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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: City Hall on Sunday 13 June 21 12:29 BST (UK)
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Hi, was just wondering if anyone knows who the Liddy cup in Dublin amateur football is named after?
Thanks.
Paul.
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Google/search
Pat Liddy
and this
https://azscore.com/football/leagues/ireland/irish-liddy-cup
Maggsie
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Thanks for the reply Maggsie. Can you post a link for where you found the cup was named after a Pat Liddy. I searched Google using Pat Liddy the Liddy cup, but didn't get any hits.
Regards.
Paul.
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Hi, this one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pat_Liddy
Maggsie
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There are newspaper snippets which refer to the Dr Liddy cup and the Charles Liddy cup - are they the same?
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Perhaps this relevant - page 17.
https://www.ucd.ie/archives/t4media/p0137-fai-descriptive-catalogue.pdf
“Charles Liddy, a member of the FAIFS Council, makes Jack Ryder aware of his intention to propose the following motion: ‘That this Council instructs its advisory committee to re-open negotiations with the Northern Ireland Association, with a view to arriving at an amicable settlement’. The proposal was later withdrawn (12 May 1929).”
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Charles Liddy's father was Patrick they were a large family of confectioners from Belfast, they lived on St Peters Road quite close to Dalymount Park
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Arran_Quay/St__Peter_s_Road/50484/
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1932/09000/5257271.pdf
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01qo2/
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Sorry for the delay in replying and many thanks to Maggsie, Heywood and Dathai for your posts. Dathai, it is great that you were able to post a photo of Charles Liddy. Can I impose on you further and ask why you state there were confectioners in the family, as this is not obvious from the material I have on the family? (very hard to ask this question without sounding cheeky!).
Thanks again.
Paul.
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Patrick Liddy 1901
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/North_Dock/Amiens_Street/1274174/
shopkeeper on his marriage cert
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1902/10274/5739013.pdf
1911 a Clerk
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Arran_Quay/St__Peter_s_Road/50484/
Clerk and Confectioner on birth certs
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01qo5/
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I see what you mean they seem to be mostly Pavior's in the family
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Hi dathai, thanks for the further information. You may well have found another branch of my Belfast Liddy family who moved to Dublin. My problem is that although I can find corresponding births in Belfast for Patrick, James and Charles born to Charles Liddy (senior) and Mary (Moorehead) Liddy, I cannot find births for the 2 girls Mary Jane and Annie to Charles senior and Mary. Also I cannot find deaths for Charles senior and Mary in Belfast or Dublin between 1881(birth of Charles junior) and 1901, year of census, so I need to find out what happened to them. There are obvious inaccuracies in the census return such as Patrick aged 23 being the son of Mary Jane aged 26, the sister Annie being born in Dublin and John the visitor being a school teacher aged 20. Given these inaccuracies, maybe Mary Jane head of family is actually the mother (who was called Mary Jane) and her age has been recorded incorrectly. Much more searching and researching to be done. Thanks again for all your help.
Paul.
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Here is a birth for Mary Jane in 1871:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1871/03277/2200826.pdf
You have James - 1875; Patrick - 1877
Annie, 1879, Dublin
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1879/02920/2069845.pdf
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Is this the death of Charles - a widower in 1889
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1889/06144/4755241.pdf
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Are John and Jane (visitors) the children of John and Alice - here in 1911
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dock_Ward/North_Queen_Street/138132/
Although John is in 1901 census with his parents and is a pavior.
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Mary Jane died 1898 a widow at Summerhill ,Dublin and is buried in Glasnevin along with a daughter Catherine 1885 age 3
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1898/05821/4648357.pdf
Probate of her will to Mary Jane £1,071 16s 8d
http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/reels/cwa/005014910/005014910_00407.pdf
i presume you know there was another Charles Liddy/Mary Campbell in Frederick St
daughter Georgina 1866
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1867/03501/2286785.pdf
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So the death for Charles in 1888 must be the other Charles’ death.
