he is an A&E nurse and she works in a GP surgery) now have COVID - both seemed to have picked it up a day or two after receiving their first jabs.
It obviously doesn't apply to your son and his partner, as they know the score, but a doctor was saying on the radio that they need to get through to some people that they are not instantly protected.
I hope they recover quickly - my 30 something neighbours and their 7 year old, Harry, had it over Christmas. Harry was fine, no symptoms as all, but his parents felt really ill for about 3 days, then tired for a week. They are fine now.
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I'm obviously on more than one list.
Today (19th January) I received a letter from NHS in Bristol asking me to phone up and make an appointment for a Covid vaccine. The envelope contained an explanatory leaflet and three pages with writing on both sides. One page was the invitation with the explanation that I was in a group that needed a vaccination and the other pages contained explanations in 16 foreign languages plus one one English explanation of how to get onto the NHS website.
I don't think I will bother to contact them and tell them that their letter is a duplication of an invitation received two weeks ago and I had my vaccination last week.
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Rena
I also received the multi-paged letter, just a day before I had my jab, which was organised through my GP's surgery. The letters were sent by a central agency, and were perhaps intended to catch some people who had otherwise slipped through the net.
The doctor who vaccinated me emphasised that I should continue to act as though I had not received the vaccine, even after I had the second one.
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I've had the first of my Pfizer innoculations and this morning during a discussion it appears that Israel has announced that the Pfizer vaccine only gives 32% to 60% protection. This is far less than the 89% that Pfizer claimed when it brought out the vaccine.
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The study is actually suggesting that the second dose should be given after 3 weeks for max. efficiency, the first dose is performing as expected.
Don’t worry, 30% efficiency is better than no protection, we need to look at the larger picture.
Mike
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Re. the efficacy of the Pfizer vaccine after the 1st dose, there's been 2 numbers reported in the media, 52% and 89%. The latter seems to have been most widely reported in UK media.
So although the early reports coming from Israel may show the efficacy isn't quite up to that shown in the trials it's not so bad when comparing against the 52% of the trials.
BBC Future
How effective is a single vaccine dose against Covid-19?
15 Jan 2021
https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20210114-covid-19-how-effective-is-a-single-vaccine-dose
According to Pfizer data published in December 2020, the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine is roughly 52% effective after the first dose. Out of 36,523 participants in the phase three trial – the final stage of testing where people either received two full doses, 21 days apart, or a placebo – who had no evidence of existing infection, 82 people in the placebo group and 39 in the vaccine group developed Covid-19 symptoms.
However, this early protection comes with some important caveats. First, the protection doesn't kick in until at least day 12 – until then, there was no difference between the two groups. Secondly, one dose is still significantly less protective than two. The latter is 95% effective at preventing the disease after a week.
But there is also another figure that has been circulating on the internet, and anecdotally, being fed to patients by certain doctors – the suggestion that the first dose is around 90% effective. And this is where it gets a little more complicated.
The second estimate comes from the UK's Vaccine Committee, the JCVI, who decided to calculate the efficacy of the vaccine differently. Instead of using all the data on the number of infections, including from days when the first dose hadn't yet started to work, they only looked at days 15-21. Using this method, the efficacy of the vaccine jumps up to 89%, because it's not being diluted by the relatively high number of infections before the vaccine begins to have an effect. Taking things even further and only looking at the first seven days after the second dose (days 21-28) – because the second dose might not have kicked in yet by then – it's 92%.
However, these calculations are controversial.
The BMJ
Covid-19: Pfizer vaccine efficacy was 52% after first dose and 95% after second dose, paper shows
11 Dec 2020
https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4826
The Pfizer and BioNTech covid-19 vaccine may provide some early protection, starting 12 days after the first dose, the peer reviewed results of a phase III trial have found.
The study, published in the New England Journal of Medicine,1 found that vaccine efficacy between the first and second doses was 52% (95% credible interval 29.5% to 68.4%), with 39 cases of covid-19 in the vaccine group and 82 cases in the placebo group.
Seven or more days after the second dose, vaccine efficacy then rose to 95% (90.3% to 97.6%), with eight covid-19 cases reported in the vaccine group and 162 cases in the placebo group.
