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General => Armed Forces => Topic started by: haney on Monday 16 August 21 03:56 BST (UK)
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Hi Everyone I am doing research on my GG Uncle WILLIAM BYRNE (also Burn/e). He joined the Royal Marines in 1797 for what appears "Life" on the records I have.
William was 17 when he joined and was born in Kings co. Bracknagh. Seems as though he left about 1822.
From attestation papers below
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/967bcc1b2e7e4b7ab1d3a8052693f035
From doing research recently it seems that some of the guys who enlisted/joined the Royal Marines this was actually a preferred method to transportation by enforced service. I don't know if that is the case here. William was Irish and his brother Michael Byrne was a convict sent here to NSW in 1799 after being tried in Kildare in 1797 (coincidence??) not sure
He was living in High St. Woolwich in the 1841 and 1851 Census with wife Catherine nee DINAN.
He also had the Hampshire Hogg from around 1823. I would like to find all the entries in the Pigots Directory from 1823-?? 1839 maybe for him.
I was wondering if there were any actual pension records available as he received a pension from the Royal Marines up until his death perhaps in 1852. Any help in adding to my timeline would be wonderful. Thanks very much for any ideas. Regards Dianna
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What was Michael Byrne's crime?
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Hi Michaels crime seems to be a political one, possibly Rebel from what I can understand. Thanks for your reply. Dianna
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Hi Michaels crime seems to be a political one, possibly Rebel from what I can understand. Thanks for your reply. Dianna
That's what I suspected in view of the timing of his conviction, the year before a rebellion and French invasion. William may have been involved/accused/suspected/assumed guilty by association and joining the army was the alternative to conviction. On the other hand his parents may have sent him into the British Army to keep him out of trouble at home.
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From doing research recently it seems that some of the guys who enlisted/joined the Royal Marines this was actually a preferred method to transportation by enforced service. I don't know if that is the case here. William was Irish and his brother Michael Byrne was a convict sent here to NSW in 1799 after being tried in Kildare in 1797 (coincidence??) not sure
"Mass recruitment in Munster and Leinster from the spring of 1797 then broadened the base of the unified movement ... By the eve of the Rebellion ... a paramilitary force boasting a nominal strength of 280,000 members. ... Leinster United Irishmen recruited in the big drive of 1797 ..." ("Desperate and Diabolical - Defenders and United Irishmen in Early New South Wales" by Ruan O'Donnell)
Jails of assize Home Circuit April 1797 were reputedly "filled with men charged with Defenderism ... Farrell Cuffe has been found guilty ..." (Saunders Newsletter 26th April 1797). Farrell Cuffe was a teacher in King's County (County Offaly) who was convicted of administering illegal oaths.
The Insurrection Act, introduced in 1796, remained in force for several years. It gave magistrates sweeping powers of search and arrest.
Were the Byrne brothers R.C.? Catholics were allowed to join the British Army from late 18thC.
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On the other hand his parents may have sent him into the British Army to keep him out of trouble at home.
On a point of order - the Royal Marines are and were part of the Royal Navy, not the Army.
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Apology to the Royal Marines. The clue is in the name. :-[
Did the Royal Marines recruit inland in wartime? Did they scour prisons on the lookout for likely young men?
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Recruitment poster from the era: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/07/c8/18/07c8182ed75037c07c9a915de9686da1.jpg
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Thank you for the link to the poster. It certainly makes it look very enticing.
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Hi Everyone Thanks for your input and information. Yes William and Michael were catholics, two other siblings that I know of where Eleanor and Rosetta Woodworth just thought I would mention them. Farrell Cuffe was one of the witness's to Michaels marriage in Sydney in 1822. Farrell and Michael were also involved in the attempted/planned uprising in Parramatta in 1800 and flogged/sent to Norfolk Island for a few years.
("Desperate and Diabolical - Defenders and United Irishmen in Early New South Wales" by Ruan O'Donnell). Also I emailed Ruan, no reply but that does not surprise me anyway will try and track down this book here in Sydney.
What year was that poster and where did it appear (newspaper). That is a great "visual" element to the story. Hopefully as I gather more on William perhaps something will be revealed, who knows.
I have been trying to search in the newspapers of the day for any mention of arrests/activities/stories especially for 1797 (ish) when Michael was tried in "Athy" Summer Assizes Kildare 23 August 1797. I have one snippet of that day but he is not named from the Freeman's Journal August 24, 1797 and the Dublin Gazette. No mention of him anywhere! There was apparently a 5 hour trial that day of Simon Frazer and John Ross which was reported! Thanks very much for your time. Kindest regards Dianna
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Thank you for the link to the poster. It certainly makes it look very enticing.
It may have been the promised rations which attracted William, a growing lad. Might have been better than what he ate at home. Plus weevils as extra protein! The prospect of receiving half his pay may have won over his parents. The poster also offered education.
If he joined after his brother's arrest it may have been as a way of showing that other members of the family were loyal. It may have been to prevent him from getting into trouble like his brother.
2 threads about Michael Byrne by haney.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=851808.msg7195784#msg7195784
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=851807.msg7195782#msg7195782
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The United Irishmen were suspected of playing a leading role in the Spithead and Nore Mutinies of 1797 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spithead_and_Nore_mutinies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spithead_and_Nore_mutinies).
The Marines* were a ships policemen so were supposed to be squeaky clean and were kept imbetween the Officers and the crew to protect them. Don't think the Officers would be keen on having anyone with republican/revolutionary sympathies anywhere near them!
*they weren't Royal until 1802