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Here is the likely death for Charles - husband of Mary Jane Moorhead
Charles Leddy - 1885
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1885/06299/4805515.pdf
Charles’ occupation on the Tramways and the address matches Annie’s birth.
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Son John Joseph also died 1885 he is also buried Glasnevin as Joseph Leddy
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1885/06289/4802019.pdf
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Son John Joseph also died 1885 he is also buried Glasnevin as Joseph Leddy
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1885/06289/4802019.pdf
I saw a newspaper snippet yesterday, not realising that Charles was so young.
29th Match 1889 Freeman’s Journal
A memorial notice re Charles and John Joseph from Mary Jane.
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heywood and dathai, thanks so much for all the additional information. It will take me a while to digest it all and slot it into the overall picture, but I want to 'get down on paper' the questions and answers that are in my head at the minute.
The Charles Liddy who died in Belfast in 1889 was from the earlier generation and was in fact the father of the Charles Liddy who died in Dublin in 1885.
Can't explain why Annie was born in Dublin in 1879(obviously after the family moved to Dublin) but Charles was born in Belfast in 1881!
Kathleen (Kash) Liddy who was born in 1899 and lived well into her 90s(and who I knew well) talked about losing someone called James Liddy who was very close to her in WW1. There was a James Liddy from Dublin(but born in Belfast) who died in 1916 serving with the Royal Dublin Fusilliers. Could this James Liddy have been the son of Charles and Mary Jane and would therefore have been a full cousin of Kash?
heywood , is there any chance you could reproduce the anniversary notice from Mary Jane for Charles and John Joseph?
Thanks again to you both for all your help.
Paul.
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The notice is on FindMyPast and I can only see that a snippet sorry.
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I saw a newspaper snippet yesterday, not realising that Charles was so young.
29th Match 1889 Freeman’s Journal
A memorial notice re Charles and John Joseph from Mary Jane.
Well found, heywood :)
Paul, here you are ;D
KG
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Army Register of Soldiers’ Effects
James Liddy, Royal Dublin Fusiliers died 6th September 1916
Effects authorised April 1917 to:
Sister, Mrs Mary J O’Shea
Brother, Patrick
Sister, Mrs Annie Ellis
27.11.1917
D.D.O Prona (don’t know what that means) Bro. Chas.
These were all payments of £1.14s 1d
30.10.19
Sister Mary J O’Shea - £3.0.0.
His commemoration on CWGC
https://www.rootschat.com/links/01qo8/
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Anne Liddy/Ellis
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1901/10310/5752818.pdf
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Arran_Quay/Benburb_Street/53847/
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Sarsfield O'Shea/Mary J liddy
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1902/10283/5742583.pdf
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/North_Dock/Amiens_Street/22039/
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https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/find-war-dead/casualty-details/800599/JAMES%20LIDDY/
https://www.cwgc.org/find-records/commemorations/id-case-form/
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Guys, I can't thank you enough for all your help. Kiltaglassan, thanks for posting the anniversary notice. That poor woman , she lost her 35 year old husband and 14 year old son within 48 hours!
Heywood, thanks for the register of soldier's effects, which initially showed that all the recipients had forenames consistent with James' siblings and dathai for proving conclusively that Annie Ellis and Mary J O'Shea were sisters of James. I will now ascertain how to get the CWGC record for James, which has next to no information, updated with the relevant family details. It is the least I can do.
Thanks again to all who contributed.
Paul
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Paul, and anyone else interested, I have been going through old family photos today, and I have come across one of a number of children with a ? Nursemaid. The reverse of the photo has a message written in pencil and an annotation by my aunt, Alice Josephine liddy saying ‘ the O’Shea family Dublin’ I thought that perhaps the nursemaid was a relation, but it would appear from all the foregoing material that the mother of these children was related to my liddy family. Genealogy is fascinating. Thanks Caroline
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Thanks Caroline - it’s lovely to hear of these links, isn’t it. :)
I am posting a link to your previous mentions of your family - Rootschatters love to go off on a trail to find these folk ;)
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=728478.msg6790660#msg6790660
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Re James Liddy
About 2016 i was doing a family tree for a friend and found his wife's grandfather and his cousin also died on the Somme have no known grave and are commemorated on The Thiepval Memorial
I some how managed to find this couple Ken and Pam Linge who were collating info on the men named on the memorial i contacted them and gave all the soldiers family particulars this man the soldier Timothy McDonnell his soldiers records like James Liddy were probably among the burnt documents.