The US' FDA review of the Pfizer trial has more detailed numbers (which I'm in no way qualified to interpret).
Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine
https://www.fda.gov/emergency-preparedness-and-response/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19/pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine
See the FDA Decision Memorandum (https://www.fda.gov/media/144416/download) link for the full report (PDF).
The Guardian's article, for reference, discussing the reports from Israel.
The Guardian
Single Covid vaccine dose in Israel 'less effective than we thought'
19 Jan 2021
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/19/single-covid-vaccine-dose-in-israel-less-effective-than-we-hoped
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It may comfort people to know another statistic - the first dose of the vaccine gives 100% protection against serious illness and death.
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How are they catching people who aren't registered with doctors or who are homeless, anyone know?
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Our town was on tv recently having initiated vaccines for the homeless. The people shown, live now, in accommodation provided through an organisation so I would imagine that people who are known to service providers will be encouraged to take up the vaccine and arrangements made.
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Well that was efficient and friendly. We were out within 25 mins of arriving including the admin, etc, and the 15 mins at the end. We were given a little card with the Pfizer batch number and date.
It was in a GP hub rather than one of those larger centres. All the staff there were so friendly and nice.
:)
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Pretty much the same here yesterday, although the 15 minute wait fell apart a bit as some folks waited a bit longer to see if the rain eased off a bit, and one or two pulled the chairs closer together so they could chat whilst they waited. :) :) :)
No side effects so far
Mike
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It may comfort people to know another statistic - the first dose of the vaccine gives 100% protection against serious illness and death.
I'm not sure too much should be read into those stats. as they're based on the number of people in the trials that suffered severe covid, and those numbers seem quite low.
In the Pfizer trial 10 people suffered severe covid out of over 43K, in total after the 2nd dose. Nine were in the placebo group and one in the vaccine group.
In the Moderna trial 30 people suffered severe covid out of over 30K. All 30 were in the placebo group.
The definition of "severe covid" seems to differ between the trials.
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I've had the first of my Pfizer innoculations and this morning during a discussion it appears that Israel has announced that the Pfizer vaccine only gives 32% to 60% protection. This is far less than the 89% that Pfizer claimed when it brought out the vaccine.
Israel and Pfizer are collaborating in a real life countrywide study. It's a rapid roll-out.
I recommend the series "How to Vaccinate the World", Mondays on Radio 4. An interviewee on this week's programme is involved in the logistics in UK. She's ex-military. The whole scheme is "Operation Stork". The initial phase which began in December is "Operation Robin". "Blue tit" took off this month. Coincidently blackbirds traditionally begin singing on St. Valentine's Day by which time the top 4 priority categories should have had 1st dose. I don't expect to be "Blackbird". I hope I'm not "Cuckoo"
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IOM Government have announced that all Manx residents having to travel across (to England) for medical treatment will be offered a Covid vaccination.
As I am still waiting for laser treatment for a kidney stone, that's welcome news indeed ;D
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We've been living with a Covid virus for years. I'm not really scared of the virus, but it came as a bit of a shock when the government minister announced there are 12,000 Covid-19 variants ! :o I'm hoping it's been incorrectly reported and that there are 12,000 known variants of corona.
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We've been living with a Covid virus for years. I'm not really scared of the virus, but it came as a bit of a shock when the government minister announced there are 12,000 Covid-19 variants ! :o I'm hoping it's been incorrectly reported and that there are 12,000 known variants of corona.
No mistake - there are 12,000 known variants of COVID-19 but that isn't unusual. That's what viruses do.
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Our local council has posted that all care home residents will have received a vaccination (presumably first) by the end of this week.
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Not sure if anyone's mentioned it but I've just read a report that suggests that the current vaccines don't suppress the South African variant and they will have to be tweeked.
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The Oxford vaccine should be relatively easy to tweak, once they have some inactive components to add to the mix.
The Pfizer one I don’t know, if they have to develop a new highly complex protein that may take a while.
Mike
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How are they catching people who aren't registered with doctors or who are homeless, anyone know?
I bought "The Big Issue" today and this was discussed at length. The answer is - they are not.
