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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Durham => Topic started by: aidansrest on Thursday 10 March 22 14:11 GMT (UK)
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Hi
Looking for more information on the bride of this man.
John Brown, born in Sunderland on the 6th November 1813, son of John Brown and his wife, Sarah Fisher.
He married firstly in 1833 to Jane Mowbray.
After she died in 1869, he appears to have remarried in Sunderland on the 11th February 1871 (venue unknown), to Elizabeth Metcalf - whose previous name was noted as 'House' when she married.
Elizabeth was younger than John, being born c1833 in Penshaw, County Durham.
They appear on the 1871 census, with three children, all given the surname of Brown;
Elizabeth Jane born c 1855
John Thomas born c1858
Alice Mary born c 1865
None of them can be John's as his wife, Jane, did not die until 1869, but cannot find Elizabeth or the two elder children in 1861.
Or have I got it all dreadfully wrong!!
Cheers
Sue
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Can you find birth records for the children? Appreciate Brown is a common name but a maiden name may stick out.
If I have it right you are saying the children can't belong to Jane because she would be too old is that right?
Have you looked under his second wife's name to see if they were hers?
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Well the 1871 you mention links to a James Brown/Elizabeth Birkbeck marriage in 1853.
Elizabeth Jane born Jun 1854 Sunderland has mothers name Birkbeck so possibly the wrong 1871 census for your family?
John Thomas Brown born Dec 1857 & Alice Mary born Jun 1865 Sunderland also have Birkbeck.
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Possible for Elizabeth Jane in 1861
Elizabeth Brown 65 head
Mathew Brown 27 son
Abigail Brown 20 daughter
Elizabeth Jane Brown 6 granddaughter
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Possibly the wrong marriage and couple!
My John Brown's first wife, Jane, died in 1869; he didnt have any chuildren with her named Elizabeth Jane, John Thomas or Mary Alice; his and Jane's last child, was George, born in 1852.
I can't find John for sure on the 1871 census, but the John who married Elizabeth in 1871 (if it is my John), was around the right age, and had a very similar occupation.
Also Elizabeth was 20 years younger than him.
Think I may need to buy the marriage certificate!
Sue
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Was the 1871 marriage before the census or after?
What occupation does your John Brown have and do you have him after 1871 with Elizabeth or has he passed away?
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Sorry just to clarify then he did have children with first wife Jane - George being the youngest.
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Hi
John Brown married Elizabeth Metcalf (nee House) in Sunderland on the 11th February 1871, his first wife, Jane (nee Mowbray) had died in February 1869. If this was 'my' John
John was employed as a shipwright, and his children with Jane were;
John - born 1835
Mary Jane - born 1837
William - born 1840
Isabella - born 1843
Sarah - born 1846
William - born 1848 (indicating that the first William had died)
George - born 1852
Cheers
Sue
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Thanks for clarifying.
So John is missing in 1871 but Elizabeth was his wife by census time.
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Hi
John (if it is him) and Elizabeth are together on the 1871 with children, Elizabeth Jane, John Thomas and Alice Mary - but, obviously, these children seem to prove that it is not 'my' John.
The John Brown on the 1871 census was also born in Sunderland c1813, and was a 'seaman' unable to work.
'My' John had also been born in 1813 and was a 'shipwright' by trade.
This particular Elizabeth was 20 years younger than John, having been born in Penshaw around 1833.
Cheers
Sue
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Do you have John after 1871.
John
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Hi
Yes - the same John and Elizabeth living in 1 Trafalgar Square, Sunderland in 1881.
John's year of birth given as 1815 - Elizabeth 16 years younger than him.
Sue
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Further discounting the other family
Elizabeth, John, Elizabeth J & John T are transcribed as Brom in 1861 on FindMyPast
RG9 piece 3780 f54 p29
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After she died in 1869
Sorry if you know all this, but it may help with things? :-\
Jane Brown buried Bishopwearmouth Cemetery, 4 March 1869
Age 56. Wife of John Brown, Shipwright.
Death occurred at White House Road.
Buried in 6A 227 (unconsecrated)
So far I haven't found John's burial there.
Lots of newspaper stories!
Shields Daily Gazette, 2 March 1869
SUSPICIOUS DEATH AT HENDON
At the Police Court, yesterday, John Brown, Whitehouse Road, Hendon, ship-repairer, was placed in the dock, charged on suspicion of having caused the death of his wife, Jane Brown.—Jane Hall deposed that on Wednesday last the prisoner went into the house and struck his wife a blow on the head, which knocked her down, and, from the effects of which she lay on the floor in a state of insensibility for nearly an hour. She never entirely rallied, but died on Saturday night. Prisoner was remanded for a week.
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More tidied up ocr text!
Shields Daily Gazette, 4 March 1869
SUSPICIOUS DEATH AT HENDON.
Mr Coroner Maynard held an inquest yesterday morning, at the house of Mrs Fairman, New Shades Hotel, Hendon Road, Sunderland, on the body of Jane Brown, who was discovered, late on Saturday night last, lying back in her chair quite dead, at her lodgings in Whitehouse Road, Hendon. The prisoner, in charge of the police authorities, was in attendance, and Mr Ritson was also present to watch the case on behalf of the friends of the deceased.—Jane Hall, wife of Charles Hall, tailor, residing in Whitehouse Road, Hendon, said she knew the deceased, Jane Brown, wife of John Brown. She was about forty-four years of age, and had lived with witness nearly five weeks. When she came to take the lodgings, deceased represented her husband to be a ship captain, and that he was at Peterhead, but would be joining her shortly. She said they had lately been living separated, but that they had made it up again, and were going to live together. The husband, John Brown, came to witness's about a fortnight ago. He had been shipwrecked, and came to stay with his wife. He stayed at witness's house up till Wednesday last. Witness then detailed the circumstances of a quarrel between the deceased and her husband on Wednesday last, in which the latter struck the former a blow on the face with doubled fist, from the effects of which she fell in front of the fireplace, and she died at a late hour on Saturday. Mrs Hall said the quarrel originated through some letters that had come from Dundee—from a woman who had previously lived in Flag Lane, Sunderland, who, it was alleged, the prisoner had cohabited with while in Scotland.—Dr. Francis described the post mortem examination he had made in conjunction with Mr Maling, and stated that the cause of death was inflammation of the lungs, which he believed had been growing for some time before. There was nothing to show that a blow or violence was the cause of death.—Mr Edward Allan Malin, surgeon, corroborated Mr Francis, and the jury returned a verdict that the deceased had died through " natural causes."
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Next day
The Suspicious Death.—The man John Brown, who was apprehended on suspicion of having caused the death of his wife, and remanded till after the inquest had been held, was yesterday brought before the Sunderland borough magistrates and discharged.
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Well done Jonw65.
So it's been established that the 1871 census is not John Brown with Elizabeth.
In 1861 John & Jane were living in Bank Street. At that same address in 1871 was his son John (1835-Shipwright) and his wife Hannah.
Did John senior possibly die pre 1871, unless OP has definite evidence of death?
John
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Hi
Sorry for late reply!! This is fantastic, thank you so much, very much in debt!!
Sue
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I wonder if John left the area after that, or, as you say, he may have died prior to the 1871 census.
Thank you so much for helping me discount the 'other John' - many thanks!!
Sue