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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: Smilingwillowb on Sunday 11 April 21 14:25 BST (UK)
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....Joseph had served in the N.S.W. Mounted Rifles in South Africa during the Boer War, and had only arrived back in Australia at the beginning of June 1902. On the evening of Wednesday 9th July, Armidale held a Peace celebration at the local showground in which a re-enactment of an incident in South Africa took place, where Joseph was one of three men who were inside an "armoured train" (actually made of wood), which was ambushed by Boers (in reality, members of local rifle clubs). The attackers had been issued with blank ammunition and instructed to fire above the "train", although two men later admitted to having live ammunition with them. Someone disobeyed orders, and fired directly at the train with at least two shots of live ammunition - Joseph was struck in the leg and stomach by dum-dum bullets, which expanded on impact. He remained conscious for a while, in great pain, but died just after arrival at Armidale Hospital. His mother was with him when he died.
....The funeral service was at St Peter's Cathedral, Armidale, on Friday 11th July, and the burial was at the "Anglican Cemetery." Would that be called Armidale General Cemetery now?
....Not much information was given in the papers about him, not even his age or home address, just that he was a young man and would have been getting to be married a few weeks later. Family attending the funeral were his father, Samuel (his mother wasn't reported as being there), William and Robert Hamilton (uncles), and "numerous relatives."
....He wasn't on Find A Grave, although I've now added him to Armidale General Cemetery (to be changed if that's incorrect).
....I'd be most grateful for any additional information about Joseph. He went through twelve months' of war in South Africa, only to die a month or so after returning home.
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Hi Smilingwillowb,
There is a quite extensive write up of the coroner's inquest in the Armidale Chronicle on Saturday 19th July. If you search on Trove and use Trooper Edgar's Death you should be able to find the article.
Regards Kaybron
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Thanks, Kaybron. The inquest lasted for about two weeks, and I've got about three-quarters of the newspaper reports transcribed so far. Even at the start of the inquest, only Joseph's name seems to have been given out, not even that he was an Armidale resident.
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Letitia and Samuel EDGAR are listed on the 1902 NSW electoral roll for NEW ENGLAND, polling place : Armidale.
NSW bdm has a marriage registered 1878, Armidale, for LEtitia HAMILTON and Samuel EDGAR.
I am NSW centric, and all four of my grandparents were born in NSW and were adults living in regional NSW by 1902. In that first decade of the 20th century, I have noticed that it is very rare for the mourners names in newspaper cuttings to acknowledge the women folk by name. I know, as they told me so, that my grandmothers were not permitted to attend funerals prior to WWI, not even of their own children who had succumbed to childhood illnesses. Both my Grandmothers were still pained by those pre WWI practices when sharing memories in the 1960s. I was born 1947.
I don't have immediate quality info on Armidale General Cemetery, but in regional NSW most cemeteries had separate sections for each denomination, so in the first instance I would consider looking for the Anglican section within the larger general cemetery. Not all graves had a headstone, and sadly, not all burial records for every cemetery are extant, but I do know that the Armidale district has many family history buffs, and that Uni of New England has excellent family and local history lecturers. Have you considered involving UNE?
JM
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Thank you, majm. I'm in England, so the Uni of New England is news to me. I'll look it up, also for any local history groups in Armidale..
Somewhere I have a report of an early 1900s funeral, I think in Wales, which specifically stated that it was for men only.
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Some further information, from TROVE
Report of return of soldiers from South Africa, mention of Joseph Edgar.
Sydney Morning Herald, 1 feb 1902
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/14432688
An account of the actual incident, followed by an account of the funeral.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/185469803
Detailed reports of evidence at Coroner's inquest
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/185469792
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/185469903
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/185469999
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/185470034
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/185470037
There are many other reports in other Australian newspapers.
Here's a hint for transcribing from TROVE - to the left of the newspaper image is usually a 'translation' into text. You can copy from this column and paste into word or whatever. You can also register for TROVE corrections and and make corrections to that text.