Regards
Chas
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I heard of one council that included street homeless and those living in shelters as part of the priority groups for the vaccine:
https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/13/homeless-people-given-the-covid-vaccine-by-council-in-uk-first-13900155/?ico=more_text_links
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I heard of one council that included street homeless and those living in shelters as part of the priority groups for the vaccine:
https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/13/homeless-people-given-the-covid-vaccine-by-council-in-uk-first-13900155/?ico=more_text_links
See reply #161
That is our council and we are told that care home residents will all be done by this weekend. (I posted that a few posts ago).
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Elderly gentleman on TV today, had his first vaccination ,was very glad and
said :- to this effect:- “ Just need my second and then I am able to go out and about again ,”
Well sorry, but you won’t be able to, not if social
distancing and stay in are still being advised.
This needs to be made clear ,very clear.
Viktoria.
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We've been living with a Covid virus for years. I'm not really scared of the virus, but it came as a bit of a shock when the government minister announced there are 12,000 Covid-19 variants ! :o I'm hoping it's been incorrectly reported and that there are 12,000 known variants of corona.
Summer 2020, there were about 7 - 8 Variants of SARS-CoV-2.
Early September 2020 - Researchers have catalogued more than 12,000 mutations in SARS-CoV-2 genomes.
I was led to believe there was a difference between a Variant and a genome mutation.
Around December 2020 the US CDC claimed Britain had about 125,000 genome sequences on a database.
Mark
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P
Elderly gentleman on TV today, had his first vaccination ,was very glad and
said :- to this effect:- “ Just need my second and then I am able to go out and about again ,”
Well sorry, but you won’t be able to, not if social
distancing and stay in are still being advised.
This needs to be made clear ,very clear.
Viktoria.
I heard something like that today, a lady having her first dose saying 'At last we'll soon be able to hug the grandchildren'
I agree with you we can't relax the precautions for a long time.
Pat
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https://mobile.twitter.com/VickiGSP/status/1350890416133066752
Twitter video
https://www.facebook.com/thegreenhouse/videos/10221858408302614
Facebook version
This is a very good representation of how we need to behave post vaccination.
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I wondered how many other countries had researched the link between SARS and the bats as I had a suspicion this was intended either as a country's method of reducing its own population or confusing/weakening a country seen as an enemy.
Topp of the search results was a 2006 USA report showing they'd more or less done similar research.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3291347/
The sight of this latter report brought back a memory of me in 1965 having hysterics because a bat was in my new born baby's room. Shock, horror, bats carried deadly virus. Spurred on by my repeated shrieks of "get it out" my OH tried to catch it in a cloth so that he could put it outside. Of course, nothing was going to work due to the bat's noisy system of knowing where objects are and how to miss them.
It eventually escaped via the open window poor thing.
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In northern NSW, there are bats which carry the Lissa virus. This is deadly to horses, and has been known to kill humans.
HOWEVER, in Australia, bats are "protected", and cannot be killed even if they kill humans :-X :-X
A news reader in Sydney, who was a good triathlete, contracted Covid 19 some months ago. She is, I think, about 30, but still is not fully recovered from the virus. She is able to work on the radio, but I am under the impression that she is not yet able to compete in triathlons.
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It is getting more mysterious, more mutations and it seemingly being here before we,the general public knew properly.
Thanks folks for your posts ,they illustrate what I meant.
We who have had the first dose are still not properly protected ,but even if we were we can still carry and transmit .
I understand the gentleman I quoted ,for a nano second I too thought
“ Yippee! Bury Market here I come! “— then Oh no! Not yet ,not for a good while yet.
And as it is our wonderful market will be closed I am sure.
Never did the words “Retail Therapy “ have such meaning.
Viktoria.
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Yes, the doctor who gave me the injection emphasised that it wasn't a free pass to liberty and that I should continue to behave as if I hadn't had the jab at all.
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We were given a leaflet telling us about what to do, side effects, etc. along with a little card with vaccine type/batch/date of 1sr shot and a blank space for details of 2nd shot.
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The information as to what vaccine recipients can and can't do after receiving it has been available for weeks now. And as Gadget says, recipients are given a leaflet that with the information.
There's really no excuse for recipients' ignorance of what's required of them.
Public Health England
Guidance
What to expect after your COVID-19 vaccination
Updated 20 January 2021
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-vaccination-what-to-expect-after-vaccination/what-to-expect-after-your-covid-19-vaccination
Can you give COVID-19 to anyone if you have had the vaccine?
