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General => Armed Forces => World War Two => Topic started by: broaway on Sunday 01 August 21 15:33 BST (UK)
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HI can anyone advise me please,
I have now received my fathers pouch from WW2 from National Archives
He enlisted in 1942 at Liverpool and was in the Merchant navy reserve pool until 1946 on paper
His pouch only shows his last ship the Atlantian and he was a trimmer and was on that ship for his last 6 months
I know he had been to Italy and a convoy from Africa but where would he have been for the service previous to this last 6 months
My Mother told me he had hearing loss due to being torpedoed prior to this on a different ship but I can find no records of ships or crew lists
Any Ideas please
Regards
Broadway
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Try here.......
https://collections.rmg.co.uk/archive/objects/1115413.html
Maggsie
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Thank you Maggsie will give it some study
thanks again
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Hello,
It depends what documents you have received. You state you have his pouch, if correct this should have come from BT 372 at Kew and is not his full service record which should be his CRS 10 held in BT 382. Can you clarify what year he aboard ATLANTIAN (149686)? If you wish to give his name, date, and place of birth I could perhaps advise.
Regards
Hugh
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Hi Mac thank you so much
his Name Frank George Smith
DoB 16/8/1911 Nottingham
They sent me BT 382-1628 and
BT 372/732/125
His last ship was The Atlantian 149686 and the dates were 30/10/1944 till 4/12/1944 as a Trimmer I think that term was a stoker National Archives were not that informative really
He was in the Merchant Navy Reserve Pool from 1942 - 1945
So bit confused as to where and what ships he served on I know he had been to Italy
Hope this helps
Kind Regards
Broaway
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No doubt Hugh will reply.
Are you sure the the reference that TNA sent you was from BT382/1628
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_cr=bt382%2F1628&_dss=range&_ro=any&_st=adv
Not BT382/1658?
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_cr=bt382%2F1658&_dss=range&_ro=any&_st=adv
Just a small point. Stoker was a Royal Navy rank. In the Merchant Navy the term was Fireman or Fireman/Trimmer.
The Trimmer literally broke up the larger lumps of coal to pass to the Fireman to shovel into the ships furnace.
Whatever your fathers position, He was a Hard man by definition. Shovelling coal, 4 hours on 4 hours off 24/7. Try and read "No Longer Required" by Bill Linskey.
This book describes in detail the condtions endured by a MN fireman in WW2.
It will make you laugh and cry at the same time.
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Hi Seaweed
Thank you very much for the reply
Yes it is definitely BT382-1658
Not very much information from national archives really for what you pay
will check that book out , I never knew what a trimmer was either , what a hard difficult time they had
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Could I ask how much did you pay. I have just corresponded with a guy from OZ who claims he received a form CRS 10 for £3.60. I must say I found this a little surprising.
You can download for free after signing in, the WW2 movement card of ATLANTIAN
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D8661110
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you may ask
I thought it quite expensive at £87.66
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The MNRP came into being with the Essential Work (MN) Order of May 1941.
Continuity of employment was provided by the MNRP which was a clearing house for men available to return to sea after leave: on leaving a ship, every seaman was told when he had to report back and to which port. There would be payment of wages while awaiting a ship and a reserve of men to man ships while in port. There were other restrictions and benefits to both employers and employees using the Pool.
You appear to have the main records for F.G. Smith although I note there appears to be no medal file for him online. I am sure he was entitled to them so you may wish to enquire with the RSS in Cardiff.
Other than what I have written above it will probably be difficult to find out what he was doing prior to 1944. I can tell you that Frank Smith joined ATLANTIAN in Manchester on 4th December 1944 and that this was noted as being his first voyage.
If you wish to double check this you could try and obtain the 1944 crew agreement for ATLANTIAN official number 149686 which is held at Kew in piece BT 381/2904 - https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C11070378 the articles will show engagment and discharge details plus details of a previous ship if he had one.
Family lore can be difficult to prove or disprove but you have to keep an opened mind.
I have the book by Bill Linskey and like Seaweed I can vouch for it being a good read.
I see Kew are still ripping people off with ridiculous charges for CRS 10 - Shame!
Regards
Hugh
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Mmm, Sounds more realistic. Thanks.
See
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=851484.msg7194324
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Thank you so much I will check with those in Cardiff and let you know
thanks again