Poem in his memory.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/194106772
Judith
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Some information about his military career:
http://members.pcug.org.au/~croe/ozb/oz_boer_more.cgi?record=6223
This record (by a volunteer organisation) includes and interesting comment quoted from the Brisbane Telegraph, newspaper date(s) 25.7.1902
Bne. Tele.: There was something about that fatal occurrence in Armidale, Now South Wales, which the Doctor cannot properly understand. 'A sham fight was arranged, during the course of which one of the participants, a young man who had gone through the Boer war unscathed, was horribly wounded with a bullet and died. The jury brought in a verdict of a most remarkable nature. They said that to take ball cartridge to a sham fight was most reprehensible, and therefore the deceased met his death through a bullet wound. It would have been far more to the point to have returned a verdict of wilful murder against somebody unknown
Also his birthdate and place B5204: 'miner born 1879 in Emmaville NSW, next of kin in Armidale'.
Judith
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Here's a hint for transcribing from TROVE - to the left of the newspaper image is usually a 'translation' into text. You can copy from this column and paste into word or whatever. You can also register for TROVE corrections and and make corrections to that text.
Poem in his memory.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/194106772
Judith
Thank you! I've been copying it all out word by word; this will save a lot of time, and also mean less eye strain for me.
Oh, that poem. I'd seen that, and can't think of a word that adequately sums it up. (Not one I can post here!)
Some information about his military career:
http://members.pcug.org.au/~croe/ozb/oz_boer_more.cgi?record=6223
This record (by a volunteer organisation) includes and interesting comment quoted from the Brisbane Telegraph, newspaper date(s) 25.7.1902
Bne. Tele.: There was something about that fatal occurrence in Armidale, Now South Wales, which the Doctor cannot properly understand. 'A sham fight was arranged, during the course of which one of the participants, a young man who had gone through the Boer war unscathed, was horribly wounded with a bullet and died. The jury brought in a verdict of a most remarkable nature. They said that to take ball cartridge to a sham fight was most reprehensible, and therefore the deceased met his death through a bullet wound. It would have been far more to the point to have returned a verdict of wilful murder against somebody unknown
Also his birthdate and place B5204: 'miner born 1879 in Emmaville NSW, next of kin in Armidale'.
Judith
Fantastic!!!! Again, thank you. That's a resource I've not come across before. You're a star, Judith.
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Hi,
What information, apart from what you have, were you especially looking for?
Sue
ADDING ;)
Another passionate verse by Matley. Heartfelt anyway!
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/173606517
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Hi,
What information, apart from what you have, were you especially looking for?
Sue
ADDING ;)
Another passionate verse by Matley. Heartfelt anyway!
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/173606517
I think I'm pretty much there now, thanks, I have suggested links to work on. The main thing still to find out is the grave location, and its condition, also if there's a headstone or if he's in an unmarked public grave.
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This site gives the following information about his burial but there's not a lot of information re the actual gravesite. The photo attached is the same as the one you have put up and was only attached to the site this month.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/225484136/joseph-henry-edgar/photo
Photo added by BereniceUK
Joseph Henry Edgar
BIRTH unknown
DEATH 9 Jul 1902
Armidale, Armidale Regional Council, New South Wales, Australia
BURIAL
Armidale General Cemetery
Armidale, Armidale Regional Council, New South Wales, Australia
MEMORIAL ID 225484136 · View Source
There is also this website which has photos and comments on graves at many cemeteries. The site only shows graves with memorials and does not show unmarked graves. Obviously not being listed on the site may just mean that the grave has been missed but I find it reasonably reliable. Joseph is NOT shown on this site which implies that there is no memorial for him.
https://www.austcemindex.com/?cemetery=armidale
Judith
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There is also this site https://www.australiancemeteries.com.au/htm
nsw/tamworth/tamworthgen.htm
adding : The link to the Armidale C of E cemetery offers transcripts and takes you to the Armidale family history group.http://www.familyhistoryarmidale.org/index.htm
I will check tomorrow if there is a probate file for him at the NSW archives. https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/ He doesn't appear on their online data but there is a gap in their indexes (c1891-c1927) which is on microfiche. However I haven't found a probate notice on trove.
Such a sad story ...