The vaccine cannot give you COVID-19 infection, and a full course will reduce your chance of becoming seriously ill. We do not yet know whether it will stop you from catching and passing on the virus, but we do expect it to reduce this risk. So, it is still important to follow the guidance in your local area to protect those around you.
To protect yourself and your family, friends and colleagues you still need to:
- practice social distancing
- wear a face mask
- wash your hands carefully and frequently
- follow the current guidance (https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus)
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https://www.hsj.co.uk/primary-care/exclusive-leading-regions-vaccine-supply-to-be-halved-so-others-can-catch-up/7029342.article
I thought that the goal was to vaccinate all the over 70s and others/special groups/ who wanted the vaccine by mid February.
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So we're being penalised for the efficiency of the people carrying out the vaccinations in our area. :( Perhaps instead of doing that they should be finding out why the other regions are behind.
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Mobile rang and "Doctor" came up. Great, I thought must be about the Covid vaccine.
"Hallo, I'm calling from xxxxxxx Medical Practice, are you interested in having the shingles vaccine?"
I told her not until I'd had the Covid one, as I think that is one of the things you are asked isn't it, have you had any other vaccines in the last few days? I certainly didn't want to have the shingles jab, get called for the Covid one and then be turned away! I asked if she had any idea when I might hear and she said within the next couple of weeks. Bit silly of them even asking about the shingles!
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I heard on the news this evening that a study of several thousand people has revealed that it's the people who go in to work who have been passing on the virus.
I'm surprised I haven't caught it myself from a plumber who fitted a new tap in August and then had to come again to stop the whole contraption from swinging about.
I wore a mask, but he didn't and said it was "alright" for him to come in. As soon as he left I sanitised everything he'd breqthed on and touched; all doors, door handles and kitchen surfaces and flooring. Including the tap of course
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It slightly beggars belief that the Belgian factory that manufactures the Pfizer vaccine is carrying out modifications to their factory, which means a pause in the number of items being manufactured.
Then today the local authority has been/is desperately trying to stop flood water reaching the Oxford vaccine factory.
I want to know who broke the glass mirror!
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It slightly beggars belief that the Belgian factory that manufactures the Pfizer vaccine is carrying out modifications to their factory, which means a pause in the number of items being manufactured.
Then today the local authority has been/is desperately trying to stop flood water reaching the Oxford vaccine factory.
I want to know who broke the glass mirror!
They say things go in threes!
"Huge fire breaks out at world’s biggest Covid vaccine factory in India killing five"
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A bit of good news...
The Jerusalem Post
Antibodies increase by 6 to 20 times after second Pfizer dose
18 Jan 2021
https://www.jpost.com/health-science/antibodies-increase-by-6-to-20-times-after-second-pfizer-dose-sheba-655861
People who received their second dose of the Pfizer vaccine had a six- to 12-fold increase in the amount of antibodies produced to defend against the novel coronavirus, Sheba Medical Center in Tel Hashomer reported Monday.
The results of preliminary research were based on 102 cases of medical personnel vaccinated at the hospital. They had more antibodies than people who were severely infected with the virus and recovered.
There's a discrepancy between the heading and the body text so I'm not sure which is correct but even the lower figure looks promising.
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So we're being penalised for the efficiency of the people carrying out the vaccinations in our area. :( Perhaps instead of doing that they should be finding out why the other regions are behind.
We keep asking in Wales as to why we have the lowest vaccination rate in the UK, but no one will or can tell us properly. Anyway, we have plenty of promises so we will see what happens. I'm now suspecting I won't be vaccinated before March, despite being in one of the groups promised vaccination by mid February. C'est la vie.
:)
Perhaps this has something to do with the problem?.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/familyhealth/morally-reprehensible-priti-patel-attacks-people-jumping-covid-vaccine-queue/ar-BB1cYh3y?ocid=msedgntp
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So we're being penalised for the efficiency of the people carrying out the vaccinations in our area. :( Perhaps instead of doing that they should be finding out why the other regions are behind.
We keep asking in Wales as to why we have the lowest vaccination rate in the UK, but no one will or can tell us properly. Anyway, we have plenty of promises so we will see what happens. I'm now suspecting I won't be vaccinated before March, despite being in one of the groups promised vaccination by mid February. C'est la vie.