Luckily there was a free weekend on one of the pay sites and i found that both lads had joined the Dublin Militia between 1901 and 1911 census'es,perhaps James may have done the same ?
reply 47 here
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=669681.msg6105081#msg6105081
The book interesting to see what details are given for James Liddy
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Missing-but-Not-Forgotten-Thiepval/dp/1473823587
http://www.greatwar.co.uk/somme/museum-thiepval-visitor-centre.htm
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Sorry for the delay in replying. I enquired on another forum how to go about getting James Liddy's details updated on CWGC website, now that we know who his parents, next of kin are. Got a mixed response, some positive, saying go for it, you have the proof. Others saying you have no chance, CWGC are very reluctant to change/add details, especially when there is no headstone for the dead soldier.(James is only remembered on Thiepval memorial). But what did come to light is that it appears James' brother Charles Liddy also served, as a sapper in Royal Engineers, service number 140110. He survived the war and gave his contact address as St Peter's Road Dublin when he was demobbed. Which brings me to my next question. What became of this Charles Liddy? Born Belfast 1881, on 1901 census at 37 Amiens Street Dublin aged 20 confectioner, on 1911 census at 40 St Peter's Road Dublin aged 29 carpenter. I can find no death for a Charles Liddy after 1919 anywhere in Ireland. Am I doing something wrong?
Paul.
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Caroline, when your father and my wife's father arrived at Connolly train station(separately and at different times) from Belfast in the 1940's on their way to their Liddy relatives at Clontarf, I wonder did they know they had Liddy blood relatives living directly across the road from the station at 37 Amiens Street?
Paul.
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I can find no death for a Charles Liddy after 1919 anywhere in Ireland. Am I doing something wrong?
Have you considered that he might have died after 1970?
Up to 1971 (current date) in Northern Ireland and 1970 (in Republic of Ireland) covered by the 100 50 year rule on data disclosure.
KG
Edited
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Kiltaglassan, I did consider that possibility and I hope that is the reason there is no record for him. He would have been 89 years of age in 1970 but lets hope he was still hale and hearty.
Paul.
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Ken and Pam Linge EMail here
send them a link to this topic
http://www.greatwar.co.uk/organizations/thiepval-database-project.htm
also see lot 2476 Deansgrange
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/dublin/photos/tombstones/1headstones/deansgrange-st-pats17.txt
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dathai, as always, thanks for the additional information. Great find re the Deansgrange family plot for Patrick and Mabel Liddy. I wonder if the Charles Liddy interred there is 'our' Charles, or Patrick and Mabel's son, who was 8 years old in the 1911 census.
I will indeed e-mail Ken and Pam Linge with the additional information relating to James Liddy,died 6th September 1916. Thank you for the link.
Paul.
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I wonder if the Charles Liddy interred there is 'our' Charles, or Patrick and Mabel's son, who was 8 years old in the 1911 census.
Likely to be Patrick and Mabel's son.
Charles Leonard born 21st March 1903.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1903/01870/1728070.pdf
KG
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Thanks Kiltaglassan, well spotted.
Paul.
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Ken and Pam Linge EMail here
send them a link to this topic
http://www.greatwar.co.uk/organizations/thiepval-database-project.htm
Dathai, thanks so much for your advice. I took it, and sent an e-mail to Ken and Pam. My intention was to provide them with more details about James Liddy but they already had a record of him on their database, which even included a photo. They sent me a copy of the photo which is something I never thought I would acquire. Thanks again for your help and advice.
Paul.
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Great outcome thanks for the update