Ros
edited to fix my confusion between Tamworth and Armidale cemetery - sorry was busy with an off-forum query about Tamworth. How clever of you MAJM to have noticed :)
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Poor finding by the Coroner in my learned view. A Manslaughter charge would have been more appropriate against the two men who admitted having live ammo and firing low into the said rail carriage. RIP Joseph.
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Hi there,
I share some further information.
1902, so this is before the motor car, it’s the era of the horse drawn carriage. So there’s 70 miles (around 110 kms) between Tamworth and Armidale. Tamworth is around 400 metres above sea level. Armidale is around 980 metres above sea level. Tamworth to Armidale is UPHILL all the way, and conversely, Armidale to Tamworth is DOWNHILL all the way. Experienced people needed to be in charge of horses. I would not expect anyone whose funeral service was at St Pauls, Armidale to be buried in Tamworth in 1902. ADD, so nor would I expect anyone whose funeral was at St Peters Cathedral, Armidale to be buried in Tamworth in 1902.
Joseph Henry EDGAR’s younger brother was William. William enlisted in the AIF, and he was KIA, 1917 and his 94 page B2455 Service file is readily available, no subscription required via the online website from the National Archives of Australia. His Service number was 3475. His nok was his mother. https://www.naa.gov.au/
Here is the live link to the current local government authority covering Armidale. https://www.armidaleregional.nsw.gov.au/ It does NOT cover Tamworth. Tamworth’s LGA is Tamworth Regional Council. Here is that LGA’s website. https://www.tamworth.nsw.gov.au/
The Armidale LGA has responsibility for the cemeteries in its LGA. Here is the live link for that…
https://www.armidaleregional.nsw.gov.au/community/community-support/cemeteries-memorials and here is the live link for Armidale cemetery. https://www.armidaleregional.nsw.gov.au/community/community-support/cemeteries-and-memorials/armidale-cemetery The blurb at that link notes that the cemetery currently in use was dedicated in 1863, so many decades prior to Joseph EDGAR’s death. That cemetery link has a live link to the Armidale Cemetery Map. The map clearly shows the sections for each denomination including the Presbyterian. To me, St Paul’s Armidale would be the Presbyterian and St Peter's, Armidale would be Anglican.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/192855544 Armidale Express, 5 May 1882.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/183165445 Armidale Chronicale 27 Feb 1895
The Register of Coroners’ Inquests includes the following:
Inquest from July 10 – 24 at Armidale, before J McLean, J.P., on Joseph Henry EDGAR, aged 23, born Rockvale, County of Clevedon, died Armidale Hospital, from Injuries received through a bullet wound at the Military Tattoo, Armidale. Cash or Property possessed by Deceased : Nil. A Post Mortem was held.
Add
I have just looked at the 1897 NSW map available online via hlrv.nswlrs.com.au for ROCKVALE, and I can clearly see CP.73.12521 (194 acres) and CP, 71.3444 (126 acres) were originally conditional purchases for a Joseph Hamilton. https://hlrv.nswlrs.com.au/ Perhaps this is where Joseph EDGAR was born, afterall, his mum was nee HAMILTON.
NSW BDM online index
Birth: EDGAR, Joseph H, parents as Samuel and Letitia, registered in the Armidale district.
Death: EDGAR, Joseph H, parents as Samuel and Letitia, registered in the Armidale district.
NSW BDMs are very detailed, include family history information. Death certs also include medical and burial information. NSW BDM has licenced Official Transcribers.
See these live links:
https://www.nsw.gov.au/topics/family-history-search/family-history-research-guide
and
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,300394.0.html
and
http://www.jaunay.com/bdm.html
JM Edit to provide live links to various online resources.
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Very extensive information majm. A credit to you.
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Joseph Henry EDGAR’s younger brother was William. William enlisted in the AIF, and he was KIA, 1917 and his 94 page B2455 Service file is readily available, no subscription required via the online website from the National Archives of Australia. His Service number was 3475. His nok was his mother. https://www.naa.gov.au/
Some family history and helpful clues on the AIF file of William EDGAR
The family HAMILTON arrived in Victoria per Aloe in 1857. Joseph, Letitia and several children.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/64986034
and apparently settled in the Armidale area.