:)
Perhaps this has something to do with the problem?.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/familyhealth/morally-reprehensible-priti-patel-attacks-people-jumping-covid-vaccine-queue/ar-BB1cYh3y?ocid=msedgntp
The wording of that link is great: Morally reprehensible Priti Patel attacks people......
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The information as to what vaccine recipients can and can't do after receiving it has been available for weeks now. And as Gadget says, recipients are given a leaflet that with the information.
There's really no excuse for recipients' ignorance of what's required of them.
Public Health England
Guidance
What to expect after your COVID-19 vaccination
Updated 20 January 2021
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-vaccination-what-to-expect-after-vaccination/what-to-expect-after-your-covid-19-vaccination
Can you give COVID-19 to anyone if you have had the vaccine?
The vaccine cannot give you COVID-19 infection, and a full course will reduce your chance of becoming seriously ill. We do not yet know whether it will stop you from catching and passing on the virus, but we do expect it to reduce this risk. So, it is still important to follow the guidance in your local area to protect those around you.
To protect yourself and your family, friends and colleagues you still need to:
- practice social distancing
- wear a face mask
- wash your hands carefully and frequently
- follow the current guidance (https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus)
Exactly, it is there on the pamphlet you are given when you book in at the venue where you have gone to, to get vaccinated.
Viktoria
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https://www.hsj.co.uk/primary-care/exclusive-leading-regions-vaccine-supply-to-be-halved-so-others-can-catch-up/7029342.article
I thought that the goal was to vaccinate all the over 70s and others/special groups/ who wanted the vaccine by mid February.
I saw a post from one of the northern MP’s that suggested our areas were getting reduced supplies. I’m not due for ages anyway, but my husband is due as an over 70 so I hope he still gets his in the correct time frame. I know it’s a scarce resource, but news like this does nothing for mental health, esp when it feels like there’s a light coming sometime.
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The Health Service Journal is a highly reputable journal.
We and some friends had ours this week- age range 75-77. We went to a GP hub in Newcastle/ which had the capacity to use up all the Pfizer supplied for that day. We were phoned up the day before by our GP practice.
Add - CF - it will be a long time before the light comes on
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I'm sure the urging from Westminster about not using the queue jumping apps will do the trick.
There have always been folk who exploit loopholes but seriously! A few years ago it was all the rage for the footy players to spend thousands with "Mr Loophole" to avoid a speeding ticket, now it's scream "exempt" to avoid using a face mask safe in the knowledge the exemption extends to proving an exemption applies, now many of those same people will, by some miracle, manage to wear one whilst being 30 years younger than everyone else at the vaccine appointments that day.
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Just to say that some regions are behind because they didn’t receive any vaccine until a month after some areas. Where I live the northern part of the town started vaccinations mid December. The southern part couldn’t start until mid January because they didn’t get any vaccines.
I live in the southern part and they haven’t finished the over 80s and care homes,of which there are a great many, yet. I’m not expecting mine ( over 70 (just) and extremely vulnerable) until mid February.
I find it extremely annoying when it’s said that they’re starting on people in their 7Os when it isn’t true of all areas.
I fully expect that “shielding” will continue until Easter and I imagine that lockdown will not end sometime in February.
At least the sun is shining today! I shall go for a walk later.
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Anent nit-picking & apples & pears, the vaccination programmes in the four countries are different and not at all comparable. The Scottish Government for example has concentrated on getting the Care Homes & Carers jagged first so far, work which is almost complete. Eighty + year olds are next. Having very old folk wound up & complaining on TV news was not a good move by people who should know better!
Dr Gregor Smith, chief medical officer, said that "vaccine misinformation is one of the biggest dangers we face just now!"
Skoosh.
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examples of old adages:
Over 400 wedding guests gathered in Stamford Hill proving the old adage of ."there's nowt so queer as folk"
They do say "variety is the spice of life" but not in this current clime.
The Welsh minister stated who had what and said they had identified six people with the South African Covid-19 variant. As travellers from South Africa have been banned since December, I'm guessing somebody decided to fool the Border guards and made a circuitous travel arrangement.
Then, this evening the Prime Minister stated a couple of southern counties had a variant virus that preferred killing its hosts quickly.
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examples of old adages:
Over 400 wedding guests gathered in Stamford Hill proving the old adage of ."there's nowt so queer as folk"
They do say "variety is the spice of life" but not in this current clime.
I think the one that applies is "You can't fix stupid".
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I think today's press conference is sobering. I ain't going anywhere.
Just making a posh fish/seafood pie for supper.
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I think today's press conference is sobering. I ain't going anywhere.
Just making a posh fish/seafood pie for supper.
Very sobering & the figures are horrific. At least Boris seems to be taking it seriously at last - I just realised tonight he's dropped the buffoon act since Cummings went.
Oven fish and chips for us tonight ;D
Pat
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Listened to the local radio today and quite a few people were calling in concerned that they were in their 80s and 90s and hadn't yet been contacted. They were worried that they would be missed as they didn't have access to internet or mobile phones.
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Listened to the local radio today and quite a few people were calling in concerned that they were in their 80s and 90s and hadn't yet been contacted. They were worried that they would be missed as they didn't have access to internet or mobile phones.
I was contacted by our GP surgery by landline as we have no mobile signal so there is a system in place. Our doctor is going thro the list alphabetically so that may be why,
I think it’s maybe a bit early to worry too much about today’s news, we are now seeing more hospitalisation from the wider community where people are all different, some dash off to the doctor at the first snuffle while others won’t go near until they are breathing their last,
which may be skewing the figures a bit
Mike
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I think it’s maybe a bit early to worry too much about today’s news, we are now seeing more hospitalisation from the wider community where people are all different, some dash off to the doctor at the first snuffle while others won’t go near until they are breathing their last,
which may be skewing the figures a bit
Mike
What do you mean Mike? No one would be admitted to hospital with a ‘snuffle’.
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I think if someone presents with one or more symptoms they will be examined, the hospitals dare not take things seriously.
Symptoms vary so much , and it is better to err on the side of caution with such a variable illness, and with mutations already with us.
People,well some are frightened, others stupid ,as witnessed by the wedding party of 140 people of a group who are more likely to be very ill or die from Covid 19, according to their Religious Leader.,
My daughter’s friend’s only symptom was loss of taste.
But she tested positive.
Viktoria.
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I think it’s maybe a bit early to worry too much about today’s news, we are now seeing more hospitalisation from the wider community where people are all different, some dash off to the doctor at the first snuffle while others won’t go near until they are breathing their last,
which may be skewing the figures a bit
Mike
What do you mean Mike? No one would be admitted to hospital with a ‘snuffle’.
Perhaps I was simplifying, some people may wait a lot longer than others, possibly until it is too late, before they dial 111 and are advised to go to hospital.
Mike
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Listened to the local radio today and quite a few people were calling in concerned that they were in their 80s and 90s and hadn't yet been contacted. They were worried that they would be missed as they didn't have access to internet or mobile phones.
A doctor's spokesperson was on "PM" programme yesterday on this topic. 2 people called in on behalf of their parents aged late 80's & 90's who were worrying they had been overlooked as they knew people who had been vaccinated. The doctor explained how it was organised and assured them that their GP practice would contact them when it was their turn. She said please don't contact the surgery as every person who phoned to enquire was taking up time of admin staff and slowing things down for other patients.
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On Radio today ,Doctors concerned the advice from the vaccine manufacturers is being ignored in the attempt to give as many as possible some immunity ,they urge the Gov to arrange for second vaccine dose to be given in the specified time ie about three weeks after the first.
Oh dear, what a problem,.
Viktoria.
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On Radio today ,Doctors concerned the advice from the vaccine manufacturers is being ignored in the attempt to give as many as possible some immunity ,they urge the Gov to arrange for second vaccine dose to be given in the specified time ie about three weeks after the first.
Oh dear, what a problem,.
Viktoria
You are just the person to go in there and bang their heads together and tell ‘em to sort it out :) :) :)
Mike
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Over here, we are sticking with the 3 weeks between vaccinations ;D
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I am torn, more people getting some immunity or fewer getting full immunity .
I do wonder if the vaccine might be wasted on some people,not because they should not have it, but that with one dose they are not fully immune so will still be vulnerable .