They had another child after arrival in 1858, Letitiia HAMILTON.(#4261) Armidale.
I think Letitia had an ex-nuptial child.
SMITH Isabella J
6684/1875
Mother LETITIA
At ARMIDALE
After this birth, Letitia went on to marry Samuel EDGAR and had children including William EDGAR in 1889. (#31197). William EDGAR, the serviceman, therefore was a half-sibling to Isabella.
Isabella married Richard A BARTLETT, becoming the Mrs BARTLETT who wrote a letter in the digitized service file of William EDGAR. She calls him her brother.
She is the beneficiary of his will as also mentioned in the file.
When Samuel EDGAR, Letitia’s husband, died in 1907, Letitia remarried to Samuel Sebastian KEENER.
KEENER Samuel S
EDGAR Letitia
At INVERELL
8016/1908
For some reason, William her son lists his mother as NOK in her former name of EDGAR, Mrs EDGAR, and the AIF’s letters advising her of William’s death do not find her. However Isabella’s inquiry as seen in the file, identified him.
Mother died
KEENER Letitia
13537/1937
Parents JOSEPH & LETITIA
At PETERSHAM
Sue
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There is also this site https://www.australiancemeteries.com.au/nsw/tamworth/tamworthgen.htm
adding : The link to the Armidale C of E cemetery offers transcripts and takes you to the Armidale family history group.http://www.familyhistoryarmidale.org/index.htm
I will check tomorrow if there is a probate file for him at the NSW archives. https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/ He doesn't appear on their online data but there is a gap in their indexes (c1891-c1927) which is on microfiche. However I haven't found a probate notice on trove.
Such a sad story ...
Ros
edited to fix my confusion between Tamworth and Armidale cemetery - sorry was busy with an off-forum query about Tamworth. How clever of you MAJM to have noticed :)
Rockvale is north of Armidale. I have many relatives in and around Uralla, so I have known that Tamworth is south of Armidale all my life. Like most RChatters, my email address receives notifications to threads that I have replied to. Like most RChatters, I read those replies. I see nothing clever about that at all, to me it is common sense, when responding to family history enquiries to consider the historical setting - the era, the social background, the local history aspects. So for example, Tamworth and Armidale, in the mid to late 1800s were not in the same electorate ... Tamworth ... on the Peel River, so 'Liverpool Plains' ... Armidale up in the highlands of 'New England'.... quite distant from each other, different focuses, different conditions, different primary industries...
JM
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I'm the person who created the Find A Grave page for Joseph, and will add a biography for him when I've been through all the information you wonderful people have dug up. You're all amazing!
I totally agree with NSWP; there should have been a police investigation into the death. During the inquest, the jury wanted to visit the scene of the tragedy, but the Coroner kept refusing to allow it, things got very heated, and it was only when a Senior-Sergeant (police?) spoke up that it went ahead. At the conclusion of the inquest the Coroner said that he would be resigning.
Letitia Keener is buried at North Ryde, Ryde City, N.S.W. https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/191813784/letitia-keener
My thanks to you all, and should I get any information on his grave, including a photo, I'll add it here.
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Hi Smilingwillowb,
I checked the microfiche at the NSW archives for a probate packet for Joseph Henry Edgar but unfortunately there was no entry for him.
Ros
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I'm the person who created the Find A Grave page for Joseph, and will add a biography for him when I've been through all the information you wonderful people have dug up. You're all amazing!
I totally agree with NSWP; there should have been a police investigation into the death. During the inquest, the jury wanted to visit the scene of the tragedy, but the Coroner kept refusing to allow it, things got very heated, and it was only when a Senior-Sergeant (police?) spoke up that it went ahead. At the conclusion of the inquest the Coroner said that he would be resigning.
Letitia Keener is buried at North Ryde, Ryde City, N.S.W. https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/191813784/letitia-keener
My thanks to you all, and should I get any information on his grave, including a photo, I'll add it here.
One wonders if one or more of the alleged shooters, were well connected in the area, if you know what I mean, bit of skull duggery?