Better brains than mine will have to sort that .
Viktoria.
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I am torn, more people getting some immunity or fewer getting full immunity .
I do wonder if the vaccine might be wasted on some people,not because they should not have it, but that with one dose they are not fully immune so will still be vulnerable .
Better brains than mine will have to sort that .
Viktoria.
Is simple really, the most urgent need is to stop the hospitals being filled with virus patients, then they can start to treat the million people with distressing painful and debilitating illnesses.
Matt and Boris have decided the best way to do that is to vaccinate as many as possible as soon as possible, if it works then they can plan a way ahead.
One dose of vaccine may not give total protection but it seems that it will greatly reduce the risk of hospitalisation, if we can get enough doses to to treat those at greatest risk.
I believe it will work so hang in there and keep yourself safe.
Mike
I feel I have to add this
Joe Biden said in his speech... when we are no longer here will our children say “ we did our best for them”
They are who matter most to us
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If people stick to the rules about social distancing and wearing masks after they've been vaccinated along with those who haven't yet, the risk of delaying the second vaccine would be much less. Unfortunately there will always be those who don't abide by those rules.
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I think if they can be 100% certain that delaying the second dose doesn't negate the first one, then it is better to vaccinate as many as possible, so reducing the effect if you do catch it.
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I agreed with that, but some Drs / Scientists were worried about it.
I suppose the manufacturers will advise - or keep out if it!
Viktoria.
.
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Just noticed there is a programme aboutNureyev’s defection to the West.
Long, but if there are clips of him dancing wow!
I was having an early night but not now!
Viktoria.
BBC2. 9-30.-11-30.
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I agreed with that, but some Drs / Scientists were worried about it.
I suppose the manufacturers will advise - or keep out if it!
Viktoria.
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Pfizer were/are advising 21 days. WHO are saying up to 42 days (6 weeks)
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I agreed with that, but some Drs / Scientists were worried about it.
I suppose the manufacturers will advise - or keep out if it!
Viktoria.
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Pfizer were/are advising 21 days. WHO are saying up to 42 days (6 weeks)
Are you stating W.H.O (World Health Organisatin), or asking who are stating up to 42 days?
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:)
What do you think I mean!
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:)
What do you think I mean!
White House Office?
World Honda Organisation?
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I think most of us know what you meant Gadget.
But just for reference.
WHO
Interim recommendations for use of the Pfizer–BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine, BNT162b2, under Emergency Use Listing
08 Jan 2021
https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/WHO-2019-nCoV-vaccines-SAGE_recommendation-BNT162b2-2021.1
Administration
...
An interval of 21–28 days between the doses is recommended.
...
Considerations for deferring the second dose
WHO acknowledges that a number of countries face exceptional circumstances of vaccine supply constraints combined with a high disease burden.
...
Countries experiencing exceptional epidemiological circumstances may consider delaying for a short period the administration of the second dose as a pragmatic approach to maximizing the number of individuals benefiting from a first dose while vaccine supply continues to increase. WHO's recommendation at present is that the interval between doses may be extended up to 42 days (6 weeks), on the basis of currently available clinical trial data.
EDIT: Corrected article date
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I think you and I actually read the current evidence, Cuffie. :)
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:)
What do you think I mean!
Not got a brain these days Gadget - think it's called "stir crazy"
but either:-
W.H.O., or
"... but some Drs / Scientists were worried about it.
I suppose the manufacturers will advise - or keep out if it!
Viktoria."
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:)
What do you think I mean!
Not got a brain these days Gadget - think it's called "stir crazy"
but either:-
W.H.O., or
"... but some Drs / Scientists were worried about it.
I suppose the manufacturers will advise - or keep out if it!
Viktoria."
You are an extremely rude person ,Rena. And Pfizer are the manufacturers. WHO was a comparison.
Have you heard of BBC, DVLA, NHS, etc? Full stops stopped being used years ago.
Re brains - I've spent about 20 years undertaking Health and social research, have published numerous article in refereed journals and have 4 degrees.
Moderator comment: enough for now. If at all possible, (I know, we're all stuck trying to find things to do, apart from look at the snow, watch for the postman, wait for a call from the GP surgery), please can we be kind, courteous, helpful and perhaps look for some family history to do? Thank you. :)